The weird people you meet in Group Finder.

[BobFredJohn]

You were in the wrong, and your guildie was as well for supporting your shenanigans. The fight is easily done using the mechanics, and your nattering only made what could have been a smooth run annoying. If we search the thread I wouldn't be surprised to find this story from their perspective =p

 

Here is the other perspective he was talking about (though not in the group that guy was in)

 

Mannan TFP 3 healers (2 sorcs 1 op) and a sorc dps. I was 1 of the healers

 

We zone in and I am already annoyed with the sorc dps as he immediately writes the 2 lines that make me think he is a pr*ck:

"Why did you take so long answering the queue pop <40k sorc healers name>" (I had just assumed that person was on a loading screen so couldn't see the group pop until he was loaded)

"lets make this a fast run" (yeah, thanks for that, I didn't know and was intending to hang around wasting my time)

 

Get to first boss and with 2 of the 3 healers being sorcs our resource management is based upon procs from our heals. As such us 2 throw out heals once in a while to get that proc that prevents consumption from ruining the force regen. The dps isn't happy: "burn the boss" "dps" "stop healing just attack" "kill him quickly". I therefore tell him to shut up which he does until the end. He now throws a tantrum about how low the dps is and we will never get through the last boss.

 

Me and the other sorc tell him we will be fine, the op tells him to just click the console. We carry on and the dps continues complaining every time anybody does any heals. I therefore stop healing.

 

Get to the second boss and the dps gets killed. He is annoyed that even with 3 healers he was killed, that the 3 of us must be total noobs. The op points out there are kolto stations and he had been "nagging like an old woman that we shouldn't heal". He carries on moaning. I point out he throws a tantrum when we heal, then throws a tantrum when we don't and he should grow up. He stays quiet from there.

 

Get to the final boss and the dps says "moment of truth, 5 minutes with 3 healers". We get started, dps gets aggro and the flames start coming from the ceiling the other side of the room. The 3 of us move over there but the dps doesn't. He holds the boss where it is, sometimes moving to the kolto stations to heal himself. The 3 of us are telling him to move the boss over to us. The dps ignores us and eventually dies. He throws more tantrums about us standing out of range and not dpsing at all and with us being healers we need to work our balls off to get through this.

 

I combat res him and suggest to him that he follows the mechanics, he tells me I should learn them first. The op healer then explains them with the dps saying "the flames only appear at the front of the room, you have to keep him there. We get back into the fight, dps grabs aggro and takes the boss to the front of the room (there is a jet of flame on the left).

 

A loud mouthed dps who decides he can tell us what to do, points out the timing is going to be tight on the last boss then doesn't follow the mechanics.

Edited November 18, 2014 by BobFredJohn

[peedeeboy]

I am physically incapable of showing my disbelief in this statement. I hope this is sarcasm, because if I learned anything from KDY, its that this statement should never be made. Ever.

 

Yes - my tongue was firmly in my cheek when I wrote that! Quite hard to convey sarcasm on the interwebs sometimes!

[CrazyGreggy]

It's been an interesting 6 weeks with 12x xp and dealing with the lazy blurts that show up in FPs. There seems to have been an influx of new players, levelling either their first toon or their first toon on a new server anyway, and the awful just keeps on rolling.

 

The 20k assassin on Shadowlands in a mix of levels of gear including a GREEN lightsabre, who when told that the tank was not in the mood to carry him through HM Mando Raiders (in those exact words, prefaced with a "sorry"), quit the group and then resentfully whispered the tank that this would've been his 2nd run of the place that day. Call me a cynic but I parsed that as "another group carried me, why won't you?". As it turned out, the 31k merc that was the other dps had no idea what the Arsenal rotation should be and was heatlocking himself spamming Missile Blast over and over. Fortunately he was prepared to listen to advice and by the end of the run was putting out reasonable numbers and happy for the help.

 

The 14k assassin tank in Cademimu on TRE with dps gear, no charge and a rating 46 (I think) enhancement with just endurance on it in his shield. When it was suggested he put on a charge, he chose Lightning. When Dark Charge was suggested, he switched and said "ok" before charging into the first group and melting inside 2 GCDs. He was then kicked from the group and fortunately a replacement was only a short time coming.

 

The pair of sentinels from the same guild in HM Czerka labs whose dps output was so poor the first boss enraged at 41%. One of them had around 22k health, even with the Oricon starter gear, and would die from the electrified water, run back and repeatedly fail to grasp that leaping down only works when you jump from the 2nd level, not the top one. In the end, although I could heal the tank through the damage the boss was putting out, killing it just wasn't going to happen and both the tank and I, who I'd been training on multiple healers across multiple flashpoints, dropped group. The last thing I saw was a plaintive "how do we defeat it?" from the 22k sentinel.

 

The shadow in Red Reaper on TRE who, on approaching the pull after the first lift, stealthed and walked toward the pack. I had hopes of a stealth cc, but no, Force in Balance and instant splat. I tried to pick up the group but with 7 strongs pounding on me and only 1 dps to reduce their numbers, a wipe ensued. We ran back, although the healer chose to remain dead and await a res. The shadow lurked near the remaining mobs in stealth and, as was inevitable, was spotted. This put us in combat and interrupted the res on the healer. At this point the healer chose to rageblast the group with words, all of them English but clearly chosen for their ability to generate confusion due to the lack of meaning when placed together. We managed to finish the run with Doc, but there were a few deaths on the packs around the central chasm and no archaeologist to open the shortcut. When warned about non-tanks pulling, the shadow said "I understand" but then did the same thing a few more times. Sigh.

 

EV Hard Mode with a group consisting of one 40k Powertech tank who, from the moment the group formed to the moment we pulled the towers before the first boss, took 45 minutes to get to the instance due to a hamster-powered comp. No really, 45 minutes. I remained in-game, my guildie, who was the other healer, tabbed out and we chatted on vent. The dps comprised 1 30k sorc, 1 19k sniper and 3 16-18k sorcs. On the first missile phase on the Annihilation Droid I dropped my circle and noted one sorc a mile away and whose health was dropping rapidly. I pulled said sorc into the AOE, and despaired as said sorc backpedalled out of it in order to resume taking damage. I typed in raid chat "STAY IN THE AOE HEAL" only for the sorc to respond "don't rely on an aoe heal. learn your class". My somewhat acidic response was that the heal was appropriate to the mechanic and that the sorc should stop "spouting platitude and learn context". This set the tone for the rest of the run in which said sorc would participate.

 

Multiple comments of "if you can't heal EV, uninstall" when not a single death had occurred. Repeated standing in bad and commenting about the lack of heals. Finally on Gharj, said sorc, a female twilek in as little clothing as could be managed, stayed in melee range of the boss during a transition and dropped to less than 3k health. I extricated, then hit an instacast Dark Heal which, incidentally, crit and filled around a third to half the sorcs healthbar. He commented "Heal instead of pull. Uninstall if you can't heal EV". At this point I told him to stop playing deliberately poorly as I was now convinced he was trolling. My guildie and I agreed on vent we would no longer heal this clown and over the next minute or two we were reduced to tears of laughter as the sorc underwent a very public meltdown in raid chat as his health remained low, finally culminating in a death after a punt back into lava and a veritable eruption of obscenity in raid chat.

 

I joyfully admit to failing to be the bigger man here, and my guildie and I were certainly guilty of the whole "u mad?", "he maaaaaad" and "so mad" routine in Ops chat, but as I refused to let this bozo get to me, making a joke of it seemed the healthier way to go Right after the cave, angrysorc then deliberately ran through every kitty pack he could to cause a wipe and was promptly removed from the group. We finished the place with 7 men despite a wipe on Soa due to the Hamstertech not being able to kite Soa to the pillar and on the 2nd attempt it was done by me on pure healer threat.

Edited November 18, 2014 by CrazyGreggy

[Elusive_Thing]

As a counterbalance to the aforementioned adventures during the time of the great 12x XP plague, I'd like to offer a nicer story. I had been running a couple of Warzones as a DPS on my Juggernaut, but after the quality of the Imperial teams sharply declined, I decided to tank a Flashpoint. I zone into Mandalorian Raiders HM and see three people, all from the same guild. Their gear was rather bad, I think none of them had over 23k HP.

 

The guild name was totally new to me, as were their Legacy names, so after my respec I checked their achievements and gear. All three were on their first level 55's and did not even have other 50's, at least from any other class. Minimal achievements, hardly any group content and no level 55 group content at all. I wasn't in a hurry, so I said hi to everyone and they greeted me back as I ran to pull the first group that emerges from the lift in the lobby. At this point I ask them to wait a bit as I realised I was still in my PvP DPS gear and when I finally had my mostly Underworld, partially Dread Forged gear on they started asking questions. A lot of questions. An avalanche of questions.

 

I spent about 10-15 minutes explaining where I got my gear, how did I decide what stats to use, what the Mando Raiders HM is like, what other group content is there... They told they had only started playing a week ago or so and they were having a LAN party or something, but they'd been harassed pretty hard over the last couple of days, because of their gear and general skill level. I gave them a few pointers and tried to play as well as I could to make things simpler for them and we only had two deaths (yourstruly and one of the DPS) during the FP and they came during the bonus boss. A well-timed combat rev from the healer saved us that one.

 

It took maybe 70 minutes to get through the FP, including the questions at the start, but since I got them all excited, I ran them through Athiss SM as well and managed to convince a few friends to join us for an Eternity Vault SM as well. Took quite a few hours to get things together, but they seemed darn pleased and when I logged in the next day to rotate some crew skills, one of them had sent me a mail thanking for the experience. Needless to say, I got the fellows on my friend list now. It was nice to see how they developed over the couple of hours. In EV, I managed to get another Sorc healer to pair up with the newbie and the two DPS we got in were a Sniper and a Marauder just like the inexperienced DPS players were, so there was ample advice available all the time.

 

Admittedly, I was very bored when the Mando Raiders HM started and I had a lot of time on my hands. Otherwise, I shamefully confess, I might've just lazily referred them to a handful of guides and they would've been stuck at the Flashpoint with no tank.

Edited November 18, 2014 by Elusive_Thing

[DogeDandolo]

Sounds like you had a great run. I always enjoy helping eager newbies.

[Ryuku-sama]

As a counterbalance to the aforementioned adventures during the time of the great 12x XP plague, I'd like to offer a nicer story. I had been running a couple of Warzones as a DPS on my Juggernaut, but after the quality of the Imperial teams sharply declined, I decided to tank a Flashpoint. I zone into Mandalorian Raiders HM and see three people, all from the same guild. Their gear was rather bad, I think none of them had over 23k HP.

 

The guild name was totally new to me, as were their Legacy names, so after my respec I checked their achievements and gear. All three were on their first level 55's and did not even have other 50's, at least from any other class. Minimal achievements, hardly any group content and no level 55 group content at all. I wasn't in a hurry, so I said hi to everyone and they greeted me back as I ran to pull the first group that emerges from the lift in the lobby. At this point I ask them to wait a bit as I realised I was still in my PvP DPS gear and when I finally had my mostly Underworld, partially Dread Forged gear on they started asking questions. A lot of questions. An avalanche of questions.

 

I spent about 10-15 minutes explaining where I got my gear, how did I decide what stats to use, what the Mando Raiders HM is like, what other group content is there... They told they had only started playing a week ago or so and they were having a LAN party or something, but they'd been harassed pretty hard over the last couple of days, because of their gear and general skill level. I gave them a few pointers and tried to play as well as I could to make things simpler for them and we only had two deaths (yourstruly and one of the DPS) during the FP and they came during the bonus boss. A well-timed combat rev from the healer saved us that one.

 

It took maybe 70 minutes to get through the FP, including the questions at the start, but since I got them all excited, I ran them through Athiss SM as well and managed to convince a few friends to join us for an Eternity Vault SM as well. Took quite a few hours to get things together, but they seemed darn pleased and when I logged in the next day to rotate some crew skills, one of them had sent me a mail thanking for the experience. Needless to say, I got the fellows on my friend list now. It was nice to see how they developed over the couple of hours. In EV, I managed to get another Sorc healer to pair up with the newbie and the two DPS we got in were a Sniper and a Marauder just like the inexperienced DPS players were, so there was ample advice available all the time.

 

Admittedly, I was very bored when the Mando Raiders HM started and I had a lot of time on my hands. Otherwise, I shamefully confess, I might've just lazily referred them to a handful of guides and they would've been stuck at the Flashpoint with no tank.

 

Damn.. And one MVP for ya

[Elusive_Thing]

Was good fun, I must admit. And since the DPS didn't kill everything before I could do two moves, I got some practice in actually tanking a Flashpoint! Usually it's just Charge, Reflect/Smash/Crushing Blow/whatever, next mob. And I was genuinely surprised that we took down the bonus boss in first try, even though I explained the fight and DPS rotations in a rather detailed manner, because I knew it was going to be a close one. When I started I got a lot of help too, so it's nice when I can put that tradition forward and now there were no overeager pros demanding for a speedrun.

 

Suited a lazy day off from work just fine.

[Ryuku-sama]

Was good fun, I must admit. And since the DPS didn't kill everything before I could do two moves, I got some practice in actually tanking a Flashpoint! Usually it's just Charge, Reflect/Smash/Crushing Blow/whatever, next mob. And I was genuinely surprised that we took down the bonus boss in first try, even though I explained the fight and DPS rotations in a rather detailed manner, because I knew it was going to be a close one. When I started I got a lot of help too, so it's nice when I can put that tradition forward and now there were no overeager pros demanding for a speedrun.

 

Suited a lazy day off from work just fine.

 

Nice from you. I know very few people who would take times to help someone else beyond giving them a few guides and kicking them nicely or carrying them and not caring.

[Elusive_Thing]

Nice from you. I know very few people who would take times to help someone else beyond giving them a few guides and kicking them nicely or carrying them and not caring.

It does happen to me from time to time too. I usually run with at least one guildie though, so carrying people through Flashpoints isn't exactly a problem and in those situations it's pretty easy to help. But if I am alone with two "veterans" and one newbie, usually the other two get frustrated well before me. If Group Finder is the boat I use to sail through the sea of offensive trolls, a little help my add a couple of drops of non-hostile water.

 

Plus, one of the DPS was a Marauder. Who am I to say 'no' to a Marauder?

[LilyJedi]

Same if it's a tank switching to dps, dps switching to tank, healer switching to tank, etc

 

The mechanics are the same no matter what role you do. Just you'll be doing something job wise, differently.

... no. For most events, for the most part, healing generally ignores most of the mechanics. And what the tank does is often not obvious to someone that has simply done a given Op or FP as a healer or DPS. Healers or Tanks switching to DPS may well have similar issues.

[Ryuku-sama]

Plus, one of the DPS was a Marauder. Who am I to say 'no' to a Marauder?

 

Oh I get it now. You were scarred of facing the wrath of the deities that are Marauders!!!!!!

[venomlash]

Was good fun, I must admit. And since the DPS didn't kill everything before I could do two moves, I got some practice in actually tanking a Flashpoint! Usually it's just Charge, Reflect/Smash/Crushing Blow/whatever, next mob. And I was genuinely surprised that we took down the bonus boss in first try, even though I explained the fight and DPS rotations in a rather detailed manner, because I knew it was going to be a close one. When I started I got a lot of help too, so it's nice when I can put that tradition forward and now there were no overeager pros demanding for a speedrun.

 

Suited a lazy day off from work just fine.

 

Good to see people developing talent in others.

When I wind up with a group of people who are undergeared/inexperienced but not actively stupid, it's always fun. I take it as a challenge, really; if I'm healing, it's good practice not only at healing but at juggling heals/off-DPS, if I'm tanking, it's good practice at timing my DCDs, and if I'm DPSing, I get to work on situational awareness, peeling for healers, and facetanking/offhealing in a pinch. The best part, though, is seeing people get better over the course of the instance, and maybe running into them in the future.

 

Some people never learn though. There's one particular Commando who I've run tacticals with a few times who seems to be immune to advice. Specced Gunnery, never uses Grav Round, has Plasma Cell active, and wields a rifle. Why.

 

Hamstertech

 

I'm dying laughing at that. Also, the sorc got what he deserved. If he wants to tell the healer how to heal, when the healing has been adequate thus far (no deaths), he ought to heal it himself if he knows so much. I just don't get why bad DPS so often feel the need to blame the healer. I'm like

"Why are you trying to dump your badness on someone else? You're a bad! Accept it! Own it! Be proud of it!"

[BobFredJohn]

Interesting run of red reaper with my sent dps. I was in a group with shadow tank, shadow dps and sorc healer. I am the weird one here.

 

Both shadows use force wave on CD. I ask them not to. The tank ignores me and continues, the dps no longer uses it on CD, instead they only use it if they feel the enemies are too bunched up and would be better defeated if spread out. The sorc healer also starts to move in and force wave on CD which he wasn't doing before I mentioned, so I get the feeling I am being trolled.

 

I carry on putting up with it by using specific tactics. The 2 shadows move in and open with force wave, thats when I jump in. Once I jump in the sorc healer moves up, stands where I am and force waves. As such I decide to just walk in so my force leap is not on CD. The 2 shadows opened with it so theirs is on CD, I make sure to walk up to an enemy but not attack it then wait for the healer to come and force wave it away from me. Because I haven't hit it the healer then gets aggro from it. I then jump to another target and start my dps allowing the healer to deal with the enemy they now have aggro on.

 

However after a few pulls the healer gets wise so instead they wait a few GCD's so I have a chance to select where I will fight, then they will move up and wave. As such I just give up. I start playing properly, force leaping in and start my rotation, the second the healer comes and force waves I force camo and the healer gets aggro on everything (the 2 shadows tunnel-vision). This results in 4 healer deaths over the next 5 pulls. I then speak up in chat "I'm not going to chase enemies around, you knock them away you deal with it". Over the next 3 pulls the same tactics result in 3 more healer deaths.

 

I then get kicked.

Edited November 18, 2014 by BobFredJohn

[DogeDandolo]

Um ... what.

[NijelBlakk]

I have a couple of stories that all involve the same thing.

 

When ever I pug FP's I either play my healer or tank since I find playing DPS boring. When I play my healer it is annoying when the tanks are in fact DPS but we push through and might only die a couple times.

 

What I find really annoying though is when I play a tank and DPS run up to the group of mobs that were just pulled and AOE knockback all of them. I always ask them to stop doing that and I get the same response every time. The move is great damage. I really wish they would make those moves do no damage at all so people would stop using them.

 

After I ask them to stop most of the time they do stop using it for the rest of the FP, however I have had 2 people so far refuse to stop and they were just kicked when I could.

[Fidelicatessen]

What I find really annoying though is when I play a tank and DPS run up to the group of mobs that were just pulled and AOE knockback all of them. I always ask them to stop doing that and I get the same response every time. The move is great damage. I really wish they would make those moves do no damage at all so people would stop using them.

 

You could point out to them that it actually ISN'T great damage. Especially when all of the lost AoEs are factored in, but even without that, Force Wave STILL isn't great damage.

 

I always say "please only use knockback for good" or "don't use knockback for evil" and that usually does the trick.

[darkapprentice]

You could point out to them that it actually ISN'T great damage. Especially when all of the lost AoEs are factored in, but even without that, Force Wave STILL isn't great damage.

 

I always say "please only use knock back for good" or "don't use knock back for evil" and that usually does the trick.

 

I have pointed out many times to people who have that constant need to use knock back when it comes off cool down, as if it does any real good. some don't do damage and the ones that do only do the lowest or near lowest damage of all of the abilities. It usually goes ignored and those players continue to be a pain in the ***, especially when I'm playing a melee toon. It's really annoying having mobs knocked out of range after using force leap and always having to chase after them. Half the time if they continue, I just stand there and either attack the closest mob, if possible, or just stand there and wait till the fight ends. Melee toons are of little use if they spend the whole fight chasing after mobs because noobs have this need to always use knock back when if comes off cool down.

[DarthMurdek]

I ran into a tank in SM black talon that insisted beyond reason that i not only wait for him to pull the mobs first but wait until he has gotten aggro on them all to go in or else "we fail lots".

 

I saved myself the trouble and soloed the damn thing. (i also learned the droid is 300X easier to solo then the squadies. at least when in modless gear)

[flavmad]

I have pointed out many times to people who have that constant need to use knock back when it comes off cool down, as if it does any real good. some don't do damage and the ones that do only do the lowest or near lowest damage of all of the abilities. It usually goes ignored and those players continue to be a pain in the ***, especially when I'm playing a melee toon. It's really annoying having mobs knocked out of range after using force leap and always having to chase after them. Half the time if they continue, I just stand there and either attack the closest mob, if possible, or just stand there and wait till the fight ends. Melee toons are of little use if they spend the whole fight chasing after mobs because noobs have this need to always use knock back when if comes off cool down.

 

As a tank, I only use knock back, when a mob is after the healer, and my taunt is on cooldown. That, or force choke. Is it a good tactic, or would there be a good alternative?

[Elusive_Thing]

As a tank, I only use knock back, when a mob is after the healer, and my taunt is on cooldown. That, or force choke. Is it a good tactic, or would there be a good alternative?

Pretty much any attack from a tank should do the trick. Force Choke is, of course, very convenient, because it puts the lad on a time out as well as damages him.

[Fidelicatessen]

As a tank, I only use knock back, when a mob is after the healer, and my taunt is on cooldown. That, or force choke. Is it a good tactic, or would there be a good alternative?

 

If you have NO OTHER ATTACK AVAILABLE, then knockback is fine in that situation.

 

See, the problem is, if you use knockback then suddenly that mob is out of melee range. As a tank, you WANT that mob in melee range. Just hit it with any attack and suddenly the healer is safe.

 

Knockback is EXTREMELY useful in gathering scattered groups together for AoE, or knocking things off of bottomless pits so you don't have to fight them. Any other use is debatable, and probably sub-optimal.

[JouerTue]

As a tank, I only use knock back, when a mob is after the healer, and my taunt is on cooldown. That, or force choke. Is it a good tactic, or would there be a good alternative?

 

if a mob is on the healer even base attack will aggro it, for sure a high threat skill

[Frenesi]

Any other use is debatable, and probably sub-optimal.

 

It's also a nice DCD if you are ranged, have 2 melee elites on you and the tank doesn't care. Knockback+root FTW

Edited November 19, 2014 by Frenesi

[Darkelefantos]

It's also a nice DCD if you are ranged, have 2 melee elites on you and the tank doesn't care. Knockback+root FTW

 

It's also a great way to annoy a tank who cares by splitting up enemies and kicking them out of melee range. Hooray

[Cox_The_Beast]

When I tank on my Jugg or Guardian, I only use Force Push in 3 situations:

- I need to jump to get to the Healer, but Intercede and Force Charge/Leap are on CD, so Force Push + Single Taunt on the same target, then jump back to the Healer and AoE when the mob follows. Then walk away back to the starting point...

- The enemy I'm focusing now is not a weak/standard and uses AoE massively, and the DPS are very close and NOT melee. I Force Push it away before Force Charge/Leap to it to eat the AoE alone.

- I screwed the rotation and need Rage/Focus badly, but I already used Sundering Assault/Strike and the skill that gives me Rage/Focus (name escapes me, sorry ) and I lack alternatives to Assault/Strike. Of course, I only use this as a last resort if there's no risk to screw the group.

 

Of course, personal ways to Tank do exist, so no critics on the plan that everyone follows unless it screws the group, on my part.

 

On my DPS chars - namely my Sorc, since that's the only one I play recently which has a knockback - I only pushback if I need a moment to breathe and the Tank is not Tanking. Which may seem nothing, but lately is quite common, at least in my experience.

The other thing I do afterwards, is to Force Speed to the Tank after the pushback so that the enemies eat the Tank's AoEs and finally leave me alone.

Edited November 19, 2014 by Cox_The_Beast