lokimogor Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 I tend to agree with the gist of the OP's post, not all of it but BW seems to focus on balance from the pvp viewpoint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthOvertone Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 My suspicion is that while PVP has gotten nothing in the way of new maps compared to the PVE endgame updates/expansions, most of the "class balance" tinkering has been done by devs trying to tweek their own main toons for PVP. We all know they don't play endgame PVE or they would have noticed things like the Exploit That Shall Not Be Named pretty quick. And if they play any endgame PvP at all, they do it poorly. The Devs did a livestream some time ago of them PvPing in Arenas on the PTS. There was backpedaling, keyboard turning and clicking in abundance from their squad, and they were completely annihilated by multiple teams of players. Embarrassing for them really... So you think they don't endgame PvE? Well, the Devs definitely don't play endgame PvP either. PvE specs, and sometimes entire ACs, have become much less viable to use because of PvP-based nerfs. You think so? Please list the balance changes in the last patch you believe to have been PvP-based nerfs. I need a good laugh. I can think of only one that was because of PvP, and it was botched pretty horribly by the Devs. But do tell... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FerkWork Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 PvP and PvE ruin RP! Am I doing it right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 PvP and PvE ruin RP! Am I doing it right? No...good try, but amateur mistakes have been made. You NEED MOAR CAPS!!! And these things "!!!". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkepticShockwave Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 (edited) Kinda have to agree with the OP. Not all of it, BW don't care about pvp but they do seem to focus on balancing from a PVP Viewpoint. Well not balancing, nerfing. Would be nice if BW could come up with actual creative balances for once instead of just hitting their nerf button Edited March 23, 2015 by SkepticShockwave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pagy Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 so you are saying that unload gave an advantage? in real pvp, not imaginary dev pvpunload removal was a pve change. so not sure why you're asking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danw Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 unload removal was a pve change. so not sure why you're asking. What game you been playing, removal of Fullauto/Unload and the missile change for vanguard/powertech was done for PvP reasons alone! In PvE it all worked fine. I agree with the OP, they keep "Balancing" classes for PvP and screwing with PvE in the process. As for Content, yes PvP has been looked over again and again, but that's because they do not know how to develop content for PvP and so they don't do anything. They have this idea that if you add "new" PvP content it has to be a new game mode, not just a remapping of existing modes, that's their big mistake. If they released a new version of alderaan game mode or voidstar game mode, or novare coast game mode but on different planets with new terrain and layout it would go a long way. Further to that if they cannot create a new map for PvP (the way I mentioned it above) in a 2-3 months then they should just pack up shop now (same goes for PvE Oricon sized content every 3-4 months, minus the operations). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mhobin Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 The change was made for players like the OP who are PTs that open with Death from Above and unload. It is a subtle way to help you play your class in a more efficient manner. Thank them for making you a better player and not someone who is kicked from group finder. They were simply helping clean up PTs bars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoom_VI Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 so you are saying that unload gave an advantage? in real pvp, not imaginary dev pvp Are you really that dense? The devs literally stated on the last PTS they where removing unload because it caused vg tanks to overperform in PVE. IT HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH PVP you ignorant tools. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BennyKrak Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 Lol at this guy whining about other people whining. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pagy Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 What game you been playing, removal of Fullauto/Unload and the missile change for vanguard/powertech was done for PvP reasons alone! In PvE it all worked fine. I agree with the OP, they keep "Balancing" classes for PvP and screwing with PvE in the process. what player used unload in pvp...ever? why am i even arguing with you...the devs stated themselves why they removed unload. youre just going to cling to whatever bs you want. unload was removed because of a tanking imbalance...they wanted to balance all pve tanks. but keep on whining about pvp, dont let facts slow you down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joesixxpack Posted March 24, 2015 Share Posted March 24, 2015 (edited) What game you been playing, removal of Fullauto/Unload and the missile change for vanguard/powertech was done for PvP reasons alone! That self-rooting garbage everyone took off their bars while still in lowbies? What game you been playing mang? Edited March 24, 2015 by Joesixxpack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlrikFassbauer Posted March 24, 2015 Share Posted March 24, 2015 (edited) And if they play any endgame PvP at all, they do it poorly. The Devs did a livestream some time ago of them PvPing in Arenas on the PTS. There was backpedaling, keyboard turning and clicking in abundance from their squad, and they were completely annihilated by multiple teams of players. Embarrassing for them really... So you think they don't endgame PvE? Well, the Devs definitely don't play endgame PvP either. Eric later told the Community that their streams were actually meant to be laid bach casual happenings - not that super erious end game stuff that you play. Of course, if someone plays a different class than the own main class, and does so in a laid back casual way, then this is what happens. And it is YOUR mistake that you didn't see it as "casual gaming" but instead mis-interpreted it as "super serious end game PvP". You can read it here : http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=7995103#edit7995103 Edited March 24, 2015 by AlrikFassbauer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DasVio Posted March 24, 2015 Share Posted March 24, 2015 The TE have a point. they give pvp not even a single thought, thats true. But look what Bioware did in the past. Blizzard called to the stronghold stuff (Garnision). Bioware called right after that. Hey we bring you Galactic Stronghold. Blizzard sayed, our classes need to be redesigned, with more personal adjustments. HERE WE GO... Blizzard talk about, bioware act-_- So blizzard give a **** about pvp but they nerv and buff classes that every little boy can smash 1button to kill.... So Bioware must destroy classes, that some Heavy Armored Tooth can cry how incredible awesome he is:rolleyes: Dosnt matter, if Bioware spare attention to pvp ore not. Blizzard "balanced" all times! Bioware have to act!!! Its extremy pathetic and sad, but the truth:( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted March 24, 2015 Share Posted March 24, 2015 That self-rooting garbage everyone took off their bars while still in lowbies? What game you been playing mang? This lol!!! That was sure as hell not a PvP change...geezus man. That was pure PvE that had minimal impact on PvP, because the ONLY place I ever used it in PvP was in Huttball when trying to shoot someone on a ledge I couldn't get to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted March 24, 2015 Share Posted March 24, 2015 As for Content, yes PvP has been looked over again and again, but that's because they do not know how to develop content for PvP and so they don't do anything. What the hell lol? They DESIGNED this entire game...why do you suddenly believe a new map is beyond their abilities?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reno_Tarshil Posted March 24, 2015 Share Posted March 24, 2015 What the hell lol? They DESIGNED this entire game...why do you suddenly believe a new map is beyond their abilities?! That whole budget thing or w/e, maybe a lack of desire to idk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AmericanNate Posted March 24, 2015 Share Posted March 24, 2015 What the hell lol? They DESIGNED this entire game...why do you suddenly believe a new map is beyond their abilities?! Didn't Snave confirm there's a new map or arena in the works? If a new warzone, awesome. New arena? Eh. I miss 8v8 ranked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted March 24, 2015 Share Posted March 24, 2015 That whole budget thing or w/e, maybe a lack of desire to idk. Mismanagement. Didn't Snave confirm there's a new map or arena in the works? If a new warzone, awesome. New arena? Eh. I miss 8v8 ranked. Recently?! The last thing I know of Snave conforming was Eric promising something "better than cross server"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vashadan Posted March 24, 2015 Share Posted March 24, 2015 Every time ppl get their hopes up about this game their health suffers, most often the mental part and threads like this are at least amusing. Just accept that both the PvP and PvE aspect of this game was never meant to last long enough to keep players around. The new expansion did not keep me around for longer than a month, and i was still able to experience both operations aswell as the new flashpoints (new PvP maps? nope, and i do mean the 5cent GSF too,for what it is worth in my eyes). There is nothing else content wise and whining and ....... whatever ppl feel should suit them to describe a pointless personal activity in hopes to get BWs attention in improving or `changing` something about this game that is based on the paying customers wishes. I have since long given up on posting anything forum wise, and I do believe the devs just might read something in here for a good laugh...or during their coffee break. As far as the thread is concerned, utter joke. Maybe it would help if ppl would bother to read the PvP section a bit more often, as they would realize that BW does not base their changes on what the PvP or the PvE side asks for, or at least hardly ever and certanly not what the PvP player base would like to see being done about class/spec balance, which the current leaderboards and FOTM specs clearly show as another bioware fail . Any changes/updates/patches are most often late, have little to no impact on the bigger picture of balance and IMO, just serve to satisfy some1 at BW that they actually did something...the new CM pack can be rolled of the line, recycled with a fresh paintjob, pat on the back, lets go do something else while the ScowTor still has so milk left in her.... P.S. At least he PvE crowd has the new ops to play around, but considering how long it has been since the new expansion release...if youre still doing them to grind in the better gear or get hard mode done you might wanna try something else. I did, and SWTOR is after all a revolving door, jump in after several months to see that brand new content and leave once more for a prolonged time. -The Irenicus Legacy- -----Dxun Rising , The Red Eclipse , ? A Major Server Merge ? ??some1 whining and BW responding?? If only.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toweleeeie Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 (edited) It's clear PvPers don't understand Ops HM tuning and PvEers don't understand some skills are not viable for various reasons in PvP but are needed in PvE. PvPers need to understand that the 3rd boss in Ravagers (Torque) dps check is so tight that if you don't bring dps with amazing AoE to burn the boss and add mechanics, you will fail. No matter how good your melee dps is, you will fail. The new Ops are tuned harder then all previous Ops. SM is more like HM and the HMs are more like NiM. Which I think is great if that's their goal. But I doubt it is. With a lot of these nerfs that are seen by Ops runners as PvP changes make the content even harder. To the point that guilds that are currently killing Torque will not be able to down him after these nerfs are made. When nerfing or buffing all content needs to be considered. Bioware is failing at this. Edited March 25, 2015 by Toweleeeie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeTheDuke Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 PvP receives no content, and hasn't for sometime. But all balancing is done for PvP sake. In PvE they make changes to the boss fights to balance out the Operations, if they find bosses are too easy, they make them harder, too hard they make them easier. But, removing abilities from advanced classes and adjusting the damage output or the way it roots or stuns players is purely a PvP adjustment. Once upon a time, it was considered the Sent/Mara that was overpowered and the got to advanced class for PvP or Operations (DPS) now, they have received nerfing and no love in terms of anything more they have fallen out of favour in many of the top areas. Should all classes be the same? No. I would say there are players in PvP who pick a class because it is the best to play with, the game is old enough that they have possibly one of each class and know what is the go to for that Warzone or Arena. PvP is a very adaptive space where players need to know their character and what their pros and cons are, IMO it shouldn't be up to BW to mess with the balancing of the classes unless there is something something drastically wrong. Each class should have an equal chance of killing another class one on one (given the same player ability) if they play it to that classes best. They don't, they complain and out comes the nerf hammer and dispenses balancing justice to all. So much so that other classes, once considered overpowered are so under power it is laughable. PvE and PvP are different areas of the game and use different strategies of play, what works for one will not work with others and the classes should not be treated as if they are the same in both. But BW must reap by they sow and they have set are precedence of "balancing" the classes when there is something not right in the PvP world. This will be on going and will always hurt PvE. I am sure this is one of the reasoning that BW have is "well PvP get nothing so we might as well make it fair" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stratasha Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 I agree with the OP, PVP related class changes have an impact on PVE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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