This game badly needs mods and macros.

[Chewpaco]

This argument is old and out-dated. There hasn't been a macro system in a major MMO that allows automation in years.

 

NEITHER IS ANYONE ASKING FOR AUTOMATION.

 

You are not arguing the topic at hand if you say, 'Games should NOT play themselves'. Noone is asking for that. That is a perfect example of a logical fault in presenting an argument called a strawman. IE, that opinion is not constructive or helpful.

 

Here's the types of macros I want.

 

Toggle between stances. (will help with limited action bar space)

/cast @focus so I can focus the tank, heal him, and target the boss for utility/dps.

 

These don't provide any sort of automation, and are in no way a sign of a lazy gamer.

 

If you want to focus on the tank - press F1 and your heal spell. Then when you want to dps, either tab target boss, or click him. You DO NOT NEED A MACRO to do what you want to do. You need skill. Quick thinking. You have to make a quick decision - should I go for a little dps on boss and risk not getting back to my responsibility of healing the tank in time, or should I play it safe and just heal.

 

In video games, we press buttons that execute actions. Macro's simplfy that process. Period, end of story. You call it mundane. But that's what games are. You press buttons over and over. Macro's simplify the decision making skills. You lose. Bye.

[Couac]

Macros are for lazy gamers. Games should NOT play themselves.

 

Welcome to the modern times. This claim is so passé.

[Couac]

Like I said, LAZY.

 

Select the tank, heal him.

 

Target the boss....DPS.

 

I can do it.

 

I've BEEN doing it.

 

So can you.

 

We don't NEED macros. We need players to play the game and not create a culture of dependance on mods/macros in order to be viable.

 

No macros = everyone on the same playing field.

 

Wow. Or sigh, I'm not sure which one is more correct.

 

I'm sure you've "played" but I'm also just as sure you haven't really played at the level that you should. Why? Because you live in some weird anti-macro world that doesn't even exist anymore.

 

Just as in many other cases in societies, ignorance and lack of knowledge and information give room to prejudices and false assumptions. You are so aggressive I get the feeling you are protecting your views because, in the end, you know you're on the losing side.

[Avrid]

nope this game doesn't need mods or macros in it thank you very much

[Couac]

You need skill. Quick thinking.

 

Exactly. Quick thinking. Actually, forget that because pointing at something and clicking is always slow. No matter how fast you think, you're still slower than you should be. Quick thinking has rarely anything to do with being skillful because you can't order your body to move "at the speed of light". But alas, macros can do that, they're just so quick.

 

You have to make a quick decision - should I go for a little dps on boss and risk not getting back to my responsibility of healing the tank in time, or should I play it safe and just heal.

 

Yeah, or you could do them both. Throw a DoT on the boss or keep a mob cc'ed with the help of a macro and still be able to keep healing full time.

[Chewpaco]

Wow. Or sigh, I'm not sure which one is more correct.

 

I'm sure you've "played" but I'm also just as sure you haven't really played at the level that you should. Why? Because you live in some weird anti-macro world that doesn't even exist anymore.

 

Just as in many other cases in societies, ignorance and lack of knowledge and information give room to prejudices and false assumptions. You are so aggressive I get the feeling you are protecting your views because, in the end, you know you're on the losing side.

 

This poster is exactly right. I couldn't care less if World of Warcraft made the decision to allow combat driven macros in their game. I don't care how popular their game is - it was a bad decision.

 

In video games, we press buttons to execute an action based on what we are stimulated by either visually or auditory.

 

When you start changing the playing field of the UI - it changes the way you are stimulated and prompted to action ( flashing text on your screen to get out of the fire)

 

When you simplify the change target/heal, a 2 step action - into a 1 step macro, it has just simplified the game. Mosueover macros are the biggest joke. Think Disc Priest and right click mouseover bubble clicking vs changing target each time you want to bubble someone. What's a joke is that the defenders of macro's refuse to acknowledge the simplicity of playing with macros.

[Aleeha]

I sorely underestimated just how poor the UI would turn out. It is so uncustomizable it isn't funny. Health bars, buffs, debuffs, and the power bar are all WAY too small. You can't move or resize anything, I HATE having the chat box up the top.

 

Not having a damage meter or even a freaking combat log is ridiculous. Why shouldn't we even know how much damage we're doing? I want to know what the best rotation is for my character and I have absolutely no way of working that out.

 

Macros are a staple in every MMO, how can you just not have them? There's a nice focus target but it's practically useless without focus macros.

 

These should be top priority for the next patch.

 

 

I lol'd... Why do you need macros in this game? What is it that you're trying to do that would require a macro? So you just want to be lazy I take it? You've got 4 bars, you can key bind everything, doooo it!!

 

If you can't figure out a 'best' or rotation which is just more of a priority than a real rotation, then you should go back to the faceroll we call WoW...

[Dayln]

I am almost certain Hello Kitty on line is going to allow Mods and Macros'

 

The Mod folks should check over there

[Chewpaco]

Exactly. Quick thinking. Actually, forget that because pointing at something and clicking is always slow. No matter how fast you think, you're still slower than you should be. Quick thinking has rarely anything to do with being skillful because you can't order your body to move "at the speed of light". But alas, macros can do that, they're just so quick.

 

 

 

Yeah, or you could do them both. Throw a DoT on the boss or keep a mob cc'ed with the help of a macro and still be able to keep healing full time.

 

With the help of a macro. Says it all. Macro's take your margin of error out of the game. What fun is it, if as a healer, I never have a chance of targeting the wrong player for a heal in the heat of battle? If I acidentally click F3 instead of F2 and then my heal. Whoops, I just healed the wrong person. Macro's reduce the chance of that. Macro's are like playing with an old Nintendo Controller. 4 Buttons - thats fun.

[WarriorsCaptain]

No macros is more gooder

[Noesis]

Agreed.

Here's to hoping it's in the next patch.

[piratepoet]

These should be top priority for the next patch.

 

Wrong

[drhay]

This poster is exactly right. I couldn't care less if World of Warcraft made the decision to allow combat driven macros in their game. I don't care how popular their game is - it was a bad decision.

 

In video games, we press buttons to execute an action based on what we are stimulated by either visually or auditory.

 

When you start changing the playing field of the UI - it changes the way you are stimulated and prompted to action ( flashing text on your screen to get out of the fire)

 

When you simplify the change target/heal, a 2 step action - into a 1 step macro, it has just simplified the game. Mosueover macros are the biggest joke. Think Disc Priest and right click mouseover bubble clicking vs changing target each time you want to bubble someone. What's a joke is that the defenders of macro's refuse to acknowledge the simplicity of playing with macros.

 

As someone who prefers mouseover macros, I will say that the reason I prefer it is BECAUSE it is more simple.

 

I think it's completely retarded to click and then press a button, when all that is really needed is 1 button press. It takes out a completely unnecessary step; even with mouseovers you still have to target the person (by moving your mouse over them or their raid frame). Why should I have to click a button in order to press another button to heal them? That doesn't make the game THAT much more difficult, it just makes it more time-consuming.

 

A better healer and a faster decision maker is still better either way, with or without mouseovers.

 

My argument is that in the case of healing, simplifying the action of targeting is preferable, not detrimental. Targeting is not really the issue in healing; it's deciding quickly on who/what gets your next use of resources, and turning the actual act of targeting into a 1 step process doesn't make a bad healer better, it just makes them a little tiny bit faster at making bad decisions.

[Raji]

It amazes me that people don't know you can use macro's from 3rd party software/products.

 

One of those products is also officially endorsed by EA/BioWare/SW:TOR (http://www.razerzone.com/swtor/mouse)

 

Effectively allowing macros in game to a select number of people that have a distinct advantage because they have macros.

 

If you like being handicapped that's cool, but I would count on macros being added at some point.

Edited December 19, 2011 by Raji

[HeyZ]

I understand your concern with macros. Maybe simple macros but I would not like to see the game turn out like Rift. Bunch of 3 button rotations.

 

There's a few builds in Rift, Shaman specifically, that could be played well as a 1 button spec. That's the spec's fault, not the macro. Most rift specs can be whittled down to 3-5, but you'll also have 6 other situational abilities and 2-3 long cooldowns at the ready. The fewer things to keep track of, the more you can actually pay attention to the game. Boss mechanics and overall raid awareness in Rift is probably the best I've seen, there's not one boss that you can just zone out and hammer keys without moving.

 

I'm desperately hoping they'll allow some macros soon. Using reactive abilities and cooldown abilities without proper macros is a pain. I don't want the game to play itself, but right now it's a choice between missing out on abilities or hotbar tunnel vision. It's not gamebreaking yet, but I've already got 3-4 similar abilities with special cooldowns that don't mesh and procs that I can't easily predict.

 

For example, Commando has a hard hitting shot only usable on a target with a dot. I don't have a castable dot to pair that with, I can only hope that phaser bullets set him on fire, notice the graphic and then I can hit him. I have 2 castable almost identical size heals, one has a cooldown and is a slightly shorter cast, and imo barely worth even using if I have to watch the hotbar to see if it's available. And mouseover healing is about the best way to keep a healer happy. I also have a lot of other specialized abilities, so hotbar space is limited. To play at max, I either need a macro, more efficient class design, or more fingers and another eye.

[Lheim]

There's a few builds in Rift, Shaman specifically, that could be played well as a 1 button spec. That's the spec's fault, not the macro. Most rift specs can be whittled down to 3-5, but you'll also have 6 other situational abilities and 2-3 long cooldowns at the ready. The fewer things to keep track of, the more you can actually pay attention to the game. Boss mechanics and overall raid awareness in Rift is probably the best I've seen, there's not one boss that you can just zone out and hammer keys without moving.

 

I'm desperately hoping they'll allow some macros soon. Using reactive abilities and cooldown abilities without proper macros is a pain. I don't want the game to play itself, but right now it's a choice between missing out on abilities or hotbar tunnel vision. It's not gamebreaking yet, but I've already got 3-4 similar abilities with special cooldowns that don't mesh and procs that I can't easily predict.

 

For example, Commando has a hard hitting shot only usable on a target with a dot. I don't have a castable dot to pair that with, I can only hope that phaser bullets set him on fire, notice the graphic and then I can hit him. I have 2 castable almost identical size heals, one has a cooldown and is a slightly shorter cast, and imo barely worth even using if I have to watch the hotbar to see if it's available. And mouseover healing is about the best way to keep a healer happy. I also have a lot of other specialized abilities, so hotbar space is limited. To play at max, I either need a macro, more efficient class design, or more fingers and another eye.

 

Macros like this I really don't have a problem with. Saving key space with shift+click or friend/foe target differentiation is merely interface convenience. A lot of addons do things I feel are just awful for gameplay as a whole, though.

 

Something that'll pop up and tell you when Riposte is available; okay. Interface convenience; better than watching your hotbars.

 

Something that tells you that the boss is going to do full autocannons in 3 seconds? Skirts the line on providing unfair advantage.. no, heck, it crosses it.

Edited December 19, 2011 by Lheim

[ZapperWeisman]

I am ok with addons if they are UI only. WoWs addons went way too far and that game became an addon blight. Macros are ok if they have tight controls over what they are able to do and only go as far as adding some minor conveniences.

 

Make the UI better by default and throw in some light to moderate macro support and allow for some UI only addons and that should be enough. Just my opinion. I know some people need addons to essentially play the game for them. Like training wheels on the game.

[Atomickillerfox]

I agree we need addons

[Kunitsukami]

I agree we need addons

 

Wrong.

[PjPablo]

Wrong.

 

Your argument is intriguing and interesting.

 

Newsletter?

Edited December 19, 2011 by PjPablo

[Woodroow]

If this game had macros, a combat log, damage meter (even just a simple in game one), a more customizable ui and played a bit more fluid it would be unstoppable and dominate the mmo scene. I will be playing regardless, just saying. (Oh and boo to a DBM type of system, I think anyone that's half way decent could agree with that.)

[zootzoot]

As someone who prefers mouseover macros, I will say that the reason I prefer it is BECAUSE it is more simple.

 

I think it's completely retarded to click and then press a button, when all that is really needed is 1 button press. It takes out a completely unnecessary step; even with mouseovers you still have to target the person (by moving your mouse over them or their raid frame). Why should I have to click a button in order to press another button to heal them? That doesn't make the game THAT much more difficult, it just makes it more time-consuming.

 

A better healer and a faster decision maker is still better either way, with or without mouseovers.

 

My argument is that in the case of healing, simplifying the action of targeting is preferable, not detrimental. Targeting is not really the issue in healing; it's deciding quickly on who/what gets your next use of resources, and turning the actual act of targeting into a 1 step process doesn't make a bad healer better, it just makes them a little tiny bit faster at making bad decisions.

 

 

Let me add that anything that makes the game more fluid and allows the player to focus more on the action is a good thing.

 

Anyone who thinks Mouseover is some kind of cheat or exploit is seriously deficient. It's an alternate targeting system. Maybe the genius you were posting will argue against F key targeting next. ROFL.

Edited December 19, 2011 by zootzoot

[DrGerm]

Healing is a total PITA without at least basic macros. Yeah, I'd love to have a decent UI addon to help too really my main gripe after playing prolly 80 hours in beta and early access thus far. Edited December 19, 2011 by DrGerm

[Kunitsukami]

Your argument is intriguing and interesting.

 

Newsletter?

 

Unsubscribe.

[Monoth]

People not wanting add-ons, are generally the people that were refused from raids and stuff cause their DPS was too low .

 

To be honest, Add-ons should be in, maybe just make it so you can only see it yourself, but i'd like to see my dps so i know how to improve, or see my threat as tank. And especially customizable UI stuff, changing healthbars/target bars, target of target, buff displays, the general UI stuff should be customizable.

 

Macros or stuff like deadly boss mods i do not care about.

 

People who demand add-on's and macros are people who want easy mode... which ironically are the same people who usually end up complaining the game is to easy...

 

But I do think Bioware needs to make the UI more customizable..

Edited December 19, 2011 by Monoth