New Bolster Exploit

[sithBracer]

1. Get rid of lvl-55 bolster

2. Add a vendor with Partisan mods

3. Make it so that Partisan mods have no credit value

4. Give people free and unlimited access to the Partisan mods. This would allow people to min/max AND be forced to put the mods in orange gear, gear that perhaps already has been auged. It's eliminating the step where people can't be arsed to care for or rip lower-tier mods.

5. Prompt an info mail when people ding 55 AND add information in warzone loading screens . If people still fail to learn about free Partisan they really need to be held personally responsible and should get farmed in warzones.

6. Keep Partisan as the free entry gear even after the next tier (Obroan +1) is added to assure gear progression. Once Obroan + 2 is released, make Conq the new entry gear.

 

This is IMO, and based on the assumption that the PvP team has very limited resources, the quickest way of solving the current problems. There are better and more elaborate solutions but they would require a ton more work.

Additionally, the biggest problem with Recruit was that we didnt have unlimted access to it, it was blue gear and unmoddable. Free Partisan would eliminate all those things.

 

This would not work unfortunately. It is the same issue they had with recruit gear. The big blocker is PvE. If partisan gear is available for a cheap price, people will take it and use it in 55 ops forgoing any flashpoints, lowering the PvE grind. I have personally done the new SM ops in partisan and 61/66blue/69purple gear on my sorc who I just dusted off and people have done HM tfb/snv in conqueror gear.

 

The issue that recruit gear gave was finding the balance between PvP and PvE, which could never be achieved. It was too weak in PvP and too strong in PvE (well stronger than starter tionese gear anyway).

 

PvE is the bread and butter of this game and will always come before PvP for the company.

Edited January 23, 2014 by sithBracer

[Aetideus]

PvE is the bread and butter of this game and will always come before PvP for the company.

 

People do not understand it and bust their...mind trying to mix and much and propose solutions, when no one gives a...dev.

Edited January 24, 2014 by Aetideus

[Ghost_Spectre]

I sure do. I'd prefer to see Expertise 100% removed from the game- make PvE and PvP gear full equals! But that's not what Bioware wants.

 

I agree with you. This would solve most issue if not all of them. Expertise is the bane of this game's PvP existence. PvPer's who do not participate in PvE would still be able to get gear that is their own and just as easy to obtain as the PvE player obtains their own gear. Remove expertise, bolster, institute a match making system and I think PvP would improve 10 fold in this game.

 

However, that's too easy to do and BioWare wouldn't do that because as it would mean they'd have to admit they were wrong. So until such time, BioWare will keep things as they are. As a famous engineer once stated (paraphrased), <Scottish accent>"The more complicated the plumbing, the easier it is to muck it up"</Scottish accent>

[Ghost_Spectre]

You can't do that unless you introduce repair bills, and charged a huge premium on buying gear via PVP. You can't reward people with top level gear mearly for participation.

EXP and EXP penalties need to stay...

 

No you don't. They can make the armor immune to damage in 55 PvP like they do in the low PvP. Hence, no need to do anything of the kind.

[iRedRIng]

imo just make all pvp gear free and remove bolster. No need for this grinding of gear.

[iRedRIng]

You really think what this crap issue for players and developers is more important than pugs vs premades issue, matchmaking for solo ranked issue, or something like returning 8x8 huttball ranked league issue?

 

8v8 huttball league would actually suck. In competitive games you won't be killing the other team when they get the ball at least 90 percent of times so it just comes down to who gets ball at mid which will often come down to connection.

[MidichIorian]

This would not work unfortunately. It is the same issue they had with recruit gear. The big blocker is PvE. If partisan gear is available for a cheap price, people will take it and use it in 55 ops forgoing any flashpoints, lowering the PvE grind. I have personally done the new SM ops in partisan and 61/66blue/69purple gear on my sorc who I just dusted off and people have done HM tfb/snv in conqueror gear.

 

The issue that recruit gear gave was finding the balance between PvP and PvE, which could never be achieved. It was too weak in PvP and too strong in PvE (well stronger than starter tionese gear anyway).

 

PvE is the bread and butter of this game and will always come before PvP for the company.

You can already skip the initial "PvE grind" by using PvP gear or by buying a cheap set on GTN so that's hardly an obstacle. How many are actually going through the FP "grind" these days for gear? And if the potential credit sink that comes with GTN gear is reason enough for keeping this fail bolster system then they might aswell cancel PvP altogether. Notice that i also mentioned that Partisan should not be replaced by Conq when the next PvP tier comes out. That means that we would have Oboran 2.0---> Obroan ----> gap (Conq is taken out of rotation until the next PvP set is added) ----> Partisan, meaning that Partisan will be three tiers below. I think it's safe to assume that we will have PvE 82's by then too, making Partisan obsolete in the upcoming raids.

 

Secondly, Partisan would not be too weak for PvP but also not strong enough to render the "PvP grind" moot. It's probably where they expected people to be with bolster but without all the bolster BS that they still havent been able to sort out. So all in all perhaps not a better system but with far less confusion and new exploits showing up every week, the gear and stats would be what they are in any enviroment.

 

Also, it's possible that some people would manage to ignore a mail, loading screen notifications and possibly also a prompted "Partisan gear mission" but then again, we currently have people totally disregarding augs and other stuff that makes their gear worse than it should have to be so there's really no difference.

[L-RANDLE]

but even your suggestion doesnt fix the source of the problem the stat gap between starters and vets. in pvp[wich is even bigger with pve items available now then it ever has been before with pvp items].

 

but it does..

Bolster nerfs EXP on Raid gear. Regardless of how powerful raid gear becomes, the EXP nerf can be adjusted during tier increases. Since they are raiders, asking them to move to a lower tier PvE set to get full bolster is not an issue and is actually easier than asking them to get a PvP set as we know it currently.

 

Non-raiding starters will have leveling PvE gear, so they will get full bolster. I think we can all agree that bolster for any PvE gear is more or less on par with each other. Sure some things might need tweaking a bit, but overall, bolster does provide a proper stat floor.

 

"Geared Vets" will only have EXP augments that, in total, would add a few extra percentage points of EXP. Not a crazy amount to create a gear gap (like old PvP gear versus no PvP gear did), but some avenues to have some PvP-specific gear progression, which has zero benefits to raiders or people looking for a starter PvE set. Instead of 60% damage, they would have 63% for top tier PvP augments. Or maybe a lower number + attach set boni to them like with armoring slot. That's not insurmountable for players carrying no EXP augments, and we can tell them with 100% accuracy its a class balance or L2P issue.

 

I don't get that at all. Even if it's a game you still have to show some responsibility and interest for the mechanics. People are constantly "LF experienced players" for PvE but with PvP it's like anything should go. If someone can't figure out how to put on a free PvP set then they're probably not too in the loop on how to play their class either and should look for a game with even more basic PvP.

While I agree 100% about that, the facts are bolster was introduced because that was expecting too much and the money for recruit gear only exacerbated the situation. Its been tried before and failed. You can't make people wear free gear, which in turn ruins the entire teams experience. There needs to be some failsafe. Bolster, even with all its warts, is that failsafe.

 

 

No you don't. They can make the armor immune to damage in 55 PvP like they do in the low PvP. Hence, no need to do anything of the kind.

You missed the point too. Remember, players tend to choose the path of least resistance. The reason you would need to do that is you need some conditions to obtain gear. In Raids, wiping is costly and a "risk". Regardless of how "easy" PvE raiding is, if you don't perform, you don't get gear.

 

If gear was moved to PvP, there would be no consequences to losing or even playing for that matter. You could get your 8 medals and AFK for the rest of the match. That would ruin PvP quality and at the same time make PvP a much easier route of attaining top gear for PvE. That's not my idea of a proper solution to balance all the equations in this problem, while keeping PvP/PvP Gearing legit.

Edited January 24, 2014 by L-RANDLE

[Technohic]

The thing is, then you are relying on bolster to nerf expertise on top Raid gear, but that still leaves Raid gear on top for the fabled OWPVP

[BooBoy]

if they remove bolster they have to add recuit gear back into the game. so fresh 55s don't go and get annhilated instantly (I have a lot of tons who are below conq, even with bolster its hard to gear them, without it and without recuit gear it will be near impossible to do)

[L-RANDLE]

The thing is, then you are relying on bolster to nerf expertise on top Raid gear, but that still leaves Raid gear on top for the fabled OWPVP

 

True that, but I think bolster in OW would help lowbies from being ganked by endgame raiders and PvP players. Raid set should be set aside for raiding only where they need all those stats, not OW PvP IMO..

[DarthRaika]

My dream that won't happen would be a base level of stats in pvp areas that you set beforehand with scroll bars. These would be at stats barely below stock conq. Then you could scroll your stats to get to a point that would be barely below min/max conq (or just stay stock if that's how you like it lol). So, in other words, take points away from accuracy and put them into power, etc. Also all people would be at max expertise. They should even give an explanation about how BW devs are dumb and that they made crit near worthless for many classes .

 

Then pvp gear would just give slight bonuses in warzones (pve gear would lose all stats in pvp areas so if you were wearing pve gear it would be the same as being naked with the scroll bar bonuses that you set up).

 

This system would be rather simple and there would be no way to game it or hurt yourself severely due to ignorance (which we all are ignorant at one point). It would also allow any new 55 to be very competitive and it would make lowbies very fun since there would be no gear gap in lowbies.

 

The % difference in tiers of gear would be extremely easy to control with this system as well.

 

My real dream would be only the scroll bar and no gear difference in pvp but I think many mmos need a gear gap to keep the population healthy.

Edited January 24, 2014 by DarthRaika

[cashogy_reborn]

Crafted gear BiS, PvE and PvP give unique skins. This is the way to do gearing properly.

[Loki_]

Best combo is

 

Two scun dps parts 61/69/63 +15% critical on back blast bonus

Two scun dps parts 69/63/61 +15% critical on blaster whip bonus

 

Drops most classes in 3 hits when the crits align

Going to be even funnier in 2.6 when they buff scun and op dps

Edited January 24, 2014 by Loki_

[Xzara_Jade]

[quote=sithBracer;7139676

I see so many people complaining about bads ruining their game, yet the same people adamantly demand a gear advantage over those same people. Which is it? Do you want an even playing field, or do you want a "I win" button over undergeared people?

 

AHHAAHHAH, i totally condemn idiots using pve gear in pvp to exploit the system; HOWEVER Your above statement hits the nail on the head about gear discrepancies.

 

Its ok to thrash people with lower gear - hey its the game ; soon as someone finds a workaround, suddenly the sky is falling and this discrepancy is unacceptable

[Twin]

You can argue that its gamebreaking on multiple levels. The severity is purely subjective, but gamebreaking nonetheless.

 

The frustration here is evidence that something is wrong. Thats gamebreaking in my book..

 

I completly agree and besides, since when does something have to be completly and utterly FUBAR'd before it's legit to get annoyed and demand a fix to the issue?

 

One guy think it's gamebreaking, another finds it an annoyance and a third considers it to be barely an advantage. Meanwhile everyone agrees that bolster is bugged, so yeah lets knowingly leave bugs like this in effect, nothing bad could ever come out of that?

 

Obviously this needs fixing asap. Anything else would be beyond bad, specially since the dev team have failed time after time to fix this Bolster system of theirs, which just seems to show evidence of being broken to the core for each patch they roll out.

 

It's obvious that they need to fix bolster imo, wether it's gamebreaking or not.

[Technohic]

What they should do, since they go piece by piece to bolster; is then set a hard cap on any stat overall that is affected by bolster to be at what it would be with conqueror gear. Then, with the first piece of Conq you get, you can get some progression by being able to go for a stat in the armor that would push it over the hard capped bolster stat.

 

Still make sure everyone has a good baseline entry, yet makes PvP gear worth something and impossible to have PvE out do PvP equipment giving a clear cut path on what to work toward.

Edited January 24, 2014 by Technohic

[TUXs]

Crafted gear BiS, PvE and PvP give unique skins. This is the way to do gearing properly.

 

While I completely agree with you, take a look at recent updates.

 

We used to have different skins for every class, every advanced class, every tier of PvP gear AND PvE gear. Every set of gear a player wore showed, at a glance, what that player participated in. Since F2P and the CM, we now get ONE set of gear that looks virtually the same for Pubs or Imps, Troopers or Knights...

 

I agree, unique skins would be plenty, Bioware can't be bothered to take anything away from the store it seems.

Edited January 24, 2014 by TUXs

[Vodrin]

What they should do, since they go piece by piece to bolster; is then set a hard cap on any stat overall that is affected by bolster to be at what it would be with conqueror gear. Then, with the first piece of Conq you get, you can get some progression by being able to go for a stat in the armor that would push it over the hard capped bolster stat.

 

Still make sure everyone has a good baseline entry, yet makes PvP gear worth something and impossible to have PvE out do PvP equipment giving a clear cut path on what to work toward.

 

I completely agree with this and have already suggested this exact solution. I also believe that you should be able to get the same level of stats from crafting, questing, PvP or PvE (make the max stat budget the same for each) with raid/PvP purchased gear allowing a greater degree of stat customization for min/maxing and having much better looking skins.

[Technohic]

Best combo is

 

Two scun dps parts 61/69/63 +15% critical on back blast bonus

Two scun dps parts 69/63/61 +15% critical on blaster whip bonus

 

Drops most classes in 3 hits when the crits align

Going to be even funnier in 2.6 when they buff scun and op dps

 

I don't know about 3 hits but 15% critical on 2 different bread and butter moves when soft cap otherwise is around 25% is kind of a big deal.

 

Like I said in another thread, I need to start PvE ing

[L-RANDLE]

Best combo is

 

Two scun dps parts 61/69/63 +15% critical on back blast bonus

Two scun dps parts 69/63/61 +15% critical on blaster whip bonus

 

Drops most classes in 3 hits when the crits align

Going to be even funnier in 2.6 when they buff scun and op dps

 

Episode 2.6: Return of the Noob-Cannon

 

 

Ah... I miss the days hearing Noob-Sticks going off like crazy and LMAO at the highjinx of Merr.

I don't have this AC, but it brings a smile to my face that it will return to roflmao status..

[Uber_the_Goober]

8v8 huttball league would actually suck. In competitive games you won't be killing the other team when they get the ball at least 90 percent of times so it just comes down to who gets ball at mid which will often come down to connection.

 

This is easily fixed by having 5 ball spawn points, randomly disperesd throughout the map, and equal distances from each goal. Never know where it's going to pop up

[DarthRaika]

This is easily fixed by having 5 ball spawn points, randomly disperesd throughout the map, and equal distances from each goal. Never know where it's going to pop up

 

I would say that if they did make a competitive huttball league then it should include a small nerf to guard. Maybe guard only transfers 25% of dmg. Also, they could do things like make it so that the most a team could hold the ball would be around 2.5 minutes. Just include an increasing dmg tick around 2 minutes. It is definitely doable and I'm sure they could think of a few other things to make matches more dynamic.

Edited January 24, 2014 by DarthRaika

[Vodrin]

I would say that if they did make a competitive huttball league then it should include a small nerf to guard. Maybe guard only transfers 25% of dmg. Also, they could do things like make it so that the most a team could hold the ball would be around 2.5 minutes. Just include an increasing dmg tick around 2 minutes. It is definitely doable and I'm sure they could think of a few other things to make matches more dynamic.

 

Strength of guard should remain as is and they should add a 10 second cooldown to guard target swap.

[DarthRaika]

Strength of guard should remain as is and they should add a 10 second cooldown to guard target swap.

 

Currently, I completely agree with you, but if there was a ranked huttball league then I think what I said would work better. A tank would still be very much needed even with this decrease in guard but the matches would be more dynamic and less turtle-ish. A ranked team that didn't bring a tank would still be at a major disadvantage.

 

Also maybe my % is off. Maybe it should be 30-40% instead of 25% but it should still be lowered. I do like what you said about the guard switch though. Would make you think who you put guard on.