fredsaase Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 Because.. I want the match to end rather than letting twits farm? I think I've hit closer to home than you want to admit. Newsflash: Some people don't find it fun to lose in five minutes and be farmed for a further ten. I don't like to win in five minutes and farm for ten either. A hard fought game is a lot more enjoyable and rewarding than worrying about how special the medals make me feel or whether I need to do one game or two to buy the new carrot. A hard fought loss that went down to the wire is infinitely more fun than curbstomping the enemy team and it's unarguably more fun than being curbstomped, then farmed. You're contradicting yourself. Join other people killing random players. Suddenly it's a hard-fought game. YOU are the reason you're being farmed. Fight back. Again, strictly a l2p issue. The last bit's a bit of dark humor, darker than you're implying by the way. If it was intended as humor, then it's irrelevant. So, you've failed to address my analogy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Netsu Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 Last few days pvping on my server made it obvious that winning/losing is now of little importance. All huttball matches I've played in the last week worked in 1 of 2 ways: One team scores 5 goals while the other team farms and after scoring those goals they also start farming; the other version is a simple deathmatch where no one cares about the ball for the entire match. This is a consequence of how valor medals are obtained. Objectives are clearly broken, scoring/advancing ball/difusing bombs, etc is not worth the effort when you can farm 75k damage, 75k healing, 10/25 kills, critical heals, critical hits. ALl of this is killing my pvp enjoyment and here we can't blame the game but solely the community. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podrik Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 So the other team getting 5 pts in a row and camping my team in Hutt-Ball for 7 minutes is B__LS__T. Wonder what the Devs will do to address this issue. Can't find the post but a mod posted in another thread about this and said they don't see anything wrong with it. Huttball is a deathmatch style warzone, with scoring huttballs as secondary objective. With that said if it gets worse I wouldn't be surprised if it changes in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeltaThirteen Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 You're contradicting yourself. Join other people killing random players. Suddenly it's a hard-fought game. YOU are the reason you're being farmed. Fight back. Again, strictly a l2p issue. If it was intended as humor, then it's irrelevant. So, you've failed to address my analogy. It's not contradicting. Alderaan 0 to 5 is a hard fought loss. Worrying that I'm not going to hit that extra medal as a tank because I want the e-cookie isn't. Again, if I'm worried about killing people, I can hop into Nuclear Dawn, Quake, the Serious Sam games, Team Fortress 2 and so on. If I want to play a game type based around objectives with friends, I'm stuck in WZs. So you keep worrying about your medals and I'll leave to find a game being played how I like. Besides, if you're losing 5-0 and being farmed, you won't even notice I'm gone and I lose what medals I'd already earned for tanking anyway. Funny how that works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustAnotherVoice Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 Can't find the post but a mod posted in another thread about this and said they don't see anything wrong with it. Huttball is a deathmatch style warzone, with scoring huttballs as secondary objective. With that said if it gets worse I wouldn't be surprised if it changes in the future. You're kidding, right? But then again, with the state of many things in the game, it makes total sense that the devs don't know jack about their own product. If this truly is how they see Huttball, then change the win condition of the WZ or the daily/weekly requirement to reflect that it's TDM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Alma- Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 Yeah, its just the nature of PVP, you cant win them all. And if you are consistently losing, then perhaps you need to look at yourself before blaming others for your constant failure. Farming isnt new, its merely the other players achieving their objectives in a orderly manner. How else are they to achieve their win, by giving their opponents some slack from time to time ? Never gonna happen. How can I improve my game? Why does that player always faceroll me? Which targets seem easier to kill for my class? If I team up with x player in my group, we can achieve so much more if we actually figure out a gameplan instead of running around like headless chickens with no idea on who is doing what and just feeding the enemy team points when we go in and attack them 1 by 1. Which of us is best guarding those turrets whils the rest focus their dps on middle turret? Im a stealth class and I have the alpha strike on anyone that dosnt discover my location. Perhaps If I stay away from tanks and healers and focus on the squishy classes throughout the game, I might stand a better chance given my lack of gear by comparison. Do you know that 90% of pug groups dont even talk to each other ? No wonder they lose all the time. Only sheer luck of the draw pitching them against an equally bad opponent enables them to win, so they think, hey, we dont talk tactics in the ops group cus we wont last tme by not saying anything etc. etc. All these things and more, and yeah, it boils down to l2p a lot of the time. Ofcourse, if you really have drawn the shortest straw and your pug truly is terribad, then instead of bailing out, get in some pvp practice for *****'n'giggles and at least try and improve your skills, regardless of whether you think you are out-geared or not, you can still improve your rotations and stuff. Practice makes perfect. Bailing out only rewards failure with no hope of improving yourself for the next game. Imagine in the next world cup, Brazil getting shafted 5-0 by Argentina or something, and at the 40 minute mark, the Brazilian Manager holds up a white flag and asks for the match to end due to his team simply being out-classed. Imagine the outcry from the fans around the world, and the utter shame and embarassment it would bring on the team for eternity. So do you want to be renowned for skill and persistence when faced against insurmountable odds, or the loser who cant accept defeat in a video game ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arden Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 Its the medals, my team does it too and i dont like it, however there is no benefit to winning in under 5 mins which most premades are capable of doing against pugs. Get rid of medals and buff actually winning and games would go a lot quicker. Well, maybe if they understood they could be smarter about it. IE if you can cap 6 in 2 minutes and reque you'd get more valor, coms, credits by doing more WZs rather then farming for 13 minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thankyjack Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 So the other team getting 5 pts in a row and camping my team in Hutt-Ball for 7 minutes is B__LS__T. Wonder what the Devs will do to address this issue. Nothing. It happens so rarely that it isn't worth wasting time on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thankyjack Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 You are being farmed, because you/your team plays worse. l2p instead of crying. This is wrong. Farming typically happens when a pre made faces a pug. Most premades I know use voice to coordinate and no pugs do. They also usually outgear the pug group being farmed. Those advantages cannot be overcome and result in farming. Farming isn't fun for anyone. It would be great after a certain disparity in kills if a boss appeared to help one team. That boss could drop loot if killed. That would make it very interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arden Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 (edited) This is wrong. Farming typically happens when a pre made faces a pug. Most premades I know use voice to coordinate and no pugs do. They also usually outgear the pug group being farmed. Those advantages cannot be overcome and result in farming. Farming isn't fun for anyone. It would be great after a certain disparity in kills if a boss appeared to help one team. That boss could drop loot if killed. That would make it very interesting. And if the loot was any good it would only increase the farming and time waste. Now stack that up with a penalty for leaving a WZ and you really have a bad situation. Edited February 17, 2012 by Arden Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fredsaase Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 (edited) This is wrong. Farming typically happens when a pre made faces a pug. Most premades I know use voice to coordinate and no pugs do. They also usually outgear the pug group being farmed. Those advantages cannot be overcome and result in farming. Farming isn't fun for anyone. It would be great after a certain disparity in kills if a boss appeared to help one team. That boss could drop loot if killed. That would make it very interesting. A lot of people PvP for general player versus player battles (myself included). Until they add in an 8v8 TDM, expect to get farmed. Edited February 17, 2012 by fredsaase Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustAnotherVoice Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 All these things and more, and yeah, it boils down to l2p a lot of the time. Ofcourse, if you really have drawn the shortest straw and your pug truly is terribad, then instead of bailing out, get in some pvp practice for *****'n'giggles and at least try and improve your skills, regardless of whether you think you are out-geared or not, you can still improve your rotations and stuff. Practice makes perfect. Bailing out only rewards failure with no hope of improving yourself for the next game. I'll be the first to admit that I'm not the best PvP'er around, but sometimes, the skill/coordination difference in WZs is so great, that there's nothing to learn because you're not alive/in control long enough to learn anything. Adding cross server queues (separate ones for pugs and pre mades), along with something like TrueSkill would go a long way to keep things competitive. Failing that, I'd like a way out without any more punishment than losing the valour/comms I would have received. Imagine in the next world cup, Brazil getting shafted 5-0 by Argentina or something, and at the 40 minute mark, the Brazilian Manager holds up a white flag and asks for the match to end due to his team simply being out-classed. Imagine the outcry from the fans around the world, and the utter shame and embarassment it would bring on the team for eternity. Except both sides in your scenario are paid professionals representing the best their country has to offer. However, when a pug gets matched against a pre-made, it's often like asking the Argentinian national team to bring their A game to face off against the local pub team consisting of fat blokes who can barely pass. So do you want to be renowned for skill and persistence when faced against insurmountable odds, or the loser who cant accept defeat in a video game ? That was so loaded, it may just go off with a bang if I look at it funny. When "insurmountable odds" mean a pre-made on a farming trip to feed their ego, I'd gladly take the latter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quor Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 You are being farmed, because you/your team plays worse. l2p instead of crying. OR We could just accept that there are people on the other side of the game and they don't like dying repeatedly so you can have your "fun" or whatever it is you do. And of course, being a game, why ruin the fun for other people involved who are just trying to have a good time of things? If you're better than they are, play the game, win fast, and get into another game where maybe you'll face someone who can give you a challenge. Unless, of course, you're afraid. Maybe afraid of running into the other pre-mades that are running, and suddenly you're challenged, and in that challenge you're faced with the harsh reality that, no, you *aren't* nearly as good as you thought you were. So you sit there, farming others, quietly telling yourself over and over that you're "just doing it for the medals, they need to l2p....just doing it for the medals, they need to l2p....just doing it for the medals, they need to l2p...." I can smell your fear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fredsaase Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 I can smell your fear. I can feel your anger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unclekaula Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 I think it has less to do with farming and more to do with griefing. These sort of things can happen in any pvp game where your team sucks. In wow we'd take over small towns and kill fp In CS we'd spawn camp In MW2 we'd spawn trap In UO we'd camp your house for hours to piss you off Suck it up and move on, thats all there is (or l2p, get friends, etc) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unclekaula Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 Are you kidding me? Every single medal grants you 50 valor. When we finish the scoring streak usually in around 5 minutes we have 2 medals tops (for heals mostly). Then what we do is we carry the ball to the enemy goal and start passing it to them before they die. So you damage the dude, CC him, pass the ball, kill him. You end up with: 2,5k dmg, 2,5k heal, 5k heal, 75k heals, 75k dmg, 300k dmg, 10 kills, 25 kills, killing blow, 1k objectives, 3k objectives. That's 11 medals instead of two. 9 medals = 450 valor. It is profit. To the farmed ones: You also get medals. Get some heals, some damage. Who cares if you loose, there's gonna be another game to play. Make sure you get as many medals as humanly possible to turn that loss into a profit. Simple. I remember joining a totally lost Voidstar once. There were 90 seconds left on the timer, we were attacking, stuck on the first door. I got 6 medals before the scenario ended. Fastest valor gain ever. Regards, Kalantris Dont be ridiculous. If any of that was remotely true, about doing this for farming medals, then you'd be rolling the other team as fast as you could. 6-7 medals in ~5 mintues x 3 matches is 18-21 medals vs your 11 for a single match. It is NOT profit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaVolpex Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 Why should BW punish people who don't want to be farmed for 10 mins? Add a "you win" vote command which will end the WZ; the winners win and the losers don't get farmed. wont fix anything there will always be rambo wannabes that wont wanna "surrender" dont believe me? go play league of legends and try to surrender a losing match, you will spend thirty minutes spamming surrender and there will always be someone who thinks you can come back from a lost game by himself honestly go afk , or just jump out of starter area, and run into fire/acid pools over and over that way they get ZERO medals from you , or leave its just a warzone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaVolpex Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 Dont be ridiculous. If any of that was remotely true, about doing this for farming medals, then you'd be rolling the other team as fast as you could. 6-7 medals in ~5 mintues x 3 matches is 18-21 medals vs your 11 for a single match. It is NOT profit. agreed, but if you played wow, you know that doesnt matter people still farmed kills instead of capping bases/flags even if it was more efficient to just win /lose faster and join another game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustAnotherVoice Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 or leave its just a warzone I do. Not often, but I do. The concern is over the punitive measures that BW are going to take with leavers/quitters/whatever the official term is. Given the track record, it'll probably be half baked and won't do a damned thing to fix any of the myriad of reasons people leave for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crowleyz Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 (edited) The medals are causing a lot of problems and actually completing objectives, like capturing a base or scoring in huttball gives you as an individual absolutely nothing. Sure it helps win, but it's not really recognized through medals or even a specific talley at the end of the game. Sure you have objective scores, which seem halfas*ed and weird at the moment, but there's very little in terms of rewards for actually trying to win the whole game. On my assassin tank I sometimes score 3-5 times in a game(I always pug) and get no medals since I'm focused on winning, and my efforts are not recognized at all except for the odd MVP vote now and then(end up at the bottom of the list after the game so rarely get votes). If they want to promote teamplay and real competitive PvP they have to adress this issue in a serious way. I do agree that getting rid of the medals will probably help alleviate some of the rediculous behavior we see in the warzones, medalhumping seems to be a top priority for too many people. At least add something for actually scoring or capping a base or setting a bomb, even add assists for passing to someone who scores or being close by to someone(protecting them) while they complete the objectives. Edited February 17, 2012 by Crowleyz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skitlz Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 10 minutes of a miserable experience makes me want to resub. Where do I sign up for the lifetime subscription? I want to do this over and over and over and over and over again! Punish players for having bad luck, Brilliant plan Watson! We should also make it so they can't leave. That way they can enjoy this wonderful experience and never solo queue again. I personally hate being on both ends of this. One end is beyond frustrating, and the other is beyond boring. Give us 8 man premades, make you a premade and u dont have to QQ. then if your 8 man still sucks, just quit the game and go read some books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skitlz Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 Dont be ridiculous. If any of that was remotely true, about doing this for farming medals, then you'd be rolling the other team as fast as you could. 6-7 medals in ~5 mintues x 3 matches is 18-21 medals vs your 11 for a single match. It is NOT profit. it is when your Q's are 5 minutes or more, if its instant Q's then you right winning and joining another would be more beneficial but its not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalantris Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 (edited) Dont be ridiculous. If any of that was remotely true, about doing this for farming medals, then you'd be rolling the other team as fast as you could. 6-7 medals in ~5 mintues x 3 matches is 18-21 medals vs your 11 for a single match. It is NOT profit. 1. I'm not ridiculous. 2. Medals flow with different speed on different characters. I need all of my guys to have their share and it doesn't matter I already have all of mine. 3. Huttball is rare, at least for the Republic. 4. You didn't consider the queues. 5. You can't get "6-7 medals" and keep on scoring, because you're avoiding the enemy, not confronting them unless you really roll them, which is something we don't want to check and learn that's not the case the hard way. So... summing it up: don't be ridiculous. Regards, Kalantris Edited February 17, 2012 by Kalantris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solnar_xan Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 1. I'm not ridiculous. 2. Medals flow with different speed on different characters. I need all of my guys to have their share and it doesn't matter I already have all of mine. 3. Huttball is rare, at least for the Republic. 4. You didn't consider the queues. 5. You can't get "6-7 medals" and keep on scoring, because you're avoiding the enemy, not confronting them unless you really roll them, which is something we don't want to check and learn that's not the case the hard way. So... summing it up: don't be ridiculous. Regards, Kalantris The medal system is bad. It rewards kill farming. If this is the plan just give us TEAM DEATHMATCH and let us go at it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KKraken Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 I never "get farmed" Those situations you cry for, to me are only hard fights. Maybe impossible ones. Works fine for me, chance to test my skill a bit further. I never quit a WZ, and if your carebear "end this game im getting farmed" button is implemented... Guess what? I vote: NO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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