Why remove expertise?

[Dlema]

Expertise needs to be adjusted thats all. It should not INCREASE your damage, that is what your primary stats and secondary stats are for ! Expertise should only lower dmg done to you, crits chance etc..

 

This is why the gap becomes so BIG between newly 50's and BM geared players, not only do they have the best mods with your primary and secondary stats, they also have a ton more expertise then you which further increases there damage WHILST lowering alot of dmg done to them.

[yeayea]

What I enjoyed today was being on Ilum. Within 5 hours of hitting 50 yesterday morning I ran into a player fully geared in PvE gear. My half 40 PvP/half centurion gear allowed me to win 2 of 3 times against him. I have been capped in valor since lvl 11. I have not stepped into a raid, flashpoint or whatever the official name for a PvE encounter is. I have stepped into countless WZs and now live on Ilum. So hate on expertise all you want but in my case it did its job. Allowed a PvP player, in a PvP environment, go toe to toe with a PvE player.

[JeremyDale]

Hey there,

I noticed a popular demand in the new feedback-request-thread is "remove expertise". I just wanted to hear arguments for that, and discuss them.

 

Just let me say I tried PvP on this game for the first time the other day after getting a new video card and it was God-awful. I've never experienced such a horrific game-play experience, and it caused me to completely lose all interest in my Jedi Sage. I hate him now.

 

I was literally slaughtered in seconds by every Sith I met. It was just stun stun stun 2-4k damage spam - dead in a couple of seconds. And no i'm not exagerating. I couldn't get away, I couldn't run - I sure as heck coudn't win, and I couldn't collect all of my stupid boxes to save my life on Illum. It was just miserable. After half an hour I was saying screw this, I rather be dead than endure this crap.

 

So either the Jedi Sage just sucks horribly, or there is a vast imbalance between geared PvP players with lots of expertise and newer players who are just starting out who dont' have any. It's too much of a gap if this is the case, so I would support getting rid of this expertise stat. It makes trying to PvP on this game as a new PvPer just lambs to the slaughter.

 

I'm going to try PvP on this game again as a stealth class soon.... hoping maybe the ability to sneak around and avoid instant death everywhere might help make it more tolerable. But yeah...they deffinitley need to do something about the PvP on this game - cause it needs a lot of help. Getting rid of expertise doens't sound like such a bad idea to me.

[LenrocNewDawn]

Rakata equipped player vs battle master equipped player are a fair match in PvP. If you would just check the stats! What % expertise gives to battle master it's negated but the sheer increase of stats for rakata (crit/surge too). Things get better for the battle master when you throw in a healer in PvP. But in all fairness rakata dominates battle master in effectiveness in PvE.

 

With the changes to DR for expertise in 1.2 things might change to favor the BM more. But rakata will always be much better then entry lvl PvP gear (centurion as it is now) so your time in raids it's not at all wasted if you decide to go into PvP.

 

Main reason they separated the gear this way is the fact that PvPers need their epeen. "Screw you, I have PvP gear. I kill players not mobs." And it sounds cool "EXPERTISE". Also it will take longer to chase two carrots instead of one. "RUN, FORREST! RUN!"

[JeremyDale]

Rakata equipped player vs battle master equipped player are a fair match in PvP. If you would just check the stats! What % expertise gives to battle master it's negated but the sheer increase of stats for rakata (crit/surge too). Things get better for the battle master when you throw in a healer in PvP. But in all fairness rakata dominates battle master in effectiveness in PvE.

 

With the changes to DR for expertise in 1.2 things might change to favor the BM more. But rakata will always be much better then entry lvl PvP gear (centurion as it is now) so your time in raids it's not at all wasted if you decide to go into PvP.

 

Main reason they separated the gear this way is the fact that PvPers need their epeen. "Screw you, I have PvP gear. I kill players not mobs." And it sounds cool "EXPERTISE". Also it will take longer to chase two carrots instead of one. "RUN, FORREST! RUN!"

 

Bottom line is you die too fast on this game. When I can't even live through one round of stuns and get mercilessly slaughtered in seconds everywhere there's a problem.

 

My gear isn't that bad. All augmented epics and oranges, a few columi pieces, the Rakata ear and implants. Running around getting stunned and killed in seconds everywhere you go is about as much fun as eating glass. Something needs to be done. The damage is way out of control on this game. It's just stupid dumb how quick you die.

 

I'm going to try a stealth class... see if being able to sneak around helps some. If not, I can deffinitely say I won't be bothering with PvP on this game again until some huge changes are made to make it a more worthwhile experience that is even remotely fun - because this garbage is anything but.

Edited March 23, 2012 by JeremyDale

[Darzk]

From a PvPer who raids to a PvE'r:

 

Just let me say I tried PvP on this game for the first time the other day after getting a new video card and it was God-awful. I've never experienced such a horrific game-play experience, and it caused me to completely lose all interest in my Jedi Sage. I hate him now.

 

Okay, you've never PvP'd before. You probably dont even have your remove-stun ability on your bar. You are completely ignorant as to other classes PvP abilities, how to migigate them, and how to use dynamic Line-of-sight. To put this in terms you understand, you are the fresh 50 entering into a HardMode Operation - but without a team to carry you, without someone to explain the fights, and you cant look them up on Google. What outcome do you expect?

 

I was literally slaughtered in seconds by every Sith I met. It was just stun stun stun 2-4k damage spam - dead in a couple of seconds. And no i'm not exagerating. I couldn't get away, I couldn't run - I sure as heck coudn't win, and I couldn't collect all of my stupid boxes to save my life on Illum. It was just miserable. After half an hour I was saying screw this, I rather be dead than endure this crap.

 

See above. You can get away, you can run. Sage is one of the best kiters 1v1. And if there was more than one Imp, you shouldnt be expecting to win on your own.

 

Dying in stunlock is irrelevant to Expertise as a topic. Of my PvE set (18.5k hp) and PvP set (16.5k /w 10% expertise) my PvE set can take more damage before dying. I have almost 20% more willpower in PvE gear too, roughly makes up for the 10% damage increase.

 

So either the Jedi Sage just sucks horribly, or there is a vast imbalance between geared PvP players with lots of expertise and newer players who are just starting out who dont' have any. It's too much of a gap if this is the case, so I would support getting rid of this expertise stat. It makes trying to PvP on this game as a new PvPer just lambs to the slaughter.

 

There *is* an imbalance between geared players who have spent /played days collecting gear and players just starting out. There should be. There has to be gear progression (or meaningful progression of some sort) to inspire people to actually do things. Someone in full battlemaster wiping the floor with someone in Centurion is no different than the disparity in kill times on the council between someone in Rakata and Tioneise.

 

Lambs to the slaughter... no. But you have to learn. Its a completely different mechanic to PvE and you have to relarn the 'strats'. Learning will result in deaths, but at least no repair costs. The difference is its much harder to google them and much more dynamic to put into practice.

 

I'm going to try PvP on this game again as a stealth class soon.... hoping maybe the ability to sneak around and avoid instant death everywhere might help make it more tolerable. But yeah...they deffinitley need to do something about the PvP on this game - cause it needs a lot of help. Getting rid of expertise doens't sound like such a bad idea to me.

 

The only issue, as I see it, is someone in full Columi facing off against a full Champ. In a static situation (Ie 1v1 same class same skill) the disparity is not that huge. The ~10% damage increase and 10% reduced damage taken is made up by the loss of close to 20% loss of stats. Truly, 1v1 PvE and PvP gear are very similar - its when both targets are being healed that the difference becomes apparent.

 

The current problem being fixed with 1.2 is the soft caps on Expertise being too low. Currently a mix of Rakata and BM gear is optimal, far over full BM - I PvP with Rakata Belt, Bracers, and implants/ear(as dps). The retooling of Expertise in 1.2 will make PvP gear ideal for PvP, which is a change I applaud.

 

The removal of Expertise as a pathway to making PvP more accessible to PvErs is already adressed with the introduction of easily available PvP gear - although odds are you will be better off in your Rakata than in the low expertise gear.

 

What people dont seem to realize is there is a significant stat loss for the gain of expertise. A 10% increase in PvP percent is equivalent to a 15-20% stat loss. Going past 10% the loss is even more drastic. This means that PvE and PvP gear is not that different - the determining factor is skill, plain and simple. Lifelong PvErs going into a Warzone and expecting to place competitively is the equivalent of someone going into a HM/NM Ops having never done the fights before or read the strats, generally without someone talking to them on vent telling them what to do.

Compared to the skill disparity, the differences caused by Expertise is negligible.

 

A Battlemaster will destroy a Rakata geared PvE'r, sure. But give that Battlemaster full Rakata and the PvE'r is equally screwed.

 

 

 

Expertise and separate gear sets exist to prevent the aquisition of gear NEEDED for HM/NM progression without the effort of completing the requisite difficulties. Total (100%) of PvP progression will be possible (albeit lengthy) WITHOUT WINNING A SINGLE MATCH.

 

A dude who runs with the huttball into the fire traps, stands in acid, never calls turret incs, watches enemies plant bombs in voidstar, etc, will eventually gear up. Consider a PvE'r not running to new islands on Gharj, standing in Bonethrasher swipes, doublestepping or falling off stairs in SoA, healing other players on council, clicking the wrong consoles... etc. They will NEVER progress gear wise (unless they get lucky and pug a 7 man group that can do it while they're dead).

 

Removing rewards from losing in WZs is impossible, the QQ against preforms from casuals would be too high. It would be like having raids reset daily, but only the first guild to finish the raid gets loot.

 

Expertise only removes PvE progression from PvP. Entering a PvP match in PvE gear is not an instant loss; you do not do less damage or die faster. The ONLY difference is in your longevity while being healed; intrinsically it only effects team play or healers.

[Orangerascal]

Expertise and separate gear sets exist to prevent the aquisition of gear NEEDED for HM/NM progression without the effort of completing the requisite difficulties.

 

This guy gets it.

Edited March 23, 2012 by Orangerascal

[PloGreen]

Because those people are dumb. If you remove expertise people in endgame raidgear will mop the floor with people who only pvp.

 

Whilst calling em dumb might be a bit strong I agree with the rest of this statement.

[PloGreen]

Expertise needs to be adjusted thats all. It should not INCREASE your damage, that is what your primary stats and secondary stats are for ! Expertise should only lower dmg done to you, crits chance etc..

 

This is why the gap becomes so BIG between newly 50's and BM geared players, not only do they have the best mods with your primary and secondary stats, they also have a ton more expertise then you which further increases there damage WHILST lowering alot of dmg done to them.

 

Doesnt matter about the gap since it is incredibly easy to gear up now anyway. Expertise is fine, those who want to pvp will do so, those who cannot handle losing alot for a bit will throw their arms up in the air and say it should be removed.

 

Its there to keep pve and pvp seperate and thats how it should be.

Edited March 23, 2012 by PloGreen

[lightertripod]

I posted at length in that thread why it should be removed.

 

Full story here

 

I'll cut and paste snippets here just focusing on reasons for TOR

 

 

Now in SWTOR we have this similar mechanic that feels pointlessly shoe-horned into the game without any real understanding of why it might be needed, if it is needed at all.

 

Currently, Expertise in SWTOR does 3 things:

1) Increase damage done to players

2) Decrease damage taken from players

3) Increase healing done to players

 

So let's break down the problems with the mechanic by itself.

Numbers 1 and 3 on that list are ultimately rendered moot by two opposing players of equal gear. The same damage bonus that you get against a player is negated entirely by that players protection from it. So that effect might as well not even exist. I have a hard time wrapping my brain around this decision, assuming it was intentional. Unlike in WoW, where Resilience makes matches last longer, Expertise serves no real purpose other than to make you completely un-killable by a player who doesn't have expertise, which means that PvP boils down almost entirely to gear.

 

Number 2 is the only effect that really makes a difference.

 

...And it is terrible.

 

It's a forgone conclusion that gear will eventually scale upwards in this game. Unless there is an entirely different formula in place for the healing bonus, or DPS stats on gear are scaled to match it, this means that eventually we will reach a point where no one can kill each other as long as a healer is present. Get it? This means you will HAVE to change the way the stat functions at some point.

 

 

Secondly, the implementation of the stat is quite baffling. SWTOR had an advantage over WoW here, in that they introduced their PvP stat in an expansion several years down the road, while you guys had one planned from the start. With that in mind, what was the logic behind the decision to make Expertise only available to level 50 players? Why wouldn't you put it on all PvP gear? This is even more baffling by the fact that you planned for people to be able to level AND gear extensively in PvP by providing all that extra armor and weapons in the vendors, yet for some reason you omitted Expertise. I mean seriously... why? I can only assume the ramifications for this were made blatantly obvious by the end of the first month when every single person under level 50 was getting slaughtered so badly that you had to put 50's in their own bracket.

The easier solution? Get rid of the stat altogether. Then 50's don't need their own bracket, because we have Bolster. I don't think I words can make it any clearer how much it detrimentally affected PvP than exactly what happened.

 

 

Finally, the entire premise of the stat itself is self-defeating and stupid. It serves only to drive a gigantic wedge firmly between the camp of players that prefer PvP and the ones that prefer PvE, and ensures that virtually no one can cross between them.

 

</snip>...The fact is that a system like the current one forces players to waste time grinding two sets of gear to compete in either system and vehemently discourages, if not outright preventing, someone who prefers one system from even dabbling in the other. I'm all for someone in their PvP-grinded gear filling a last minute raid slot, just as I know many PvPers who would welcome a new challenge from someone who normally raids. Instead, having a PvP stat does the exact opposite.

 

 

 

As far as Aether's.... charming assertion goes... I find a measure of situational irony in the fact that I took the stance that the vast majority of people who defend Expertise don't even know why they do it.

 

awesome post problem is most pvper don't want to pve at all I for one and pretty much my whole guild would of never even gotten the game had this been the case

 

if the way they put expertise in was right or wrong or if they should of added it to all pvp equipment 20-40-50 is a totally different debate

 

having a pvp stat allows for a set of gear for pvp

 

having no stat only benfits pver's

 

pvp with or without a stat for pvp still boils down to gear you really think if you meet a level 50 in orange gear out in the world and your in rakata he going to stand a chance ?

 

expertise adds stats that only effect pvp so that you need to be in pvp gear to compete is just the same how pver gear has better stats minus the expertise so you cannot just rock up i full pvp gear and do pve

 

we can ofc agree to make the 2 sets of gear the same right remove expertise but make the pvp gear through pvp same as pve gear through pve this would be deeply unpopuler with pvers but would benfit the pvpers in the same way removing expertise will for pvers

 

sure some players want to do both and they have the option to do that they just have to get the right gear to do both will take them longer but thats jsut the way it is and should be

[SneiK]

Of course there is.

 

You either make them both random drop systems (by awarding a bag upon completing your Daily/Weekly/Whatever PvP mission), or you make them both Acquire-Coupons-To-Give-To-the-Vendor systems (just have all raid bosses drop only various types of commendations). What you don't do is one system for one thing and an entirely different system for another. That's what causes imbalance.

 

 

And the only reason PvE gear has slightly better stats in the first place is because of the dated and inefficient raid encounter design.

 

Like I stated in the post, designing the entire game around PvP, and then providing a PvE buff that increases damage done to NPC's solves both of these problems.

People can PvP and/or PvE in whatever gear they want, you have balanced PvP, and keep the current raid design that Bioware can easily tinker with at any point to adjust difficulty as needed.

 

If they had a 'PvE' stat, then it would favor PvE players would it not? At the moment, you have to PvP to PvP, and PvE to PvE...I don't see a problem...

[zaknaphein]

You sure about that? Those guys on sithwarrior.com seem to say something different. Correct me if im wrong. According to them, expertise is now "capped" at 0.5 not 0.2; so the overall formula changed, but not specific for damage reduction etc..

 

Yes in general it's changed. Expertise for example caps at 20% for dmg dealt but dmg taken for the same values would be 16% and healing 20%.

[Khoraji]

I posted at length in that thread why it should be removed.

 

Full story here

 

I'll cut and paste snippets here just focusing on reasons for TOR

 

 

Now in SWTOR we have this similar mechanic that feels pointlessly shoe-horned into the game without any real understanding of why it might be needed, if it is needed at all.

 

Currently, Expertise in SWTOR does 3 things:

1) Increase damage done to players

2) Decrease damage taken from players

3) Increase healing done to players

 

So let's break down the problems with the mechanic by itself.

Numbers 1 and 3 on that list are ultimately rendered moot by two opposing players of equal gear. The same damage bonus that you get against a player is negated entirely by that players protection from it. So that effect might as well not even exist. I have a hard time wrapping my brain around this decision, assuming it was intentional. Unlike in WoW, where Resilience makes matches last longer, Expertise serves no real purpose other than to make you completely un-killable by a player who doesn't have expertise, which means that PvP boils down almost entirely to gear.

 

Expertise does serve a purpose, seperating PvP and PvE. If there was no expertise, PvE'ers would just faceroll the warzones. Also, it takes like a week to get full champ gear, suck it up and then you can use your "skill" to kill people

 

Number 2 is the only effect that really makes a difference.

 

...And it is terrible.

 

It's a forgone conclusion that gear will eventually scale upwards in this game. Unless there is an entirely different formula in place for the healing bonus, or DPS stats on gear are scaled to match it, this means that eventually we will reach a point where no one can kill each other as long as a healer is present. Get it? This means you will HAVE to change the way the stat functions at some point.

 

Its called trauma, moron. All they have to do is increase it a bit once PvP gear gets too powerful.

 

 

Secondly, the implementation of the stat is quite baffling. SWTOR had an advantage over WoW here, in that they introduced their PvP stat in an expansion several years down the road, while you guys had one planned from the start. With that in mind, what was the logic behind the decision to make Expertise only available to level 50 players? Why wouldn't you put it on all PvP gear? This is even more baffling by the fact that you planned for people to be able to level AND gear extensively in PvP by providing all that extra armor and weapons in the vendors, yet for some reason you omitted Expertise. I mean seriously... why? I can only assume the ramifications for this were made blatantly obvious by the end of the first month when every single person under level 50 was getting slaughtered so badly that you had to put 50's in their own bracket.

The easier solution? Get rid of the stat altogether. Then 50's don't need their own bracket, because we have Bolster. I don't think I words can make it any clearer how much it detrimentally affected PvP than exactly what happened.

 

First of all, expertise is available pre-50. Secondly, who cares about 1-49? It takes like 2-3 weeks to get to 50, then it doesn't matter. The pre-50 pvp gear is there because there has to be SOME gear progression if all you do is pvp.

 

 

Finally, the entire premise of the stat itself is self-defeating and stupid. It serves only to drive a gigantic wedge firmly between the camp of players that prefer PvP and the ones that prefer PvE, and ensures that virtually no one can cross between them.

 

It is not a gigantic wedge. You can't raid once a week and do PvP the rest of the time? How hard is that? PvP and PvE should be separated or you will run into a situation where hardcore PvE'ers faceroll everyone in PvP.

 

</snip>...The fact is that a system like the current one forces players to waste time grinding two sets of gear to compete in either system and vehemently discourages, if not outright preventing, someone who prefers one system from even dabbling in the other. I'm all for someone in their PvP-grinded gear filling a last minute raid slot, just as I know many PvPers who would welcome a new challenge from someone who normally raids. Instead, having a PvP stat does the exact opposite.

 

This is an RPG, most people who enjoy this genre enjoy gearing their toons. If you dont like this...go play COD, there are no classes or gear in FPS. Thats the point of different genres, and you obviously dont like RPG's.

 

 

As far as Aether's.... charming assertion goes... I find a measure of situational irony in the fact that I took the stance that the vast majority of people who defend Expertise don't even know why they do it.

 

You sound like a douche bag.

 

 

 

There....

[Nhaok]

Without reading the next 11 pages.

 

Make end game pvp gear equal to that of end game pve gear and fine. If not, keep expertise or a similar stat. pve gear should never be better than pvp gear for pvp.... and the opposite... pvp gear should never be better than pve gear for pve.

 

I could live with that they are the same. Just don't force me to PvE just so I can PvP.

[Evilsteps]

Without reading the next 11 pages.

 

Make end game pvp gear equal to that of end game pve gear and fine. If not, keep expertise or a similar stat. pve gear should never be better than pvp gear for pvp.... and the opposite... pvp gear should never be better than pve gear for pve.

 

I could live with that they are the same. Just don't force me to PvE just so I can PvP.

 

This! You don't need expertise, just make the tiers of gear exactly the same same stat wise in both PvE and PvP awards. Expertise only benefits those with lots of free time and not only segregates the PvE and PvP world, but it also segregates the PvP community to those with and those without. Tier the gear stats, but get rid of the expertise and the whole community could enjoy both sides of the game without a hinderance.

[Khoraji]

This! You don't need expertise, just make the tiers of gear exactly the same same stat wise in both PvE and PvP awards. Expertise only benefits those with lots of free time and not only segregates the PvE and PvP world, but it also segregates the PvP community to those with and those without. Tier the gear stats, but get rid of the expertise and the whole community could enjoy both sides of the game without a hinderance.

 

could you imagine the PvE/General section of the forums QQ'ing if that were to happen.

 

Hey I personally dont have a problem with this idea...but could you just imagine the tears...

[Evilsteps]

could you imagine the PvE/General section of the forums QQ'ing if that were to happen.

 

Hey I personally dont have a problem with this idea...but could you just imagine the tears...

 

LMAO, yeah I could. I personally enjoy both PvP and PvE and spend equal time playing both so I really don't mind getting two sets of gear. However, there really is no reason for having expertise. If the PvP gear for the hardcore players was attainable at a similar pace as the PvE gear for hardcore players there, then no tears should be shed. Haha, but it would be pretty epic.

[Olympic]

Really sick and tired of people with your fail argument.

 

1. Stop thinking that WoW is the only MMO in the world with PvP.

 

2. Stop thinking that all games WITH PvP actually have a PvP stat.

 

3. Stop thinking that it is impossible to balance PvP and PvE gear timesinks.

 

Answer to 1. Most MMOs have PvP.

 

Answer to 2. Only SWTOR and WoW have a PvP ONLY stat.

a. WoW had a PvP only stat because the game didn't launch with PvP and needed something to balance the two activities.

b. SWTOR has a PvP only stat because Bioware is dumb and think that they have to copy most of WoW's core mechanics.

 

Answer to 3. Both WaR and DAOC did this. Both activities were viable for gear, as it should be in any game that launches with PvP.

 

You will never get the arena warriors to understand this.

[Quinlynn]

Other than Endurance, I don't get how PVE gear is better.

 

Less armor, less crit, less other stats.

 

Also, as I understand it, expertise does not just affect PVP stats and provides some benefit to PVE by boosting skills. This seems to be a debate to be verified when we have a real combat log. Maybe some one knows for sure by now after being on PTS.

 

IMHO.

[Quinlynn]

It is not a gigantic wedge. You can't raid once a week and do PvP the rest of the time? How hard is that? PvP and PvE should be separated or you will run into a situation where hardcore PvE'ers faceroll everyone in PvP.

 

Should be obvious this is what they are after.

 

Besides, many peeps have already demonstrated that a mix of PVP / PVE gear gives the best overall viability so not like peeps don't raid.

[ADMCD]

I have successfully avoided all post-50 PvE content for the last two months. If they removed Expertise from PvP gear, they'd have to create gear that was on par stat wise with PvE gear or the PvE people would show up in a warzone and destroy PvP players, regardless of PvP rank or ability. If they changed the PvP gear to match the top end PvE gear the people who like PvE could simply go and get PvP gear and then wipe the floor of the PvE content.

 

I don't see the probem of having separate gear acquisition systems. I would be horrified if there were only one way to get gear and you have to do that way to have decent gear. I would much prefer several different sets of top end gear all recieved in severa different ways. I think that would keep the game more interesting because you'd always have something to do and work for.

 

People just want to be able to get stuff too fast and then they complain about having nothing to do. I'm afraid most MMOs are reward based game systems and there isn't much one can do about it, unless all games went sandboxy. I like getting gear and I never understand why anyone complains about 'gear grinds'. If you don't want to grind gear then don't grind gear. But also don't expect it handed to you either. I hate PvE but I don't expect to be handed PvE gear.

 

On another note, saying that PvP should all be about skill is silly. There's only so much someone can do skillwise before you run out of stuff and you end up even regardless. Gear is just another way to slightly imbalance things to make fights interesting. Perfectly balanced fights are dull. You must have been in a Voidstar where both defenders successfully hold the first door the entire time? It's very very boring.

Edited March 23, 2012 by ADMCD

[Nicain]

People blame their losses on anything but they sucked.

 

So at first it's expertise, then it's the PVP gear, next it will be "nerf this class because he killed me"

 

It's very simple psychology, but what's just as simple is the back lash these people have when you point it out.

[Joetwoshots]

People blame their losses on anything but they sucked.

 

So at first it's expertise, then it's the PVP gear, next it will be "nerf this class because he killed me"

 

It's very simple psychology, but what's just as simple is the back lash these people have when you point it out.

 

No, people blame fact they cant be arsed to start pvp on the fact the moment they enter warzone they immediatly become cannon fodder, unless geared in high end pve gear, which gives them SOME chances to down pvp player. They simply choose not to waste their nerves for being slaughtered for extended period of time.

 

second point- i wish i could punch people over internets, cause its complaints about "class x killed me within stunlock" destroy classes like operatives, which had burst damage and little sustained. Now dps ops play primarly pvp, in pve people prefer them to heal, that will widen esecially after 1.2

 

Also somebody earlier posted that expertise shouldnt increase damage. Yes, i also wonder why EA/BW tried to be smarter than everyone else and push offensive and defensive stats into it. Resilience in WOW served to lower burst, but you dont lower burst if you increase it against non expertise players.

Edited March 23, 2012 by Joetwoshots

[Orangerascal]

No, people blame fact they cant be arsed to start pvp on the fact the moment they enter warzone they immediatly become cannon fodder.

 

 

took me 4 days to get full champ/centurion mix with 550 expertise on my scoundrel.

 

8 bags from dailies

6 bags saved while getting to 50

6 bags from weeklies

 

Next patch you can buy full champion gear with credits and BM gear is 1000 commendations.

 

.

.

.

 

The QQ is just too strong with some people.

Edited March 23, 2012 by Orangerascal

[Smashbrother]

If there was only 1 set of gear for both pvp and pve, that would mean there would only be one set of armor set bonuses. This would mean that the armor set bonuses would have to be something that is useful in both pve and pvp, but not incredibly useful for either one. This doesn't make anyone happy.

 

With one set of gear for pvp, and one for pve, there can be armor set bonuses that are tailored towards pvp or pve.