Comms need to be changed.

[Raansu]

I already wrote somewhere that in my opinion the solution to excessive grinding is too simple : Reducing the conversion rate Regular Commendations -> Ranked Commendations.

 

I'd definitely have less issue with it if they made some changes to the comm rates. Personally I think the daily reward is a joke. You get more comms in the 2-4 matches you play than you do from the daily. imo the daily should give 300 comms and the weekly should give 600.

 

They also need to increase the amount awarded at the end of a match. Some of these maps go on for 15-20 minutes and you only get a measly 130+ comms out of it. That's almost insulting. The low comm cap doesn't help either for new players. I get bolster is supposed to help but bolster is so friggan complicated that most can never get the right combination to get 2018 expertise.

 

I'm not 100% against gearing, but at the same time I am tired of it. PvP is about competition not progression like pve. The barrier to entry for lvl 60 pvp needs to be faster and easier so people wont feel useless or get discouraged when they get wrecked by a 15k+ crit.

 

pve players if they save their basic comms can at least buy the majority of the basic 186 gear if they have maxed their basic comms. I think its like 10 or 11 pieces out of a 14 piece set and basic comms are stupid easy to get. Not that pvp comms are hard to get but you can get basic comms way faster. if you maxed pvp comms you can get MAYBE 4 pieces if you get the cheaper stuff first but you're still pretty much screwed if you don't know the weapon swap trick, which most new players wont know.

 

I'm pretty sure that if someone sat down a played a large number of matches in stock gear and recorded their exact performance stats for each one, and then min/maxed their gear and played a large number of matches with that and again recorded their exact performance stats, they would certainly see a performance gain.

 

Whether they see a performance gain or not is not the point. Its a matter of if its meaningful gain or not....which it 100% isn't. In pve? Ya sure go for it. In pvp? No, not in the least, especially in the randomness that is warzones. You can have one match where you do 2k dps and the next you do 800. The only true test would be to just do 1v1 duels with someone.....which is meaningless in swtor pvp meta.

 

This is why most people just stack power and maybe some accuracy, because everything else is pointless in a meta where consistency is all that matters and power brings more consistency than crit, but even then the difference is so small that it doesn't really justify the grind in pvp. Example, you might opt for a crit build. Doing this and keeping in line with the DR on crit you will probably only lose about 100 bonus damage. That's it....that barely affects your big hits. Instead of a 9.2k you might get a 9.1k or 9.0k......big whoop.

 

Like I said in my above conversation in the other quote. pvp is not pve. I used to love it, but really progression has no business being in pvp. Obviously the gears not going anywhere so you have nothing to fear, but they really should opt to change things in terms of comms and daily rewards. Too bad BW doesn't care.

[TUXs]

I'd definitely have less issue with it if they made some changes to the comm rates. Personally I think the daily reward is a joke. You get more comms in the 2-4 matches you play than you do from the daily. imo the daily should give 300 comms and the weekly should give 600.

 

They also need to increase the amount awarded at the end of a match. Some of these maps go on for 15-20 minutes and you only get a measly 130+ comms out of it. That's almost insulting. The low comm cap doesn't help either for new players. I get bolster is supposed to help but bolster is so friggan complicated that most can never get the right combination to get 2018 expertise.

 

I'm not 100% against gearing, but at the same time I am tired of it. PvP is about competition not progression like pve. The barrier to entry for lvl 60 pvp needs to be faster and easier so people wont feel useless or get discouraged when they get wrecked by a 15k+ crit.

 

pve players if they save their basic comms can at least buy the majority of the basic 186 gear if they have maxed their basic comms. I think its like 10 or 11 pieces out of a 14 piece set and basic comms are stupid easy to get. Not that pvp comms are hard to get but you can get basic comms way faster. if you maxed pvp comms you can get MAYBE 4 pieces if you get the cheaper stuff first but you're still pretty much screwed if you don't know the weapon swap trick, which most new players wont know.

 

 

 

Whether they see a performance gain or not is not the point. Its a matter of if its meaningful gain or not....which it 100% isn't. In pve? Ya sure go for it. In pvp? No, not in the least, especially in the randomness that is warzones. You can have one match where you do 2k dps and the next you do 800. The only true test would be to just do 1v1 duels with someone.....which is meaningless in swtor pvp meta.

 

This is why most people just stack power and maybe some accuracy, because everything else is pointless in a meta where consistency is all that matters and power brings more consistency than crit, but even then the difference is so small that it doesn't really justify the grind in pvp. Example, you might opt for a crit build. Doing this and keeping in line with the DR on crit you will probably only lose about 100 bonus damage. That's it....that barely affects your big hits. Instead of a 9.2k you might get a 9.1k or 9.0k......big whoop.

 

Like I said in my above conversation in the other quote. pvp is not pve. I used to love it, but really progression has no business being in pvp. Obviously the gears not going anywhere so you have nothing to fear, but they really should opt to change things in terms of comms and daily rewards. Too bad BW doesn't care.

 

Fantastic post Raansu!!! Extremely well written and I agree with absolutely everything you've stated.

[maverickmatt]

That's a problem with grinding not a problem inherent to having a choice in stats. I think understanding stat functions and min/max is a interesting thinking mechanic of the game.

 

You would be correct if any one stat were as valuable as the next, but that is not the process of minmaxing (which s a stupid endgame in itself. Talk about limited gearing choices....)

 

If they do not intend to boost crit and alacrity then I am fine with the removal of the stat system for pvp.

 

 

 

 

 

Also, our stat system is a bit bland anyway.

[maverickmatt]

I'd definitely have less issue with it if they made some changes to the comm rates. Personally I think the daily reward is a joke. You get more comms in the 2-4 matches you play than you do from the daily. imo the daily should give 300 comms and the weekly should give 600.

 

They also need to increase the amount awarded at the end of a match. Some of these maps go on for 15-20 minutes and you only get a measly 130+ comms out of it. That's almost insulting. The low comm cap doesn't help either for new players. I get bolster is supposed to help but bolster is so friggan complicated that most can never get the right combination to get 2018 expertise.

 

I'm not 100% against gearing, but at the same time I am tired of it. PvP is about competition not progression like pve. The barrier to entry for lvl 60 pvp needs to be faster and easier so people wont feel useless or get discouraged when they get wrecked by a 15k+ crit.

 

pve players if they save their basic comms can at least buy the majority of the basic 186 gear if they have maxed their basic comms. I think its like 10 or 11 pieces out of a 14 piece set and basic comms are stupid easy to get. Not that pvp comms are hard to get but you can get basic comms way faster. if you maxed pvp comms you can get MAYBE 4 pieces if you get the cheaper stuff first but you're still pretty much screwed if you don't know the weapon swap trick, which most new players wont know.

 

 

 

Whether they see a performance gain or not is not the point. Its a matter of if its meaningful gain or not....which it 100% isn't. In pve? Ya sure go for it. In pvp? No, not in the least, especially in the randomness that is warzones. You can have one match where you do 2k dps and the next you do 800. The only true test would be to just do 1v1 duels with someone.....which is meaningless in swtor pvp meta.

 

This is why most people just stack power and maybe some accuracy, because everything else is pointless in a meta where consistency is all that matters and power brings more consistency than crit, but even then the difference is so small that it doesn't really justify the grind in pvp. Example, you might opt for a crit build. Doing this and keeping in line with the DR on crit you will probably only lose about 100 bonus damage. That's it....that barely affects your big hits. Instead of a 9.2k you might get a 9.1k or 9.0k......big whoop.

 

Like I said in my above conversation in the other quote. pvp is not pve. I used to love it, but really progression has no business being in pvp. Obviously the gears not going anywhere so you have nothing to fear, but they really should opt to change things in terms of comms and daily rewards. Too bad BW doesn't care.

 

This was very well written.

 

I just want to add one point: The top tier PvP gear (or any pvp gear, for that matter) is not necessary to be competitive. A player in bolstered 162s can outplay someone in full Dark Reaver. This can never happen in PvE, but PvP is a different animal.

[nrevox]

I agree 100%. I am totally fine with having a grind. The grind from tier 1 to tier 2 is completely fine and keeps the hard core pvp'ers happy that top gear is not "given" away. The problem could easily be solved if they allowed us to transfer comms to other alts. 1. you are still earning them through pvp 2. you are still having to grind for that top gear. which is extensive enough having to convert ranked at a 3 to 1 ratio takes forever. And that is okay with me. 3. it will get more people doing pvp in all brackets (which is a good thing), because your comms are actually worth something and not wasted on medpacs (that most of us already have collecting in our storage) or crappy low level pvp gear that does nothing for you in warzones. 4. it gets rid of having people enter 60 pvp with crappy pve gear to get 2018 expertise. 5. Those old pve alts that I started with that have been collecting dust can be given some coms to get some gear.

 

Content alone will not save PVP from the low participation that is sees now. It just isn't enough to throw in a map here or there. I don't like arenas as it is and so I do ranked mostly as an unhappy participant. I stopped queuing completely since 3.1.2 dropped and took away the stronghold title thing. New content wont get me to come back to it, I want the comm system to be changed to make this process more fun. I love the pvp here, and I want to participate but something needs to change to make me want to pvp again. I'm just raiding until that happens. If it never happens then pvp will not be interesting to me at all.

[Joesixxpack]

I'm not 100% against gearing, but at the same time I am tired of it. PvP is about competition not progression like pve. The barrier to entry for lvl 60 pvp needs to be faster and easier so people wont feel useless or get discouraged when they get wrecked by a 15k+ crit.

 

^This^ sums it up IMO.

[nrevox]

This was very well written.

 

I just want to add one point: The top tier PvP gear (or any pvp gear, for that matter) is not necessary to be competitive. A player in bolstered 162s can outplay someone in full Dark Reaver. This can never happen in PvE, but PvP is a different animal.

 

Yes it is possible, but that usually means the guy in full Dark Reaver is not very good. You ABSOLUTELY have the advantage having full DR against 162 gear. You are doing more damage and taking less. The 2018 expertise might be the same, but the stats that go with it are a huge difference. Otherwise nobody would be grinding for the DR at all .... nobody would care if it didn't make a difference. I entered 3.0 with crap 162 gear on a fresh lvl 60 and went up against a guild that came out of the gates in full DR and they did so much more damage to me than I was doing to them. As I started getting my DR pieces, things started to change and I was taking them down just as much as they took me down. Same skill ...just better gear.

[maverickmatt]

Yes it is possible, but that usually means the guy in full Dark Reaver is not very good. You ABSOLUTELY have the advantage having full DR against 162 gear. You are doing more damage and taking less. The 2018 expertise might be the same, but the stats that go with it are a huge difference. Otherwise nobody would be grinding for the DR at all .... nobody would care if it didn't make a difference. I entered 3.0 with crap 162 gear on a fresh lvl 60 and went up against a guild that came out of the gates in full DR and they did so much more damage to me than I was doing to them. As I started getting my DR pieces, things started to change and I was taking them down just as much as they took me down. Same skill ...just better gear.

 

I was trying to illustrate a point. In PvP, gear is not the deciding factor. Better play is.

 

 

We could do without the gear.

[DomiSotto]

I find that the first set of gear comes very naturally through just playing. However, instead of the cumbersome work-around solution, having an official, open and convenient way to purchase the T1 while levelling would be awesome.

 

I would love nothing more than to buy the armoring, mods and enhancements, but I think we get set pieces so we can get the bonus set.

 

PvE apparently actually have it worse, I was explained yesterday. Apparently they earn the comms that don’t buy the gear they value. Instead of half-a-dozen warzones & 4 Arenas they get to repeat the 2 Ops, to get what they actually want to get. So, them raiders, they have problems too.

 

Not sure if it is any solution at all, but if ranked was to provide the T2 set in the same natural and easy way the unranked provides the T1 set, I think it might both increase the number of entry level players and relieve the grind. ?

[nrevox]

I was trying to illustrate a point. In PvP, gear is not the deciding factor. Better play is.

 

 

We could do without the gear.

 

I get what you are saying bro, not trying to create an argument.. I am saying that it really takes both. Nobody is winning very many ranked matches or topping leader boards in 162 gear. But my main issue is that something needs to change with the current comm system and how to acquire gear. I would love to see the PVP community grow, but I know too many people playing that won't queue because they are tired of the grind. If gear doesn't matter then BW should loosen up on the WZ comms. Allow comm transfers between alts, and raise the cap that you can hold. I think we all agree that 2750 is not enough.

[Zoom_VI]

You guys are totally not getting it. What you guys really want is to get rid of the grind, there is no reason why stats have to be standardized to fix the problems you are complaining about, since all of the things in this thread are all grind related.

 

You would be correct if any one stat were as valuable as the next, but that is not the process of minmaxing (which s a stupid endgame in itself. Talk about limited gearing choices....)

 

If they do not intend to boost crit and alacrity then I am fine with the removal of the stat system for pvp.

 

Uhhh, you realize most specs will take some amount of crit or alacrity or both? The budget for tertiary stats on the current tier of gear is too large to stack pure surge for nearly all specs (there are a couple exceptions) Not to mention that in the current game alacrity is more valuable than accuracy for everything that isn't a sniper or marauder.

 

Also "if any one stat were as valuable as the next" makes no sense, if any stat was a valuable as the next then min/maxxing would be redundant because any random allotment of stats would net the same output.

 

Whether they see a performance gain or not is not the point. Its a matter of if its meaningful gain or not....which it 100% isn't. In pve? Ya sure go for it. In pvp? No, not in the least, especially in the randomness that is warzones. You can have one match where you do 2k dps and the next you do 800. The only true test would be to just do 1v1 duels with someone.....which is meaningless in swtor pvp meta.

You missed the statement of "a large number of warzones" i.e. large sample size, i.e. how you minimize random in a data sample. Stock gear is not as good as min/maxxed, now whether or not you think that min/maxing is worth your time is a whole different argument.

Edited April 23, 2015 by Zoom_VI

[maverickmatt]

You guys are totally not getting it. What you guys really want is to get rid of the grind, there is no reason why stats have to be standardized to fix the problems you are complaining about, since all of the things in this thread are all grind related.

 

 

 

Uhhh, you realize most specs will take some amount of crit or alacrity or both? The budget for tertiary stats on the current tier of gear is too large to stack pure surge for nearly all specs (there are a couple exceptions) Not to mention that in the current game alacrity is more valuable than accuracy for everything that isn't a sniper or marauder.

What is the fascination with typing out "uhhh"? It takes away from whatever you post.

 

Also "if any one stat were as valuable as the next" makes no sense, if any stat was a valuable as the next then min/maxxing would be redundant because any random allotment of stats would net the same output.

t[/i].

 

 

So by your own admission, there is a "correct" way to allot stats. That isn't minmaxing and there isn't any choice in the matter.

 

Stacking alacrity should net you the same DPS as stacking surge. How fast would you like to hit something vs. How hard would you like to hit something. You should be able to adjust your stats according to your playstyle and what feels comfortable, but that is not "optimal". Therefore you are almost forced into a static stat allotment.

 

 

Not much minmaxing going on, just taking the long road to get back to level anyway. There is no variance, there is no choice. Why have the illusion?

[Zoom_VI]

So by your own admission, there is a "correct" way to allot stats. That isn't minmaxing and there isn't any choice in the matter.

Stacking alacrity should net you the same DPS as stacking surge. How fast would you like to hit something vs. How hard would you like to hit something. You should be able to adjust your stats according to your playstyle and what feels comfortable, but that is not "optimal". Therefore you are almost forced into a static stat allotment.

 

Let me put it simply

 

If there is no such thing as a correct way, then there is no point to have stats at all because they would then be meaningless.

 

Your statement would be the equivalent of asking for there to not be a correct rotation and that you should be able to just hit abilities in any order and have the same results.

 

Part of game is to try and figure out what the correct way is, and in PvP that is a very open-ended question, since as of right now there is no consensus about the proper stat allotments for various specs. Especially since what determines the optimal amount of various stats is partially determined by what opponents you are fighting.

 

But hey heaven forbid a game have the audacity to make you use your brain.

[Kazz_Devlin]

The rate itself isn't that fast. I believe the developers should r

 

• remove queuing restrictions on preferred players for warzones and group ranked
  
• Give Subscribers a 1.5x comms bonus.
  
• Introduce more rewards in the form of orange shells, deco, pets, ect...
  
• Introduce new warzones
  

 

Note this is outside the population problem. Which I assume they'll fix with mega-server like tech.

 

No i'd rather valor be tied to bonus comms. the morev valor the higher the bonus. As it stands now Valor= nada

[maverickmatt]

Let me put it simply

 

If there is no such thing as a correct way, then there is no point to have stats at all because they would then be meaningless.

 

Your statement would be the equivalent of asking for there to not be a correct rotation and that you should be able to just hit abilities in any order and have the same results.

 

Part of game is to try and figure out what the correct way is, and in PvP that is a very open-ended question, since as of right now there is no consensus about the proper stat allotments for various specs. Especially since what determines the optimal amount of various stats is partially determined by what opponents you are fighting.

 

But hey heaven forbid a game have the audacity to make you use your brain.

 

For a moment I thought you were attempting to channel your inner Evolixe, but even he would not be as arrogant as you are.

 

 

Sorry, we know you like to play with stats and feel like you have some input in the way your character plays. The truth is that you do not. There is an optimal stat distribution for every spec, every class.

 

Do they vary slightly? Sure. What you won't see is a major departure (i.e. stacking all crit or all alacrity etc..).

 

Until stacking full alacrity becomes just as usable as stacking full surge (obviously just one of many examples), you have no choice. The choice was made for you. You are free to believe otherwise but it is a fallacy.

[Kazz_Devlin]

I already wrote somewhere that in my opinion the solution to excessive grinding is too simple : Reducing the conversion rate Regular Commendations -> Ranked Commendations.

 

OR Double the amount earned for wins or losses. Win nets ~280 loss nets ~160. I would even support

Triple the amount earned for wins and losses. Win nets ~420 comms and loss nets ~ 240

[Zoom_VI]

Sorry, we know you like to play with stats and feel like you have some input in the way your character plays. The truth is that you do not. There is an optimal stat distribution for every spec, every class.

Ah yes there is, but there is catch, we the players don't have the means to actually definitively figure out what the optimal setup is (for PvP at least, PvE is another story) There is no way to quantify PvP combat in a way that allows you to determine what "optimal" is. Yes there is a optimal but we the players will never find it, or if a player does find it, the player will never be able to prove it.

 

Of course wee each have our own beliefs as to what is "optimal" in PvP, but none of us can prove to the rest of us that their belief is truly "optimal"

 

Do they vary slightly? Sure. What you won't see is a major departure (i.e. stacking all crit or all alacrity etc..)

First of all, stacking all of the same is actually against "choice" if you want choice then stacking all of the same should always be bad.

 

Until stacking full alacrity becomes just as usable as stacking full surge (obviously just one of many examples), you have no choice.

What? So your saying that there is only choice if and only if you can stack pure of one stat to the same effect of stacking pure of another? So apparently the choice of going mixed crit and power versus mostly power doesn't count? So apparently doing mixed surge/alacrity versus surge/accuracy doesn't count?

[maverickmatt]

 

Ah yes there is, but there is catch, we the players don't have the means to actually definitively figure out what the optimal setup is (for PvP at least, PvE is another story) There is no way to quantify PvP combat in a way that allows you to determine what "optimal" is. Yes there is a optimal but we the players will never find it, or if a player does find it, the player will never be able to prove it.

 

Of course wee each have our own beliefs as to what is "optimal" in PvP, but none of us can prove to the rest of us that their belief is truly "optimal"

 

 

First of all, stacking all of the same is actually against "choice" if you want choice then stacking all of the same should always be bad.

 

 

What? So your saying that there is only choice if and only if you can stack pure of one stat to the same effect of stacking pure of another? So apparently the choice of going mixed crit and power versus mostly power doesn't count? So apparently doing mixed surge/alacrity versus surge/accuracy doesn't count?

 

 

No, I used alacrity vs surge as example. Surge magnifies your crits and alacrity lowers the GCD and ICD to allow more actions per minute.

 

If the target DPS can be achieved by going full surge (it can), you should be able to reach the target dps by going full alacrity (it can't). The choice should be hitting hard or hitting fast (in this instance) but no such choice exists because one is a workable allocation and one is not. This is why there is no choice.

 

Even if you expand the scope to include secondary stats, the song remains the same.

Edited April 24, 2015 by maverickmatt

[Svarthrafn]

Just make a baseline bolster where everyone gets a preset stat (meaning it ignores the pve gear and jsut gives you pvp stats for the match) and be done with it.

 

This please. Eff it.

[Zoom_VI]

 

 

 

No, I used alacrity vs surge as example. Surge magnifies your crits and alacrity lowers the GCD and ICD to allow more actions per minute.

 

If the target DPS can be achieved by going full surge (it can), you should be able to reach the target dps by going full alacrity (it can't). The choice should be hitting hard or hitting fast (in this instance) but no such choice exists because one is a workable allocation and one is not. This is why there is no choice.

 

Even if you expand the scope to include secondary stats, the song remains the same.

 

Some stats no matter how you tweak them will be not good when stacked. Crit for one will never be good when stacked just due to how it functions (even if it didn't have a DR curve stacking it would be bad) Alacrity will never be stacked because there is a point when you can no longer gain advantage just because your server latency will stop you, Plus it's bad game design to allow abilities to be fired so fast since it promotes macro'ing. Accuracy naturally will never be stacked since anything past 95% will only mean anything against tanks and inquisitors.

 

Even Surge isn't that great when stacked to the exclusion just because of the DR curve is so harsh past 75%. I only do it on my vanguard because of how much that spec devalues the other tertiary stats

 

If the target DPS can be achieved by going full surge (it can), you should be able to reach the target dps by going full alacrity (it can't).

Just because you play a Sith Lawd in game doesn't mean you have to deal in absolutes. Your logic is flawed since you are assuming that since option D isn't viable then therefore there is no choice despite the fact that options A, B, and C are perfectly viable.

Edited April 24, 2015 by Zoom_VI

[foxmob]

Not really, that was true in 2.0, but now with larger stat budgets to play with, the 3% accuracy talents gone, and alacrity actually being useful there is much more variance in builds. And as far as PvP is concerned there isn't even a consensus for what is BiS for most specs.

 

the only debate I've seen in 3.0 is mainstat or power, and the difference is so ridiculously negligible that it doesn't matter, but a crit build would obviously benefit more from main because you sac less bonus dmg than modding with straight crit.

Edited April 24, 2015 by foxmob

[Zoom_VI]

the only debate I've seen in 3.0 is mainstat or power, and the difference is so ridiculously negligible that it doesn't matter, but a crit build would obviously benefit more from main because you sac less bonus dmg than modding with straight crit.

 

Nah mainstat or power isn't even a real debate anymore, the real questions now are crit and alacrity. Simply put the stat budgets are high enough especially on Dark Reaver that stacking power/surge exclusively isn't BiS anymore. There are only a couple specs that still want to do power/surge

Edited April 24, 2015 by Zoom_VI

[GrandLordMenace]

This is PVP. There is always variation in stats. Sure, you can choose the supposed, correct way, but if you have the brains and the guts, you can experiment. There are people who run high alacrity builds to success, the key is not to blindly stack what you want, but always have a reasoning for every single point you invest in a stat. Stacking 40% crit for the heck of it is stupid, but debating whether to go for a high power surge build, or go for a more tank oriented accuracy build, or go with a more Dotty build with alacrity, is up to the player, spec, preference, and even server (Depending on the classes you see you may need a higher accuracy build.)

 

 

TL:DR PVP statbuilding is more about what utility each stat brings you rather than the mathematically ideal method of healing dpsing or tanking, much like how healing is in PVE, open to interpretation, at least to a degree.

Edited April 24, 2015 by GrandLordMenace

[Raansu]

This is PVP. There is always variation in stats. Sure, you can choose the supposed, correct way, but if you have the brains and the guts, you can experiment. There are people who run high alacrity builds to success, the key is not to blindly stack what you want, but always have a reasoning for every single point you invest in a stat. Stacking 40% crit for the heck of it is stupid, but debating whether to go for a high power surge build, or go for a more tank oriented accuracy build, or go with a more Dotty build with alacrity, is up to the player, spec, preference, and even server (Depending on the classes you see you may need a higher accuracy build.)

 

 

TL:DR PVP statbuilding is more about what utility each stat brings you rather than the mathematically ideal method of healing dpsing or tanking, much like how healing is in PVE, open to interpretation, at least to a degree.

 

You can no more experiment with stats than you can with math. 2+2 will always be 4 and BiS will always be BiS. There's very little leeway which makes the entire thing pointless.

[Zoom_VI]

You can no more experiment with stats than you can with math. 2+2 will always be 4 and BiS will always be BiS. There's very little leeway which makes the entire thing pointless.

 

Saying there is no leeway is only true if we can prove what is optimal. We can't not in PvP, there are too many variables involved, we can only eliminate the obviously bad builds.

 

Plus you have to define what "optimal" is, for instance I frequently get in arguments with other VGs over whether Tactics should gear for DPS or gear for Burst, since optimal DPS versus optimal Burst requires different stat allocations.

Edited April 24, 2015 by Zoom_VI