Swtor mods

[eldefail]

Macros would be nice to have.

 

Some basic macros would be nice. I haven't played my jugg lately but last I checked the massive ability bloat was still there. I like a minimal interface, so having every single action bar enabled bothers me. I'd like to have a macro that lets me click something, and when I ctrl click it, it casts something else, to save action bar clutter. It doesn't give me any kind of edge or advantage, it just saves me some keybinds.

 

Mouseover healing would be nice as well. It's not a game changer by any means, it's not hard to click heal, it just feels less clunky that way.

 

Graphic UI addons would be awesome. I like the default UI but I would love to be able to customize my ops frames--instead of buff icons I'd like corner indicators a la a certain other game's raid frames. Far more tidy that way. I'd also like to be able to filter out debuffs I'm not interested in cluttering up my screen.

 

NO game needs damage meters and TOR does not need bossmods or anything. But various UI elements feel clunky, outdated, and are just...ick. I'd love some UI mods that allow me to customize my bags, implement a more in-depth bag sorting feature, etc.

 

Lotro's API is fairly limited in what you can mod, as well. Most of it is graphical modifications--just skinning the UI. There are a few other useful things, none of which make or break the game by any stretch of the imagination and are most certainly not required, but it lets you kind of personalize your interface or more easily keep track of your travel locations, pets, little things that do not make or break the game at all.

 

WoW got really bad, and at one point they were actually tuning end-game encounters on the assumption that your guild/raid group required you to use certain bossmod addons and threatmeters, and as such, it became difficult to do those encounters without them. That's a good example of the wrong way to do it.

 

But what many of us are asking for are the little things. Let me skin my action bars and unitframes. Give me mouseover healing. Give me simple, basic macros that let me put keypress conditionals so when I click, shift click, alt click, or ctrl click, it casts a different spell I define in the macro so I can save on bar space without cluttering up my screen.

[fresnosmokey]

I played WoW and I used a lot of mods, but I'm pretty OK with the lack of mods in SWTOR. However, the main thrust of the OP's rant was the GTN, and I very definitely agree that the GTN sucks and could be greatly improved. I also think the mailbox has room for improvement. These could be fixed by BW, especially the GTN. Mods are not necessary.

[Rafaman]

Hmm... OPs argument seems to be all over the place. It's about Mods... and GTN... and the lack of gear outside of GTN if you don't do flashpoints?

 

Well, as for mods, meh... not needed. You want a combat/threat meter? They are out there. You want to automate when to use a specific ability when you proc? L2p. Cosmetic customizations should be in game and not modded. All other reasons to have mods are superfluous crap that is not needed IMO.

 

The GTN is... ok. I can usually find what I'm looking for very quickly as the search feature has been greatly improved. I play GTN and have made tons of creds but it is aside anyway. I'd rather the resources go elsewhere like a better character customization system.

Edited January 31, 2013 by Rafaman

[Rezakh]

"interface action failed because of an addon"

 

I see this message a lot when I play WoW.

 

riddle me this, addon lovers.

 

WHY does it have to be an addon and not just in game addition? what makes third party addon better then the same functionality added by game developers?

 

We're talking about TOR's interface, here. The same guys that gave us the UI travesty that people had to run end game with prior to the interface editor. If you were here for that no one should need to answer this.

 

is SWTOR UI perfect? no, its not. its miles better then WoW's stock UI though. you want improvements to UI, like visible procs, better buff/debuff management, better GTN interface (personally, I'd settle for shift-click item to copy paste its name into a search window option, though ability to see all the other listings would be fabulous), etc - why couldn't it be part of stock UI? added to stock UI?

 

addons by themselves are NOT inherently better. what's important is ability to customize your experience. and SWTOR ALREADY offers that.

 

I can change the font of the hp on my unit frames without enlarging the frames themselves?

I can alter what displays in my tooltip for ease of reading in combat?

I can set profiles for hotkey mapping so I do not have to remap all my keys for every new character I create?

I can change the appearance of my mini map and unit frames to stream-line my screen real-estate?

I can track gathering locations exclusively via my game client?

I can use mouse over macros to help mitigate the interfacing lag like targeting and ability delay?

I can actually perform ready checks in flashpoints?

I have the ability to make party companion frames appear as ops frames for the sake of cleaning up my UI?

 

I will not get into mission log display, inventory sorting (current inventory sorting is terrible), enemy/friendly nameplate customization, tab targeting, buff tiles, debuff indicators, tools for ops leaders, and a streamlined guild management system. I think you get the idea, so I'll stop there with absolutely no mention whatsoever of the GTN, which would double the length of this response.

 

I have a very conservative addon list in WoW. 42 (according to curse, including various dependancies, necessary for main addon to work). oh yes. 42 is conservative. all of them but altoholic and auction master? were installed to give me the UI customization options, I get in SWTOR base game. and I have to check on them constantly to make sure they are up to date (or they break), and sometimes, they break randomly anyways, and I need to reload. and god forbid my favorite addon's maker decides they don't want to play WoW anymore, I now have to look for a replacement option.

 

42 mods is not really conservative. I was a top tier raider with many server first kills in Classic and TBC (killing almost every boss from Lucifron to Illidan, except we did not get four horsemen before BC release in classic naxx so no saph or KT kill, either. I never ran over 20, and usually I did not run close to that, and I was a healer, dpser, raid leader, and GM much of BC when the interface was nowhere near as refined as it is now. And 40 of the 42 mods that you're running are baseline in SWTOR, with the amount of options you had with the out of the box UI in MoP, and I just went back to it for a time, I really do not see how this is an accurate representation. Could use clarifications here.

 

tell me again, how third party addons are better?

 

I'm playing WoW right now in addition to SWTOR for several reasons, but their UI is NOT one of those reasons.

 

Keep in mind, this is just WoW.

 

This is not even getting into other games. Which if I had to say, City of Heroes, probably had, by far, the best out of the box UI customization I have ever seen. Now that thing was impressive and what amazed me was you really did not need mods for any of the interfacing functions in the game. I am still surprised that I have not seen anyone emulate that level of customization. DAoC had a pretty amazing out of the box UI as well, not as good as CoH, but still pretty good.

 

How many subs do you think would have been retained in the first two months if mods/macros were implemented? That would have mitigated so much frustration on the part of most that the lack of end game would not have mattered, cause this game had more end game content in its first 2 months than WoW did prior to ZG/BWL.

Edited January 30, 2013 by Rezakh

[DiabloDoom]

Might aswell outsource my gaming time to a china boy in a sweat shop...

[AshlaBoga]

We're talking about TOR's interface, here. The same guys that gave us the UI travesty that people had to run end game with prior to the interface editor. If you were here for that no one should need to answer this.

 

I like to pretend I could always customize the UI, because remember the stock version makes me feel dizzy.

 

Does it count as 3rd party software if we write it ourselves? We're the 2nd party right?

[eldefail]

It seems to me many people think macros and addons are more or less botting features that automate the game. In any MMO I have ever played, these features were unsupported, considered exploits at best, and were usually bannable offenses once discovered.

 

UI customization would be best if it was just managed by the game client, give us a crap ton more options, but opening up that part of the API for player customization--within reason--would let the devs focus on other things. Macros should not automate ANYTHING, I don't think anybody is asking for that. A macro that, say, uses my mount when I hit my M key and uses my jet boost when I hit ctrl+m is what we're talking about, we're just talking saving action bar real estate and minimizing necessary keybinds. It doesn't give anybody any kind of automation, I could just as easily bind my jet boost to my N key instead, but now my N key is not available to bind any of my other spells. I could place it next to my mount and bind it to ctrl+m, but now that action bar slot is unavailable for something else in my spell book, be it a pet or a vital rotation skill. It doesn't give me any kind of edge to give me this functionality, it only helps me reduce the number of action bars I use and cut down on clutter.

 

UI skinning doesn't automate anything. I would just like to see the abilty, whether native to the client or through addons, to anchor buffs and debuffs to another part of unit frames, disable portraits completely, change unitframes to something more like the ops frames while still docking them seperately, the ability to filter and resize buffs, and customize which ones dispaly on my ops frames, things like that. I would love to see a few different UI skins for a different visual feel, but this is not something I would like the devs to prioritize, and thus simply opening up that part of the API to player customization that is TOTALLY OPTIONAL, you don't need it if you don't like it, would be ideal.

 

We aren't talking about addons that your guild will say you have to have in order to do ops or to pvp. The kind of addons that actually give anyone an edge (HealersHaveToDie in WoW or Bossmods or arguably damage meters) should be avoided, I totally agree with that.

 

But I think that some people misunderstand what basic addon and macro functionality is. A macro should never function as a third party program or provide any form of automation. I'm not even entirely sold on castsequence macros. But macros to handle modifiers to save screen real estate should be considered industry standard by now. Customizable unit/raid frames should be industry standard now. Scaling them is not good enough. Period.

 

There seems to be a lot of "I'm fine with the stock UI therefore addons are unnecessary." If so many of us felt that way we probably would not have this recurring discussion. Can we at least discuss the reasons why you feel these features are unnecessary? The GTN is terrible (so is WoW's auction house). Inventory? I don't like all in one bags, and I don't like the half-assed sort feature. Instead of wasting dev-team resources on this, we could let modders do it for FREE, and it would be totally optional.

Edited January 31, 2013 by eldefail

[Jeweledleah]

We're talking about TOR's interface, here. The same guys that gave us the UI travesty that people had to run end game with prior to the interface editor. If you were here for that no one should need to answer this.

 

 

 

I can change the font of the hp on my unit frames without enlarging the frames themselves?

I can alter what displays in my tooltip for ease of reading in combat?

I can set profiles for hotkey mapping so I do not have to remap all my keys for every new character I create?

I can change the appearance of my mini map and unit frames to stream-line my screen real-estate?

I can track gathering locations exclusively via my game client?

I can use mouse over macros to help mitigate the interfacing lag like targeting and ability delay?

I can actually perform ready checks in flashpoints?

I have the ability to make party companion frames appear as ops frames for the sake of cleaning up my UI?

 

I will not get into mission log display, inventory sorting (current inventory sorting is terrible), enemy/friendly nameplate customization, tab targeting, buff tiles, debuff indicators, tools for ops leaders, and a streamlined guild management system. I think you get the idea, so I'll stop there with absolutely no mention whatsoever of the GTN, which would double the length of this response.

 

 

 

42 mods is not really conservative. I was a top tier raider with many server first kills in Classic and TBC (killing almost every boss from Lucifron to Illidan, except we did not get four horsemen before BC release in classic naxx so no saph or KT kill, either. I never ran over 20, and usually I did not run close to that, and I was a healer, dpser, raid leader, and GM much of BC when the interface was nowhere near as refined as it is now. And 40 of the 42 mods that you're running are baseline in SWTOR, with the amount of options you had with the out of the box UI in MoP, and I just went back to it for a time, I really do not see how this is an accurate representation. Could use clarifications here.

 

 

 

Keep in mind, this is just WoW.

 

This is not even getting into other games. Which if I had to say, City of Heroes, probably had, by far, the best out of the box UI customization I have ever seen. Now that thing was impressive and what amazed me was you really did not need mods for any of the interfacing functions in the game. I am still surprised that I have not seen anyone emulate that level of customization. DAoC had a pretty amazing out of the box UI as well, not as good as CoH, but still pretty good.

 

How many subs do you think would have been retained in the first two months if mods/macros were implemented? That would have mitigated so much frustration on the part of most that the lack of end game would not have mattered, cause this game had more end game content in its first 2 months than WoW did prior to ZG/BWL.

 

I was there for original TOR interface. 5 days early access, digital deluxe edition player here.

 

it was about same as WoW base interface, I'd say slightly better as it never bugged me the way WoW UI did. and developers admitted as much, that 1.2 was supposed to be release state, not what we original got. game was rushed. we know this

 

I'm not saying that improvements shouldn't be made. all I'm saying is that I'm fine with developers being the ones making them, even if it takes more time, as long as it saves me the addon updating headache (not to mention compatibility) and the thing is - i don't hate addons. i use them extensively in single player games. but I'm weary of addons in MMO's solely because MMO's get patched a LOT more often. and every patch breaks something.

 

I'm also fine with macros. I don't hate macros. I've used macros myself. I adore mouse over macros. but I can manage without.

 

curse list tells me 42 items installed. in reality most of it is modules and libraries for something like 10 addons maybe, I mean couple of them are WoW specific - the pet battle improvements stuff, but they still take up memory. and I don't even use gatherer. never have. some of the addons I have though are as simple as "get all male/delete all mail" functionality, I have with SWTOR. recently - they added an ability to sell all junk, without having to send off companion. in WoW - I need an addon for that and I never had an option to send companion to do that for me. moving my minimap around, or changing bar size? need an addon. heck, I need a separate addon just to give me the timer on my cooldowns, another option I get with SWTOR without. map that I can have open while I'm traveling around and that fades as I move, allowing me to see the surroundings, while still showing me where I'm going? need an addon for that.. I used to use grid instead of stock raid frames, but after over 5 years, they finaly implemented something similar enough (and btw, I don't know about you, but I use op frames as my party frames - the option is in game. the only thing its lacking, is companion display, but I did change the font of the health display without changing the size of the frames - it also is availabel in stock customization). I'm not entirely sure what you mean about inventory sorting, as I've always done it manually

 

either way - this third party dependence it is NOT a desirable state IMO.

 

I have a huge respect for addon makers. I think they are awesome. but they are also human, and they do this stuff for free and sometimes they get tired of maintaining an addon, or they no longer play the game and you end up having to figure out what could you possibly use as replacement. and I cannot blame them for giving up their projects. they are not obligated to stick around.

 

so to reiterate, I'd rather developers implement the changes. even if I have to wait longer for them.

Edited January 31, 2013 by Jeweledleah

[Fornix]

I'm not saying that improvements shouldn't be made. all I'm saying is that I'm fine with developers being the ones making them, even if it takes more time, as long as it saves me the addon updating headache (not to mention compatibility) and the thing is - i don't hate addons. i use them extensively in single player games. but I'm weary of addons in MMO's solely because MMO's get patched a LOT more often. and every patch breaks something.

 

The thing is, developers will simply not be able to implement it all, or create a major level of bloat riddled with dozens of options on how to display things.

 

As for example, this is the style of UI I'd work with in WoW:

http://www.wowuigallery.com/bb-gallery/original/201_RealUI-010-combatinfo.jpg

 

Lots of center, on screen information in a very minimalistic look. Allowing you to stay both on top of your game, as well as actually enjoy the fight graphically.

 

Some people however, do not like the minimalistic look, some like lots of information spread out throughout their screen with every little part of the edge being put to use, such as this:

http://www.wowuigallery.com/bb-gallery/original/100_fuibetaraidxt1.jpg

 

Personally, I consider that a terrible UI, but there's many people working with UI's just like that in WoW.

 

 

And there's many more UI's hanging in between, or being even different in another way.

 

 

Developers will NEVER be able to match that, they will never be able to incorporate all desired styles, desired layout options and alterations, without creating an ultimate form of bloat and essentially reducing their QA departments time in patches on testing actual content to practically nothing, just to make sure that none of the UI elements were messed up during the patch.

[Jeweledleah]

half the stuff you showed above is purely cosmetic and not necessary for functionality, it just bloats up the memory and makes things look slightly prettier. all they would really need to implement is ability to move chat window and ability to hide UI elements out of combat. that's it.

 

the cost of enabling addons IMO is too high. between addon makers having to constantly stay on top of updates, players having to deal with broken addons every time there's a patch, developers now having to keep addon makers in mind.. its just... not worth it to me. not in MMO.

 

so in my opinion a more productive course of action would be to compile a nice, doable wish list of quality of life features for developers to work on. and I do believe there's already at least one thread covering that.

 

P.S. that second screen shot is horrifying. why does that person need duplicate raid frames?? among other things...

Edited January 31, 2013 by Jeweledleah

[Vigilanis]

Where I agree that Macros would be a nice addition I am pleased that Mods don't exist for this game. Although Macros were great in SWG for automating your dancing or crafting activities, they wouldn't have a massive use in TOR although I can imagine they would be useful.

 

As regards the GTN, I must admit to finding it difficult at first until I got a feel for how it worked (guess my mindset was still thinking SWG Bazaars lol), but I soon found my way around. I think that the only annoying thing for me is when you just want to browse all light armours for example and the search box is grayed out until you pick a slot or add a keyword. I know this is to limit the massive amount of results but I found it constrictive.

 

I would maybe like to see a little more in the line of usability for whatever your browsing preference is on the GTN but to be honest now I know how it works, it is pretty much fine as it is.

Edited January 31, 2013 by Vigilanis

[Fornix]

half the stuff you showed above is purely cosmetic and not necessary for functionality, it just bloats up the memory and makes things look slightly prettier.

 

I disagree, yes it may be cosmetic, but it also enhances functionality. Placing cooldown timers, buff icons and other combat related data spread out over the screen, attached on big blocks is far from functional. Yet many game developers go down that path.

 

This leads to a scenario in which you keep swapping focus between your character's surroundings, hotbars, healthbars, buff icons, etc.

 

Whilst in an ideal situation you want to get a direct overview of ALL of that WITHOUT needing to shift focus on your screen to various locations.

 

A more minimalistic approach allows transfering those elements towards the center of your screen, as shown well in the first image. This enables you to get exactly that direct overview of all necesarry data without ever needing to shift focus. You can keep focus on surroundings, cooldowns, energy status, etc.

 

If you'd want to do something similar to this in SWTOR? You can't, because multiple elements are fixed together such as buffs/health/energy status all being part of one bulky block with pointless decorations.

 

all they would really need to implement is ability to move chat window and ability to hide UI elements out of combat. that's it.

 

In addition:

 

- Seperate movable buffs.

- Split buffs / debuffs as well as indicators for your (de)buffs.

- Detachable healthbars, preferably altered shapes as well.

- Detachable energy bars, preferably altered shapes as well.

- Cooldown bar(s) with multiple format layouts.

- Ability to alter positioning and text effects of incoming damage/heals and outgoing damage/heals.

 

And well yeh, that's basically just my desires and expectencies from an MMO UI. I'm sure many people have other desires to be added to that list.

 

the cost of enabling addons IMO is too high. between addon makers having to constantly stay on top of updates, players having to deal with broken addons every time there's a patch, developers now having to keep addon makers in mind.. its just... not worth it to me. not in MMO.

 

Keeping addon makers in mind is only much of an effort if you let your development team work through needless loops. If your development team is able to use a solid API for their interface elements, it doesn't have to be a lot of work for allowing addon makers to do the same. And addons breaking with a patch, is never of importance to a developer. It's just of importance to the addon maker. It should never even be regarded as the other way around.

 

P.S. that second screen shot is horrifying. why does that person need duplicate raid frames?? among other things...

 

No clue, never understand that sort of UI's either . But there's many UI's out there like it.

[Prysha]

What mods?

Armorings? Mods, Crystals and Enhancements?

[Petnil]

QoL mods mainly. like a mod to fast gearchange from dps to tank ex. a mod to shut up you ship droid.

 

Mod´s are a way to get the comunity engaged. Lf mods were enabled loads of theese clipping issues on armors would probably have been fixed by a mod. It all depends on what the developer wants to be given free for mods.

 

An alternative could be to only allow certified mods. Give the modders a way to make mods and dont allow them to use mods untill they have been certified.

 

Ofc you would need uncertified mods enabled on PTS for testing.

 

Mods are good. Keeping mods under control is important though, but it shouldn´t be too hard to do that.

[xxIncubixx]

mods are terrible, still remember on warhammer online Nerfedbuttons... 1 huge sequence of attacks, with priorities with debuffs, buffs and so on in one button, the character almost played alone. Edited January 31, 2013 by xxIncubixx

[Rezakh]

the cost of enabling addons IMO is too high. between addon makers having to constantly stay on top of updates, players having to deal with broken addons every time there's a patch, developers now having to keep addon makers in mind.. its just... not worth it to me. not in MMO.

 

There is no real cost to enabling them, minus developing mod tools for modders to use. There is quite a bit to be gained. You end up creating a very robust community of people that enjoy the game that want to improve it with quality of life type things, which makes many happy and for those that do not like, they do not have to partake. No one is forced to have it one way.

 

In your suggestion, you're forcing a majority of the player base (its a PC game standard to be able to mod, btw) to follow a preset list of conditions in their interfacing developed by one team of people. The game's staff does have to spend more time/man hours developing their out of the box UI to meet demands which by the way can change, thereby, perpetuating a workload that needn't exist. BW can simply open up the game to modding, embrace the free labor, and for the most part neglect the interface from here, on.

 

Many of the things you listed that SWTOR has in their default interface which WoW lacks in its default interface is because Blizzard embraced the free labor (free labor that is passionate about what they do). That's more time on development and since its the systems design guys that work on much of the interfacing, this could equate to better balance in this game, had they gone with mods. Why? More time and availability to do so. Notice the balance issues in this game? How about the laggy interface? Ability delay? All these things, and probably many more, could have had more manpower invested in them during 1.2's development had modding been allowed.

 

so in my opinion a more productive course of action would be to compile a nice, doable wish list of quality of life features for developers to work on. and I do believe there's already at least one thread covering that.

 

The problem is, this is not a more productive course of action, in the long run. You end up with too many people that end up unhappy with the ship they're forced to sail on, rather than giving people the vast customization options that allow them to sail how they wish. Compiling a nice doable wish list would work great, if we were all robots with the same functions, built by the same manufacturer, and programed to like said wish list. Problem is, we're humans.

 

Granted your suggestion would be more believable if BW showed that they respond to feedback well and actually provide what their customer base wants (they're notorious for doing the opposite). So, how would that change in the UI design for the "wish list"? It would not, so the idea is a failed one, it already has failed, twice.

 

And, again, I was a hardcore raider and did loads of end game content in prior MMO's. I have no desire to do them in this game because the interface is the hardest boss in the game. I know many who quit with the major exodus last spring that would have stayed had modding and macros been added, its just too important to PC gamers to not allow it and the benefits (which are potentially limitless) by far outweigh any possible cost.

[Royox]

Famous MMO UI with "mods" and Addons:

http://pastandoenmulgore.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/wowscrnshot101407130246ml3.jpg

 

SWTOR UI:

http://www.forcejunkies.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/Force_Junkies_Become_One_With_the_UI_tank_large.jpg

 

 

So no. Not addons needed, not addons wanted.

[DAWUSS]

The mods I'd install would be texture packs (possibly - I'd have to see them first) and nude mods (a nitpick of mine when I have nothing equipped)

[Jeweledleah]

@ Rezakh - I disagree that BIoware doesn't listen. almost all the customization changes they implemented were DUE to player feedback.

 

btw, I don't know if you all are aware, but Blizzard actualy does work with modding community. becasue they have been made aware of the issues that happen every time a patch hits - they releace the lua notes to the modders as quickly as possible, sometimes prior to patch, so that mods could be fixed.

 

bioware would have to do same if mods were implemented, or deal with fallout of people coming in droves to complain how their favorite mod doesn't work anymore.

 

Blizzard also has to deal with shutting down mods that essentially allow botitng and cheating. they actively have to work on changing the code that makes those mods possible, usually after mods are released, because possibility didn't occur to them.

 

and again. pc gaming and modding do go together. but to me, that should be limited to games that don't get frequent (sometimes weekly) updates. you know, like single player games. developers relying on modders means that I'm stuck relying on modders as well and chances are it will take them a lot longer if at all to implement features that improve quality of life. I've been through multiple occurrences where I had to completely overhaul my UI, spend way too much time looking for comparable mods and not always finding them, simply because addon maker stopped updating their addon. and each and every time, I tried doing without and it was bad. and while appearance addons don't change balance of the game, a lot of quality of life addons? can. right now, WoW is specifically balanced for addons. Blizzard painted themselves into a corner and now they have to design encounters to take addons into account, or people scream "TOO EASY" and that in turn FORCES everyone to have to use essentials.

 

it IS productive to make lists of suggestions and let developers implement those that are most crucial and most doable. its not productive or realistic to expect them to implement everything on YOUR time table. even modders cannot accomplish that, even when you have a much larger community of them

[Rezakh]

Famous MMO UI with "mods" and Addons:

http://pastandoenmulgore.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/wowscrnshot101407130246ml3.jpg

 

SWTOR UI:

http://www.forcejunkies.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/Force_Junkies_Become_One_With_the_UI_tank_large.jpg

 

 

So no. Not addons needed, not addons wanted.

 

Post an example of one guy using mods wrong and so we need to ban them. Well, I suppose its time for us to ban cars, doctors, fast food, and alcohol.

[Rezakh]

@ Jeweledleah

 

Blizzard also has how many subscribers for WoW? Versus how many for TOR? Its embarrassing enough to EA that they're still not publishing those numbers. Not a very good comparison. We're comparing a pecan plantation to pieces of pecan pie that just passed through someone's digestive tract.

 

And BW listens, sure. I'm not saying they do not listen at all, I am saying they listen to very very few of the important suggestions made concerning the game. They're infamous in TOR for turning their backs on the majority of the community (this is probably the main reason why they lost so many players).

 

Their customer service is absolutely atrocious because of the guy they hired to run live services and he's the executive producer now. This is the same guy that is responsible for bug fixing, patching, and overseeing the avenues by which players can present criticism and feedback to the devs so that improvements can be made and his history in this role, in this industry, is horrid. He is known for blatantly ignoring gaming communities and ramming his initiatives down player's throats until the game is shut down.

 

If this has somehow changed overnight and he did some press apologizing for his past and trying to move forward thinking about the players, please share with me...that would be welcomed news and would mean that TOR could be saved without his departure.

 

You have some OK points that could have the potential to be amazing points, but if they rest on the shoulders of some of the higher ups at BW, they're not going to happen, not by a long shot. I know this by history, I played DAoC when it was awesome and saw how far it fell when he took over. I stayed away from WAR because of him and so many of my friends went to it anyhow, and that thing was a Greek tragedy. As for TOR, I like the story and I like SW, so I put up with it...and its something the wife will play with me cause she likes it, so how can I argue with that.

Edited January 31, 2013 by Rezakh

[Monoth]

So basically the OP wants mods that play the game for him....

 

Personally I'm glad Bioware stuck to their guns and don't allow mods and macros.... Take Rift for example if you don't run macros for PvP you don't stand a chance... It ruins MMO's IMO...

[Manifoldgodhead]

I honestly think mods are killing WoW, the game practically plays itself. With the curse installer you sign in, load all your mods and start single clicking for every action. One click to switch specs, one click to run a dungeon, one click to change gear. Blizzard keeps adding mods to the UI and now the whole experience has the depth of a kiddie pool.

 

Yes modding is optional but it's so easy and addictive. The last time I played WoW I beat all the content without ever getting on my fancy flying mount. And even when they up the level cap it's do heavily phased younger as well be playing a single player game. Which is why I'm here, if I'm going to play a single player MMO it might as well be fully voice acted.

Edited January 31, 2013 by Manifoldgodhead

[Jeweledleah]

@ Jeweledleah

 

Blizzard also has how many subscribers for WoW? Versus how many for TOR? Its embarrassing enough to EA that they're still not publishing those numbers. Not a very good comparison. We're comparing a pecan plantation to pieces of pecan pie that just passed through someone's digestive tract.

 

but that's exactly the point. with WoW having as many subscribers as it does, there are still consistent points where a mod breaks irrevocably and players are left scrambling and base UI doesn't offer alternatives.

 

SWTOR has a lot fewer subscribers (which personally doesn't bother me, but YMMV), its NOT going to have nearly as big of a modding community, which means depending on modders is going to get even more precarious. people get bored. people move on. its normal. its expected. especially when they are not payed to continue to work on their projects. how does that make them more reliable when it comes to implementing changes, then developers themselves?

[eldefail]

The cost for enabling addons is too high

 

Not really, since the developers can pick and choose which parts of the API they want open up to mods. WoW happens to open up a huge chunk of its API to this. Other games, like LOTRO, only allow mainly cosmetic changes like UI skins and some windows to keep track of your crafting alts or your songbook or your hunter travel locations. There is no cost to this, and in fact now Turbine can avoid wasting resources creating additional UI skins since the community can do this for themselves, all they have to do is keep the UI bug free and up to date.

 

I think it would be a massive waste of money to ask SWTOR's devs to implement all the UI customization players are asking for. It would be a large undertaking and then people would whine and complain that they didn't get something more to show for it like quest hubs or end game content. Just open up part of the API so we can make cosmetic changes, so we can move our buff and debuff displays and filter them.

 

There is no cost involved. Opening up part of the API for customization does not mean opening up the floodgates for automation, ridiculous castsequence/rotation macros, or anything of the sort.