xengist Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 Does anyone have the numbers on this? How long it lasts, how much to activate, how much healed... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darthshnooky Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 4 Rage to activate it. It can heal once per second whenever damage is taken for 10 seconds, every time it heals it costs another rage. So it costs, for full effect, 14 Rage over about 10 seconds and provides an only "ok" heal. It's horrible. Minor self-heal that leaves you rage-starved and unable to do anything else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth_Sookie Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 Does anyone have the numbers on this? How long it lasts, how much to activate, how much healed... 3% HP each tick. Sounds good but for the rage it cost to keep up, it's going to be useless in PvP most of the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xengist Posted March 23, 2012 Author Share Posted March 23, 2012 Its useful imo for what it does. Lets say its 20% heal extra ever minute or so Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanctified Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 4 Rage to activate it. It can heal once per second whenever damage is taken for 10 seconds, every time it heals it costs another rage. So it costs, for full effect, 14 Rage over about 10 seconds and provides an only "ok" heal. It's horrible. Minor self-heal that leaves you rage-starved and unable to do anything else. What makes it worse in my opinion is that it's clearly been lifted from World of warcraft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darthshnooky Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 What makes it worse in my opinion is that it's clearly been lifted from World of warcraft. But worse since it doesn't up HP and reduces threat... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodrin Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 But worse since it doesn't up HP and reduces threat... I can't see me ever using this in PvP on any spec, or spending any talent points in abilities that improve it. The rage cost is simply too high. They would need to remove the rage cost on heal, or significantly buff the jugg ability to generate rage for me to even consider popping this ability in PvP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vulup Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 Could be alright with Endure Pain and a Rakata Medpac probably still hardly worth the rage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewalshinator Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 I havent tried it, but i dont see its going to be amazing as it will probably sacrifise our dps for the duration. Probably amazing for a PvE tank, in PvP it might be okay for vengence but rage suffers from starvation already. Someone posted a week or so ago that Enraged defence doesnt cost if you have shien form up? Can someone confirm or deny this? i would love this to be the case but seriously doubt it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darthshnooky Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 I havent tried it, but i dont see its going to be amazing as it will probably sacrifise our dps for the duration. Probably amazing for a PvE tank, in PvP it might be okay for vengence but rage suffers from starvation already. Someone posted a week or so ago that Enraged defence doesnt cost if you have shien form up? Can someone confirm or deny this? i would love this to be the case but seriously doubt it. 1. It reduces threat, so probably not going to see much use by tanks, unless it's a fight that needs two tanks trading aggro. 2. Shien indicates it's only for attacks, which this is not. Maybe it works, but I also seriously doubt it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MisterWallace Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 its designed for pvp, for when you kill someone, and you need fast HP quickly to move on to the next target, I find myself in many situations where I'm fighting 2 people got the first one down, and have nothing to save me from dying.... they should just designed it like Victory Rush, but i guess copying another game is too easy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noth Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 its designed for pvp, for when you kill someone, and you need fast HP quickly to move on to the next target, I find myself in many situations where I'm fighting 2 people got the first one down, and have nothing to save me from dying.... they should just designed it like Victory Rush, but i guess copying another game is too easy... It's not designed for that as it doesn't give you fast hp. It gives you no hp and just mitigates incoming damage at the cost of rage. That is how small the heal is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dracosz Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 (edited) From what people who have been on the TR have told me it DOES work well with endure pain but it burns your rage out fast. AKA it's horribly designed for a Melee DPS class. For vengeance, the gains from rampage with regard to rage gen are nice but it cuts so deeply into rage gen that you literally CANNOT be offensive with it and have to be ready to turtle completely. Rage apparently *can* sustain it if it gets lucky with vicious slash, but that's a long shot much of the time and very RNG dependent. In short it's just kind of lame. Edited March 25, 2012 by Dracosz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackdots Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 (edited) This is the bone Bioware throws jugs to compete with the Marauder's five base defensive cooldowns? How about instead of this, just one of either undying rage, obfuscate, camouflage, or cloak of pain. I prefer Jug aesthetically, but I'm switching to my Marauder as a main. A jug can still be useful as a utility monster, but for power-gaming DPS, Marauders just get too many tricks to justify bringing the DPS Jug. Edited March 25, 2012 by blackdots Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cempa Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 (edited) I really enjoy Juggernaut Vengeance but as a solo/PuG player hate life due to lack of heals and though statistically this ability may equate to a good med pack it won't save any one from burst damage which is PvP damage. I rather have an ability on CD that instantly gets me out of combat. Edited March 25, 2012 by Cempa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rookss Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 (edited) As an Immortal Tank, here are my thoughts (although I have not used it yet.) Very situational skill. Basically only useable when 1) You are taking a LOT of incoming damage and really need the heal, and 2) When you are getting attacked but you know a threat drop is incoming. An example would you foreman crusher. He's enraged and smashing you. After the enrage, he's going to drop aggro. So you pop the skill during his enrage along with endure pain to survive, then taunt him as soon as it ends to pick him back up. Of course, being rage starved afterwards really sucks. But then again the entire rage generation for Immortal spec'd Juggs is poorly designed, so this just shines a light on that entire problem. As Vengeance or Rage (PvE) i can see it useful. Rage generation is much better, and it only consumes rage when you are hit - so fights where random AoE occasionally hits you (Gharj, for instance) would be a nice thing to use for the entire fight to help healers a little bit. The fact that it reduces threat also is great for any DPSers, as long as they aren't taking enough damage to eat through their rage generation. Edited March 25, 2012 by Rookss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elyx Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 Yeah, it was quite anti-climatic for me. I'm glad it's a baseline ability...I probably wouldn't buy it if it cost me skill points. I think they should just give us another simple CD, and buff it for Immortal. something along the lines of: Making Sonic barrier baseline. give it a 30 Sec CD. change the immortal talent to add a HoT to the baseline ability (so you shield and get a small amount of health back over the duration or for 9 sec or so), AND to also reduce the CD of Sonic barrier every time you effectively retaliate. A few retaliations and the CD is back up again. the HoT would balance out the increased CD (since immortals currently get it once every 9 seconds), and they could adjust the HoT to compensate the immortal for the time variance. IMO the shield would be far better then simply "another" DR skill. Plus it would give us a unique thing that other tanks don't get...our own little sor/sage bubble. Not a complete idea there (pulled it out of my heiny while i was reading), but it's a start. and it would be tons better then the weird thing that is Enraged Defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darthshnooky Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 Yeah, it was quite anti-climatic for me. I'm glad it's a baseline ability...I probably wouldn't buy it if it cost me skill points. I think they should just give us another simple CD, and buff it for Immortal. something along the lines of: Making Sonic barrier baseline. give it a 30 Sec CD. change the immortal talent to add a HoT to the baseline ability (so you shield and get a small amount of health back over the duration or for 9 sec or so), AND to also reduce the CD of Sonic barrier every time you effectively retaliate. A few retaliations and the CD is back up again. the HoT would balance out the increased CD (since immortals currently get it once every 9 seconds), and they could adjust the HoT to compensate the immortal for the time variance. IMO the shield would be far better then simply "another" DR skill. Plus it would give us a unique thing that other tanks don't get...our own little sor/sage bubble. Not a complete idea there (pulled it out of my heiny while i was reading), but it's a start. and it would be tons better then the weird thing that is Enraged Defense. I like the idea of making Sonic Barrier baseline for Juggernauts -- but i'd say they could just leave it as a passive. Let every Jugg have a little more survivability from it and just have it get a bonus from Defense; that way it's much better for Tanks/Immortals than the two other trees. The idea of a talent to add a HoT (nice and high in Immortal) would do wonders for our survivability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth_Sookie Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 Rage cost is far too high. However i can see it doing some good if we pop, Enrage, Endure Pain and Rakata Medpack. Like if you are in a tight spot with your healer at the wester turret in Alderaan. You are both getting pummeled so you pop your cooldowns and get some extra healing in while taunting the enemies etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a_beast_ Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 enraged defence is pointless for jugger tanks, reduce threat lol yeah just what tanks need, threat is not good enough for ops ect, if u use this ability then there is a good chance the mob might kill the team. BW should of made a better ability, seems i wasted 25k getting this ability from the trainer. and if ur playing with 2 tanks then am sure the other tank will hit his taunt and pull the mob. all and all seems assassin tanks are the best in game and the juggers are getting screwed, not sure why but they are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeoAcario Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 (edited) I've read most of your concerns... and they are valid... but I'd like to interject something: I love it. I raid as veng with those *****-tards in Defiance. With the changes I am now regularly pulling threat due to the increase in both spike and sustained dps. This new skill with talents in deafening defense is amazing. I can drop threat like a rock AND take an additionally 15% less dmg while I do it... and be healed by 3% per hit per second on me. I found using this during the aoe phase withe T&Z was effective. It was very rough for healers and ensured I didn't pull threat later. I will admit that I haven't yet had a chance to test it out in pvp... but I can tell you right now that I'll love it. Keep in mind that my favorite PvP role is huttball runner. And for that.. this will be amazing. 15% less dmg, healed for 3% per hit... Yes, it costs rage, but what do I care when I'm just trying to cross the field and score? I do have one question, as I didn't even look and can't with servers down: Are there any talents that affect Enraged Defense besides the Deafening Defense upper tier talent in Veng? ~Steve edit Edited April 13, 2012 by NeoAcario Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordExozone Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 The initial cost for the ability is too high. Should be 2 rage, instead of 4, with the Rage tree getting it for 0 rage if they spec for the Through Passion talent. That said, the ability even at its current cost is pretty useful, especially for Vengeance with the 15% mitigation tied to it. The heal recovers roughly 500 health with 16k health. Depending on the damage of the hit that's between 100% mitigation (for attacks doing 590 or less damage) and 25% mitigation (for attacks doing 5000 damage). That really isn't bad. It is also very useful as a way to survive dots after a fight. No more inevitable death as the dots eat away your health Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusksoverture Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 Deafening Defense also gives you 15% DR for the duration. http://www.torhead.com/ability/79yB4wn/deafening-defense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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