BW, do you ever plan on addressing DPS Powertechs/Vanguards PvP-wise?

[dcgregorya]

they're a 10m dot spec that can be cleansed by the vast majority of healing ACs in the game.

 

This is the only real issue here. Sure the spec can put out some decent damage against terribads right now, but 10m range on a DoT spec doesn't make sense. The heat cost of incendiary, for a 10m skill, does not make sense (25% energy that can get cleansed very easily). If they put back those skills to 30m and dropped the cost of incendiary, it'd be fine for regs at least.

[XyriusSES]

The class definitely got hit pretty hard with the nerf bat. While it did deserve to be toned down a bit, I think they may have gone a tad overboard.

[vimm]

Seriously PT/VG is a joke of a class in PVP and PVE. We might as all roll lethality snipers and smash mara's.

 

Good, enjoy.

[TonyDragonflame]

Mates, if we wanna our power back, there is only one way - like mercs, crying every day in this thread, and create new threads with names:

 

Nerf smash!

Nerf Snipers!

Nerf Sins!

Nerf mercs!

etc.

 

Cuz mercs crying all year, and finally got sweet buff, so they are now OP again, like in march-2012.

 

However, operatives, anni maras after get nerf just shut up and dont crying every day on forum - so, they are all still in uhm, black hole.

 

So, every day need crying in this thread! Pyro/vanguards pure crap now! Nobody dont want us in ranked teams! WE NEED BUFF BACK, BIOWARE!!!

Edited May 22, 2013 by TonyDragonflame

[Aelaias]

Mates, if we wanna our power back, there is only one way - like mercs, crying every day in this thread, and create new threads with names:

 

Nerf smash!

Nerf Snipers!

Nerf Sins!

Nerf mercs!

etc.

 

Cuz mercs crying all year, and finally got sweet buff, so they are now OP again, like in march-2012.

 

However, operatives, anni maras after get nerf just shut up and dont crying every day on forum - so, they are all still in uhm, black hole.

 

So, every day need crying in this thread! Pyro/vanguards pure crap now! Nobody dont want us in ranked teams! WE NEED BUFF BACK, BIOWARE!!!

 

Supposedly they are shooting for a fix to Assault Trooper in 2.1.1. That should at the very least improve IP damage unless the skill's buff doesn't work for all others in which case it should fix the class altogether. If the latter were true they literally broke a class in 2.0 and let it stay in this manner for over 1 month.

[cashogy_reborn]

Supposedly they are shooting for a fix to Assault Trooper in 2.1.1. That should at the very least improve IP damage unless the skill's buff doesn't work for all others in which case it should fix the class altogether. If the latter were true they literally broke a class in 2.0 and let it stay in this manner for over 1 month.

 

they literally broke merc in 1.2 and let it stay in that manner for over a year...... quit your QQ.

 

but yes, pt is crap right now. youll get some diehards that say its an l2p issue, but its not. there was no need to nerf it in the first place. it just had a low skill cap, so there were a lot of bads succeeding with it in regs, which gave the appearance that it was overpowered. the only reason worth taking one into ranked is for the grapple, but most teams take a tank sin over that.

[klham]

The class definitely got hit pretty hard with the nerf bat. While it did deserve to be toned down a bit, I think they may have gone a tad overboard.

 

I wonder if the Powertech player base is overreacting a bit. They've gone without a significant nerf to their burst dmg until now, and they're also the only AC that gets their healer as their first companion at the start of the game. So they're long accustomed to playing both PvP and PvE in easy-mode for most of this game's lifetime. Not to be insulting, but this particular spec/AC combo strikes me as the type of compromise that gamemakers include in order to enable kids to participate in the game without frustration (to be honest, I suspect the same compromise informed the design of Rage/Focus on a Jugg/JK, albeit less obviously).

 

There's been a long-standing game-wide consensus that Pyro-powertech burst was overpowered, especially relative to the skill required. The spec & class continually rewarded mediocre (and bad) gameplay with easy victories. I suspect that's the mindset behind some of the overreactions we're seeing among the pyro-powertech player base.

 

As an aside, I also find it interesting that there's almost no complaint from the Vanguard half of the equation (or very little).

Edited May 22, 2013 by klham

[Capt_Beers]

I'm pretty sure the change to Assault/Pyro was a play by BW to get me to pay change my Vanguards name.

[ceelaniri]

I wonder if the Powertech player base is overreacting a bit. They've gone without a significant nerf to their burst dmg until now, and they're also the only AC that gets their healer as their first companion at the start of the game. So they're long accustomed to playing both PvP and PvE in easy-mode for most of this game's lifetime. Not to be insulting, but this particular spec/AC combo strikes me as the type of compromise that gamemakers include in order to enable kids to participate in the game without frustration (to be honest, I suspect the same compromise informed the design of Rage/Focus on a Jugg/JK, albeit less obviously).

 

There's been a long-standing game-wide consensus that Pyro-powertech burst was overpowered, especially relative to the skill required. The spec & class continually rewarded mediocre (and bad) gameplay with easy victories. I suspect that's the mindset behind some of the overreactions we're seeing among the pyro-powertech player base.

 

As an aside, I also find it interesting that there's almost no complaint from the Vanguard half of the equation (or very little).

 

The argument about having a healer as a first companion is pretty weak and irrelevant at lvl55. Moreover, and to be pedant VG/PT arent the only AC to benefit from, Merc/Commando also do...

 

As for the nerfs, you did not notice them but they happened such as a limitation on the proc for HIB/RS or the range on IR and TD/AP from 30m to 10m.

 

As an aside, VG have more reason to feel nerfed since one of their talent is broken (cf. Assault Trooper and IP), go on their class forum and check the first page. Similar to the PT page.

 

There is no overreaction. the burst is simply gone at lvl55 and not much has been given/adjusted in compensation.

[Aelaias]

they literally broke merc in 1.2 and let it stay in that manner for over a year...... quit your QQ.

 

but yes, pt is crap right now. youll get some diehards that say its an l2p issue, but its not. there was no need to nerf it in the first place. it just had a low skill cap, so there were a lot of bads succeeding with it in regs, which gave the appearance that it was overpowered. the only reason worth taking one into ranked is for the grapple, but most teams take a tank sin over that.

 

Did they fail to implement an ability which affected a very important merc skill in 1.2 and neglected to fix it for a year. Because if yes, you have a point. On the other hand if that's a negative you can shove your opinion up your tailpipe.

Edited May 25, 2013 by Aelaias

[Ottoattack]

I wonder if the Powertech player base is overreacting a bit. They've gone without a significant nerf to their burst dmg until now, and they're also the only AC that gets their healer as their first companion at the start of the game. So they're long accustomed to playing both PvP and PvE in easy-mode for most of this game's lifetime. Not to be insulting, but this particular spec/AC combo strikes me as the type of compromise that gamemakers include in order to enable kids to participate in the game without frustration (to be honest, I suspect the same compromise informed the design of Rage/Focus on a Jugg/JK, albeit less obviously).

 

There's been a long-standing game-wide consensus that Pyro-powertech burst was overpowered, especially relative to the skill required. The spec & class continually rewarded mediocre (and bad) gameplay with easy victories. I suspect that's the mindset behind some of the overreactions we're seeing among the pyro-powertech player base.

 

As an aside, I also find it interesting that there's almost no complaint from the Vanguard half of the equation (or very little).

 

For the 20th time, the class difficulty is not correlated to the damage output. I do not care how simple or complicated is a class. Everyone will play the class the does the most damage in the shortest period of time. In addition, I played all classes except merc and operative. All classes work off 5-6 button rotations, with 20 skills used from occasionally to rarely. PT is no exception. Your two button friends never topped the dps charts or set foot in RWZ.

 

Also, the next time you say PT was easy mode and as a result should be nerfed, please list your nuclear science class and the 50 buttons needed to pressed in a sequence, thus entitled to be the best in damage.

 

I will not get in detail regarding PT balance (feel free to browse PT forums). What I can tell you is a class with weak burst, mediocre overall damage and low survivability has no place in competitive play, wither its PvP or PvE.

[OldSpiceSwag]

If we are talking dps burst is something that has to be in the equation. That doesnt make 1.7 pyro fine.

 

Have you ever been trained by 1.7 deception? Man those guys could hurt like insane, as hard as pyro if not harder. Why no one ever took deception to rateds? You couldnt rely on them. If all pyro had was burst you wouldnt go to rateds, people prolly would take MM sniper and MOAR MARAS.

 

1.7 pyro has faceroll burst that anyone would execute coupled with tons of utility that can could turn a game around.

 

Ive played with a pyrotech since 1.2 to 1.7 in a rated team, ive seen enemy pulls rule huttball, ive seen incredible enemy pull kill setup like pulling a healer to the middle of our team and globaling him. When i was in trouble he would taunt me.

 

Ive seen stealth scan win alderaan civil war because he took the enemy sin out of stealth and they couldnt delay home node cap while the other team didnt have stealth scan and got delayed by our shadow for almost a minute. Stealth scan free win.

 

The problem is that dealing damage as a powertech was so mind numbing that most (not all, just most) people that played the spec turned into a drooling facerroller and now cant understand the spec as a whole because the faceroll burst is gone.

 

The nerfs were severe, overdid prolly, but maybe now its the time to understand your spec as a whole and use all your skills instead of just flameburst / rail shot 2 button spam because that kind of crap is not coming back i assure you.

 

dps sins were previously not taken into rateds because although their burst was good, their sustained dps was not. you said it yourself, they both had great burst, but pts were more reliable FOR THEIR BURST. pre 2.0, pts had the best single target sustainable burst in the game. this was their main attraction

 

pts did not have "great" utility. they had and have utility. the pull is really good, and that's just about the main thing. but now in huttball, there is NO REASON to take a pt SOLELY for the pull with gimped burst...just bring an extra tanksin.

 

the thing about stealth scan... i mean it's useful but it isn't a main attraction. its like an added bonus, maybe a little better than offheals, and the only thing unique to pts.

 

again, taunts, yeah they're great, but sins and smash juggs if you bring that both have them, and both have far, FAR greater utility, defense, and utility than a pt

 

so what it comes down to: think of a pt pre 2.0 and how it would have fit in with classes in 2.0 with no big changes. probably pretty well. now think of the current pt. name one thing other than stealth scan (lol) that a pt brings to the table that another class can't bring better

Edited May 23, 2013 by OldSpiceSwag

[TonyDragonflame]

/bump

[TonyDragonflame]

Today's /bump

[Brunner_Venda]

Some buffs for Arsenal/Advanced Prototype would be nice.

 

The prototype loaders skill only affects shoulder cannon, which is nice, but it's a level 55 skill. AP picks this up much earlier than that, it should give a bonus to rail CD or something - just 2-3 seconds would be nice.

 

Prototype Cylinders. 1% extra fire damage. Really? Seriously? 1%. Try again.

 

Immolate: damage buff? Not in line with what a top tier ability should do. Increase damage, do not turn this into a DOT. Do. Not. Want. More. DOTS. In this spec. AP already has one and it's fine.

[TonyDragonflame]

Please, move talent "Shock Absorbers" from Tier 6 Tactics tree to Tier 1 Tactics tree, for using Shield and Assault specs too.

 

After that, vanguard tanks and assault vanguards will be at least competitive, when get more survivability. Now Assault total glass dps crap, and Shield tank without any escape abilities still dont competitive in terms of survivability with guardian (have 1 escape ability - guardian leap) and shadow (have 2 escape ability - vanish and teleport) tanks.

[Aewu]

Wait 9 more months, they might add something. Until then bump.

[Ajuntalee]

PT are fine, they are denfensive dps, their main abilities are taunts, AoE taunts . You can't ask to have taunts and at the same time the dps of pure damaging class like the Marauder or the Sniper. You have to accept that you rolled a tanky, even if you focus is on damage, you still have the capacity to defend others, for free mana wise and GCD wise, and you should use it, of course it is not going to help in a duel or 1 vs X, but it is of great use as soon as you hit 2 vs 2.

 

Speaking os branches.

 

Since 2.0

 

Shiled spe is extremely resilient has tons of cc, excellent mobility, and infinite AE hard snares.

 

Pyro has been given movement imparing invunerability abilitie, and hence has now excellent kiting abilities, and the new kolto reserve which makes it a ****ton more survivable than it was before. They are still capable of finishing people at long range. I like how people focus on the puny flat dps output nerf and completely forget about the massive mobility and tanking buffs.

 

It is still a very easy spe to play, so you have no excuse for not binding your TAUNTS, which are the reason why you are still extremely usefull in most situation in a BG. regardless of how you deep specialize, "Thermal D", "Oil slick" or retractable.

 

Proto spe is almost untouched, lost a bit damage, earned a little survivability evens out for the greater good.

 

I think the game is better now that all three spe are desirable in PVP.

 

Remember you are in the BGs for 2 reasons,

 

denying ennemy's mobility

denying the ennemy its "burst damage"

 

Neither one nor the other gives lots medals or lots of score to brag about at the end. But unless you sacrifice yourself on split gimmicks ( another usefull role which doesn't get endgame credit either) you 'll be in the heart of battle for the whole match, and play a key role in helping your team body the other with the momentum of its core.

 

Which depending on your spe pairs with one of the following

 

Shield -> further mobility and burst denial. You are a dedicated body guard.

Proto -> flat unmitigated dps pressure. You are an attrition body guard.

Pyro -> opportunistic burst surges. You are a finisher body guard.

 

Stop whining start to taunt and to position yourslef properly,

 

you are not a duelling class, you are a group vs group class,

 

Your job is to have your team's 4-6 CORE slowly push the other teams 6-8 CORE in the ropes. your job is to do your share in the process of stalemating the ennemy on the big clash with less people on your side than theirs, in this job taunt is what you are expected to do, the rest is just gravy.

 

Alternately you can suicide yourself doing "split" 1 vs 3 slowing down and wearing down ennemy reinforcement in a slush fight with you or draging them away from the real fights, keeping them busy doing something useless.

 

Stealthers and monotarget DPS are the one suppposed to do 1 vs 1 and steal lightly defended nodes or defend lightly attacked objectives.

 

Now that you have read that I hope you will find pride in a bg in other things than measuring your E-pecker on the DPS scorechart at the end. Stop crying about the rebalancing of our class and adapt.

 

powertech/vanguards regardless of the spe is one of the easiest class to play, and our role has never changed, we are better at it than before, we lost a bit of punch in the process, and are less good at dealing than pure dealing classes I guess that is what we can call working as intended.

Edited May 25, 2013 by Ajuntalee

[Leafy_Bug]

Indeed powertechs do need a buff, they are so nerfed, don't bother taking them anywhere. With these so called nerfs they pull almost 2900 dps in PVE and you call that bad.

 

 

Nothing to see here, l2p really .

 

Please, move talent "Shock Absorbers" from Tier 6 Tactics tree to Tier 1 Tactics tree, for using Shield and Assault specs too.

 

After that, vanguard tanks and assault vanguards will be at least competitive, when get more survivability. Now Assault total glass dps crap, and Shield tank without any escape abilities still dont competitive in terms of survivability with guardian (have 1 escape ability - guardian leap) and shadow (have 2 escape ability - vanish and teleport) tanks.

 

 

Can I have your stuff when you ragequit?

Edited May 25, 2013 by Leafy_Bug

[DharmaPolice]

You can't ask to have taunts and at the same time the dps of pure damaging class like the Marauder or the Sniper.

I think the suggestion is that Vanguards/PTs are not currently on the level of Shadows/Sins or Guardians/Juggs (all of whom have taunts).

[Aelaias]

Indeed powertechs do need a buff, they are so nerfed, don't bother taking them anywhere. With these so called nerfs they pull almost 2900 dps in PVE and you call that bad.

 

 

Nothing to see here, l2p really .

 

Can I have your stuff when you ragequit?

 

Go do a raid or something. Who gives a flying **** about your PVE parses? This is a pvp forum in case you are lost; the topics generally revolve around class' pvp performance. (I think you were looking for a response contained in the preceding sentences). I am sure you know all this (right?) and just picked a low hanging fruit (like yourself) to troll on.

Edited May 25, 2013 by Aelaias

[ImpliedCarth]

Good old times with my lovely vanguard, miss ya <3

http://s7.directupload.net/file/d/3173/ftqb7syt_jpg.htm

http://s7.directupload.net/file/d/3156/d74cdf7a_jpg.htm

http://s7.directupload.net/file/d/3140/9mxvtinf_jpg.htm

http://www.pic-upload.de/view-188848...90333.jpg.html

 

Do you even taunt?

[TonyDragonflame]

Can I have your stuff when you ragequit?

 

I have 5 chars for pvp dude, I simply more enjoy atm playing my guardian tank, focus sentinel and infiltration shadow When I play my vanguard, I am still obviously on top-3 dps charts, but it dont enjoyable now as in old good days...

 

So I can kick your butts anyway with any nerf, I have enough OP chars for it, buahahaha

[Ajuntalee]

OP:

Seriously PT/VG is a joke of a class in PVP and PVE. We might as all roll lethality snipers and smash mara's.

 

Hence

 

I think the suggestion is that Vanguards/PTs are not currently on the level of Shadows/Sins or Guardians/Juggs (all of whom have taunts).

 

So no.... the suggestions of the topics OP is that since 2.0 DPS spe PTs are not on par with DPS spe Snipers and Marauders, which personnaly I agree with, on the other hand (apparentrly contrarily to some other PTs) I find it totally normal given the utility, the reasonable dps, the self survivability and projected survivability we still bring on the table.

 

Now to tackle your concern

 

I do thing juggernauths are better taunters, but i don't play one so out of modesty I really can't tell if outside of that they are more usefull than PTs in a BG, are they OverPowered, maybee, maybee not , if they are it is ground for nerfing them not buffing everything else.

 

I do think assassins are better duellists,

 

They can bodyguard longer than we do but they can't quite switch bodyguarded friendly as fast as us, and they can't bodyguard as strongly as we do, think about all the area hard snares, area hard damage debuff, area stun that we have on top of the taunts, as long as we stand all the focused guy has to do is move a bit, and our team can rain AE damage on the enemy pack stuck in the mud.

 

They can do "split" or "opportunistic attacks" without suiciding but they are not nearly as effective at slowing down people as we are, when you catch a healer (or better 2 healers) runnning to reinforce somewhere with your PT they don't go anywhere until they resolve to take you down which is going to take them well over 90s. good luck doing that with an assassin.

 

They are excellent solo defenders for nodes, honetly nothing comes close to them, good for them, I 'd rather enjoy the fights than doing watchdog.

 

Are assassins Overpowered, well that would explain why everybody and their grandmother plays sorcerer/assassin/shadow or sage these days, but then again it is ground for nerfing those and not buffing everything else.

 

I think you guys base your claims on the numbers you see at the end of the battlegrounds, but these are just stats they are just one viewing angle and they don't encompass the whole picutre, sometimes having the enemy's number low and winning is better than having your own numbers high and losing, it certainly pays better anyways.

 

If you want to win your 1 vs 1 roll a duellist class, PT is not a duelling class it might have been in the past, we enjoyed it but I don't think that was really the purpose of the class, every body likes to win duels, but sometimes you have to accept that is not what your class was designed/intended for.

 

PT shine at decreasing enemy's mobility, this in turn improves our team damage potential, and reduces enemy damage potential, and it stack very well with our other tools specifically dedicated to debuffing enemy's raw damage output.

[Mularky]

All bioware has to do to fix pyro is revert all the changes made to CGC and TD and everyone would be happy. Everyone and their mother go burst. We got ours taken away. I'm interested on the thought process for that . Edited May 27, 2013 by Mularky