The Incompetence of Bioware is Astounding.

[Divona]

So, if you're that upset with the game, maybe it is time to take a break, like I do whenever I hit a wall in an MMO. Play something else and come back when there's more content. It's better than sitting in a forum and calling developers incompetent.

 

I have also experience playing various MMO's in past and one game (not wow) i played even longer than SWTOR that i started since launch. It all comes down to Your playstyle. If you are casual and not a raider then you can take long breaks, but if you are raider and want to do always engame group content then taking long breaks is not generally good idea. You loose knowledge of class changes and also will lag behind from rest of guild/raid members having to start all over again each time. In some MMO's the grind is so high that if you take break more than 1 year it will be hard to catch up.

So its very different for each player depending what and WHY they play mmo in first place.

Also taking breaks means you will miss out some content while those who are subscribed ALL the time have done most likely all game has to offer. They have right to ask NEW content unlike those who take 1+ year breaks.

 

Sadly, the "we want it now" mentality that rules most gamers is not sympathetic to the MMO genre. But I've come to understand that things don't just magically appear-- developers need money, resources, man-power and time for content.

 

Every MMO making company is here for business. Rules of business is to make money. To make money you need to learn market and your customers what they want/ask from you. If you deliver that product or service and they are happy (majority) then they will pay for that service (subscribe) and support company. IF they are not happy, then they ask changes and wait ...wait. If then nothing changes they leave. All the money have been payed by customers upfront and they have to BELIVE and hope MMO company has manpower + staff to use that money well. This is where many peoples opinions are not same. Bioware had time 4+ years, They had money and man-power but it is shrinking because of many many mistakes done past years not one time.

If business plan didnt succeed then you have 2 options. Shrink team size and hope for best to maintain game above proft level or invest more money to change features and hope you hit the nail.

Bioware has messed up many times and looking their announcements it sure looks quite bad for long term time/money investing players WHO DONT take long breaks.

Those customers who are taking often long breaks between content updates are not valued as much than those who are supporting game wihtout taking breaks. Its obvious that Bioware is interested of players who keep spending money continuously than taking breaks. Bioware needs money all the time not only when new content is released. So overall it does more harm for them if many players taking breaks between content updates.

Edited December 21, 2015 by Divona

[Alssaran]

I've been thinking about how to word this for some time. I don't want to make it sound as if I am attacking Bioware, but I feel this post will be a lot more aggressive than I intend it to be.

 

There is one major problem I have with Bioware. It's not so much on Eric. He is only the messenger. He's being told what to tell us. The problem is with the people telling him what to tell us. I'll word this question as careful as I can:

 

Do you think we are retarded?

 

Guys, you can cover a pile of sh*t in as much cologne as you want. It will be a pile of sh*t all the same. You are trying to sell us a pile of said substance, while at the same time trying to make it sound as if it is the most awesome thing ever. Like...the MMORPG industry has never seen something that awesome before!

 

Let's go over a few things which happened recently:

 

NiM operations don't drop nightmare gear.

 

There is no reasonable explanation for this. The only explanation is that you are trying to increase the time spend gearing up our characters. You have not delivered sufficient (new) content. Now you are trying to artificaly increase the old content. It's just that simple. Instead you're trying to tell us that NiM is only relevant for titles and decorations. And where would that imply that nightmare gear should not drop? Does dropping titles and decorations in any way invalidate the need for nightmare gear?

 

You know the answer. It doesn't. It's a desperate try to increase the grind and artificaly blend over the missing (new) content. The most disturbing thing about all of this is how you went back to the blog in question and edited it to make it sound as if that was always intended. Guys, at least own up to it. We can read page history and code. You've screwed up big time, but you don't want to admit it.

 

Subscriber rewards

 

It's not special. You advertised this as "interesting for loyal customers.". No, it's not interesting for loyal customers. Loyal customers are the people who stuck with this game through the worst. Ravager exploit. This recent exploit. The 14 months PvE drought. The two years since the last PvP map. The "short and unrewarding patch" that was "Rise of the Emperor". The people who stuck around for the incredibly bugged launch of SoR.

 

Your loyal customers are the people who already spend money on this game for the past years. You weren't rewarding your "loyal" customers. Let's not pretend this is in any way a reward. This is a retention meassure. You aren't rewarding loyalty. You are rewarding throwing money at you when there is nothing to justify 15€ a month. Not for quite a few of us anyway. Not a majority. Not "many" per se. But quite a few.

 

Yes, I love free stuff. Give me free stuff when you can. But don't give me free stuff when there is an apparent need to work on the game. Don't use the ressources you spend on the HK-55 chapter, no matter how minor they may be, on something as this. Use the manpower and money to actually make content. Free stuff is nice and dandy, but it can never be the sole reason you subscribe. Never. It's flavour, but content is substance.

 

You are perfectly aware that the content for the next months is thin. That's why you try to sweeten the deal with those "rewards". That is a serious sign of trouble. Are you actually that unconfident in your product? You believe you need those "subscriber rewards" to keep us around? Take that as a lesson. Focus on actually making the game worth to subscribe to.

 

You know what's happening. I know it. Everyone who is currently disliking the rewards does. Even you wouldn't subscribe to the game in it's current form, not as a veteran. Even you are seeing the flaw and the mess. You can't openly admit it, but it's there.

 

The mute conversations

 

This is a feature to remind you about KOTOR my "rear". This is a cost cutting measure. We both know it. Don't try to spin this as anything else. It's not a "KOTOR easter egg". A KOTOR easter egg would have been something like on Corellia: The quest where you activate the holos. Or the crashed Endar Spire. Not a feature that can magically decrease development cost.

 

Those are just some examples of my current issue. I'm not tired of my guild. Not even about Eternity Vault and Terror from Beyond either. I'm tired how you treat us customers like we are idiots. How you're trying to sell us every screw up and every lie as something amazing. That's why my guild is p*ssed. If you want to sh*t on my yard, just run away. That's bad. But trying to tell me that's a nice thing? That's downright insulting your communities intelligence.

 

Don't say one thing and then do the other. Don't hype stuff beyond compare, espescially when we know that isn't the case.

 

And for gods sake, work on the game. I couldn't care less for playing as HK-55 for 89.99€. Make the game worth paying 89.99€ over months, for each of the four pillars of the MMO. During release you spoke about those four pillars. How they were very important. Now you abandon three out of four.

 

At this point, dealing with Bioware is like dealing with a hypocrite. At this point, waiting for a screw up is not a question about "if" it will happen. It's just "when". And then you'll sell it to us as something "amazing". Or even a "new feature", like with the NiM gear. Yeah, right.

[twpotter]

I've been thinking about how to word this for some time. I don't want to make it sound as if I am attacking Bioware, but I feel this post will be a lot more aggressive than I intend it to be.

 

.

 

Quote edited for space.

 

But couldn't agree more with the sentiments expressed.

[IslanderRebel]

As long as they can make money

 

right on, bro.

 

Cash sinkage time.

too bad they didn't make that mount shoot snowballs at people like Eve online did on their 2nd or 3rd Anniversary xmas presents to players.

newbies shot their snowball missile launchers pummeling vets who retataliated with real ammo and proceeded to get waxed by Concord. lmao merry xmas cheesehead

[Swedguy]

The worst thing about me is the amount of bugs and the lack of communication. For example: the Romance Bug.

 

2 months, over 20k views, over 100 replies. And they've said nothing

[nissanmaxima]

I agree with the OP.

[Swedguy]

I would also like to say that the shared story is really underwelming: All characters, Darth Nox, Emperor's Wrath, Hero of Tython etc. all become pointless except for 1 imp character and 1 Rep character.

 

Until after Oricon where they all share a single story-line, making all other characters obsolete except for the character you turn bring through SOR and KOTFE.

[thelordofhate]

Attempting to discredit the content of a message based on the tone of the message is a feeble attempt at controlling the message itself. We have tried repeatedly to get the developers to listen to us, with absolutely no results. They refuse to admit that anything is even wrong here, and nothing could be further from the truth - these are not small bugs we're dealing with here, these are HUGE bugs that should have been caught in testing. And when some of us have spent WAY more on this game than just our subscriber fee (yes, I spend a LOT on cartel coins, and until now have never regretted it), we are responding in a manner that is befitting of the situation. I am not just angry with BioWare, I am absolutely incensed with them. I feel like I've paid my own money for a game that THEY broke, and that THEY are completely ignoring. I don't think it's in any way unreasonable to be absolutely furious at this point. All we (the extremely incensed subscribers) are asking for is for BioWare to admit that they completely screwed up here, and that they are redirecting all of their resources to fixing the extremely broken game before they add new content. Delaying the release of new content will not anger people anywhere near as much as the broken cartel market. I'd rather have a delay than a game that doesn't even work now.

[TriggerBlade]

When have bug fixes not taken the same time as they've taken currently,

 

Since launch if you consider the pink shirt glitch. 4 years and that bug STILL pops up on occasion. While I personally haven't experienced all of them, people are saying they've encountered bugs that existed in beta.

[Swedguy]

Since launch if you consider the pink shirt glitch. 4 years and that bug STILL pops up on occasion. While I personally haven't experienced all of them, people are saying they've encountered bugs that existed in beta.

There's also the bug where characters run forward by themselves. How long has that bug been around? At least two years I think.

[trueKieran]

I've been thinking about how to word this for some time.

Personally I think you managed to do it pretty well.

[Holocron]

Since launch if you consider the pink shirt glitch. 4 years and that bug STILL pops up on occasion. While I personally haven't experienced all of them, people are saying they've encountered bugs that existed in beta.

 

I still have a bug from 3.0 where one my characters always logs in with an invisible weapon drawn in a combat stance. I have cycle through weapon holster command to get him back to a normal state. People brought it up in the forums at the time, so I'm not the only with this bug either, but most have just given up on reporting it. The dev team seems to have fired their QA department, and really won't address bugs unless enough people make an uproar on the forums. Sadly, that is the only way to get anything changed around here.

[Divona]

I still have a bug from 3.0 where one my characters always logs in with an invisible weapon drawn in a combat stance. I have cycle through weapon holster command to get him back to a normal state.

 

Yes same for me with scoundrel annyoing bug and probably wont ever get fixed.

I dont recall bugs from beta as someone claimed but there are many bugs that have been for years. The one i remember when character wont stop autorunning and have to pretty much smash keyborad keys to end this cycle is still not fixed. There are many CM items clipping when mixed with each other while running around. But all those are now minor compared to latest bugs like GTN and events.

Edited December 21, 2015 by Divona

[Esron]

1 bug that has been here forever is SOA in EV just resetting, he still does that to this day, another bug thats been around forever is the "vanishing items" from peoples bank slots when they use the sort items button.

Tons of bugs that should have been fixed, but the worst one of all is maybe the customer service bug.. you know, the one that answers the phone if you call them.....

Edited December 21, 2015 by Esron

[santafaye]

With no ops no wz no new fps no content cant customize new companions like they said we could forcing us to pvp and do other bs to get comps this chapter thing is such a load of crap its almost like this game is heading down the city of hero path we will go to log in one day and the game will be gone and theres way to many companions we can only use one and only send what 5 or 6 out .if it aint broke dont fix it theres never any info always the same bs events even wow has boss fights for there events.the one guy said in one of the streams we will never take anything away if you have that one companion you really love we want you to use it lmao .but he forgot to say but not during story because we want to force you to use who we want not who you want.and he says i can confirm lana is a full companion if thats true why cant i customize her like jaesa and kira.you have a awesome game but your taking it to a place where no one wants to go give us back full expans let us play and enjoy the game .and i dont need another useless companion like hk-55 i have hk-51 this reskin **** is just bs .so for me you lied about customizing our companions .and with the lack of game and this chapter month thing players will leave for games that have full expansions and are mmo this game is like single player now you guys took a fun game and turned it into this congratz ..sigh i fell like i did so much in this game for nothing.i really hope you fix this ..sorry but it really does suck

[Karkais]

I still have a bug from 3.0 where one my characters always logs in with an invisible weapon drawn in a combat stance. I have cycle through weapon holster command to get him back to a normal state.

 

I have this problem with my agent, but interestingly enough, I believe it only surfaced after KOTFE launched.

[Kaedusz]

With no ops no wz no new fps no content cant customize new companions like they said we could forcing us to pvp and do other bs to get comps this chapter thing is such a load of crap its almost like this game is heading down the city of hero path we will go to log in one day and the game will be gone and theres way to many companions we can only use one and only send what 5 or 6 out .if it aint broke dont fix it theres never any info always the same bs events even wow has boss fights for there events.the one guy said in one of the streams we will never take anything away if you have that one companion you really love we want you to use it lmao .but he forgot to say but not during story because we want to force you to use who we want not who you want.and he says i can confirm lana is a full companion if thats true why cant i customize her like jaesa and kira.you have a awesome game but your taking it to a place where no one wants to go give us back full expans let us play and enjoy the game .and i dont need another useless companion like hk-55 i have hk-51 this reskin **** is just bs .so for me you lied about customizing our companions .and with the lack of game and this chapter month thing players will leave for games that have full expansions and are mmo this game is like single player now you guys took a fun game and turned it into this congratz ..sigh i fell like i did so much in this game for nothing.i really hope you fix this ..sorry but it really does suck

 

http://cdn.meme.am/instances/500x/62129461.jpg

Edited December 22, 2015 by Kaedusz

[Costello]

I've been thinking about how to word this for some time. I don't want to make it sound as if I am attacking Bioware, but I feel this post will be a lot more aggressive than I intend it to be.

 

There is one major problem I have with Bioware. It's not so much on Eric. He is only the messenger. He's being told what to tell us. The problem is with the people telling him what to tell us. I'll word this question as careful as I can:

 

Do you think we are retarded?

 

Guys, you can cover a pile of sh*t in as much cologne as you want. It will be a pile of sh*t all the same. You are trying to sell us a pile of said substance, while at the same time trying to make it sound as if it is the most awesome thing ever. Like...the MMORPG industry has never seen something that awesome before!

 

Let's go over a few things which happened recently:

 

NiM operations don't drop nightmare gear.

 

There is no reasonable explanation for this. The only explanation is that you are trying to increase the time spend gearing up our characters. You have not delivered sufficient (new) content. Now you are trying to artificaly increase the old content. It's just that simple. Instead you're trying to tell us that NiM is only relevant for titles and decorations. And where would that imply that nightmare gear should not drop? Does dropping titles and decorations in any way invalidate the need for nightmare gear?

 

You know the answer. It doesn't. It's a desperate try to increase the grind and artificaly blend over the missing (new) content. The most disturbing thing about all of this is how you went back to the blog in question and edited it to make it sound as if that was always intended. Guys, at least own up to it. We can read page history and code. You've screwed up big time, but you don't want to admit it.

 

Subscriber rewards

 

It's not special. You advertised this as "interesting for loyal customers.". No, it's not interesting for loyal customers. Loyal customers are the people who stuck with this game through the worst. Ravager exploit. This recent exploit. The 14 months PvE drought. The two years since the last PvP map. The "short and unrewarding patch" that was "Rise of the Emperor". The people who stuck around for the incredibly bugged launch of SoR.

 

Your loyal customers are the people who already spend money on this game for the past years. You weren't rewarding your "loyal" customers. Let's not pretend this is in any way a reward. This is a retention meassure. You aren't rewarding loyalty. You are rewarding throwing money at you when there is nothing to justify 15€ a month. Not for quite a few of us anyway. Not a majority. Not "many" per se. But quite a few.

 

Yes, I love free stuff. Give me free stuff when you can. But don't give me free stuff when there is an apparent need to work on the game. Don't use the ressources you spend on the HK-55 chapter, no matter how minor they may be, on something as this. Use the manpower and money to actually make content. Free stuff is nice and dandy, but it can never be the sole reason you subscribe. Never. It's flavour, but content is substance.

 

You are perfectly aware that the content for the next months is thin. That's why you try to sweeten the deal with those "rewards". That is a serious sign of trouble. Are you actually that unconfident in your product? You believe you need those "subscriber rewards" to keep us around? Take that as a lesson. Focus on actually making the game worth to subscribe to.

 

You know what's happening. I know it. Everyone who is currently disliking the rewards does. Even you wouldn't subscribe to the game in it's current form, not as a veteran. Even you are seeing the flaw and the mess. You can't openly admit it, but it's there.

 

The mute conversations

 

This is a feature to remind you about KOTOR my "rear". This is a cost cutting measure. We both know it. Don't try to spin this as anything else. It's not a "KOTOR easter egg". A KOTOR easter egg would have been something like on Corellia: The quest where you activate the holos. Or the crashed Endar Spire. Not a feature that can magically decrease development cost.

 

Those are just some examples of my current issue. I'm not tired of my guild. Not even about Eternity Vault and Terror from Beyond either. I'm tired how you treat us customers like we are idiots. How you're trying to sell us every screw up and every lie as something amazing. That's why my guild is p*ssed. If you want to sh*t on my yard, just run away. That's bad. But trying to tell me that's a nice thing? That's downright insulting your communities intelligence.

 

Don't say one thing and then do the other. Don't hype stuff beyond compare, espescially when we know that isn't the case.

 

And for gods sake, work on the game. I couldn't care less for playing as HK-55 for 89.99€. Make the game worth paying 89.99€ over months, for each of the four pillars of the MMO. During release you spoke about those four pillars. How they were very important. Now you abandon three out of four.

 

At this point, dealing with Bioware is like dealing with a hypocrite. At this point, waiting for a screw up is not a question about "if" it will happen. It's just "when". And then you'll sell it to us as something "amazing". Or even a "new feature", like with the NiM gear. Yeah, right.

 

Because it needed Quoting.

 

The game is pretty bad, but the community team/devs thinking that players are fooled by any of it is even worse.

 

Perhaps though the joke is on the players who kept supporting the game. Everyone hopes that things would get better. How insane is it to believe that the dev team would be working on something awesome or unprecedented when the past few years have shown so very little.

 

Come on this is from people that thought level 60 and getting to play the 10 or so hours of Kofte was in some way inspired. If people didn't play through the original game with 8 class stories and massive worlds to explore the Kofte experience was not going to get people interested.

 

Choices would matter! Its part of the hype and yet they don't. Even the loss of a companion WHICH HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH CHOICE is reversed if you pay for 7 months subscription.

 

They ditch 5 unique companions and give us 30 generics. Streamline companions get rid of those that are under used but don't just give 30 reskined companions it was the worst of all possible ideas. And the new ones can't even have their appearance changed.

 

Bump the galaxy on 5 years except on every planet except 2? Have the Emperor do a complete 180 story change with no explanation and think people wouldn't notice. On my smuggler his told his not that bright on Ziost and a few days later his the emperors chosen. Seriously up until Ziost he didn't even known who he was and then he tried to flirt with them... this is not the leader of a revolution. As for the outlander title that is a title held by everyone not from Ziost, even the dialogue reflects this an outlander kill the eternal emperor not THE outlander. That is akin to saying a foreigner did it and then thinking that is a title of note.

 

As has been mentioned in other threads it seems the staff get to take most of December off (and please show you don't have a real job by suggesting that is normal or people should be allowed to spend time with their families). It seems that when they are at work what they put out isn't great. Of the 10 hours of new story we have a small fight, imprisonment, running, repairing, running, repairing, hiring, running. Where is the epic scope, where was the deep character arcs where was the galaxy spanning war. In that 10 hours nearly every useful question or even a starting question of where is my husband/wife was not answered. Surely while the coders and designers were working the writers could plot each companion characters arc and put one line in saying last we heard of Risha was she... rather than leaving it with a 3 year old e-mail.

[Holocron]

I have this problem with my agent, but interestingly enough, I believe it only surfaced after KOTFE launched.

 

It's on my Agent too, lol.

[ArenCordial]

I've been thinking about how to word this for some time. I don't want to make it sound as if I am attacking Bioware, but I feel this post will be a lot more aggressive than I intend it to be.

 

There is one major problem I have with Bioware. It's not so much on Eric. He is only the messenger. He's being told what to tell us. The problem is with the people telling him what to tell us. I'll word this question as careful as I can:

 

Do you think we are retarded?

 

Guys, you can cover a pile of sh*t in as much cologne as you want. It will be a pile of sh*t all the same. You are trying to sell us a pile of said substance, while at the same time trying to make it sound as if it is the most awesome thing ever. Like...the MMORPG industry has never seen something that awesome before!

 

Let's go over a few things which happened recently:

 

NiM operations don't drop nightmare gear.

 

There is no reasonable explanation for this. The only explanation is that you are trying to increase the time spend gearing up our characters. You have not delivered sufficient (new) content. Now you are trying to artificaly increase the old content. It's just that simple. Instead you're trying to tell us that NiM is only relevant for titles and decorations. And where would that imply that nightmare gear should not drop? Does dropping titles and decorations in any way invalidate the need for nightmare gear?

 

You know the answer. It doesn't. It's a desperate try to increase the grind and artificaly blend over the missing (new) content. The most disturbing thing about all of this is how you went back to the blog in question and edited it to make it sound as if that was always intended. Guys, at least own up to it. We can read page history and code. You've screwed up big time, but you don't want to admit it.

 

Subscriber rewards

 

It's not special. You advertised this as "interesting for loyal customers.". No, it's not interesting for loyal customers. Loyal customers are the people who stuck with this game through the worst. Ravager exploit. This recent exploit. The 14 months PvE drought. The two years since the last PvP map. The "short and unrewarding patch" that was "Rise of the Emperor". The people who stuck around for the incredibly bugged launch of SoR.

 

Your loyal customers are the people who already spend money on this game for the past years. You weren't rewarding your "loyal" customers. Let's not pretend this is in any way a reward. This is a retention meassure. You aren't rewarding loyalty. You are rewarding throwing money at you when there is nothing to justify 15€ a month. Not for quite a few of us anyway. Not a majority. Not "many" per se. But quite a few.

 

Yes, I love free stuff. Give me free stuff when you can. But don't give me free stuff when there is an apparent need to work on the game. Don't use the ressources you spend on the HK-55 chapter, no matter how minor they may be, on something as this. Use the manpower and money to actually make content. Free stuff is nice and dandy, but it can never be the sole reason you subscribe. Never. It's flavour, but content is substance.

 

You are perfectly aware that the content for the next months is thin. That's why you try to sweeten the deal with those "rewards". That is a serious sign of trouble. Are you actually that unconfident in your product? You believe you need those "subscriber rewards" to keep us around? Take that as a lesson. Focus on actually making the game worth to subscribe to.

 

You know what's happening. I know it. Everyone who is currently disliking the rewards does. Even you wouldn't subscribe to the game in it's current form, not as a veteran. Even you are seeing the flaw and the mess. You can't openly admit it, but it's there.

 

The mute conversations

 

This is a feature to remind you about KOTOR my "rear". This is a cost cutting measure. We both know it. Don't try to spin this as anything else. It's not a "KOTOR easter egg". A KOTOR easter egg would have been something like on Corellia: The quest where you activate the holos. Or the crashed Endar Spire. Not a feature that can magically decrease development cost.

 

Those are just some examples of my current issue. I'm not tired of my guild. Not even about Eternity Vault and Terror from Beyond either. I'm tired how you treat us customers like we are idiots. How you're trying to sell us every screw up and every lie as something amazing. That's why my guild is p*ssed. If you want to sh*t on my yard, just run away. That's bad. But trying to tell me that's a nice thing? That's downright insulting your communities intelligence.

 

Don't say one thing and then do the other. Don't hype stuff beyond compare, espescially when we know that isn't the case.

 

And for gods sake, work on the game. I couldn't care less for playing as HK-55 for 89.99€. Make the game worth paying 89.99€ over months, for each of the four pillars of the MMO. During release you spoke about those four pillars. How they were very important. Now you abandon three out of four.

 

At this point, dealing with Bioware is like dealing with a hypocrite. At this point, waiting for a screw up is not a question about "if" it will happen. It's just "when". And then you'll sell it to us as something "amazing". Or even a "new feature", like with the NiM gear. Yeah, right.

 

Thank you very much for some how voicing the frustrations I've had in coherent manner.

[Shwarzchild]

After seeing the Bounty week is broken, and they don't even care to fix it I'm done trying to defend this Bioware team. Frustrating.

[DarthJimilingus]

After seeing the Bounty week is broken, and they don't even care to fix it I'm done trying to defend this Bioware team. Frustrating.

 

Beyond belief. I mean i know that they said the team was taking some time off but did they leave anyone in charge?

[well]

Beyond belief. I mean i know that they said the team was taking some time off but did they leave anyone in charge?

 

Yes. Biff The Understudy:eek:

[Colow_Leper]

Well, I admit that I have been wondering whether I should carry on subbing - I did the 4.0 stuff twice, and have been levelling all my other alts outside of the new content (couldn't cope with the repetition! - I know that many can, more power to 'em, but it's not for me).

 

So I've gone back to running ops etc - but therein lies a problem....

Our guild (and, having talked to some other players that I know, at least 3 other guilds to my personal knowledge) is losing members so fast that it's starting to become difficult to run an operation at all. The last 3 operations that we ran had PUGS in them - one of them had only 4 guild members in it. Prior to 4.0, we had to make sure that we were logged in and ready to go, if we were to get a place on a 16 man - now we're having problems filling 8 man ops. The characters are still in our guild - they just don't log on any more.

 

I know this sort of thing happens in every MMO - people stop logging on for any number of reasons, whether real world problems or game related. What I'm worried about is the speed of the drop off this time. I know that there are new players coming in - I've grouped with them (god help me - they haven't got a clue, bless 'em). But the "old lags" in the game seem to be disappearing at an alarming rate.

 

It may be that EA has decided to pretty much drop the traditional MMO player in favour of the Star Wars fan base generated by the new films. I hope not - I really enjoyed this game!

[rasputein]

Well, I admit that I have been wondering whether I should carry on subbing - I did the 4.0 stuff twice, and have been levelling all my other alts outside of the new content (couldn't cope with the repetition! - I know that many can, more power to 'em, but it's not for me).

 

So I've gone back to running ops etc - but therein lies a problem....

Our guild (and, having talked to some other players that I know, at least 3 other guilds to my personal knowledge) is losing members so fast that it's starting to become difficult to run an operation at all. The last 3 operations that we ran had PUGS in them - one of them had only 4 guild members in it. Prior to 4.0, we had to make sure that we were logged in and ready to go, if we were to get a place on a 16 man - now we're having problems filling 8 man ops. The characters are still in our guild - they just don't log on any more.

 

I know this sort of thing happens in every MMO - people stop logging on for any number of reasons, whether real world problems or game related. What I'm worried about is the speed of the drop off this time. I know that there are new players coming in - I've grouped with them (god help me - they haven't got a clue, bless 'em). But the "old lags" in the game seem to be disappearing at an alarming rate.

 

It may be that EA has decided to pretty much drop the traditional MMO player in favour of the Star Wars fan base generated by the new films. I hope not - I really enjoyed this game!

 

This is what iv been saying in other threads, the rate that seasoned players are dropping is the fastest iv ever seen in any MMO besides maybe Warhammer Online. In Sept before 4.0 hit the guild my toon is in had a steady primetime number of 45-50, non-primetime it had around 20-25 on at all times, we had 3 steady set PvE raid teams that you had to gear check and pars to get a spot on and you had to try out to get a PvP guild tag to get in the set PvP grps, enough people that they could be picky and make sure you where properly set up for said activity (if you where not they would get you there), this is a long standing established guild that has been around since launch (in fact we where having to dump alts to fit more new people when xpac hit)...now you log in (and these people didn't leave the guild, toons are there still, they have just moved on) and primetime hits about 20, non-primetime about 6-8, the other night I logged on to get the Darth Malgus armor before my sub expire and credit limit hit, it was 730pm pst (primetime for the guild) 6 people where on, jumped up to 9, then stayed at 7 until I logged 2hrs later........this new terrible xpac coupled with the one after another bugs and atrocious CS has killed this game imho.