Sorc Healers - 1.2 and YOU

[kickinhead]

No, just no.

 

I'm doubtful you even have a sorcerer at 50 and even more doubtful you played against anyone that knows their class...

 

Honestly, you think force speed and a fairly weak 3k bubble that get popped by nearly anyone's burst will save you.

 

Maybe they are stunned after breaking that bubble, but they get out of that pretty easily. Force Speed? It takes one stun to stop force speed, dead in the water. Then what? Electrocute? careful they will have full resolve....

 

You can't seriously think you'll be able to fight back. You'll probably dead before anyone can peel them off you. Wait until that tankassin or a concealment op finds you. You are dead and you wont even see it coming. Without a fast cast big heal you are dead before people even realize they should be peeling it off you.

 

Now they want you to cut your wrist every time you want some force back.

 

/Signed:

 

The amount of Burst-DMG is laughably OP compared to burst-heal (I'm talking about heal in under 1 Second). I'm not only worried about the Sages burst-heal, but also the other classes: Even if you have two healers (we go for Scoundrel+Sage) a reju before the spike, a bubble during the Spike and the Scoundrels insta-heal means 5k heal in under 1 sec tops, but even 4 DMG-Dealers dish out 25k+ DMG easily in under 1 Sec, how are you supposed to heal that?

 

Coming from Guild Wars, the amount of DMG and time it takes to spike down a target is pretty similar, but as a Healer (2 Healers per 8man group) you had SOOOOO much more burstheal and prot and all of it was necessary:

 

- You had an Infuse with 1/4 Second casttime, that healed the target for easily 60% it's life (which would be an instant 10k Heal in SWTOR) the caster had to sac 50% of it's own health though, but this spell was essential to heal against spikes, without it, GW would've been unplayable, cuz every spike (which occured all 5-10 seconds) would have resulted in a kill.

- You had sth. like a bubble, but it had no lockdown-duration but only lasted 5 or so seconds and absorbed a little less I guess.

- You had a Prot-Spell that could guard a target to not get over 10% DMG per hit, so in SWTOR with most ppl having about 18000 HP, it would mean no attack could deal more than 1800 DMG for 20 seconds (there were ways to remove those buffs prematurely by the opponent though)

- You also had another Spell with casttime of under 1 Sec that healed for about 40% if the target was below half health.

 

You see, even if you have Tanks in SWTOR with guard and taunt, the burst-DMG still outweighs the burst-heal or Prot by miles. And with it being so easy to spike in SWTOR (Meles have jumps, certain ranged-DD cannot be interrupted etc.) it will result in the fact that all 5-10 seconds, 1 player goes down.

 

I can see it now: Sniper-Spikes with 4 Snipers (they should be enough to kill a target all 5-10 seconds) and the rest can be Tank/heal/support/runners and there is NO WAY you can heal against it, interrupt it or kill them fast enough so the spike looses it's necessary burst-DMG.

 

What would I do to fix it?

 

- Give some Healer-Class a very good burst-heal that acitvates instantly with some sort of a drabwack. Like heavily increasing the effect of Emergency Medpack, but giving it the necessity to sacrifice health, like infuse in GW (it worked well, cuz it was a good burstheal, but it didn't negatively impact the overall healing-power of the team, cuz of the health sac. So for pressure-builds, it doesn't get harder to kill the team, just for spikes).

- Change the bubble so it has no Lockdown-duration but only lasts for 5 seconds.

- Get rid of the bubble-stun and replace it with another buff for the bubble, like having some lingering aftereffect that lasted longer than the 5 seconds, like a bit more Armor, or a buff to gain 10% more heal for an additional 10 Seconds. That way, it would be a good burstheal, it would be harder to use and less useful to spam and it could still be viable to Prot against Pressure.

Edited March 18, 2012 by kickinhead

[Illidor]

There won't be sorc healers.

 

Exactly.

[Zataos]

I have nearly every AC at level 50 (with the exception of OPs) and I can say that none of the changes excite or bother me as much as these changes to the Sorc , the Sorcerer probably needed a nerf in order to keep one from being able to chain heal ANY enemy and even multiple enemies in a row or at the same time, but a simple force increase cost to Dark Infusion would have been a simple and effective solution, giving the Sorc the ability to burst heal himself in a one on one or slow heal his team but keep him from chain healing for multiple enemies.

[Zepidel]

Thats like comparing apples and oranges. I will cast long heals if i get medium armor and a vanish/stealth ability. Dont forget I also want instant cast HoTs (Probes) that give me TAs while I hide. Oh and I want my big heal to be instant and cost only TAs. Its funny how you forgot about those...

 

difference between medium armor and light armor is negligable, especially since most attacks in this game ignore armor. Combat stealth for healer ops is garbage, puts you completely out of the fight for 10s and if it breaks its 100% guaranteed death.

 

Which big heal do we have thats instant cast and only costs TAs?

[kickinhead]

I have nearly every AC at level 50 (with the exception of OPs) and I can say that none of the changes excite or bother me as much as these changes to the Sorc , the Sorcerer probably needed a nerf in order to keep one from being able to chain heal ANY enemy and even multiple enemies in a row or at the same time, but a simple force increase cost to Dark Infusion would have been a simple and effective solution, giving the Sorc the ability to burst heal himself in a one on one or slow heal his team but keep him from chain healing for multiple enemies.

 

My mind literally explodes when I read stuff like that.

 

Do you really think it's hard to spike down targets or kill anything in Warzones if you don't encounter a team with more than 3 Healers or if your team simply has no DMG-output?

 

It's just impossible: Do you all just bash on different targets or what? Does nobody interrupt/Stun/CC heal? Does nobody call spikes? I mean: As a Healer 1 Melee-Ops alone can spike me down in 2 Seconds and keep me pinned down and if we go in with 4 DD's and call spikes, there is no possible way for sages to heal up the 25k+ DMG we 4 deal in under 1 second.

 

it's a team-game: Don't expect to get anything down if the opponent has 2 or more competent Healers if you don't work together, you just need to realize that and don't keep on slashing blindly onto enemies and wondering why nothing is killed.

 

I've been saying it to the players on our server for a long time: If you want to get sth down if the opponent has competent healers, just call spikes all 5-10 seconds and the healers will have no chance at all healing it up, even with having full Mana and all cooldowns of every stim there is rdy. The way DPS compared to Healing per Second works right now, a Team of 8 Sage-healers couldn't heal up the DMG being dished out by a Team of 6 DD's.

 

I give you 1 thing though: The Sage has a very easy time healing up allies to full health with no mana-problems whatsoever if he has enough time: A compromise could easily be reached if you give the healer a very very strong burstheal (I'm talking about instant 5k heal) but making Mana-management a bigger Problem, so healing up Pressure actually becomes an issue. The change to Resplendance doesn't really help surplus of mana the sage has for healing up pressure, cuz I play with literally no mana-management and it works fine in PvP.

 

*Edit: I also don't really care about which healer gets the insta-burstheal, it can be scoundrel or Commando as well, as long as some healer gets it I'm fine with it. I don't worry about my class being OP or not, I worry about how an 8-man team can fight off spike-DMG if the rate of DMG in under 1 Second to heal/prot in under 1 second is nearly 20:1 if you take a "normal" team with 1-2 Tanks, 2 Healers and rest DD's.

Edited March 18, 2012 by kickinhead

[Spero-Mcgee]

difference between medium armor and light armor is negligable, especially since most attacks in this game ignore armor. Combat stealth for healer ops is garbage, puts you completely out of the fight for 10s and if it breaks its 100% guaranteed death.

 

Which big heal do we have thats instant cast and only costs TAs?

 

TA = UH for scoundrel and its emergeny medpac, no idea what the ops call it.

It's not a big heal though even speced into it, its better to use a Kolto Pack instead if you need a bigger heal that casts faster and costs less energy than Underworld Medicine.

Using your emergency is only great, if you either can easily keep your target topped, you don't want any new UH procs go to waste because it can only stack to 2, although it does refresh it if procs, and healing does go up by 6% if UH is active.

Whenever I use disappearing act its merely to drop the focus on me away, then if I stay at max range and enemies dont notice me I usually can heal my allies safely back up.

I'd also use defense screen (45 sec) on myself to increase healing recieved by 15%, any other healer that notices this should if possible spot a heal that helps out alot.

But usually the slow medpacs and defense screen heals me up nice, it's only when im truly being focused and my teamm8es dont help that im a goner.

I wouldnt trade the stealth mechanic in for light armor and a bubble.

[Harower]

Originally Posted by Harower

I posted so many threads about the OP ness of force using healers

 

Best aoe

Best instant heal (bubble)

Largest nuke heal ingame that due to bug was spamable at reduced cast time

pvp changing percs = pull / nockback / sprint

 

 

1) AoE-Heal is heavily overrated in Warzones, especially the ones you have to keep standing in for 10 secs to grant a heal that is negated with 1 AoE that can be casted instantly (Force Wave for example)

2) It's mindboggling that ppl don't see how to get rid of that problem with everyone spamming around Bubbles: Search out a target without a bubble, pressure it with 1 Melee/ranged until it gets the bubble, switch target with melees and let a ranged DD get rid of the bubble and you have a target with no bubble and which is unable to receive 1 for 15+ seconds. Besides that, the bubble is no real heal and all your other heals take a long time to cast/channel, so it's always necessary to have a Scoundrel-Healer in your team, cuz he has the best burst-heal in under 1 Second with his instants. So both classes have their place in a well thougt-out Team.

3) It's not all about the numbers you know

4) true, but commandos have much better Armor and scoundrels can go invis etc. Again: No class is better at everything, they all have their pros and cons.

 

I really don't understand ppl like you whining about a class being imba in a team-game with teams of 8 players, when most BG's don't even have one 4-man-group which is organised. Of course you will think CCs/Stuns of the Sorc is imba if your support doesn't remove it immediately! Of course you think the burst-heal is fine if all players attack different targets and no targets are spiked. Of course you think Sorc-DD is imba if it gets the highest numbers cuz everybody is balling up like crazy. Of course you think the Sorc AoE-heal is OP if ppl just let them stand in it without punishing them for balling up.

 

I can assure you though, that these things don't matter one bit in a well thought-out team that plays together well. On our server, we often play with more than 4 players on TS, cuz we have so few reps that we get the same players in Warzones all the time anyways, we worry about very different things:

 

- How can you heal a target that is being spiked with 20+k DMG in under half a Second (and we easily get that number with 4-5 DMg-Dealers), when there is basically no heal you can dish out in that amount of time?

- How can it be possible, that one of the heaviest ranged-DD's cannot be interrupted (Sniper), which is basically the only way to deal with good spikes nowadays besides having 1-2 VERY good Tanks and 2 Very good Healers, which most of the time isn't enough anyways?

- How can certain Melee-Classes have jumps ready all 15 seconds, making it so much harder to sniff out a spike and negating any effect that slowing the movement on them has? This basically makes the heaviest Single-tagret Burst DMG-Dealer (Sentinel by far) to have no drawback at all for being a Melee-class, other than the bubble-stun.

- How can the Assa have a Strike that takes out a healer for 4 Seconds rdy all 15 seconds, which means minus half the heal in every 2nd to 3rd spike?

- How can it be possible for a Class that is very tanky to have hybrid builds that allow them to spike every 5-10 Seconds and heal up everything in between? (I'm talking about hybrid-commandos, 4 of them and you deal insane DMG and need no additional heal and with the reactive shield buff, you can't even be interrupted for the first spike)

 

I get it: Sorc can be veeeeery annoying and they seem very strong on certain Maps, but in a well thought-out team, you can deal with all that and all the classes and various different specs have their viability, but the things above are actually heavily OP and there is simply no real way to deal with it yet.

 

wow you post so much on every page, if only the sheer amount of words compensated for the quality of your content. You must be here to learn because majority of what you say is rubbish.

 

Lets break down your crap a little.

 

1. Learn to read, my sage doesn't even have the aoe heal let alone uses it. Yet what I said is correct, it is the best aoe ingame. But that aside, pre dropping an aoe down on a zone you know the entire group is going to take say a death from above around a capture point is very very wise. Especially when you are protecting a bomb disarming or such as that.

 

2. No one spams bubbles, instants are emergency use heals(usually due to cd or cost) and yes with the global spread cd of bubble no one pre bubbles. This isn't pve. What I said is the force user instant is the most powerful. Which it is

 

3. It isn't about numbers? Do you even read the stuff you spew out?

 

4. The strongest game changing pvp perks are nockbacks, stuns, sprint and pull. Armor is simply a class balancing aspect and one that doesn't hinder a force user if they are skilled. You think a sage runs into the middle of combat?

 

Discussing use of a particular type of heal to assess the value of the class is beyond stupid. There is always a situation for everything and in that regard force users have superior numbers of every type of heal and superior utilities.

 

Situation x calls for option y! There is a good chance sage can do it better, easier and for less cost. pre 1.2

 

The only thing I can think of would be if a sage chooses to run into 7 enemies and tank it. Other classes would last longer. But that being said a quick juke and you can still be spamming off massive heals on yourself.

 

I have all 3 kinds of healers and I am looking forward to this nerf, I hate knowing my sage can do it better and easier while I am playing my smuggler or commando.

 

Alright I'm not going to read the rest of your rubbish because I already feel lame for replying to you. I am such a sucker for a troll If the rest of your post started to make some level of sense then I apologise for missing your potential.

 

I laugh at the sages who can't handle the fact they are getting.... whats the phrase? TO THE GROUND!

Edited March 18, 2012 by Harower

[Monterone]

For a little while there will still be sorc healers, even though most will either go Madness or find a new main. Around a month after 1.2, or somewhere around early May, it will be very rare to see a sorcerer healing in PvP.

 

It seems that there are devs out there who are so hell bent on making us use the stock power/alacrity mods we get from all gear, that now they're forcing us to use those in all gear if we wanted to heal. So I foresee that while the sorc healer population is dwindling, those who remain will start pulling those lvl 58 alacrity mods out of the vault that I hope you all saved.

[LoL-K-Noob]

There won't be sorc healers.

 

Indeed. DoT hybrid got a buff atleast even with the 6% nerf to telekinetic throw.

[fungihoujo]

Which is what a majority of players wants..

 

More so when you think about dual spec on the horizon..

 

I am so pumped for the sorc/sage healing nerf. They needed it, got it and will clean up the gutters of too many of them.

 

(this is where you can stomp your feet and say how nobody will get heals anymore and/or you are quitting).

 

Kind of interesting though- most games you get used to the complaints of 'nobody heals in pvp' and 'never can find a healer'. TOR I guess healing was so common they have to do their best to discourage it.

 

Thankfully, they nerfed the sage/sorc dps specs into the ground by removing CL from rotations- which is akin to removing rail shot from pyrotechs- so the masses got what they want- far fewer sorcs.

 

Irony is, all good pvpers already knew sorcs were good for nothing but padding numbers and capping huttballs.

[dutch-master]

I have nearly every AC at level 50 (with the exception of OPs

 

Maybe you should have focused on becoming a good player instead of amassing 8 50s...

 

A sorc can barely keep up with anything focusing him. The only thing that we survive is baddies that dont know their class (IE you). If we cant get away or get somebody to peel we are finished. Bubbles only keep you from getting 2 shotted. Sorcerers where not OP PvP healers. Probably the weakest, due to the FACT that a slight breeze makes them fold like a lawnchair.

 

People need to stop making up BS stories because they want to get sorcerers nerfed. The only thing even remotely OP was double dipping on force bending (GJ Bioware's QA). They should have just fixed that and seen how much of a difference that makes first. Now they just ruined the class as a pvp healer.

 

Now that you cant heal more than any DPS can dish out as a sorc, what do you think will happen? I guess WZs will be 8/8 dps. Its the only thing that makes sense...

 

All I can do is hope they abort a lot of these changes. If not expect to see a large population drop (not only sorcs).

[Mannic]

I can tell you with certainty that there will be enough Sage-Healers left, there will be less, but those who don't play Heal anymore cuz of a few nerfs are nothing to be shedding any tears about. Besides that, the Nerf to the DD-Sorc is much more devastating than that to the healers and players whining about Sorc-Healers do it for several reasons, none of them being that the Sorc is OP as a Healer, it's cuz:

 

- The Sorc is the by far most played Class on IMP-side

- Imps are played more than reps

 

----> Imps fight a lot of imps

----> Sorc is the Class they encounter the most

----> there are more good Sorc-Healers that stand out (just cuz of the numbers)

---------> the class must be OP

 

There are too many healers in general. Whether or not they are individually OP, the fact remains that 90% of WZ's boil down to which team has more healers (or has healers at all.)

 

If there was a class out there that was individually weak, but had a buff that multiplied everyone in their ops group's health by 200% and they could choose to buff the health of a couple people in the ops group by 1000%, they would be overpowered because of how strong they make their teammates, and no one would argue they were OP no matter how individually weak they were. That's essentially what healers do, yet people want to argue that they can somehow be underpowered? You could increase burst damage by 50% and WZ's would still boil down to who has more healers. If two teams are in a WZ and one team has ONE decent healer and the other team has no healers, who are you going to put your money on? In this game, you can't make that statement with any other specs. All other roles can be swapped, hybridized, and interchanged-- except for healers, who are vital and unbalancing.

 

Healers take a lot of the fun out of PvP, imo, especially when you start getting into multiple-healer-per-team scenarios. They are too important, too key to whether a team can win or lose in a WZ. No other spec carries such weight, especially in Bioware's poorly concieved warzones where being able to survive is so much more important than being able to kill that you see 75% of Assasins running Dark spec because they are just so much more viable. The fewer healers there are in WZ's in general the better, IMO.

Edited March 19, 2012 by Mannic

[Threskov]

With full expertise in 1.2, healer will have about 25% healing bonus. There you go, fixed. Stop crying now.

[Leszor]

There are too many healers in general. Whether or not they are individually OP, the fact remains that 90% of WZ's boil down to which team has more healers (or has healers at all.)

 

 

If your team has 0 healers and the other has 2 or 3 dont blame it on the healers, blame it on the bad matchmaking and/or bad class balance in your faction

 

I dont think you have any idea on how frustrating it is to play a Voidstar with 4 healers, 2 tanks and 2 dpses

You wont be able to arm the first door, period, istant win my ***

 

People like you just want a disorganized dps sheep herd to kill guarded healers without any care about fulling the resolve bar(s) or interrupting the right spells

 

Gues what, Bioware will reward you, congratulations

[Mannic]

If your team has 0 healers and the other has 2 or 3 dont blame it on the healers, blame it on the bad matchmaking and/or bad class balance in your faction

 

I dont think you have any idea on how frustrating it is to play a Voidstar with 4 healers, 2 tanks and 2 dpses

You wont be able to arm the first door, period, istant win my ***

 

People like you just want a disorganized dps sheep herd to kill guarded healers without any care about fulling the resolve bar(s) or interrupting the right spells

 

Gues what, Bioware will reward you, congratulations

 

People like me want "tactics" in PvP to revolve around something more than just "focus fire the damned healers because they will destroy any and all chance we have to win if we don't."

 

Don't like being focus-fired as a healer? Then you should welcome nerfs. Because when you aren't OP to the point where controlling you is absolutely imperative to having any chance to win, then you won't get focus-fired as much. As it stands right now even bad and/or poorly geared healers must be accounted for because with these warzones that are all about surviving for as long as possible at a switch, healers immediately tip the scales in any fight if you don't focus them. Doesn't matter how good the player is or if they even really understand how to heal... they will get you killed if you don't kill them first. That's practically the definition of OP.

 

Or maybe ask Bioware to come up with something other than the current warzones, which are based on surviving for as long as possible at a switch, or getting spam healed while carrying an objective. In all three warzones fighting ANYWHERE other than within 20m of an objective is pretty stupid. Even in Huttball if you're fighting anywhere other than at the ball-spawn, at the ball-carrier, or at the goallines, you're wrong. Healers tip the scales in all three of these locations.

Edited March 19, 2012 by Mannic

[Culdor]

Since it looks like they also nerfed merc healers, I think their goal is to make sure none of the healing classes is better than the others. In theory, everyone will be on par with scoundrel healers now.

 

In my opinion scoundrel healers, for pvp at any rate, are as good if not better then the other two healers in organized PvP as it is very hard to shut them down. After the patch I think they will be hands down be the better PvP healer.

[Culdor]

Maybe you should have focused on becoming a good player instead of amassing 8 50s...

 

A sorc can barely keep up with anything focusing him. The only thing that we survive is baddies that dont know their class (IE you). If we cant get away or get somebody to peel we are finished. Bubbles only keep you from getting 2 shotted. Sorcerers where not OP PvP healers. Probably the weakest, due to the FACT that a slight breeze makes them fold like a lawnchair.

 

People need to stop making up BS stories because they want to get sorcerers nerfed. The only thing even remotely OP was double dipping on force bending (GJ Bioware's QA). They should have just fixed that and seen how much of a difference that makes first. Now they just ruined the class as a pvp healer.

 

Now that you cant heal more than any DPS can dish out as a sorc, what do you think will happen? I guess WZs will be 8/8 dps. Its the only thing that makes sense...

 

All I can do is hope they abort a lot of these changes. If not expect to see a large population drop (not only sorcs).

 

While I do not agree with your assessment of how weak sorc/sage are, because a good one is damn slippery and hard to kill, but I agree 100% that what they needed to do was fix the force bending way back 3 months ago and evaluate the numbers before they made larger changes.

[Leszor]

People like me want "tactics" in PvP to revolve around something more than just "focus fire the damned healers because they will destroy any and all chance we have to win if we don't."

 

Don't like being focus-fired as a healer? Then you should welcome nerfs. Because when you aren't OP to the point where controlling you is absolutely imperative to having any chance to win, then you won't get focus-fired as much. As it stands right now even bad and/or poorly geared healers must be accounted for because. Or ask Bioware to come up with SOMETHING for PvP content where you have to be able to actually kill somebody to win. With these warzones that are all about surviving for as long as possible at a switch, healers immediately tip the scales in any fight if you don't focus them. Doesn't matter how good the player is or if they even really understand how to heal... they will get you killed if you don't kill them first. That's practically the definition of OP.

 

No, thats the definition of healer, you know, a class that does the opposite a dps does

Now, if you want to kill people REGARDLESS they are healed or not, as your post suggest... i think Call of Duty might be a game better suited for your tastes

 

Your "tactics" are not pressing buttons at random and focusing the right target (who is not always a healer, depending on the fight it might actually be faster to kill a single dps who is being healed by interrupting and cc'ing said healer

Obviously i dont expect this kind of stuff from a Pug, heck, usually the first thing i cast gets interrupted no matter if its a big heal or a worthless Diagnostic Scan... but why the hell people playing at higher level should suffer because of terrible people?

 

Makes no sense to me, but apparently it does to Bioware

[Mannic]

No, thats the definition of healer, you know, a class that does the opposite a dps does

Now, if you want to kill people REGARDLESS they are healed or not, as your post suggest... i think Call of Duty might be a game better suited for your tastes

 

Your "tactics" are not pressing buttons at random and focusing the right target (who is not always a healer, depending on the fight it might actually be faster to kill a single dps who is being healed by interrupting and cc'ing said healer

Obviously i dont expect this kind of stuff from a Pug, heck, usually the first thing i cast gets interrupted no matter if its a big heal or a worthless Diagnostic Scan... but why the hell people playing at higher level should suffer because of terrible people?

 

Makes no sense to me, but apparently it does to Bioware

 

You just don't get it.

 

To kill that DPS, even in your scenario, you still have to interrupt and focus the healer.

 

It all revolves around the helaer. How do you neutralize the healer? The team that answers that question will win, and if they fail to answer that question they will lose. That cannot be said about DPS classes. Healers prevent the kill. Keeping someone from dying is WAY more powerful than removing someone's health and then failing to finish them off.

 

I've been in matches where my Merc has died 7 or 8 times and I just take it as a bad match, and in the same match my healer will die twice and ***** for half an hour about how he was constantly being focus-fired. It seriously makes me want to /slap healers. Healers are seriously the only players in the game who, for whatever reason, believe that if they are dyring more than once every other match, their spec must be terribly broken.

Edited March 19, 2012 by Mannic

[Leszor]

You just don't get it.

 

To kill that DPS, even in your scenario, you still have to interrupt and focus the healer.

 

It all revolves around the helaer. How do you neutralize the healer? The team that answers that question will win, and if they fail to answer that question they will lose. That cannot be said about DPS classes. Healers prevent the kill. Keeping someone from dying is WAY more powerful than removing someone's health and then failing to finish them off.

 

I've been in matches where my Merc has died 7 or 8 times and I just take it as a bad match, and in the same match my healer will die twice and ***** for half an hour about how he was constantly being focus-fired. It seriously makes me want to /slap healers. Healers are seriously the only players in the game who, for whatever reason, believe that if they are dyring more than once every other match, their spec must be terribly broken.

 

Im not sure you get it, actually, considering you misunderstood your healer

 

While he only died twice, what happened is a single dps forced him into selfonly healing, leaving people like you die a miserable death

And competent Dpses do it as it is right now

 

But since both burst AND sustained healing will be nerfed now even people who interrupt the first spell will(likely)be able to kill a single healer

 

Does that seem fair to you?

It doesnt to me, but considering it did to Bioware, and thats the "opinion" that count, the whole discussion is futile :\

Just dont be surprised if post 1.2 you will die 10-15 times in a single WZ because your healer is permadead or simply playing dps too

Edited March 19, 2012 by Leszor

[Sagiboi]

Today I played a warzone Voss, and sorcs just spam CC while the other imps just killed reps off one by one.

 

I see no reason why sorcs should'nt be nerfed. they would be still useful in PvP matches.

 

If you want to solo kill, able to spam CC and heal so much damage nobody can kill you, you can't find it here.

 

 

Go and make your own star wars fan game and make your own leet characters.

 

 

100% yes for sorc nerf.

[Leszor]

See, Mannic?

 

Its because of people like the above poster who probably are very new at the game that healers are considered to be "immortal"

 

I dont see why someone who believes that there's a Warzone Voss should be allowed to pose a threat to a more competent player, fairness seems to be pretty one sided

[Sagiboi]

See, Mannic?

 

Its because of people like the above poster who probably are very new at the game that healers are considered to be "immortal"

 

I dont see why someone who believes that there's a Warzone Voss should be allowed to pose a threat to a more competent player, fairness seems to be pretty one sided

 

In a short sentence, heal so much damage.

 

For a longer explaination so poor people like you can understand, they can heal. they can CC and they can dish out good damage, thats too much of a good thing

 

Warzones are meant to be team matches, with useful buffs from other classes, sorcs are not easy to kill, and their healing is'nt bad.

 

So your claim for fairness is redundant.

Edited March 19, 2012 by Sagiboi

[Broom]

It's amazing to see how many people here pretty much admit they are completely without skill in PVP. Combined with developers who are apparently completely clueless on the subject, it makes for appalling gameplay.

 

I have PVPed extensively for nearly a decade, joining forces with server-best PVP guilds. I'm not claiming I'm personally the best PVPer ever, mind, but I know how good PVPers get things done.

 

Strange but true: any GOOD PVP team uses focus fire. No single healer in any game can outheal focus fire. And healers in other games tend to be WAY WAY better than the healers in this one (in Warhammer, my Archmage managed to heal an entire warband of 24 through a fortress siege once. Which says a lot about the lack of competence of the other side, but still).

 

Say an average non-crit single heal in SW:TOR hits for 3.5K... Even on new 50s, that's a laughably small percentage of the total hitpoints. Casting this heal currently takes 1.5 seconds (round up to 2 seconds, since another ability has to be cast first in order to get the cast time down). Even a BAD single target DPS should do at least that much damage in the same amount of time.

 

Yes, the big single heal is buggy right now, sorcerors can cast it twice inside of roughly 2.5 seconds. So a single DPS cannot focus down ONE healed target fast. Erm... how about teamwork? Two DPS, and down the target goes. And how about focussing down that healer first? Stops them from healing their team quite nicely. And even with a second healer supporting the first (that odd thing called teamwork again), that healed target WILL go down when focussed.

 

Dear players: how about you quit whining about OP healers for a sec and learn how to play as a team? Odd as this may sound, PVP matches are a team effort, you're not intended to be solo DPS gods. And you might want to consider how fast YOU will go splat when healers become marginalised. No more 300K DPS per round for you, since you'll be spending a lot of time running back from the spawn point.

 

And dear development team: how about FIXING the bug, then evaluating the effect on healing overall?

 

(As a side note: I have no idea how this nerf is going to affect PVE, but seeing how hard even BT HM bosses hit, it can't be good.)

[kickinhead]

wow you post so much on every page, if only the sheer amount of words compensated for the quality of your content. You must be here to learn because majority of what you say is rubbish.

 

Lets break down your crap a little.

 

1. Learn to read, my sage doesn't even have the aoe heal let alone uses it. Yet what I said is correct, it is the best aoe ingame. But that aside, pre dropping an aoe down on a zone you know the entire group is going to take say a death from above around a capture point is very very wise. Especially when you are protecting a bomb disarming or such as that.

 

2. No one spams bubbles, instants are emergency use heals(usually due to cd or cost) and yes with the global spread cd of bubble no one pre bubbles. This isn't pve. What I said is the force user instant is the most powerful. Which it is

 

3. It isn't about numbers? Do you even read the stuff you spew out?

 

4. The strongest game changing pvp perks are nockbacks, stuns, sprint and pull. Armor is simply a class balancing aspect and one that doesn't hinder a force user if they are skilled. You think a sage runs into the middle of combat?

 

Discussing use of a particular type of heal to assess the value of the class is beyond stupid. There is always a situation for everything and in that regard force users have superior numbers of every type of heal and superior utilities.

 

Situation x calls for option y! There is a good chance sage can do it better, easier and for less cost. pre 1.2

 

The only thing I can think of would be if a sage chooses to run into 7 enemies and tank it. Other classes would last longer. But that being said a quick juke and you can still be spamming off massive heals on yourself.

 

I have all 3 kinds of healers and I am looking forward to this nerf, I hate knowing my sage can do it better and easier while I am playing my smuggler or commando.

 

Alright I'm not going to read the rest of your rubbish because I already feel lame for replying to you. I am such a sucker for a troll If the rest of your post started to make some level of sense then I apologise for missing your potential.

 

I laugh at the sages who can't handle the fact they are getting.... whats the phrase? TO THE GROUND!

 

wow, you've got to be kidding me....

 

1) Do you think you're the only one posting here and every post is in reference to yours? There have been a lot of posts here about the AoE heal and I've simply stated ways to negate the AoE and why it's overrated in PvP. If you think differently, do so, cuz you obviously know it better anyways.

 

2) I've also stated that you shouldn't spam bubble and explained why, there are still a lot of ppl out there spamming it, if you don't or in general ppl on your server don't - good for you. If used correctly, the bubble is certainly very strong, but it's also the only tool the sage has against spikes, which IMHO is just too little.

 

3) Several ppl stated that the Sage gets the highest numbers in healing, but do you simply look at the number and say: the best healer is the one with the highest numbers?

 

4) Stuns and knockbacks and CC are in no way gamebreaking, they are often coupled with a big drawback (like long cooldown, DMG breaking stun or the need to be near enemies etc.) If you have competent Support, no Stun/CC will last on you longer than 1 Second. Besides that, there are actually a number of situations where a Sage should actually run into the middle of combat, like to activate Force-Wave and then sprint out, the make a bubble-stun more effective etc. Of course though, these are exceptions. But do you really think the concept of Front-line and Backline really is as essential to PvP as it was for example in Guild Wars, if Melees have 15 sec cooldown jumps, various Specs have pulls and some of the strongest DD's have a range of 35 on their spells? In positioning, it's much more important to negate AoE and to maximize the effectiveness of your spells and to LoS.

 

The main thing I wanted to say with my posts is that in general, all the healers combined have too less burst-heal to heal spike-DMG within a second. This is to some extent because of how the spells work, but also game-mechanics like Global Cooldown etc. I'm fully aware of the strenghts of the Sage and I can surely live with the changes, but those changes just aren't things I worry about when thinking about 8v8 global ranked PvP.

Edited March 19, 2012 by kickinhead