So Bioware, about people bypassing the locked part on Ziost to fight the OP Boss etc.

[MJSCHNEIDER]

Thx, that restored my faith a little again.

Ill pay it a visit on monday then

[captindoom]

Bioware the only acceptable punishment for people who have used this exploit is the following:

 

1. Removal of all in game credits from all characters in account

2. Removal of all gear from all characters in account

3. 10 level reduction for all characters in account

 

This is the only way people will understand exploiting is not acceptable, simply giving people 1 - 30 days ban will not stop them. All exploiters are prepared to take bans as they know they can keep the gear and if they lose that particular item they know that they can quickly get it again after they return from the ban. Doing it the way i have mentioned above makes them have to work again and will give them the time to think over what they have done, also a punishment of this nature will stop people using other exploits, or exploiting in the the future. The above 3 points are the only way to make players understand that exploiting is totally unacceptable.

 

Thank you in advanced for using my form of punishment, people really do not care if they get banned for 1-30 day, what they do care about re the 3 points i mentioned above.

[Dainter]

Bioware the only acceptable punishment for people who have used this exploit is the following:

 

1. Removal of all in game credits from all characters in account

2. Removal of all gear from all characters in account

3. 10 level reduction for all characters in account

 

This is the only way people will understand exploiting is not acceptable, simply giving people 1 - 30 days ban will not stop them. All exploiters are prepared to take bans as they know they can keep the gear and if they lose that particular item they know that they can quickly get it again after they return from the ban. Doing it the way i have mentioned above makes them have to work again and will give them the time to think over what they have done, also a punishment of this nature will stop people using other exploits, or exploiting in the the future. The above 3 points are the only way to make players understand that exploiting is totally unacceptable.

 

Thank you in advanced for using my form of punishment, people really do not care if they get banned for 1-30 day, what they do care about re the 3 points i mentioned above.

 

Never gonna happen, but A for effort.

[nrevox]

One of the things we tried to be clear about with the Ravagers is that we are serious about handling exploits. With that exploit, the Ravagers we were open about our process and the action we were taking. For this issue with Ziost, we are going to do the same.

 

If a player is bypassing the environment to access an area they should not be able to, and then killing a boss to get loot they should also not have access to, we absolutely consider this an exploit. We are investigating this issue right now, and will be actioning any player who participates, or has participated, in this exploit.

 

If you ever hear of or find something that can be exploited, do not test it yourself. Please notify us immediately and privately. Some of you brought this issue to our attention on PTS and we thank you for that. We closed that opening, but it seems that there is another method of getting into the area.

 

We would also like to thank those of you who did not exploit and who have brought this to our attention. Our goal will always be to create a safe and fair environment for our players.

 

Thanks.

 

-eric

 

THIS all day ^^^ It is amazing and freaking hilarious that some people have to be "told directly" the difference between right and wrong and then we have to wade through floods of tears when punishments get mentioned. I know its just a video game but c'mon, some people need to grow up already. You accepted the "Terms of Service" just like everyone else. If you don't understand the words in that agreement, then it is a YOU issue, not a Bioware issue.

[KortanVescalor]

I am Jack's total lack of surprise.

 

Right!? And now I see videos of someone driving a mount round in warzones from that mission on Ziost. What a joke!

[Transcendent]

Eric, you probably lack this tech, but other MMOs that have had areas which were off limits for a duration after being patched to live used a teleport mechanic to instantly teleport any player character that enters the area back to a safe zone.

 

I guess in the guess of SWTOR, if you can't do that, maybe you could have put in place exhaustion zone in there.

 

We'd prefer you to patch again a week later than to have exploits live like this. Players will always find away around, so you need to make being there impossible.

 

They already have this technical ability for instanced areas, the Rakghoul tunnels being one example of this. It would be the best option moving forward, not only to stop intentional exploiting, but also players who wouldn't have gone out of their way to find a way around terrain locks.

[dscount]

They already have this technical ability for instanced areas, the Rakghoul tunnels being one example of this. It would be the best option moving forward, not only to stop intentional exploiting, but also players who wouldn't have gone out of their way to find a way around terrain locks.

 

It appears this is likely instanced some how. Like TC was - had a DOOR you entered. You can see the mission for each of your characters now.

 

What BW should have DONE was lock that instance out until Monday.

 

I would have said just mark everyone "Completed the mission", but I don't see how they could do that with one day play time prior to reset Tuesday. Would have been unfair to people trying to do it on Monday.

 

Only real course of action is some BOOM HAMMER TIME needs to happen. Especially to those that previously exploited. I don't give a crap if it's even members from BW's PET Guilds... they need to learn. If nothing is done.. it's going to be a complete EXPLOITERS hell the next one that comes out. Everyone will do it and everyone will wait for the feather tickle and go.. "Sorry..." and do it again.

[DanNV]

Bioware the only acceptable punishment for people who have used this exploit is the following:

 

1. Removal of all in game credits from all characters in account

2. Removal of all gear from all characters in account

3. 10 level reduction for all characters in account

 

You're nicer than I would be. It should be:

 

1. Removal of all in game credits from all characters in account

2. Removal of all gear from all characters in account

3. Removal od all Legacy levels and perks

4. Removal of all titles and achievements

5. Removal of all experience boosts for 30 playing days (not just 30 calendar days, but 30 days of game play)

6. Barring from ability to group for 30 days

7. Barring from guild membership for 30 days

8. Return all characters in account to level one and return them to the starting planet as new characters

9. No in game chat for 30 days

 

If that doesn't get the point across, nothing will short of perma-ban.

[Bradypan]

Just remove 204 MHs from the game files entirely, therefore no one who already exploited will benefit from the exploit and nobody will bother trying to exploit the boss any further.

[GrandLordMenace]

IMHO, while people should be punished for the exploit, that is ancillary, because this is a wholly different situation to the Ravagers exploit.

 

The ONLY reason this exploit is even necessary, is the boneheaded idea that the devs could implement a boss that the top prog guilds could l2Farm in a half hour to get 204 mainhands, bug the hell out of Revan, gut Sword Squadron like a fish, then make Torque obscenely stupid with the new fire.

 

Do you realize, that most of the people that attempted this exploit, may just quit the game on their own upon the realization that the work they put into killing Revan HM was for naught?

 

The top prog guilds were attempting to get to the boss simply to figure out whether or not their progression was being completely invalidated. 204 mainhands, if they become widespread, will kill the game's already dying progression ecosystem. You've given a piece of gear that SHOULD NOT EXIST PERIOD essentially to any raider worth their salt even remotely. WHY? HOW IS THIS NECESSARY?

 

You've broken our bosses, nerfed our bosses, killed our classes, smothered us melee, and now you're striking the final blows. The fact that I'm even considering swapping to full time PVP (Lol... you know how long that's going to last without any new PVP content...) should be frightening.

 

the Monolith SM, should drop Resurrected gear. The Monolith HM, should drop Revanite implants and relics and bracers. Both should be supplementary avenues for gear, NOT SOMETHING THAT UTTERLY SUPERSEDES OUR TOP TIER BOSS.

Edited April 29, 2015 by GrandLordMenace

[Thiil]

How come they didn't fix it (When reported on PTS?) or even postponed the launch instead of (yet again ... ) releasing broken content?

[The_Wulff]

How come they didn't fix it (When reported on PTS?) or even postponed the launch instead of (yet again ... ) releasing broken content?

they fixed the one reported on the pts people found another way in

[Jojomagro]

How about a way to block all the people that cry exploit when ever new content comes out. You are worse then the gold spammers on fleet. For everyone who is calling for the witch hunt again, I hear Baltamore is nice this time of year.

 

Every single content release since launch has had some issue with it, that has allowed something to be exploited.

 

This time around it was reported (yet again) on the PTS. How hard would it have been to not have the new boss instance spawn until the rest of the ziost content went live, like the rest of the story missions are?

 

Or better yet, not be so tight fisted about content flow and give the entire game update at it's actual release date. Either the team didn't have the instance up to snuff on PTS (although even though technically an exploit in PTS, it was accessed and killed by many top tier raiders), or they can't think of anything better to give on the hallowed "may the fourth" holiday than half of the content that SHOULD have all dropped tuesday.

[Bradypan]

IMHO, while people should be punished for the exploit, that is ancillary, because this is a wholly different situation to the Ravagers exploit.

 

The ONLY reason this exploit is even necessary, is the boneheaded idea that the devs could implement a boss that the top prog guilds could l2Farm in a half hour to get 204 mainhands, bug the hell out of Revan, gut Sword Squadron like a fish, then make Torque obscenely stupid with the new fire.

 

Do you realize, that most of the people that attempted this exploit, may just quit the game on their own upon the realization that the work they put into killing Revan HM was for naught?

 

The top prog guilds were attempting to get to the boss simply to figure out whether or not their progression was being completely invalidated. 204 mainhands, if they become widespread, will kill the game's already dying progression ecosystem. You've given a piece of gear that SHOULD NOT EXIST PERIOD essentially to any raider worth their salt even remotely. WHY? HOW IS THIS NECESSARY?

 

You've broken our bosses, nerfed our bosses, killed our classes, smothered us melee, and now you're striking the final blows. The fact that I'm even considering swapping to full time PVP (Lol... you know how long that's going to last without any new PVP content...) should be frightening.

 

the Monolith SM, should drop Resurrected gear. The Monolith HM, should drop Revanite implants and relics and bracers. Both should be supplementary avenues for gear, NOT SOMETHING THAT UTTERLY SUPERSEDES OUR TOP TIER BOSS.

 

Exactly this. But they know they can completely ignore the cries of progression raid teams because only 20 of them have killed Revan.

Edited April 29, 2015 by Bradypan

[ZionHalcyon]

As I said, they made a point of giving a wrist-slap with the Ravagers thing, but promising far worse punishment for future offenses. If they go back on that, it'll be open season on all bugging and exploiting since they'll have established that all their talk of severely punishing 'future exploiting' will be revealed as nothing but talk.

 

If they don't severely punish these exploiters....and bear in mind, everyone got the same warning not to do it again after Ravagers...then no one will ever take them seriously about exploiting.

 

This is where they have to prove that they were serious and sincere about severely punishing exploiters. They have no choice, really.

 

So, no. This is very much an issue with long-term long lasting consequences if they get it wrong. If they don't drop the hammer on these exploiters, their entire player base will ignore their warnings about exploiting from now on and simply do it knowing that BW isn't serious about punishing exploiting.

 

I DO think it should be on an account to account basis.

 

I think a slap on the wrist for a first offense is more than fair. Just a "Hey, hello, we're watching you."

 

But if any of these accounts that exploit are of the same accounts that exploited the Ravagers, THOSE I would be going scorched earth on.

 

To me, THAT is what's fair. Slap on the wrist for a first offense, lower the boom on the second. It helps also in the event someone gets duped into an exploit or else is unaware - a first time slap will make them more aware of these things.

[RandyL]

Of course all of that being said, is 1 week of "early access" to something going to have any lasting measurable impact on the game?

 

No, it will not.

[Orizuru]

IMHO, while people should be punished for the exploit, that is ancillary, because this is a wholly different situation to the Ravagers exploit.

 

The ONLY reason this exploit is even necessary, is the boneheaded idea that the devs could implement a boss that the top prog guilds could l2Farm in a half hour to get 204 mainhands, bug the hell out of Revan, gut Sword Squadron like a fish, then make Torque obscenely stupid with the new fire.

 

Do you realize, that most of the people that attempted this exploit, may just quit the game on their own upon the realization that the work they put into killing Revan HM was for naught?

 

The top prog guilds were attempting to get to the boss simply to figure out whether or not their progression was being completely invalidated. 204 mainhands, if they become widespread, will kill the game's already dying progression ecosystem. You've given a piece of gear that SHOULD NOT EXIST PERIOD essentially to any raider worth their salt even remotely. WHY? HOW IS THIS NECESSARY?

 

You've broken our bosses, nerfed our bosses, killed our classes, smothered us melee, and now you're striking the final blows. The fact that I'm even considering swapping to full time PVP (Lol... you know how long that's going to last without any new PVP content...) should be frightening.

 

the Monolith SM, should drop Resurrected gear. The Monolith HM, should drop Revanite implants and relics and bracers. Both should be supplementary avenues for gear, NOT SOMETHING THAT UTTERLY SUPERSEDES OUR TOP TIER BOSS.

 

 

The main point you are trying to make about progression loot deserves it's own thread. I won't disagree that it's not a great idea to have drops on a SM boss that is better than HM Revan drops.

 

However, to use that as an argument that an exploit was necessary to test something is foolishness in my opinion, and does not negate the fact that people used an exploit and should be actioned appropriately for doing so. If HM raiders were worried about their progression, they could have waited one more week to test this and been no worse off.

[blackopsranger]

Should have just held off on Ziost on until this would be released. Oh and Why would you make a single boss drop a Main hand higher than an actual Operation? You might as well just be nice and hand them out to everyone for free. Maybe patch it so revan drops 204 and this one drops 192 or 198?

[masstan]

The top prog guilds were attempting to get to the boss simply to figure out whether or not their progression was being completely invalidated.

 

That's sound reasoning indeed!? And they couldn't wait a few more days like the rest of us?

[GrandLordMenace]

I want to see a hotfix at some point before monday. 204 Mainhands need to be removed from the game. 198 mainhands shouldn't even be dropping this ****. Torque fire needs to be changed to something else, even if it's the old fire. Seriously, this is dumb. While you're at it, close off the new area until monday. Edited April 29, 2015 by GrandLordMenace

[Ardarell_Solo]

The main point you are trying to make about progression loot deserves it's own thread. I won't disagree that it's not a great idea to have drops on a SM boss that is better than HM Revan drops.

 

However, to use that as an argument that an exploit was necessary to test something is foolishness in my opinion, and does not negate the fact that people used an exploit and should be actioned appropriately for doing so. If HM raiders were worried about their progression, they could have waited one more week to test this and been no worse off.

 

What he said. Two different topics. No justification for exploiting.

[RaiderMid]

The punishment should be harsh. There is no grey area with this. This isn't an is this an exploit or not situation. Anyone with a brain should realize this shouldn't be possible at this point.

[masstan]

Anyone with a brain should realize this shouldn't be possible at this point.

 

That's what I find curious - people saying they might accidentally find their way there while searching for datacrons or whatever. If you're clever enough to find a way in I bet you're clever enough to know what you're doing.

[Sudo]

I joined a guild that had extensively abused the Ravagers exploit (I had just come back to game so no 60s), and when I read about all the hub hub and the 'harsh' penalties....well after the punished were dolled out I just laughed.

 

I think one or two people received 1 or 2 day suspensions, and a few people lost a handful of items.

 

Now mind you, those people who lost items, didn't lose the bank spaces full of other items they received from the same exploit, so the over all impact of the punishments was laughable at best.

 

 

I'm not encouraging people to exploit, at the same time I'm also reminding people of the 'harsh' penalties they dished out last time, and how little of an impact it really had.

 

So make your own decisions on if you want to do it or not, me... I just pvp so I could care less:D

[JattaGin]

If that's the case, how does a player who doesn't follow the forums know this exactly? The only thing I can guess is that the method they're using clearly shows a desire to exploit and push past? As in to say, they know exactly what they're doing and it's not something they just stumbled on thinking they found?

 

Exactly ^^this. I know that I repeat myself, but:

 

Cheaters gonna cheat.

 

Exploiters gonna exploit.

 

Excusers gonna excuse.

 

Proper players play properly.

 

That said, I think we should distinguish one other kind of player: Explorers. I myself like to explore areas that look like there could be a secret behind. There are not really many areas (if any at all) in this game though. The (former) secret tomb on Tatooine comes to mind here. However, an explorer stops after he successfully explored. He does not tell others about it (except, if necessary, the game developer). He does not abuse an exploit he might have found.

 

The post from Eric addresses all the above mentioned kind of players. I agree with his argumentation. It is good that there are some players who take the time to explore new areas like that and give feedback. It's a shame that others have nothing better to do than selfishly think about themselves and how they can abuse a mistake in the game. Yes, shame on them. They are not good players. Their behaviour is unethical. Read up some books / essays about the Ethics of Computer Games if you want to know more about this interesting topic.