Server forums?

[Bulwark]

Despite what the game mags might tell you, MMOs live and die by their community.

TOR should be working to build up community, not prevent it.

I want TOR to succeed. Please help us do that.

[Skiveron]

/Sign, this is stupid, Bioware on one hand tries to promote community by cutting back a convenient tool (Dungeon Finder) but on the other hand does not inlcude server forums?

 

FAIL!

[DjuretJan]

Agreeeeeeeeeeeeee

[Vandrel-Blitz]

Seeing as how a number of you have been discussing guild recruitment, I would like to paint a prime example for Bioware to evaluate.

 

 

Day 1, early game access, I created a guild recruitment thread in the guild hall. I did not put my thread in any of the sub-forum areas because, quite frankly, my guild is not applicable.

 

My guild is a international coast to coast PvP/PvE guild that is a gaming community and due to this we have both EMPIRE and REPUBLIC guilds, essentially we have characters in both factions. We happen to presently play on a US PVE EST server, however we have members from all over the world and we focus on all aspects of the game.

 

Saddly, within seconds of my guild thread creation, a Bioware moderator moved my thread to the OTHER > PvP > EMPIRE sub-forum section. So, I responded and reported the thread notifying the moderator of their error, naturally I got no response and no support.

 

I then made a new thread, in the same area of the main guild hall (along with the 100 other threads) yet this time I made sure to clearly state in the title that my guild was international, that does PvE and PvE yet we're on a PvE server. Within seconds, that thread was moved to OTHER > PVE > EMPIRE sub-forum.

 

Again, I attempted to report the moderators error in moving my thread, because now at this point I have 2 recruitment threads buried in Empire ONLY forum sections, yet my guild has both factions. Naturally I got no response.

 

Lastly, I read the sticky (rules) thread stating that we are only allowed to create "2" threads if our guild is international. So at this point I'm lost, Bioware expects me to recruit for a international multi-faction gaming community guild with only 2 threads when their sub-forum sections are not only broken down by PvE/PvP/RP but also by faction and regional location. So what am I to do? I cannot recruiting in all sections, clearly because moderators insist on moving the threads, yet due to this fact I am now limited severally on my recruitment capabilities.

 

While the above is true in my personal case, it is a great example of WHY the current forum layout DOES NOT WORK, period. We need server forums to be successful and right now we are setup for failure.

Edited December 20, 2011 by Vandrel-Blitz

[Alwaysthirsty]

Server forums or bust.

[Saydros]

Looks like we'll find out how much BioWare values their customers' feedback. Server forums, please. Keep this thread bumped...they'd be unwise not to take notice.

[AbsolutZach]

/signed

[ZuperTrooper]

Mindboggling attitude from Bioware. Are you SERIOUS? Are you taking away THE MOST USED form of communication for a community?

 

Really?

 

Are you aware that the COMMUNITY is what is keeping a MMO alive? Friendships, rivalries ... they all play out on these forums! Unbelievable this level of ignorance, it is...

Edited December 20, 2011 by ZuperTrooper

[Vandrel-Blitz]

I have sent in a follow up response to their customer support via the ticket I had open. I requested them to forward this case to the appropriate manager/director for their review.

 

I'll keep everyone updated if/when a response is given. Hopfully they don't simply forget or ignore this thread.

[Cuspar]

There are few arguments remaining to be made on this issue, so I won't re-list them.

 

All I can say is this. The lack of server forums coupled with the spectre of queues is going to make it VERY hard to subscribe beyond my initial 3 months. This makes me sad, because the game is very enjoyable and it's outstanding to play with one's guild but it will be next to impossible to expand one's gaming sphere measurably with the constraints coming from poor implementation.

[oredith]

I'll probably get flamed for saying this, but despite also wanting server forums, I agree wholeheartedly with the decision. I have little doubt that server forums will be implemented in the future, but without a sufficient number of moderators to 'police' proceedings, said servers can degenerate into quagmires of childish slinging-matches. MMO veterans can only attest to the base behaviour that has plagued similar forums for past titles. You can argue that we're all adults and we should be allowed to self-moderate...but it's naive to think this game will be spared the same level of idiocy as other communities have experienced. I'm content to wait until BioWare has the system/moderators in place to ensure an enjoyable experience on the server forums.

 

this is all part of the server forum experience.

 

while YOU may not like it, it provides entertainment value for others.

[Vandrel-Blitz]

The lack of server forums coupled with the spectre of queues is going to make it VERY hard to subscribe beyond my initial 3 months.

 

Quite right,

 

This matter only compounds the larger issues at hand. The game is great, the majority loves it but the delivery and sustainment plan is heinous.

 

These forums have generated so much frustration that customers are already considering unsubscribing from the game. THE FORUMS HAVE DONE THIS?!

 

Top that off with the server population caps (que time) and we have a serious....issue.

[oredith]

Quite right,

 

This matter only compounds the larger issues at hand. The game is great, the majority loves it but the delivery and sustainment plan is heinous.

 

These forums have generated so much frustration that customers are already considering unsubscribing from the game. THE FORUMS HAVE DONE THIS?!

 

Top that off with the server population caps (que time) and we have a serious....issue.

I hate to make the comparison, but it really seems applicable.

 

Bioware made a great game, similar to KOTOR, but bigger, more polished, but they are failing on the MMO part.

 

not anticipating the huge numbers on the servers (even though they had very solid pre-order numbers that they can work from), and this move to not provide server forums.

 

it really just feels like they produced a single player game, and tried to make it multiplayer as an afterthought.

[Senden]

Seeing BW's post in here is really making me lose faith in their ability to run an MMO. If they think server forum negatives are enough to not bother implementing them well then they truly are complete clueless. I don't think I've ever played an MMO where they didn't have server forums. For BW to fail on the most godamn basics of how to make a successful MMO is extremely disheartening.

[Eclipso]

In short since I am at work, I think its far more relevant to talk with people on my own server and have the option to talk to everyone else in a "general" set of forums if need be.

[Vandrel-Blitz]

it really just feels like they produced a single player game, and tried to make it multiplayer as an afterthought.

 

A number of people have made similar comments. It does make you wonder.

[pyrobot]

I have to say this made picking a server impossible by not having these. When early access to rift started, I spent 2 days scouring the forums for my guild to try and find a server that wouldn't fill up, or be too empty, and it was worth the effort as some players were reporting 9 hour queues on the heaviest servers. That's something I wanted to be able to do for my guild and friends, and to be able to check the forum in case I sat through queues again. Speaking of which, my server opened 2 nights ago, and is full, but my previous one is now only heavy pop. What. The. Heck.

[drkwolfjj]

Come on Bioware server forums should exist on launch day, this is just sad

[XaeVinci]

Its a must, it allowed server events and to get to know each other better it was sweet.

[Vladamier]

Its a must, it allowed server events and to get to know each other better it was sweet.

 

You know what bugs me the most is that the biggest reasons given for not implementing cross server warzones or dungeon finders was "to promote a sense of community on the servers".

 

I'm afraid I'm going to have to call bull**** on that one.

 

The single best resource for building a sense of community on a server would have been server specific forums. A place for cross faction smack talk, somewhere to check in on people and guilds who landed on the same server, and a place to just generally shoot the S*** while sitting at the office.

 

Instead now we're stuck trying to talk to people using the general chat channel for basically everything, guild recruiting, finding groups, asking general questions, etc.... That makes for one busy channel, add in the barrens chat ******* and it's basically useless for any of the above.

[oredith]

Instead now we're stuck trying to talk to people using the general chat channel for basically everything, guild recruiting, finding groups, asking general questions, etc.... That makes for one busy channel, add in the barrens chat ******* and it's basically useless for any of the above.

add to that, the inability to scale the UI, nor move anything on the UI except for the chat box. it becomes impossible to break apart the chat boxes unless you like playing with only seeing 1/2 the screen (i run at 1920x1080). so I'm forced to just see guild/party/tell, because if i add general in there, I'd never catch anything from guild.

[Imhotep]

No server forums is a shortsighted decision. You want us to have communities but dont give us the tools to help them thrive. Edited December 20, 2011 by Imhotep

[Darth_Slaine]

No server forums is a shortsighted decision. You want us to have communities but dont give us the tools to help them thrive.

 

This man speaks the truth.

[Annabelle]

I tried (and failed) to find a guild to join using these forums. If anything, why not expand on the guild finder features you guys ALREADY HAD instead of removing the whole functionality making it worthless then having your customers wallow through garbage to find maybe 1 post regarding their server.

 

The guild finder was a good feature :-/ If you don't want server forums due to your company's pros and cons list, it only shows you don't care what the customer's pros and cons list is. You're showing us that you lack the resources to make the customer happy and you give empty promises instead of solid answers.

 

The biggest reasons we need server forums are: master crafter lists (didn't you say you wanted crafters to feel like they'd accomplished something? Harder to get your name out there if you are spamming general with your crafting stats.), wtb/wts/wtt requests, guild progression threads, community events or grouping or any other multitude of threads that would be constructive and critical to the community.

 

But no, you want us to "Search" the forums for the key word of our server name and whatever else might be there? This is a terrible and clunky idea and does not give the customers the functionality they pay for.

 

I'm loving the game as far as story and play goes, but everything else is really not what I hoped for. You have to show me why I should pay you money to be frustrated about simple things like server forums when I could be having fun doing something other than MMO's.

[oredith]

I tried (and failed) to find a guild to join using these forums. If anything, why not expand on the guild finder features you guys ALREADY HAD instead of removing the whole functionality making it worthless then having your customers wallow through garbage to find maybe 1 post regarding their server.

 

The guild finder was a good feature :-/ If you don't want server forums due to your company's pros and cons list, it only shows you don't care what the customer's pros and cons list is. You're showing us that you lack the resources to make the customer happy and you give empty promises instead of solid answers.

the search tool is going to come back, i think they said that in other posts, but it's only for people who are literally totally new to the game.

 

server forums are necessary for people who have played the game, maybe casually, and decided that they want to do operations type, so that they can look at who on the server's active in that regard, their progression, etc. posts like guild progression would be absolutely laughed at in the general forums ("months behind"?)

 

The biggest reasons we need server forums are: master crafter lists (didn't you say you wanted crafters to feel like they'd accomplished something? Harder to get your name out there if you are spamming general with your crafting stats.), wtb/wts/wtt requests, guild progression threads, community events or grouping or any other multitude of threads that would be constructive and critical to the community.

 

But no, you want us to "Search" the forums for the key word of our server name and whatever else might be there? This is a terrible and clunky idea and does not give the customers the functionality they pay for.

searching for threads provides no continuity. In a singular server forum, it's easy to tell which threads have more interest to the people on that server. threads like that have no chance to survive in general.

 

I'm loving the game as far as story and play goes, but everything else is really not what I hoped for. You have to show me why I should pay you money to be frustrated about simple things like server forums when I could be having fun doing something other than MMO's.

I too, love the game. I played wow without caring about the story, so I was really happy to find myself actually CARING about the story in SWTOR.

 

however, maybe that's not a praise? I'm beginning to wonder if I am judging the storyline aspect of a single player game (which have typically been very story driven) against MMOs.

 

i guess it's all about the standards one measures by. SWTOR thus far has been an awesome single player game. At CURRENT implementation, it's only an OK MMO. If BW really wants to establish SWTOR as a MMO contender, it needs to actually Walk the walk, not just talk the talk.

Edited December 20, 2011 by oredith