Time to end Biochem reusables

[Ghamsar]

sorry to bother, i don't want to start a thread that has an easy answer.

 

But is there anyway I can go Bio-chem..ramp it up to max, get a reusable bound to my character, then go back to my original profession and level it back up, while still using my reusable pack?

[Battilea]

sorry to bother, i don't want to start a thread that has an easy answer.

 

But is there anyway I can go Bio-chem..ramp it up to max, get a reusable bound to my character, then go back to my original profession and level it back up, while still using my reusable pack?

 

Nope, the re-usables require Biochem skill.

 

That's what they really need to fix, in my opinion, combined with slapping skill requirements on the perks the other crew skills have, so as to level the playing field.

 

Standard reusable - anyone can use.

Rakata Reusable - stronger reusable, requires biochem.

Blue used types - strongest.

[Griad]

Nope, the re-usables require Biochem skill.

 

That's what they really need to fix, in my opinion, combined with slapping skill requirements on the perks the other crew skills have, so as to level the playing field.

 

Standard reusable - anyone can use.

Rakata Reusable - stronger reusable, requires biochem.

Blue used types - strongest.

 

So what we need are more restrictions in your opinion, i do follow you because atm i can get synthweave get the gear needed and then drop it for biochem.

[Fumanchu_Fow]

If biochem is so OP why does this debate continue? Clearly it's so good that everyone is already biochem or is retarded and nothing they say matters right? I mean if you are telling me biochem is 100 million billion times better than everything else and you are still another profession you must have a mental deficiency so why bother listening to your rambling?

[BMBender]

Skills are just that "skills". And class balance is independant of healing pots. This is because any class can take Biochem.

 

When I say infinite I mean ZERO cost once created. As long as they have that heal item and stim item in their inventory they have the ability, at NO cost.

 

Every consumable in the game has a cost, except biochem and grenades. Both should be removed or balanced against other infinite consumables for the other crafting classes.

 

It's a broken mechanic. You can argue that it's not very broken..but it's still broken.

 

Even if they healed for 1 point of health, it'd be broken.

 

I honestly don't know why this is so difficult for people to understand. Broken mechanics are broken. Justify their value or lack of value all you want it's still broken.

 

Fine then remove amrmor mechs abil to get FREEEEE omg skys falling aug stats from REing rakata bracers belts and MC criting = playing field ;p

Edited February 17, 2012 by BMBender

[Flowerslayer]

Over 150 in stat points at all times for free is useless? How can one be so dumb. You can also craft items JUST LIKE EVERY OTHER PROFESSION can. Oh and there are TWO TWO TWO DID I SAY TWO slots for your crafted items. But somehow you think biochem is worse than another profession. LIKE WOW! WOWOWOWOWOW

 

EVERYONE who is not biochem right now is a F-O-O-L.

 

Crafting is now free? Must've missed that memo. If you are serious, please pass whatever you're smoking.

 

OP, what you're asking for is welfare. Why do you expect to have the same stats or gear as someone who put in more effort to get it?

Edited February 17, 2012 by Flowerslayer

[BMBender]

Crafting is now free? Must've missed that memo. If you are serious, please pass whatever you're smoking.

 

OP, what you're asking for is welfare. Why do you expect to have the same stats or gear as someone who put in more effort to get it?

 

I'm guessing American Lib or greek:D /joke

 

tbh at this rate I'm banking on all crew skills to be no more than a mini game within 6mo.

Edited February 17, 2012 by BMBender

[FarizAA]

For the EXACT same reason EVERY other class crafts.

 

1>To sell their products.

2>To craft their own products instead of buying them at retail prices.

 

Biochem breaks crafting, because they have access to an infinite pool of healing whereas everyone else has no such equivalency.

 

Instead of removing Biochem reusables I'd be 100% in support of EVERY crafting class getting an equivalent reusable. Time will tell if BW can make this happen.

 

Exactly. Make every professions a Biochem. Artifice can produce light sabre amplifier crystal, which lasts 2 hour before burning out, give boosts, and stacks with other profession items. This way every profession will be viable, and GM will get a huge boost. People will produce boosters to sell them in the market to buy boosters from other professions.

[Maserdom]

Sigh, just another thread that could be easily summed up as "I'd rather ask the devs to nerf Biochem than have my crew skill buffed to match its usefulness".

 

I still can't understand why people don't even consider the fact that they could be asking MORE for themselves instead of pretending other to have LESS like them. /facepalm

[LopmaRibar]

Careful what you wish for. Live by the nerf, die by the nerf.

[NuclearPanda]

How can you possibly buff up the other crew skills to the point that it's comparable or better to having free adrenal/stims/medpacs? You can't.

 

And do you know why you can't sell stims? BECAUSE EVERYBODY IS A BIOCHEMIST! And good luck trying to sell implants. They're barely going for more than costs because there are so many biochemists trying to sell implants. If they haven't reached that level on your server, they will as more people switch to biochemist.

 

The other professions are fine, you can make lots of credits from them. Sure, they require tweeks, but they certainly aren't broken. They LOOK broken because everybody is comparing them to Biochem.

 

I'm not saying remove Biochem or to remove stims/adrenals/medpacs from the game. You can still use them. You just can't have an unlimited use one. Which is what the problem is now.

 

I'm a Biochemist. I use to sell about 10-20 stims a day. Now i will be lucky if i can sell 2. Who would buy stims when the costs for 2 stims is the same cost as an unlimited reusable one?

 

You know it's overpowering, which is why you guys are fighting so hard to keep it. You like the advantage of having a free use adrenal/stim/medpac. The game wasn't designed for that, but it's what it's becoming. When i raid, it use to only be 1 or 2 biochemist in the raid. Now it's like half.

 

You guys need to think long term. You say you're making more credits doing the dailies... and that's alright with you? I don't want to grind out dailies every single day just so i can raid.

 

ME ME ME. That's all you guys are thinking about.

 

 

Well first off, I'll apologize for calling some of you "morons". Apparently I was "warned" by the Admins for using such extreme language. lol

 

How can other skills be possibly buffed enough to compete? How about when the update rolls around to be able to place Rakata level mods/enhancements/armor into created Orange items? That is going to FLOOD the market with items literally worth millions each. Biochemists will make no money in comparison to those selling high-level raid gear. That is supposedly happening next month sometime with when 1.2 is released.

 

I sell a variety of Columni Implants all the time. I don't bother with the lower level ones, but Columni ones for for 300-500k each. These require Alien Data Cubes, an item only dropped in 8 Man HM Ops. It takes a lot of my time to get these items so it's not like I'm making money hand over fist.

 

I still don't see the problem with unlimited use medpacs/stims/adrenals. They're practically useless in PVP when you compare them to the consumables specifically for PVP. Also having them in end-game raids is pretty much a moot point. There is no reason why you should be having to rely on using your medpacs all the time. If you are then you need to find a better healer to run with your group because they're obviously failing. Medpacs should be last resort items, not your "go to" for healing. Sure, it's infinite but I don't usually HAVE to use it unless I'm in dire need. Medpacs hardly cost any money as it is, so suck it up please and shell out a few credits yourself.

 

 

I want other professions to evolve. I don't see the need for Biochem to be nerfed further. The original nerfs, sure, I can deal with it even though I don't fully agree. Completely taking away re-useables from Biochemists will make Biochem completely worthless. That is me thinking long-term.

[NuclearPanda]

And as far as overpowered goes once march hits and the rak/bm mods/armoring/hilt/barrels can be transferred to any orange then armor crafters will be the new gods of the game with the best gear ever plus an augment slot to boost them above everyone else by 20-35 pts per augment per gear slot. yeah that's completely useless.

 

here let me augment my medpac.......wait a minute I can't it is the same as normal only I don't have to keep making them for personal use.

 

^^^^ This times 1000.

 

When the March update hits, Biochem will be a thing of the past. People who can CREATE end game level items will be making money hand over fist. I guarantee stuff will flood the market for 1m+ at the minimum.

 

Heck, I've seen Columni Implants on the GTN on my server being sold already for 1.25 million. I can't imagine what a Rakata level piece of gear would sell for that is augmented.

[goulet]

so basically your argument is its overpowering because they dont have to spend money to use it?

 

because:

a: the pvp stim that you can buy with commendations heals more then the reusable once you have majority centurion gear. 30% health quickly outdoes the reusable.

 

b: the passive buff (+class stat) stim even if it wasn't reusable would still last through death.

 

c: the reusable combat buff ones (+def +crit etc) are essentially a 3rd relic, and you're telling me that 15 second buff every 2 and a half minutes is overpowering? better yet something that acts at best a 20 percent buff of your base abilities is overpowering? and not the other 80 percent of your damage contribution during the buff thats from gear/class?

 

d: the cheap cost max level stuff is only gained through pve.

[Wintor]

Exactly. Make every professions a Biochem. Artifice can produce light sabre amplifier crystal, which lasts 2 hour before burning out, give boosts, and stacks with other profession items. This way every profession will be viable, and GM will get a huge boost. People will produce boosters to sell them in the market to buy boosters from other professions.

 

Love this idea.

[GnatB]

Sigh, just another thread that could be easily summed up as "I'd rather ask the devs to nerf Biochem than have my crew skill buffed to match its usefulness".

 

I still can't understand why people don't even consider the fact that they could be asking MORE for themselves instead of pretending other to have LESS like them. /facepalm

 

Because I don't want them breaking my tradeskill too?

 

Currently, I have a choice. I can either pick a functional tradeskill I can make good money on, because few other people have it, thus high demand/low supply, or if I want to be the best I can be for combat, I must pick the broken tradeskill that is hard to make money on BECAUSE EVERYBODY ELSE HAS IT, thus low demand/high supply.

 

Breaking all the other tradeskills by "forcing" people to have them too isn't the solution. Fixing biochem by removing the requirement for everybody to have it is. (though at this point, possible too late, as so many people will still have it)

 

Currently, if you want to be just an adventurer, great. Pickup Biochem. More power too you. If you want to be just a crafter making stuff other people want to use, great. Pickup anything except biochem. If you want to be both the best adventurer you can be and a great crafter with everybody using your stuff? Tough beans.

[Brokor]

Biochem already sells implants that can be useful and sometimes even best in slot with some lucky crafting criticals.

 

i am a synthweaver who has crafted a lot of armour. i have around 100 purple recipes and i have 3rd grade schematics for most light armor at lvl 49 (bought design from trainer as blue and RE's 2 times to get a "superior" schematic). even when the craft is critical the item is useless. due to item sets noone ever buys synthweaver products.

 

i have been trying to sell mastercraft items at 1/100 the cost it took me to make them (pretty much even cheaper than the material cost) and people still wont buy them.

 

only reason i craft is because i like keeping my companions occupied (and i filled 4 bays with companion gifts noone uses) and i equip some fresh 50's every now and then.

 

 

biochem sells better items that people might actually buy, and they have the added benefit of stims/adrenals/medpacks.

 

i am just checking now the GNT on my server on consumables->healing there are only lvl 24 medpacks and on consumables->buffs there are some alacrity adrenals for 30k each (i am an assassin so i dont use alacrity) and some skill)cunning) stims for 20k each.

 

so in reality people with biochem always got 1 more heal, 120 more main stats, 50 more secondary stat (power/defence) and 1 adrenal which offers overpowered stats for 15 seconds.

 

 

the biggest imbalance in PVP is not class imbalance or faction imbalance, but crafting imbalance.

 

they need to make either reusables used by everyone (the ones you can sell but need biochem, keep rakata as they are) or abolish them completely and have biochem people and non bochem use normal medpacks/stims that are consumed on use. then ofc biochem people will have them cheaper since they can craft them themselves but atleast the rest can be competitive in pvp.

 

 

synthweaving and armormech offer zero advantages in pvp.

biochem offers better healing, better buffs and also adrenals that make you godmode for 15sec.

 

they need to nerf it or make its products available to all.

[inseeisyou]

Not sure if serious...

 

Biochem nerfed repeatedly into absolute oblivion...

 

Not sure how they could possibly make it any worse?!

[Brokor]

Not sure if serious...

 

Biochem nerfed repeatedly into absolute oblivion...

 

Not sure how they could possibly make it any worse?!

 

atm biochem helps in pvp through stims, medpacks and adrenals.

 

synthweaving offers nothing, nada, zero to a pvp player(nor a pve one for that matter since operations usually just drop jedi-only designs and i am imperial).

 

how is that balanced?

[inseeisyou]

atm biochem helps in pvp through stims, medpacks and adrenals.

 

synthweaving offers nothing, nada, zero to a pvp player(nor a pve one for that matter since operations usually just drop jedi-only designs and i am imperial).

 

how is that balanced?

 

Synthweaving gives access to crit crafted Rakata belt and bracers (w/ aug slots)

 

BEST IN SLOT... unobtainable through any means except Synthweaving...

 

Looks like back to the drawing board for you (or torhead maybe)

[Brokor]

Synthweaving gives access to crit crafted Rakata belt and bracers (w/ aug slots)

 

BEST IN SLOT... unobtainable through any means except Synthweaving...

 

Looks like back to the drawing board for you (or torhead maybe)

 

my point was about pvp. pve bonus was in brackets.

 

 

i repeat to be clear for a 4th grader like you:

 

how does synthweaving help in pvp?

[Shatteredstar]

NO! Reusables should NOT go away. They are a nice perk in that you aren't burning materials, not game breaking via more stats or shifting things around.

 

The presence of the reusable already ensures you always have a buff of some sort that someone else may not have, as such getting a perk that boosts it more would just mean you use more materials and get an even larger bonus. Thereby amplifying the so called "OP" calls and also making the market for stims and such rougher because biochems will be using the materials increasingly for their own use and not selling the stims to others.

 

More powerful effects aren't what we need when that does not really address the materials costs or the market issues we face already.

[DarthBloodloss]

Like the title says, i think it's time to end this. It clearly is overpowering because having a free heal, free adrenals and free stims is just too powerful.

 

Even Biochemists should want this change, because with so many biochemists, the market for stims and medpacs is just not there.

 

The perks for a biochemist should be stronger stim/adrenals/medpacs for their own use only. Change the reusables to the Exotech (requiring 400 biochem to use), and drop their mats to only requiring one Radioactive Paste (4 is absurd).

 

Adrenals are too expensive currently. A good start would be to cut their mats by half.

 

For ops schematics, make the Exotech have a 4 hour duration that anybody can use (and requiring 4 Radioactive Paste).

 

The other crafting skills aren't broken. Some require tweeks, but they ARE viable. It's just when people compare them to Biochem, they see it as useless. When people look up stims and see that 2 stims is the same price as a reusable, it's a no-brainer that stims are a ripoff or/and that biochem reusables is too fantastic to not have.

 

Make biochem give us negative stats!!! Like -500 endurance and -25% to the stat of your choice!!!

 

Also make bioanalysis and diplomacy gathering skills that bring back empty ammo clips and dead animal claws!

[Undorett]

add credit sinks to the game and let the reuseables be used by everyone, bind on use so they cannot be handed off once a character starts using them

[Lividcalm]

How about NO

 

Anyone can take Biochem, so how is it overpowered?

 

So again, how about NO.

[flegg]

I had a long post explaining exactly how you are wrong, and why. Then I realized "what's the point? This person probably won't even have the ability to read a response that discredits their very narrow way of thinking"

 

So I deleted it and decided to post a very terse statement to you.

 

"You are wrong". Period, there is no other way of saying it. Biochem isn't even a profession first. Second it is worse than some other skills. Now if you need a real explanation of why, well you obviously a) don't read dev posts, and b) aren't worth the time it would take to explain it to because you lack the ability to look at things on any sort of real scale beyond your own level 20 concerns.

 

And yet you can't even link your own post. You're just bad at life as well as the game apparently. Keeping an exotech stim on whenever I play is expensive and will drain all of my credits unless I buy from gold farmers not to mention for PVE I need to have adrenals and medpacks as well. Unless you are crying that cybertech is better than biochem I can't comprehend how you think biochem is not a profession compared to other professions.

 

You can even make best of slot items. For two slots. Again... wow

 

And to repeat. The only professions that give any PVP advantage are biochem and cybertech. Yet somehow biochem is not a profession compared to other professions. Excellent.

Edited February 17, 2012 by flegg