This game lacks epeen

[Pekish]

to me the only way to make mont-everest experience is through the comunity/social part of the game and it actually realize itself in the PVP

 

PVE is made for you to win no matter how u turn it around it will always be a carrot

it did happen a couple of time that i saw unbeatable PVE (actually in AOC T3 was unbeatible for a while) and it only bring discontent in the comunity whine and at the end or tehy make you drop cooler gear that allow you to make it or they lower the bar.

 

PVE is made to be win by most (when is by few it will not work as will not bring satisfaction to the comunity)

 

On the other hand PVP "could" be the real Mont-Everest IF some rule apply one and for all you need to remove gear and unbalanced advantage taken through PVE or even through PVP farm (that is actually another form of PVE "carrot" for PVPer)

 

second you have to make it effect the existing world that will give you the "feeling of accomplishment" that u are looking for

Edited February 28, 2012 by Pekish

[Senatsu]

People are complaining because the "hardest" raid content in the first raid created in a 2 month old MMO isn't as hard as the players want it to be?

 

Do you see where your logic falls apart?

 

Since it's their first raid they need time to get feedback, both from players and their own statistics. They need to get a better feel for how players play each class and how each class plays for different players.

That is nothing new. It's simply that BioWare couldn't possibly have the information required from the player base as a whole to adjust different content difficulties to the appropriate levels. Give them time to get their data.

[Dumpiduke]

People are complaining because the "hardest" raid content in the first raid created in a 2 month old MMO isn't as hard as the players want it to be?

 

Do you see where your logic falls apart?

 

Since it's their first raid they need time to get feedback, both from players and their own statistics. They need to get a better feel for how players play each class and how each class plays for different players.

That is nothing new. It's simply that BioWare couldn't possibly have the information required from the player base as a whole to adjust different content difficulties to the appropriate levels. Give them time to get their data.

 

The 'complaints' are precisely that, feedback. I agree with you, but there is nothing wrong with the many, many players voicing their concerns about the end game content. It is justified, and hopefully Bioware adjusts accordingly in the 1.2 operation.

Edited February 28, 2012 by Dumpiduke

[Pekish]

I dont know if you are bioware u know exactly what is the % of player that ended for real the content...

 

you can monitor exactly the number of people how many time that raid has been made how many failed how many didnt....

 

and you think a guy whining is a real feedback?

 

I always though feedback was more intresting stuff than a guy whining with no number at all about a thing he has no clue about

 

maybe i am wrong.

[Larce_Apollo]

I'm I guess a moderate gamer, in-between casual and hardcore.

 

I'd have to say right now the game is far too easy all the way thorugh, too solo centric, and nothing "on the side" that I can do to grind up for something special.

 

Although I can live witht he general ease of the game, I would like to see some sort of "carrot on a stick" out there that takes awhile to get and shows to everyone else you worked hard for something in the game as something else to do.

[Koalachan]

Wait, a game targeted at casuals isn't liked by hardcores cause they can't brag about who's is bigger than who's?

[RabidPopcorn]

I'm I guess a moderate gamer, in-between casual and hardcore.

 

I'd have to say right now the game is far too easy all the way thorugh, too solo centric, and nothing "on the side" that I can do to grind up for something special.

 

Although I can live witht he general ease of the game, I would like to see some sort of "carrot on a stick" out there that takes awhile to get and shows to everyone else you worked hard for something in the game as something else to do.

 

Yep I agree with the "solo-centric" aspect of the game, and also the lack of "on the side" things to do.

 

Class quests are entirely solo, heck, most of the questing experience is solo.

 

Outside of class quests, there aren't any epic grinds/quests for players to do which will lead to something interesting, be it an epic crafting grind, epic quest grind, epic mount grind... you know, the kind where there are dozens of steps involved, dozens of npcs involved... a really long story where everyone can take part in, like the drakefire amulet quest, or really rare world drops (not world bosses).

[RabidPopcorn]

Same here.... people usualy refer to DAoC as setting some kind of standard in mass PVP, and they did without a doubt... but what people seem to forget is that even in a game like DAoC the first few months were... well... "fun" to be honest.

 

No armor ingame (not crafted or dropped) over level 35 (50 was the max)

No falling damage... what a great day it was after that patch seeing 90% of the players fall to their deaths due to not reading the patch notes

Infiltrators killing entire groups without loosing stealth...

 

Oh, those were the days.... to bad people usualy seem to compare the state of a game now to any new game...

 

You forgot one MASSIVE difference... compare the time it takes for a NEW MMO player to get to 50 in SWTOR with the time it takes for a NEW MMO player to get to 60 in WoW (or Max level in DAoC (i never played, sry, but you get the point).

 

A really light player would take probably a month to two to get to 50 in SWTOR; in WoW you would have taken maybe twice the amount of time, or even thrice, i.e 6months to get to 60.

 

So WoW essentially had a longer lag-time for them to delay release of content, and in WoW there was SOOOO much stuff you could do on the side - that was ALSO INTERESTING and REWARDING - that you could do without end-game raiding; since so many people in SWTOR are already at 50, the dearth of engaging and rewarding side-content (sorry, dailies do not count, among other things, they lack a certain 'exclusivity' factor to the quest itself, and the rewards) have lead to people complaining when instead they would have still been grinding their way up to 60 if they were in a game like WoW and they would still have yet to experience all of Azeroth and its grandeur.

 

In SWTOR a NEW MMO player would typically reach 50 with enough credits to be able to purchase speeder 3; in WoW a NEW MMO player would typically not be able to afford an epic mount upon reaching 60, this provided something to look forward to and something people were acutely aware that they could achieve given sufficient time. And WoW was a world where your mount was almost like both your speeder and your spaceship (if you didn't have the flightpath).

Edited February 29, 2012 by RabidPopcorn

[Pekish]

it's the social trend of internet "solo" in the moltitude, it's honestly what people want.

 

the all internet it's "solo" you have no clue who are you talking to u probably don't care as long as they are there no matter what you keep going on ur way doing your stuff.

 

It wouldn't make sence to make a "group heavy" type of MMO nowday last group heavy one i played was DDO and they had to make a way to bring back the "single" player experience

 

The problem is not the game the problem is the user we are not forced to group but nobody force us to "NOT" to group

 

it's a choise as it should be (you shouldn't force people too much on those aspect of the game if u want to succeed)

 

and as a choise the data reflect the reality of the situation people like to solo-play a large majoiry of time

 

I made a character from lvl 1 and i decided to make ALL quest in group I met really really few people that weren't happy to join but really really few people every came back to me and invited me or kept contact with me to group again.

 

Sorry to say it's not the game too much "SOLO" player style it's the MMORPG typical USER that is as resoult of a time/xp strategy solo playing pay more and it will always do.

 

You could reward group playing and they did "social points" but u cant reward with real gear or people would coplain u cant reward to much or solo player (the majority) will cry...

 

they did the best they could to promote groupping evne the voice thing with the game of winning the answer... but the player nowday dont give a Sxxt to play togehter.

Edited February 29, 2012 by Pekish

[Gungan]

Wait, a game targeted at casuals isn't liked by hardcores cause they can't brag about who's is bigger than who's?

 

And who exactly are you going to group with to do anything past 50 when everybody who gets there before you gets bored after 2 weeks?

Edited February 29, 2012 by Gungan

[Pekish]

hopefully other casual that got there slowly like me and since it seems casual are the majority most probably he will have more people to group with then you do right now.

 

plus keep in consideration that a casual dont have the NEED to do things RIGHT NOW when he get 50.... if that day he is not lucky and can't find a group he will log off do other stuff and try again tomorrow

 

you know normal people without the need to impose their ego over a videogame.

Edited February 29, 2012 by Pekish

[DarthKhaos]

As to the "Vocal minority can shove-it, I'm having fun".. Good for you. I'm having fun too, but guess what all the potential new customers are reading when they come to the forums to check out the game. The ones who are vocal, and upset with the current state of the end-game. You may not like the Hardcores, but they are the voice of the playing population in a lot of cases.

And you wonder why people don't appreciate them using every possible free moment they have trying to drag the name of the game through the mud instead of looking for something they enjoy.

 

 

it's the social trend of internet "solo" in the moltitude, it's honestly what people want.

 

the all internet it's "solo" you have no clue who are you talking to u probably don't care as long as they are there no matter what you keep going on ur way doing your stuff.

 

It wouldn't make sence to make a "group heavy" type of MMO nowday last group heavy one i played was DDO and they had to make a way to bring back the "single" player experience

 

The problem is not the game the problem is the user we are not forced to group but nobody force us to "NOT" to group

 

it's a choise as it should be (you shouldn't force people too much on those aspect of the game if u want to succeed)

 

and as a choise the data reflect the reality of the situation people like to solo-play a large majoiry of time

 

I made a character from lvl 1 and i decided to make ALL quest in group I met really really few people that weren't happy to join but really really few people every came back to me and invited me or kept contact with me to group again.

 

Sorry to say it's not the game too much "SOLO" player style it's the MMORPG typical USER that is as resoult of a time/xp strategy solo playing pay more and it will always do.

 

You could reward group playing and they did "social points" but u cant reward with real gear or people would coplain u cant reward to much or solo player (the majority) will cry...

 

they did the best they could to promote groupping evne the voice thing with the game of winning the answer... but the player nowday dont give a Sxxt to play togehter.

Well F'n said.

Edited February 29, 2012 by DarthKhaos

[daMarek]

So if YOU don't care about epeen, why do YOU care so much if they make it available and some people go for it?

[Rasstavad]

... In the future, instead of people telling bads to go play "Hello Kitty Island" people will say "go play ToR". Rofl

 

This game is so easy it's a joke. I can't even fathom the level of "casual" that can't see this.

Edited February 29, 2012 by Rasstavad

[MMornard]

Casuals, you wont have those pointers being posted anymore to help you on encounters that beat you. You wont have positive feedback drawing more players to the game. You'll simply notice a decline in population to the point that the game wont cut it even for you.

 

I don't use pointers, I don't check web sites, I don't give a crap if anybody else is playing. I'd be perfectly happy to pay thirty clams a month for a server that had only my wife and me on it.

[MMornard]

So if YOU don't care about epeen, why do YOU care so much if they make it available and some people go for it?

 

Because I'd like to be able to read the forums without having to wade through fifty seven gazillion threads of "Waah waah waah waah effing waah."

[daMarek]

Because I'd like to be able to read the forums without having to wade through fifty seven gazillion threads of "Waah waah waah waah effing waah."

 

what?

[Geoduck]

This quote is from another thread, but really it applies to this one as well.

 

As soon as companies realized they could not only make a profit from gamers, but become filthy rich off of us, the "ZoMg special uber leet lolhardcore" content stopped.

 

Personally, I haven't seen NEAR the crybabying for this game that I have seen for others. People don't seem to care about the current endgame (the lack thereof) or what color crystal anyone has.

 

Hell.. if they offered everything on vendors that was available through every type of "endgame" (PvE/PvP/Crafting/Dailies/etc)... who cares?

 

They could attach a title to the achievements of doing it the "hard" way. They could give the title "Laziest of Carebears" to people who just buy it. I know I'd wear the title proudly... along with THOUSANDS of others.

 

It's a video game. Modern developers realize that gaming is a hobby, it's not a lifestyle (for 97% of gamers.. and yup, statistics online are always true), and one that most people do for fun. Healthy people feel accomplished in real life and don't need to parade around in something purple to think they completed some hard task.

 

The shed they built in the backyard or alternator that was replaced in their 2002 Mercury Cougar (Look it up.. it ain't easy) means more than killing pixels over and over to get a drop.

 

I used to spend 40+ hours a week raiding, farming for repair bill/mats, crafting for raid nights, officer meetings.. etc... etc... etc..

 

That was before I had children, a wife, a college degree, and a career. Sure, I could still be all LOLHARDCORE and get things done, but it's just not important... just as it's not important for a majority of gamers.

 

The loud minority that cares about accomplishing something in a video game should keep looking. SWTOR will never have what you are looking for, nor will any other mass marketed MMO. Your hardmodes will be nerfed, your gear will be had by all, your titles mean little when 6 months later, people solo content to get them.

 

MMOs, by design, are meant to be enjoyed by as many people as possible (unless your market is Asian only, or it's EvE online). Why would companies spend so much money for content that few, comparatively, will experience? Blizzard tried to go back to LOLHARDCORE. They were rewarded with less than 6% of players actually doing it. They lost millions of subscribers. They backpedaled somewhat. They got subscribers back... somewhat.

 

People spend so much time ranting and raving about a video game... jeebus. If it's important enough to post about, and you don't think it will change, just quit the game. There is no contract that forces anyone to continue playing something they dislike.

[Russell_Solo]

I like this game for the same reason I like Mass Effect, story driven action adventure, set in a futuristic world. All the people who bought this for PvP, bought the wrong game. Same reason I would not buy Battlefield or Call of Duty for the story or single player experience, but strictly for the PvP.

 

That doesn't mean that in the furture the PvP won't be a lot better, but I personally would prefer more story based quests and flashpoints.

 

So I hope they cater more to the people who really enjoy the game as it is, and less to the people who seem not to, because frankly, either they bought the wrong game, are trolls, or would never be happy, because they are trying to find some type of "salvation" in a game, instead of looking to Jesus Christ. Happiness comes from within, not some external game. If you aren't happy, your not happy, and a video game will never change that.

[Graveside]

You know, perhaps if it wasn't for the hardcore players - mostly exploiting, cheating, and all sorts of other things the game would still be fresh.

 

Hardcore players are not the bread and butter of this game, it is the thousands upon thousands of gamers that are below hardcore that want to have fun and do missions and flashpoints and raids.

 

I rather watch a raid of lv 20's and 30's go at it than watch 15 lv 30 get slaughtered by two lv 50's in UBER gear and then watch you brag because they logged. Then listen to you complain about nothing to do and everyone quitting the game.

 

Ask this question, why are they making changes to acquire easier pvp gear? Well because most of the hardcore players are running around with it...the casual players have no effin chance to survive or continue to do quest when being camped...50's on Tatoonie seriously that was fun...nope.

 

PvE servers are booming with players because they don't have to worry about gear constantly to have fun...they can come on and do missions and flashpoints with others who want to just have fun.

[Rathik-]

Fun is a lie, there is only my false sense of superiority.

[Graveside]

... In the future, instead of people telling bads to go play "Hello Kitty Island" people will say "go play ToR". Rofl

 

This game is so easy it's a joke. I can't even fathom the level of "casual" that can't see this.

 

Why don't you go play EVE Online then as a new player...then let me know how you like having to wait minutes, hours, days, weeks and months for items in the game to be built for end game content. OH wait I bet you would quit any game like that because you can't get to max level in a month.

[PeacefulViolence]

This game lacks alot more than e-peen.

[Samborino]

This game has no epeen factor or skill factor and that is why my server is dying fast.

 

We have 4 guilds that have cleared all nightmare 16 man raid content. Countless others doing 8 man.

 

Most pvpers got all the battlemaster gear and I never see them on anymore because they either quit or are waiting for some sort of incentive to log in again.

 

I don't think this game lacked endgame content, it was just way too easy to beat and way too easy to get all the gear in the game, pve and pvp.

 

Whatever hardcore playerbase was/is here needs challenging content and a reason to farm it. Quality pvp players need a competitive situation and not just a stupid RNG grind.

 

1.2 better hurry and it better be incredible, with rated warzones and compelling/challenging content.............but it might already be too late.

 

You can argue all day about game is failing/successful or thriving/dying but I can only tell you what I witness on my own server as someone who cares, and I have seen our pop dwindling, with our hardcore playerbase bleeding out extremely fast.

 

Maybe you want the more hardcore players gone, maybe you dislike them for whatever reason, but the hardcore playerbase is a good base of an MMO, you don't want to lose them.

 

In short, this game needs more epeen and reasons for hardcore players to keep playing.

 

It is a short window to keep us here before we move onto the next big thing or end up going back to MMO's that we came from that are simply doing it better. I was patient, gave game a couple of months, wasn't going to jump ship so fast, but time is running short.

 

You only hear or have bad experiences with the minority of hardcore players. The majority of them are good people who absolutely drive MMO's because they care.

 

They are the ones who create awesome websites with strats and videos for bosses, or the math nerds who theorycraft all the best specs and how to gear and spreadsheets and 3rd party programs to make the game better if you are into that stuff.

 

They are the ones who are comfortable leading PUG raids (ops) in their sparetime or leading rated pvp teams.

 

They are the ones who run smaller dungeon/flashpoint content multiple times looking for specific gear or trying out a new spec or playing alts or maybe even just for fun, while a casual may run it only once just to see it, this makes more groups happening and more often!

 

They are the ones who run the best guilds and push content and develop rivalries and server communities in both PVE and PVP.

 

They are the ones who are very active on the GTN and help drive the server economy.

 

They are the ones willing to test new content on patches on the test servers.

 

You may not want to believe it or care, but losing your hardcore playerbase has a very important trickle down effect on the servers. They are the players that are around the most and you will notice it when they are gone, I already am noticing it and it is not good.

 

Edit: Added one of my other posts to this as I felt it was relevant and helped add to my original point.

 

I completely agree, i made a thread very similair to this but it was directed at end game PVE.

 

The end game content was good, there was enough of it for the start of an mmo, but it was executed and implemented poorly.

 

This thread touches on the same issues, and delves into ways that they could go about fixing the problem.

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=327988&highlight=execution

 

Im to lazy to retype it in this thread so ill just direct you to the thread i made

[LordBLB]

I'm already going back to something else (Rift). There's just not enough in this game as far as content to keep me playing. Plus, it just feels like the worlds are empty with no 'Global Chat' to get groups together with relative ease. Most of the time, I'm questing, and the chat box on world will sit empty with only the stuff I've killed showing, and no one talking at all. Sometimes for hours. It feels like I'm playing a monthly fee to play a single-player game. It is for this reason, that I have cancelled my sub.

 

I may return in a few months to see how things are progressing, but for now... I'm keeping my cash.

 

Seeya round guys.