Level synch = Revival of SWTOR

[Max_Killjoy]

The expansion's early access starts in less than 3 weeks...it's too late to worry about compromises. It's a done deal.

 

They came back and added an opt-out for 12x eventually, so it could happen.

[EnkiduNineEight]

I am not a fan of it, but I'm trying to see the upside too. Another benefit I thought of is, I can go back and do all the mission I skip while using 12xp. I already plan to do this with world arch etc, so it will be nice to get appropriate gear, xp, and credits instead of nothing. At least that how I understood it, I am worried about this feature being very buggy and causing a lot of trouble. Hopeful they did there testing.

 

Except most of that gear is useless. You no longer have to gear companions, and it will not be better than the other stuff you can already obtain.

 

Guild Wars introduced their system as part of a game where doing all the quests etc would not level you up to cap. BioWare already streamlined leveling to the point where you barely have to do anything to level to cap. So, the number of people working backwards will not really increase too much, outside of their alliance system.

 

Its basically a way to recycle content and force people to go back and do missions they complained about having to do multiple times and making them do them multiple times anyway, so I see sweet irony in the future if the game lasts that much longer as all the people who *****ed and whined for 12x XP will now be upset that all the content they were able to skip they now have to go back and do to advance their Alliance.

 

Ah well, I'd already resubbed 6 months automatically, but I'm on the fence about anything past that.

[EnkiduNineEight]

Adding this to this thread as well.

 

Delicious Irony Incoming:

 

People demanded 12x and easier leveling because they got tired of having to do the same planetary quests repeatedly on multiple characters. They didn't want to do this content.

 

BioWare capitulates and gives them what they want. Here's 12x XP.

 

12x XP does further damage to the game (Servers I have knowledge of have lost player density) Bioware gets their metrics and decides that the way to increase density is to make people go back and do past content/planets and level scale people there so the level 60+'s coming back are not overpowering the prior content overly much.

 

To encourage the level 60+ players to do this, they purpose all the current content with rewards fro a new Alliance system.

 

So all these people who absolutely loved 12x because it allowed them to get to end game and avoid repeating content are now going to find that end game consists of repeating the content they wanted to avoid.

 

So.. hah. We'll see how this works out. I expect to see consistent whining in a few months from people who are bored of having to repeat planetary content jus to get Alliance points.

[Jaseja]

I just wanted to thank Bioware for the upcoming level sync feature. Finally there is a reason to go back to old planets because they are not "grey quality" like before. My biggest issue with MMORPG's in general is, that first game companies build these huge beautiful maps to play in, but once you outlevel them they become "grey" and meaningless. Not only does the map become mostly meaningless when outleveled, but it also prevents you from helping your friends and guildies, because they get no XP with you.

 

I LOVE helping lowbie guildies and friends, but usually it's COMPLETELY impossible due to the XP loss if I join party, and let's be honest, it sucks the joy of the game if you one shot everything. So how is it even possible in the first place that these games are designed in such a way, these massively MULTIPLAYER games, that it's impossible to join friends unless you always have a character at their level, always need to create new one and keep the character at their level if you want to enjoy the game with friends while leveling?

 

Long overdue mandatory feature, thank you so much for level sync. It's a blessing for people who like to multiplay this massive multiplayer. Soloers can still solo everything so it's pointless to whine, you don't lose your high level abilities and downscaled characters are always at the maximum power level of the current area, making you effectively still immortal.

[sosolidshoe]

I just wanted to thank Bioware for the upcoming level sync feature. Finally there is a reason to go back to old planets because they are not "grey quality" like before. My biggest issue with MMORPG's in general is, that first game companies build these huge beautiful maps to play in, but once you outlevel them they become "grey" and meaningless. Not only does the map become mostly meaningless when outleveled, but it also prevents you from helping your friends and guildies, because they get no XP with you.

 

I LOVE helping lowbie guildies and friends, but usually it's COMPLETELY impossible due to the XP loss if I join party, and let's be honest, it sucks the joy of the game if you one shot everything. So how is it even possible in the first place that these games are designed in such a way, these massively MULTIPLAYER games, that it's impossible to join friends unless you always have a character at their level, always need to create new one and keep the character at their level if you want to enjoy the game with friends while leveling?

 

Long overdue mandatory feature, thank you so much for level sync. It's a blessing for people who like to multiplay this massive multiplayer. Soloers can still solo everything so it's pointless to whine, you don't lose your high level abilities and downscaled characters are always at the maximum power level of the current area, making you effectively still immortal.

 

Meanwhile, those of us who like to "multiplay this massively multiplayer" by, you know, roleplaying in this mmoRPG, get humped by making a feature they could easily have included for people like you as an option when grouping with lowbies mandatory, thus making huge swathes of those "huge beautiful maps" unusable for RP thanks to being continually attacked by at-level mobs that used to just ignore us.

 

But yeah, sure, the only people objecting to this are ebil seflish soloers

[LordTynell]

"I don't agree with the other side, so I will throw shade at them."

 

Boy, sure makes your stance stronger.

[sosolidshoe]

I agree, seriously cannot think of any other downsides. I don't know what the big deal is.

 

Areas where people like to RP being essentially take away, since it's kinda hard to RP when you're being constantly attacked by mobs that used to ignore you.

 

Quick speeder trips turning into knocked off > fight > remount > knocked off again slogfests.

 

Missions that spawn enemies designed to challenge you in areas full of other mobs which, until now, were no threat, but are now essentially adds for that boss enemy(see above point re Bounty Kingpin).

 

And the whole "not being able to solo stuff anymore(and still achieve the results you were soloing them for in the first place)" isn't actually that small a downside if folk would step outside their own preferences and gameplay style for five seconds and consider other people gain enjoyment in different ways. You know, that thing, what's the word, it'll come to me...oh yeah "basic human empathy".

[PavSalco]

__________________________________________________

 

Pros:

 

1. A new way to level up

If you roll X toon and you are exhausted of passing through Makeb, Rishi and Yavin IV. You are finally given an opportunity to level up either by playing tons of flashpoints which people actually queue for or revisiting the old planets and take up quests you haven't seen before.

 

2. Content again relevant

SWTOR is one of the largest, if not the largest, MMO when it comes to solo content. I don't think any other MMO can compete with the amount of quests SWTOR has. On top of that almost all of them are fully animated and voiced. It's highly doubtful any MMO will try that again, so we should cherish every moment with SWTOR.

But the problem with our game is when people level up because they are mostly interested in the class story which in understandable. However, after level 50 the path is always through the same quests that you have already seen unless you choose to grind pvp/flashpoints (if you are lucky to see people queueing up). Zillions of quests wait for you on the older planets that haven't been touched in a while or at all. Newcomers have never seen them. It will be something new to discover and listen to. Now you can come back and profit from doing the missions you haven't known about rather than to grind the same missions on the endgame planets.

 

3. Incentive to do Heroics. The old content that is almost like new

Heroics like any other missions on the old planets were mostly forgotten and abandoned by the majority of players. Otherwise, we would have seen the old planets with better populations but we don't. Even though people can one-shoot mobs, the majority is not interesting in coming back to do quests which give them laughable rewards. Why would anyone who is not an achievement hunter or "immersion seeker" spend his precious time on the quests that give him 1/8 of credits that potentially could be gained by doing a single daily? Scaling turns the tables of what we can do with our time in SWTOR. New players that usually couldn't get a group for heroics will be able to finally find a group. Yes, they occasionally could get some guy with lvl 60 to help out but it was rare and entirely missing the intention of the heroics by getting carried through.

 

4. Helping out your friends or newcomers

Instead of blasting everything before friends or newcomers open fire, they will take an active part in their quests and will get used to their new class. Their gameplay experience will become much more pleasant. You could always make a new character and support your friends with him but what if your friends outleveled your new character? How many new character people can make for the pure purpose of helping out people? Now you take your fav character with you and enjoy the friend's quest as it was intended to do.

 

5. PVP servers and the problem of ganking

New pvp players getting ganked by people at the level cap seemed completely unfair and unfun. This change gives new players a slight chance to compete.

 

6. RP friendly.

All that negative talk about how downscaling is not RP friendly is bantha poodoo. "I'm Dark Lord of the Sith. How can I be beaten by padawans on X planet". Yet the same Dark Lord struggles with mere frogs or padawans on new planets. How's that make sense to the reasoning posted in the quote? It doesn't. Before scaling down you were Dark Lord of the SIth/Jedi Master or a highly skilled non-Force use who one-shot Jedi Masters/Darths on Alderaan but had more difficulty to beat a single lurker on Yavin IV. How's that make sense? Level-syncs actually give the depth to RP more than their lack of.

 

7. Reasonable level-sync.

As it was proven in the livestream, despite the fact that you are downscaled, you are still superior to the mobs which don't deal that much damage to you. Musco casually clicking his three skills wrecked a mob. The difference is that you won't be able to one-shoot everything in your sight like a god.

__________________________________________________

 

Cons:

 

1. You won't be able to one-shoot mobs.

Getting achievements such as "kill X mobs" will be more time-consuming. Other than that, you will be still able to solo side missions but it won't be bursting through the map like it is now. However, instead of getting 1k credits and a useless piece of green gear as your rewad that you sell for 500 credits, the quest will give you now adequate rewards for your level. All in all, that drawback has its advantage.

__________________________________________________

 

Final Score: 7:1

__________________________________________________

 

Verdict: Downscaling wins

Edited October 1, 2015 by PavSalco

[Faelandaea]

...now that nodes scale with your crafting level. have fun farming for lower level mats! since you can no longer physically farm them on a maxed out character...

 

As far as I understood from Eric in the live stream, the nodes do not scale with you. You just can access all nodes. So, nodes on capital world - still low level but say you are at 500 skill gathering, if you nail a node you will get a tonne of mats compared to the newbie running around at 25 skill level getting just a few mats.

 

On the other end of the stick, if someone with really low level gathering tries to gather at a high level node, they WILL get something but it will be very little.

 

This is a great system already in place in many other MMO games. Sometimes I levels character so fast I end up getting ahead of my gathering planet-wise. A couple of my characters are that way, so it will be awesome to run up to a node and gather from it even though my skill level is lower. It's not all about the mats at that point but at least getting points to raise my skill.

[Max_Killjoy]

I just wanted to thank Bioware for the upcoming level sync feature. Finally there is a reason to go back to old planets because they are not "grey quality" like before. My biggest issue with MMORPG's in general is, that first game companies build these huge beautiful maps to play in, but once you outlevel them they become "grey" and meaningless. Not only does the map become mostly meaningless when outleveled, but it also prevents you from helping your friends and guildies, because they get no XP with you.

 

I LOVE helping lowbie guildies and friends, but usually it's COMPLETELY impossible due to the XP loss if I join party, and let's be honest, it sucks the joy of the game if you one shot everything. So how is it even possible in the first place that these games are designed in such a way, these massively MULTIPLAYER games, that it's impossible to join friends unless you always have a character at their level, always need to create new one and keep the character at their level if you want to enjoy the game with friends while leveling?

 

Long overdue mandatory feature, thank you so much for level sync. It's a blessing for people who like to multiplay this massive multiplayer. Soloers can still solo everything so it's pointless to whine, you don't lose your high level abilities and downscaled characters are always at the maximum power level of the current area, making you effectively still immortal.

 

So because you like it, it should be mandatory?

 

Also, how often do you feel bound by the RPG part of MMORPG? Or is that just not as convenient for your argument?

[Neglience]

BW came up with 12XP because players did not want to do the old content. Now they should be happy because the old content, that they do not want to do, is relevant again? Great logic.

 

For your topic, i highly doubt that something like level sync can be a revival for this game. It is not like those planetary H2 are in any way awesome content lol

 

On a side note: You should try ESO. This game also has a huge amount of solo content AND the quests are actually good most of the time. not the stuff swtor offers.

Edited October 1, 2015 by Neglience

[sentientomega]

Alliance points?

[DarthDetonate]

3 alpha numerics

 

G W 2

[LordTynell]

Sweet. I just gave my money to Blizzard. Better product, better options, better optional scaling, better mechanics, fixes bugs, better raids, better dungeons, better rep grinding, better, well, everything.

 

Oh, and their expansion as has new endgame stuff, you know, unlike recycled H2s on old planets.

 

I am sure your level-synching will save TorTanic.

[PavSalco]

BW came up with 12XP because players did not want to do the old content. Now they should be happy because the old content, that they do not want to do, is relevant again? Great logic.

You could have at least read the first two points. The side missions have the new purpose of being an alternative for the solo endgame stuff. I completely understand and support the need of experience boosts for the class stories and the main planetary quests. People don't like when the meaningful story is interrupted by typical MMO duties where they need to grind experience to level up. Eventually when they go back from grinding to the meaningful story they already forget what it is all about. Side missions used to be means to level up between your class stories in the vanilla game. Currently they are sitting there forgotten. After KotFE they get the new purpose to be viable again as an alternative to level up post-50 level. Instead of forcing yourself through Makeb/Oricon and Rishi/Yavin IV, you get the wide range of other quests you can pick up and be rewarded meaningfully on top of it.

 

For your topic, i highly doubt that something like level sync can be a revival for this game. It is not like those planetary H2 are in any way awesome content lol

Revival not in sense that it will bring hordes of people but that the current playerbase will regularly revisit the old planets, so these planets won't feel that much empty and useless.

Edited October 1, 2015 by PavSalco

[tharbison]

This scaling thing really is kind of funny, if not ironic.

 

First, Bioware gives subs 12xp so everyone can race to the end.

 

Now, they're giving us 'scaling' (reverse bolster?) so we can go back & do all the stuff we skipped using 12xp.

 

Personally, I think it sounds pretty slick. It gives you lots of options at endgame which you didn't have previously. I mean now, say you like Hoth and want to hang out there for a while. It's kind of pointless since you can faceroll everything. With scaling, it creates a challenging environment on a planet you enjoy playing.

Edited October 1, 2015 by tharbison

[Rafaman]

Old content will be relevant again even if it is just for a little while.

Vets can do content with lowbies at level. Great for grouping, guilds, and replay-ability.

Openworld will have a sense of danger as it should.

Certain achievements will require thought and skill.

WB mechanics and takedowns will mean something.

Openworld PvP will be less of a gank fest.

 

This is a great move and will re-invigorate planets and old content. Keep it up BW. Don't worry, keep moving forward!

[Uruare]

Sarfux, when you wake up in the morning and crawl out of Bioware's bum, do you shower before coming to preach your gospel or do you prefer to remain au natural, reeking as Lord Bioware intended?

 

You can have it however you like, so long as the only thing you like is what you're given.

 

Bioware knows what's fun so much better than everyone else and has clearly never been wrong when making this assumption before, right?

[Diefenbaker]

I'm 60 with all the characters I ever wanted to be. My legacy level is 50. Why would I want to go back?

 

The heroics are irrelevant, the stuff I get from them is no way better than what I can get at endgame.

 

So the syncing serves really no purpose at all. It's also completely opposite from giving us the 12x boost. It makes no sense.

 

Seriously, who'll go back for the specific purpose of doing content we've done several times over already? The 12x allowed us to not having to do all the old crap again.

 

Only reason to go back to the old planets is to help buddies (easier when you're cap) and harvest resources.

Edited October 1, 2015 by Diefenbaker

[Eillack]

A pure waste of time and resources. But what should we have expected with Bioware?

[Rafaman]

Thanks for the post Sarfux. As I mentioned before the zealots will not be able to stand your words. lol. Truth burns their eyes or something.

 

Nevertheless, BW will hopefully weather this and not overreact to their overreaction. Level sync is great for the game. Can't wait to jump in there and see how it all works in practice.

[Diefenbaker]

I have a 60 of every AC, my legacy is 50, I'm in raid gear on my Nox and in Ziost gear on everybody else. I've grinded all the Yavin companion gear (and, tbh, I'm happy I can now wear it on my characters.)

 

How are old planets relevant for me exactly?

Edited October 1, 2015 by Diefenbaker

[mudmobile]

1. Did you not hear that the leveling system will be almost like a permanent 12x? The only thing you need to do for leveling is class and planet stories, all other things are irrelevant in that sense.

 

2.Who wanted to go back and redo stuff for any other reason than achievements?

 

3.Very few people ever wanted to do HEROICs when they were leveling through a planet the first time. How does this make them anymore interesting now?

 

4.This could be a good and bad thing but it can stay as a Pro.

 

5. From my experience this will kill what's left of the PVP servers. Because there are really very few true PVPers, many people are wannabes that are in it only for the ganking.

 

6. I don't RP so I can only go by what some RPers have said this past day and very few seem to think its a Pro.

 

7. Cant say yes or no to this. The conditions Eric was playing under could be quite different form live, being that that was the internal server for the devs.

[Quraswren]

You are overreacting max! It won't be a sloggy nuisance :confused: YOU will still have all your max level gloriness, it is just scaling you to the level of the planet is for max.

 

So in other words, you will NOT have all your max level gloriness. You will lose hit points, power, crit, mastery, pretty much everything will be less except you retain a massively decreased skill set.

 

What part of down scaling do you not understand with how you seem to think we will still have all the max level gloriness?

 

You will still flow through mobs like butter. did you watch the stream? Eric went through those guys like nothing! It's nothing like you think it is!

 

and yet it will not be the same. you will not block and dodge as you did. You will not farm as we have been.

 

This change is not the rosy enjoyment you seem to have concocted in your head.

[Black_Mon]

My quest ion is, the stats on your equipped armor, they are still going to give you the full benefits when you level down isn't it? They're not going to scale them back to the level you were synced in. Edited October 1, 2015 by Black_Mon