The Incompetence of Bioware is Astounding.

[Ghisallo]

"There is little in this expac to justify not simply the number of bugs but how stupidly long it takes to fix them"

 

Stop. Think about that statement. Compare this to the content from before, say 3.0, and revisit that line of logic. There isn't "a little" in this content. There's quite a bit. You have to go outside the story to see it iall. 9 operations from story mode to hard mode re-scaled. How many flashpoints re-scaled? How many heroics re-done? 9 chapters worth of integrated cinematics and areas of zakuul/ asylum, gravestone etc. New characters included. Star fortresses, alliance. The idea that "this expac is this tiny little thing is truly the most brain dead thign I might have ever heard you say. You're literally doing what I accused you of before by taking a premise, and filling in the blanks with only things you know can support it and by doing so totally screwing up the point. Whether there's a lot of content available for you in this expac is one thing i.e content you truly love and want more of

 

If you're going to act like there's nothing in this expansion then you're just not being realistic and you shouldn't taken seriously. Look at 3.0 for game breaking bugs. The final Revan fight? Ravagers? I mean come on. You can't just ignore the pasts because you want to. It's DECEMBER. This expac has been live for how long? Almost 2? How long did 3.0 bugs take to fix? It's simply not as simple as you want to believe it to be. 2 months of live, and also where we know that there will be down time from the employees since they've earned a break and are taking advantage of it? This is what I'm talking about from earlier. This is a slow time for the game. Every expac launches, and then the slow time follows. Which is why February will be the tell tale month.. Slow down!

 

I don't think you understand the issues, or lack there of, with not just rescaling but the way they went about it, whether with bolster or lvl sync. I'll use the bolster as an example. Now the way they initially explained it I thought the content was going to scale to level. Now THAT takes a metric butt ton of work. However when you have 4 years of metrics regarding dps, hps, gear scaling etc, creating one level and then just bolstering? That is actually more grunt work than "think" work. In doing this they also broke GRAPHICS components somehow and mob respawns? Now either the modified hero engine they are using is buggered all to hell and back OR they are not just understaffed but, tbh, incompetent.

 

Was there a fair amount of code change? Not just a little yes... BUT a lot of the stuff that makes it work is actually simply variations on the same exact theme. Now again, I understand why it was done this way "need a big subscription boost with new and returning players"+ "they crushed our budget" will do this to you, but the point still stands.

 

Examples:

-Explain to me how a level sync component addition will make it so mobs in the open world do not desapwn?

-Explain to me how a leveling up of an OP in terms of mob damage and HP will make a GRAPHICS component (rocks dropping from the ceiling making it so you do not walk in fiery lava) only appear if, as they are dropping, you are looking at the ceiling?

-Explain how they allowed the exploit in as silly as that one and THEN let it exist for almost 2 months after extensive reporting?

-How do you break an event that has existed for howmany years?

 

I could go on but things that should be completely unrelated to many of the changes got broken... AND that completely ignores the fact that, more than likely the server issues, that resulted in rolebacks, were likely caused by what ever steps they took to FINALLY investigate an exploit reported to them over 6 weeks ago.

 

You can argue semantics about what is and what is not a lot of work until the sun dies and the solar system with it, but they have had their budget slashed and this expac SHINES with the results of that slash (and if need be I will give the page and a half of proof the budget was slashed) if you bother to look at the Expac holistically across the board and not simply myopically at the things we may like.

 

Trust me I tried to like this expac really hard... I am one of those players who gets VERY invested in their characters, hell my wife, half jokingly, says I am obsessed with whatever game I play in a dedicated fashion atm. I am the person that is the "classic" fanboi if I am honest, but eventually the fish bat hits me in the head enough times even I have to say wth?

 

There is an old saying, the first step in solving a problem is acknowledging there is a problem.

Edited December 18, 2015 by Ghisallo

[CrazyCT]

There is nothing new....like, nothing new, stop playing fanboy because there is NOTHING new....being in denial does not help anyone. The expansion and the content within can be done under a month, and after that doing it again with different conversation choices alters nothing.

Editing that rant slightly (I don't think I'm changing the tone of it, just trying to point out what you said) - "Nothing new...like, nothing new...NOTHING new...expansion and the content". So there is nothing new, but an expansion and new content? Which is it, it can't be both. Whether you can do it in under a month or not, it's new. And I know they advertised it as "Your choice matters", but that was just marketing. Besides the first boss in Esselles/Black Talon, I can't think of a single time in any part of the game that your conversation choices changed anything of consequence, let alone the main line of the story.

"You've never went past SM OPs, but you are complaining of the lack of endgame content. I'll just leave that comment as is, I don't think it needs anything else."

 

Point being what? You just proved my point as some...one who considers content to be doing the same on a harder difficulty, so I will just leave you with that and let ppl, sorry people decide to sort this out for themselves.

My point being that there is endgame content out there, you have chosen not to do it. That's perfectly fine and your right as a (former?) subscriber. But to complain about lack of endgame (or, rather, elder game) content when you have chosen not to do it? It's like complaining about being wet but choosing not to come in out the rain. So, what is it you ARE looking for in ways of elder game then? More story? You want the programmers to code content faster than you can walk through it? Another PvP map? But then you don't want repeatable content, so they'd have to keep designing and coding more and more maps.

I have read this kind of response on fleet and I just do not get how doing the same on a harder difficulty is anything but time spent doing the same.

And that is not in anyway like doing PvP over and over? At least when you do HM/NiM mode OPs, you are increasing the challenge. With PvP, the only way you can increase the challenge is to do Ranked, but you're still only playing against other people, and quite possibly the same people you played against in Unranked.

If you can not see that the so-called veterans, (sorry if it makes you butthurt, but yeah) the old ones who have been around for some time find the amount of content lacking, and do not chase achievements...which again, is about time past and not time spent, as you can not get the Founder title again, and, not to be in your face, but it means only that you saw how the game started, and what it was, and what it could have been, compared to what it is today.

The expectations and the first experience "we" had when the game came out.

Who are these "veterans" you are speaking for? Can they not speak for themselves? Did they vote you in as a spokesperson? Funnily enough, I don't know if this qualifies me as a 'veteran', but I am also a 'Founder' (I hate when people throw that in, but people like you seem to think it has some gravitas) and that is not my opinion. If it was your opinion (you know, like you claimed you were only giving your opinion later in your argument) you wouldn't say that. You don't know what every other 'veteran' player, or even what most veteran players feel. All you have to go on are the opinions of a few players, out of how many hundreds of thousands or millions? So you are basing your assumption on the views of a miniscule percentage. Most people I play with are excited about KOTFE and the coming content, the only people I've seen complaining about any 'lack of content' have been on these forums. So, again, I ask you, please, don't speak on behalf of a large percentage of the game.

If you do not get that part then please enjoy your HM/NiM content and the recycle of what we have had for years, or just not to hurt your feelings, what I had for years.

Yup, I'm totally confused again. You said you didn't do anything past SM OPs? But you're complaining about having to suffer with the recycling of HM/NiM?

Just for the likes of you I will end it with something you can relate to, or at least I hope so. I wanted new content, something new to experience and I had that with KotFE. It lasted for about two weeks and now it is done. And yeah, about forum posts, they are always about one person giving his opinion, which apparently in your case helped me more to prove my own views than my original post.

Ty for that.

Just my two cents

Oh, see, you did manage to give just your opinion. I knew you could do it. You're welcome. Glad I could help you give your opinion.

[Shwarzchild]

I don't think you understand the issues, or lack there of with rescaling, and then a generic "bolster" based on level to boost people up or level sync to nerf them down. Now the way they initially explained it I thought the content was going to scale to level. Now THAT takes a metric butt ton of work. However when you have 4 years of metrics regarding dps, hps, gear scaling etc, creating one level and then just bolstering? That is actually more grunt work than "think" work. In doing this they also broke GRAPHICS components somehow. Now either the modified hero engine they are using is buggered all to hell and back OR they are understaffed and, tbh, incompetent.

 

Was there a fair amount of code change? Not just a little yes... BUT a lot of the stuff that makes it work is actually simply variations on the same exact theme. Now again, I understand why it was done this way "need a big subscription boost with new and returning players"+ "they crushed our budget" will do this to you, but the point still stands.

 

Examples:

-Explain to me how a level sync component addition will make it so mobs in the open world do not desapwn?

-Explain to me how a leveling up of an OP in terms of mob damage and HP will make a GRAPHICS component (rocks dropping from the ceiling making it so you do not walk in fiery lava) only appear if, as they are dropping, you are looking at the ceiling?

-Explain how they allowed the exploit in?

 

I could go on but things that should be completely unrelated to many of the changes got broken... AND that completely ignores the fact that, more than likely the server issues, that resulted in rolebacks, were likely caused by what ever steps they took to FINALLY investigate an exploit reported to them over 6 weeks ago.

 

You can argue semantics about what is and what is not a lot of work until the sun dies and the solar system with it, but they have had their budget slashed and this expac SHINES with the results of that slash (and if need be I will give the page and a half of proof the budget was slashed) if you bother to look at the Expac holistically across the board and not simply myopically at the things we may like.

 

Trust me I tried to like this expac really hard... I am one of those players who gets VERY invested in their characters, hell my wife, half jokingly, says I am obsessed with whatever game I play in a dedicated fashion atm. I am the person that is the "classic" fanboi if I am honest, but eventually the fish bat hits me in the head enough times even I have to say wth?

 

EV is fixed. It's been fixed for a little while now. The exploit has been since closed correct? So you're trying to hold them hostage for what? They were too slow for you maybe? Could the server roll back, or even the corpse despawn issue, be totally unrelated to Kotfe and more because the game is 4 years old and servers require maintenance from time to time? More things go wrong with your car the longer you own it i.e it requires more maintenance. From what I can understand these things happen, have happened before, and when going live with content they will continue to crop up in each and every game that adds content. In an ever fluid game to say no bug shall ever crop up seems far fetched to me. Sitting there and saying that bioware is totally incompetent because they weren't able to fix things in some immediate ideal time frame is just expanding too far. Acting like things never happen is just insane to me.

 

It comes down to you having a subjective basis for your arguments. you are neither right nor wrong. But, you play off as if you do know it all when you seriously have NO idea. You ignore what we already know to further the discontent we find here, and it's just awful. It's why I said in another thread you either have an agenda, or have your head in the clouds in regards to what you think you know.

 

I'll withhold judgement on the breadth of the expansion until everything has been released. It's my belief that you're judging an incomplete product because you are annoyed that you don't have more content to play. Fair enough. At least, either internally or verbally, admit to yourself that the expansion isn't finished. It's not like Shadow of Revan where the entire expansion was laid out at our feet from day 1. But, you want to treat it as such.

[AAAAAAJKKRRYZZ]

I unsubbed for this exact reason. Until the last couple weeks, when everything seemed to happen at once (nim loot "fix" announced, slingers becoming irrelevant, events broken, general bugs, delayed content, game breaking exploit being fixed after six weeks with little to no retribution, etc) I had some faith or at least hope that BW would get their stuff together. After all of those things happening in like ten days I lost all faith and unsubbed. I leave behind three nim raid groups, two of which have also fallen apart completely due to lack of interest/incentive to keep raiding. PVP is broken because of sage/sorc healers, especially with the two biggest burst classes being nerfed. FPs are pointless, gear prog is broken, and we wont see a new raid until late 2016, earliest.

 

And why should I stay subbed for the next nine months? To play as HK? No thanks.

[Styxian]

I don't think they're incompetent, I think they're severely understuffed. It seems like they can't afford the team size required to maintain / bugfix the game of this size properly while also developing new content.

[AAAAAAJKKRRYZZ]

I don't think they're incompetent, I think they're severely understuffed. It seems like they can't afford the team size required to maintain / bugfix the game of this size properly while also developing new content.

 

That is definition incompetence as far as long term strategy goes for the game. I dont think people are talking technically incompetent, like they suck at coding, but BW is incompetent at managing this game.

[Styxian]

That is definition incompetence as far as long term strategy goes for the game. I dont think people are talking technically incompetent, like they suck at coding, but BW is incompetent at managing this game.

But then it's EA, not BW. EA as publisher is responsible for the size and funding of the dev team allocated for the project.

Edited December 18, 2015 by Styxian

[AAAAAAJKKRRYZZ]

But then it's EA, not BW. EA as publisher is responsible for the size and funding of the dev team allocated for the project.

 

You dont necessarily know how EA does its budgeting. It could give big tent BW a pot of money and they decide how to spend it. I can see EA intervening and setting deadlines, but that would be a lot of micromanagement for such a big company to go down that far into the smaller offices of all of their affiliates. Also, even if EA did do that then it is up to BW execs to convince EA to give them more money.

Edited December 18, 2015 by AAAAAAJKKRRYZZ

[TUXs]

Endgame needs love. We know it. I assume Bioware knows it.

Not to pick on you, I agree with everything I stripped out of your reply except for this part...

 

I don't think Bioware understands it. I think Bioware is oblivious to the desires of their customers. They don't talk with us, they don't interact with us, they don't seem to understand anything except cancelled subs, which is why they reverted the companion nerf. I would love to assume they know what we want, but 4.0 proved that hope to be folly.

 

Maybe you're right...but I just feel like since 4.0, this game has become one massive cluster ****.

 

Star Wars: The Force Awakens released today...has the only Star Wars MMO tried to capitalize on any part of that? NO! But every other market has, even other MMOs, have! I find the current state of things to be extremely depressing right now...I don't believe EA cares about this title and I think Bioware has proven their complete incompetence far too long.

[Highborne]

I don't think they're incompetent, I think they're severely understuffed. It seems like they can't afford the team size required to maintain / bugfix the game of this size properly while also developing new content.

 

So the incompetence is on management side. It's still incompetence.

[Ghisallo]

EV is fixed. It's been fixed for a little while now. The exploit has been since closed correct?

 

after 6 weeks and the way the chose to track "offenders" rounded up more than a few innocents as well. It is the when and how of a fix that is just as important if you care to look objectively at things.

 

So you're trying to hold them hostage for what? They were too slow for you maybe? Could the server roll back, or even the corpse despawn issue, be totally unrelated to Kotfe and more because the game is 4 years old and servers require maintenance from time to time?

 

I expect things to be done in a timely manner, absofreakinglutley. The bit about "aging servers." Well lets say you are right and the old saying of "i don't believe in coincidence is true. Then they have piss poor infrastructure management. These companies know the average life expectancy of their hardware and swap it out regularly otherwise.

 

More things go wrong with your car the longer you own it i.e it requires more maintenance.

False equivalency?

 

It comes down to you having a subjective basis for your arguments.

The fact that I am miffed at the dirth of new content yes, that is indeed subjective. The bit about the bugs exploits etc... nope not subjective all.

 

-I can post timelines if you like that make coincidence all but impossible on issued like the serve "POOF" and rollback.

-quotes from devs in the past where they talk about what is and what is not a hard/expensive part of their development etc.

-copies of PMs sent by myself, and posts from others on the forums asking about the exploit almost 2 months before the got around to fixing it.

-screen shots of CM purchase records that show there is nothing there that identifies what was purchased thus justifying the CSR's saying sorry can't refund Cartel Coins and can't refund an item I can't verify you purchased.

 

Sadly at work I have NOTHING to do between about 230 am and 6 am 40 hours a week to research everything the game I play puts out officially, what others data mine and the anecdotal experiences posted on the forums and other sources.

 

Hell I HATE WoW and this thread actually made me defend them in relation to a game I LIKE because someone tried to laughingly claim an equivalency between WoW and SWTOR development. I almost felt dirty doing it.

 

really I think your last paragraph sums it up. You are willing to give them the benefit of the doubt. I have adopted what my father used to say when I was "the problem child" as a kid 30 odd years ago... "I'm from Missouri, Show Me." The benefit of the doubt sailed roughly around Ziost.

[Pagy]

I expect things to be done in a timely manner, absofreakinglutley. The bit about "aging servers." Well lets say you are right and the old saying of "i don't believe in coincidence is true. Then they have piss poor infrastructure management. These companies know the average life expectancy of their hardware and swap it out regularly otherwise.

they more than likely don't own any hardware and pay for managed services.

 

and given that it's bioware, pay for the absolute minimum.

[CrazyCT]

Yeah, cause it's better to pay more? Of course they are going to try to find a cheaper option. It's called

, pay as little as you can out, bring as much money as you can in. People keep forgetting this isn't a game, it's a business.

[brunelesky]

1º Only customer service for subscribers

ok I just wanted to play a bit, but to my surprise, my 2 characters were gone

not very high lvl, but they were mine!!

more than a week after my subscription , still no reply from the technical service, my characters still missing

decided to make myself one lvl 60 and try the new episode

 

to my surprise, after the first day of gaming, I can´t log with my lvl 60 character anymore

seems that my account email is not validated (wrong), and I need to give them a new email so they can send me "confirmation email"

done it 30 times now

no email received yet

bye bye again bioware

[SootyTX]

<snip>

 

You are willing to give them the benefit of the doubt. I have adopted what my father used to say when I was "the problem child" as a kid 30 odd years ago... "I'm from Missouri, Show Me." The benefit of the doubt sailed roughly around Ziost.

 

This is not intended in any way as a personal attack, so please don't take it that way, but throughout your posts here you have been claiming things regarding the exploit bans and rollback in particular with no evidence either. Others have stated absolute contrary experience regarding rollback refunds (also, without evidence) - but we are supposed to believe you just because you say so.

 

It cuts both ways - you are well within your rights not to believe certain things the devs and other posters say, as we are well within ours to not believe you. Just because you write 8 paragraphs of text each time doesn't make you any more right than someone that writes a single line.

 

Personally I have never once believed the protestations of the "falsely accused", even when I knew them, because very few will admit they cheated. And, for the record, things like the exploit are subjective, whether you like it or not. It didn't affect me one tiny little bit as I didn't use it and I never use the GTN. A quick poll around players I know in game has led to no discernible impact for them either.

[Pagy]

Yeah, cause it's better to pay more? Of course they are going to try to find a cheaper option. It's called

, pay as little as you can out, bring as much money as you can in. People keep forgetting this isn't a game, it's a business.

has nothing to do with what I said but thanks.

 

theres a difference between being cost effective, and being cheap.

 

being cheap means you go with a solution that breaks down and falls apart. ie bw and the hardware used for this game.

[Fyurii]

In all honesty, the only problem I have with post 4.0 is the removal of so much of the previous custom shells for us to craft.

I'm just glad I've still got much of them in the archive section of the crafting menu, but I really wish they'd bring them back for us to craft again.

Not just bring them back like they have been the old comms gear, through the alliance system, but so we can craft them again.

[Holocron]

Thank you OP for clearly stating what everyone here feels. You were spot on!

[well]

Funny thing is there are plenty of folks out playing the game. I jump on different chrs at different levels and factions and there are plenty of folks on the planets. I been here since early access and still play. Are there things I don't like. Sure. There are bugs that definitely need fixed. Still it is a good game overall otherwise I would of left. Still might but mostly because I been playing since the start. Like many others.

[well]

Thank you OP for clearly stating what everyone here feels. You were spot on!

 

No. Actually the OP didn't. Some maybe but not all.

[SootyTX]

No. Actually the OP didn't. Some maybe but not all.

 

This whole forum is a veritable pit of false-consensus bias masquerading as discussion lately

[TripleOG]

If the OP doesn't have anything positive to say, why expect it from me?

 

The large wall of text might more effectively be rendered as:

 

"Bioware's focus on story with this expansion isn't working for me. I think they could more profitably focus on the other aspects of the game: raiding, PvP, etc. Also, I feel they should pick up the pace on bug fixes, even if it means they must work through the holidays."

 

Unfortunately, stripped of the hyperbole, inaccurate blanket generalizations, and large chunks of diatribe, what you get is a calm, brief statement of opinion.

 

I wonder what game all the EA nut huggers will play after all the SWTOR servers shut down.

[CrazyCT]

Is it ironic that there are people who actually believe that by leaving they will force Bioware to remodel the game to suit what they wanted?

 

a) You are no longer part of the game, so why would they cater to you

b) They won't hear your opinions/complaints

c) You are basically cutting their funding, making it harder for them to make more new shiny stuff.

 

Something something cutting your own nose off....

[well]

This whole forum is a veritable pit of false-consensus bias masquerading as discussion lately

 

Ain't that the truth...lol

[twpotter]

Is it ironic that there are people who actually believe that by leaving they will force Bioware to remodel the game to suit what they wanted?

 

a) You are no longer part of the game, so why would they cater to you

b) They won't hear your opinions/complaints

c) You are basically cutting their funding, making it harder for them to make more new shiny stuff.

 

Something something cutting your own nose off....

 

Just as i wouldn't buy a slightly faulty laptop (at least if i did, i could take it back and get a refund!) I will not be paying for a slightly and continuously faulty game. My sub runs out in 7 days after almost 4 years continuous 6 monthly renewals.

The game is definitely worth playing for free!.

 

If a company makes a faulty product it wont sell well. Therefore they are forced to make a better one or go bust.

 

This has nothing to do with cutting noses off. In fact by continuing to sub you are condoning Biowares shocking behaviour across the board, in pvp, ops, general content and customer support.