Dvius Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 It is an issue they know the community is interested in. I was told by David Bass that there are reasons, but I haven't gotten specific feedback yet, although I was told they'll be answered. As soon as I get a reply, I'll be sure to update both the article and this thread. http://tor-talk.com/community-fog-of-war/ So far close to 90% want server forums, so if the community speaks up enough they'll consider it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imhotep Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 It is an issue they know the community is interested in. I was told by David Bass that there are reasons, but I haven't gotten specific feedback yet, although I was told they'll be answered. As soon as I get a reply, I'll be sure to update both the article and this thread. http://tor-talk.com/community-fog-of-war/ So far close to 90% want server forums, so if the community speaks up enough they'll consider it. Id imagine the reasons being they dont want to have to moderate an additional 200 forums. That being said server forums are usually only lightly moderated anyways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dencre Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 These forums leave much to desire... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urbanlamb Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 considering the number of posters they have they need server forums to make threads of a sane size and level. Its not really any harder to moderate its still a bazillion posters posting its just that the posters are diluted a bit. As it stands now the forums server little function. The threads are far too large and it will get worse not better on launch day. for those wanting to take part in their community and have community based discussions at the moment this forum seems geared towards pushing posters off the official site. I dont know if this is the intention or not but hopefuly its not. Bioware has never run an mmo and EA has limited experience in it and are not that good at herding the masses. So hopefully a few things will happen Bioware will make server forums Bioware will increase the capacity of their servers so they can open less which in the long run will mean less server merges 1-2 years from now.. Bioware will learn to moderate more effectively on these forums at the moment I am seeing what appears to be inexperience mod decisions which is not helping the climate on their forums removing posts with +1 or /signed in a thread needing community support is well destructive. Yes they are not wordy, but considering the size of this forum and its threads it works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oredith Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 Id imagine the reasons being they dont want to have to moderate an additional 200 forums. That being said server forums are usually only lightly moderated anyways. I think the reality they want to pretend isn't the truth, is that server forums, for a large part, are work-time chat rooms for people who want to be able to put face to name (so to speak). it isn't even about crafters, server events, etc, etc. I am part of a community that started from SWG (ahazi server, which begot http://www.ahazi.org), then we moved to WoW, at which point, the community grew when we absorbed more people from wow. while it's not impossible to grow the same way in SWTOR, but it sure would be harder without server forums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalgaar Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 Please create server forums not only for the communities sake but for your own. Server forums are just great for a community in many many ways, for pvp organisation / event organisation and to keep track of pve progression and guild development. If I use your search feature to find guilds on my server I firstly need to know that guilds name, how am I meant to know all of the recruiting guilds names on my server? Do you expect us to login and search manually for guilds then spend time finding out if they are recruiting my class or not.... this seems rather counter productive especially in these early stages of leveling. - A server forum will counter this issue, as recruiting guilds on that server will be very easily identified. This is coming from a guild GM who has used server forums in the past to great success! I understand you already know this, but as a paying customer Im just voicing my own opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ibukowski Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 /signed and bumped Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EroticSquirrel Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 I understand everyone wants server forums and trust me so do I. But it's seeming like they are unwilling to do so as they don't seem to have the desire to moderate them. So my vote is for someone to make an unofficial forum and have it setup for the server forums. Less moderation of course. Could really pay off for whoever can get it up and running successfully. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oredith Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 I understand everyone wants server forums and trust me so do I. But it's seeming like they are unwilling to do so as they don't seem to have the desire to moderate them. So my vote is for someone to make an unofficial forum and have it setup for the server forums. Less moderation of course. Could really pay off for whoever can get it up and running successfully. the problem with this, as well as any other "unofficial server forum" types is that it's not the official forum. a major part of official forums is to be a jump-start point for someone that's relatively new to the game (which we all are), to be able to easily connect with people (that would be the "community" part BW is talking about). this is not a chicken / egg discussion, there's a very very definite A begot B. a community that sprouts from an official forum can thrive, because the official forum becomes the feeder into the offshoot. the reverse does not work because the unofficial server depends on various factors, such as luck, word of mouth, etc, to thrive. those are sufficient for small groups, but not enough for a server population. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vandrel-Blitz Posted December 20, 2011 Author Share Posted December 20, 2011 (edited) I understand everyone wants server forums and trust me so do I. But it's seeming like they are unwilling to do so as they don't seem to have the desire to moderate them. So my vote is for someone to make an unofficial forum and have it setup for the server forums. Less moderation of course. Could really pay off for whoever can get it up and running successfully. The thing is, that's a issue..... this company is expecting it's customers to create out of pocket expenses and do their job for them, that's completely unsat. No one should have to tac on additional debt to their financial situation just because the company does not want to do the work. Wrong answer. The right answer, and only solution, is that Bioware coughs up the money they generated from sales, our money, and hires a couple of moderators to watch over server forums that THEY create for US. Bioware is a company, we are the customers, this is business. Our money pays for the product and services as well as the supporting staff. The company has generated more then enough revenue to justify additional costs for hiring more personnel. Edited December 20, 2011 by Vandrel-Blitz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orvish Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 The thing is, that's a issue..... this company is expecting it's customers to create out of pocket expenses and do their job for them, that's completely unsat. I don't think they're looking for that at all. I think they feel that dedicated server forums may not be necessary. I would, however, say that I would love to have them. While they can sometimes be negative, they often help to foster a greater sense of community among players. For example, the guild I came to TOR with I met through my server forums in Warcraft. Had I never had the opportunity to meet and socialize with my faction opposites on realm forums, I feel like I would have had a far cheaper experience in Warcraft. Indeed, the only thing still keeping me tied to my realm are my guild, and the great friends I've met through our server forums. So I'd like to ask that we do, please, get them added. I know they're not a huge priority right now, but they are a wonderful community tool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trebarian Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 Just to weigh in once more, after reading the official response a second time and then spending an hour scanning the General Discussion forum I'm seeing a substantial contradiction between intent and outcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oredith Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 So I'd like to ask that we do, please, get them added. I know they're not a huge priority right now, but they are a wonderful community tool. it may not be a priority for Bioware right now, but this issue has a time critical aspect to it. in a vacuum, something else will try to fill the void. or, maybe that's what BW's counting on. to me, that's a sign of poorly conceived plan of action though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qqemokitty Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 (edited) the problem with this, as well as any other "unofficial server forum" types is that it's not the official forum. a major part of official forums is to be a jump-start point for someone that's relatively new to the game (which we all are), to be able to easily connect with people (that would be the "community" part BW is talking about). this is not a chicken / egg discussion, there's a very very definite A begot B. a community that sprouts from an official forum can thrive, because the official forum becomes the feeder into the offshoot. the reverse does not work because the unofficial server depends on various factors, such as luck, word of mouth, etc, to thrive. those are sufficient for small groups, but not enough for a server population. Exactly this. Can you imagine how different our life would be if we hadn't had the community/server forums on SWG. Think of all the friends we wouldn't be playing SwToR with today! Edited December 20, 2011 by qqemokitty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paganini Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 (edited) Server forums are great for community. Absolutely baffling that Bioware can't be bothered to even give us forums for just a little extra prices (No MMO that I've ever seen had dedicated mods for each server's forums). They are either extremely out of touch with the playerbase or are penny pinching something that is quite essential in building community (cough EA cough). Edited December 20, 2011 by Paganini Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anochiir Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 there's always a case for and against. To have a forum specifically for every server with all the sub forums, moderate,post etc is not a 5 mins job. I know from running my site that there is still a lot of time involved and the resources to moderate them properly would be huge. How many servers in total are there any ? 40/50? They haven't even sorted the servers out etc so until that is done there no way you'll get anything like them. I'm sure they will come but not this year..or even Q1 2012. they have bigger fish to fry at the moment Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AcerLerxt Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 there's always a case for and against. To have a forum specifically for every server with all the sub forums, moderate,post etc is not a 5 mins job. I know from running my site that there is still a lot of time involved and the resources to moderate them properly would be huge. How many servers in total are there any ? 40/50? They haven't even sorted the servers out etc so until that is done there no way you'll get anything like them. I'm sure they will come but not this year..or even Q1 2012. they have bigger fish to fry at the moment All true, and yet it still needs to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oredith Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 there's always a case for and against. To have a forum specifically for every server with all the sub forums, moderate,post etc is not a 5 mins job. I know from running my site that there is still a lot of time involved and the resources to moderate them properly would be huge. How many servers in total are there any ? 40/50? They haven't even sorted the servers out etc so until that is done there no way you'll get anything like them. I'm sure they will come but not this year..or even Q1 2012. they have bigger fish to fry at the moment in terms of game mechanics, yes. in terms of longevity of the game? no. the community is what makes a MMO. yes, the game itself needs to function, but after that, you depend on the community for people to keep playing. and 40/50? you greatly underestimate it.. over 100. we're not saying it's a small task, but it's a necessity, not an option. this is not a console game, this is a MMO, and server forums might not have always been a necessity in MMOs, but it's an evolving field, and it is very much a deal breaker if there isn't one. it's like cars. 20 years ago, it was a super luxury item to have power door locks and windows. only the best cars had them, and only as an option. Now, EVERY car must have them, because that's simply expected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vandrel-Blitz Posted December 20, 2011 Author Share Posted December 20, 2011 (edited) To have a forum specifically for every server with all the sub forums, moderate,post etc is not a 5 mins job. I disagree in full. I've been using vBulletin for many years now, since it's early days. I can tell you that creating forums and sub-forums is as easy as "CLICK, CLICK, TYPE, CLICK, DONE". Creating a sub-forum requires nothing more then: /admincp/forum.php?do=add Assign: Title Description Display Order Parent Forum SAVE Then assign a moderator /admincp/forum.php?do=modify moderator.php?do=add Enter in the account name that will act as moderator for the section SAVE DONE /repeat on all until each server has it's own forum section. Managing the forums is very easy to accomplish when you are a large company that just made a lot of revenue off of sales. You can afford to hire entry level personnel who can sit around and watch forums all day at a low-cost salary range. I know from running my site that there is still a lot of time involved and the resources to moderate them properly would be huge. Again, see above. Large company = new product = revenue = hire employees = done. This is vastly different from any home-grown back woods small communuity or hobby site out there. This is a major business and high-vis product that carries a lot of employees. It can be done. How many servers in total are there any ? 40/50? Still doesn't matter. Sony was able to accomplish this for SWG and every other MMO they carry, why can't Bioware? Infact, every other MMO has been able to do this....why can't Bioware? They haven't even sorted the servers out etc so until that is done there no way you'll get anything like them. Erroneous They can still give us sub-forums for the known servers. Plus, the game is LIVE. Servers are live. People are playing. There's zero excuse why they cannot do their jobs and add server forums. I'm sure they will come but not this year..or even Q1 2012. they have bigger fish to fry at the moment Did you catch their response statementon the 1st post here? They stated they have no plans to add server forums at this time. No plans, as in they do not desire to add server forums at all. This is still subject to change and review however, but we must lobby to get it done. Edited December 20, 2011 by Vandrel-Blitz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
COMSAT Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 Yes we need this. Im not so sure bioware will do it but there is a high chance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VinnieDaMac Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 If you're on the Bondar Crystal server, please check out the unofficial server forum: http://www.bondarcrystal.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobinator Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 I very much second this! We need server forums so I can have a place to go to escape the QQ of general discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dagimpster Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 This is need, for a simple reason of keeping everything well organized for your customers to find what they need. Right now the only way to find people to join a guild or join one your self is spammed general chat since the "guild" forums here are just so cluttered with endless random servers looking for people. In a Server forum style it lets its own community find the people on there server to help with what is needed in a timely manner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senden Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 (edited) Am I the only one who thinks this is all absolutely pathetic? How as a community we are forced to come together like this to practically beg for one of the most standard features found in any MMO game's community? Shame on you bioware, shame on you. Edited December 20, 2011 by Senden Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyzael Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 Having no server forums is ridiculous. How do you know what guilds are on your server, who is the best, what events are going on, etc? I'm not going to scroll through 100's of posts in the Guild Hall. This is extreme laziness by Bio-Ware. Community success is intrinsic to server forums. Stop being lazy BW. FOR SHAME! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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