1.1.2 PvP bag changes.

[Volnoxiom]

Let me just point this out, since there's confusion about it.

 

The 1.1.2. bag changes have reduced the RNG element on drops DRAMATICALLY. Exactly what you guys asked for.

 

Instead of hoping to get specific item tokens, you now get (more) commendations that you can turn into an item of your choice. That is a lot more deterministic and reliable than opening bags and hoping for a token.

 

-- Georg

 

This seems as if it's only adressing CHAMPION gear. Sure more champ tokens is great for those looking for champ gear. Now what about Battlemaster gear? The patch simply states more commendations (you currently get champ comms from BM bags) and your quoted statement seems like it has nothing to do with BM bags since you can only gear up through BM tokens.

 

So please clarify a bit more on BM bags... will There be more BM tokens? (a better rate) or will it the same pvp for barely any progression method.

 

(Also for those who might think I want easier gear... not at all. I'd rather the Valor requirement be HUGE or possible BM bags pruchaseable for 1k merc 1k warzone. Something harder to get but at least you are moving toward something while playing. Not just random luck)

Edited February 2, 2012 by Volnoxiom

[TehMadHatterz]

Thank god they're just giving me less reasons to even want to attempt making/gearing an alt.

[ComeAndSee]

Let me just point this out, since there's confusion about it.

 

The 1.1.2. bag changes have reduced the RNG element on drops DRAMATICALLY. Exactly what you guys asked for.

 

Instead of hoping to get specific item tokens, you now get (more) commendations that you can turn into an item of your choice. That is a lot more deterministic and reliable than opening bags and hoping for a token.

 

-- Georg

 

Georg, you aren't getting what we're asking for. What we want is more Champion and Battlemaster items.

 

I grinded my butt off (60++ hours) to get my Battlemaster Title so I can get Battlemaster Bags and I got my first token after 16 bags and I've opened 3 so far this week and haven't gotten any items.

 

I have full champion gear and have gotten so many items that my companion is almost fully geared and I was able to take items for PvE tanking. I even got so many extra pieces that I've been stealing the mods and mix-matching my sets. Hell, I can open my bank and probably find two-three extra tokens that I have no use for.

 

It's absolutely frustrating opening Battlemaster bags and not seeing tokens. It's demoralizing to me and I feel like quitting more and more every time I open a bag and get nothing.

 

//

 

TLDR;

 

* Make Centurion gear cost warzone + merc commendations!

* Champ + Battlemaster bags drop tokens corresponding to each item!

Edited February 2, 2012 by ComeAndSee

[malformed]

starting to wonder if they should just let people buy cent gear with wz coms (more expensive than the blue lvl 40 gear)

and champ bags should give champ coms with the chance at a token.

 

duno.

 

edit: what the poster above me said +1

Edited February 2, 2012 by malformed

[royad]

I actually keep being amazed by how bad most things have been done. I mean PVP wins not counting and then reducing the champion gear you get by winning. I knew some things would not be good but pvp is just not fun anymore.

[neoexo]

* Make Centurion gear cost warzone + merc commendations!

* Champ + Battlemaster bags drop tokens corresponding to each item!

 

This. If we get a token in our bag, awesome, if not, give us corresponding commendations. Either way we'll get gear from those bags, instead of lower tier gear. This is how it should have been at the start.

 

Making Centurion a starting gear set for fresh 50s is also a good idea. Least new characters wouldn't be rolled as much as if they didn't have any pvp gear at all.

[MigSebes]

Let me just point this out, since there's confusion about it.

 

The 1.1.2. bag changes have reduced the RNG element on drops DRAMATICALLY. Exactly what you guys asked for.

 

Instead of hoping to get specific item tokens, you now get (more) commendations that you can turn into an item of your choice. That is a lot more deterministic and reliable than opening bags and hoping for a token.

 

-- Georg

 

It's ok, all the people already in Champion gear don't mind this change.

[WallyRez]

BioWare, just one question:

 

What are you thinking ????

 

This is the single dumbest change you've done yet.

 

I don't know, there's a lot of competition...

[Briljin]

Instead of hoping to get specific item tokens, you now get (more) commendations that you can turn into an item of your choice. That is a lot more deterministic and reliable than opening bags and hoping for a token.

 

-- Georg

 

Outside of having expertise, Centurion armor tends to be pretty bad. Most builds will actually be forced to replace the mods because the armor doesn't even follow their primary stat build. So we end up working towards an item that we have to gut just because it has expertise upon it.

 

Yeah, we wanted a more predictable progress but not towards building a rather lackluster PvP set.

[Stongrel]

This will be a forgotten issue in 2 months once it becomes the standard for progression. The only ones affected are the temporary people that will see this transition. Otherwise no big deal.

The game will be long dead by then. All that will be left are fanbois/diehards, enough to keep this turd of an mmo going until they pull the license and try a 3rd time.

[CapuchinSeven]

Wait, hang on.. so now it's harder to get Champion items when you're under rank 60 but they can't take Battlemaster bags and save tokens instead because you can't open them until rank 60...

 

Centurion gear is better off not worn and traded/crafted blues/purples worn instead, but they give you more tokens for those items.

 

How do they (and the defender brigade) think that's a good system...?

[Budizzle]

Well Mr. Internet Tough Guy, that's not what I was saying at all. What I WAS saying was that this change is going to make it harder for new 50s to get caught up to where many, many people already are. I have an assassin that has all Champ gear now except the belt and 1 implant so he's hardly effected by this change. However, I know what a difference that champ gear makes over non-pvp or the Centurion crap. It's substantial. Hell, you have a guy just a couple posts above yours saying that t2 pve gear is better than Centurion.

 

I've got no problem going through a progression. What I have a problem with is the beginning of that progression is not as good as crafted pve blues when it's supposed to be epic quality. That makes it undesirable and having to grind through it is kind of pointless when you likely won't even want to wear any of it anyway.

 

Uh, Centurion gear is better than blues. And the way PVP items are designed, you're supposed to sacrifice other stats for expertise. PVP gear is not intended to be good for pve.

 

I don't know how you can't understand this. Also, it makes sense that t2 pve gear would be better than t1 pvp gear.

[Nowyourdead]

Let me just point this out, since there's confusion about it.

 

The 1.1.2. bag changes have reduced the RNG element on drops DRAMATICALLY. Exactly what you guys asked for.

 

Instead of hoping to get specific item tokens, you now get (more) commendations that you can turn into an item of your choice. That is a lot more deterministic and reliable than opening bags and hoping for a token.

 

-- Georg

 

All this determines is that we won't be getting champion gear until we are 60 valor. The chances of getting CHAMPION tokens from CHAMPION bags is the problem with a small percentage and dupes. Now you've just made those chances even lower. Wait until the rage when people finally get a token from their Champ bags and it's a dupe. LOL

Edited February 2, 2012 by Nowyourdead

[Myung_Alatioc]

I am not a Battlemaster yet so was hoping for some clarification.

 

I understand that the reward bag you buy for 200/200 pts and the ones you get from your daily and weekly missions are called Champion Bags.

 

Question I have are the bags you get from your daily and weekly missions when you are a Battlemaster still called Champion bags or are they called Battlemaster bags?

 

If so are both weekly and daily missions available when you are a BM? For instance can you get a Champion bag daily and a Battlemaster bag daily, or does the BM daily replace the previous one?

 

 

 

Was just reading the patch notes and they are a little confusing esp since I am unsure what bags are called when you are a BM.

[MPagano]

This is really disheartening to hear. I was hoping that we would at least hear some sort of change that was a step in the right direction. This tells me that BWs attitude toward pvp progression just doesn't mesh with what I'm looking for in a game. At least the leveling is fun. I could probably bang out another character story. I never got to finish my first one since it's bugged out.

[Bakarn]

Bioware! Seriously, you can fix this system NP in four easy steps.

 

1. Reintroduce buyable blue gear for WZ commendations.

2. Reduce the price of Centurion gear by 50%.

3. Allow the buying of Battlemaster Commendations with Champion commendations.

4. Allow the buying of Champion Commendations with Centurion Commendations.

 

Easiest thing in the world.

[Budizzle]

You took advantage of broken systems to gain your gear, there was no "effort" involved.

 

I don't have a full Champion set. In fact, I have two pieces of Champion gear and ZERO pieces of Centurion, because it was impossible to get anything with the commendation spread before the patch.

 

Now I can get Centurion gear much faster than before, then I can make the leap to 60 Valor and get Champion gear.

 

Welcome to item progression you serfs.

[CapuchinSeven]

Uh, Centurion gear is better than blues. And the way PVP items are designed, you're supposed to sacrifice other stats for expertise. PVP gear is not intended to be good for pve.

 

I don't know how you can't understand this. Also, it makes sense that t2 pve gear would be better than t1 pvp gear.

 

It doesn't matter what you think you're supposed to do, in reality Centurion gear is pretty crap outside of a small amount of expertise.

 

I don't know how you can't understand that.

Edited February 2, 2012 by CapuchinSeven

[Bloodylittle]

I am confused as to why they are rewarding people that have rushed to end-game pvp status by punishing those who have taken their time enjoying their "story-driven" game...which btw takes time.

 

Seems to me they have no FN clue what the hell they are doing.

 

PS...I'm almost BM and in full Champion gear and I find this change ridiculous for those just hitting 50.

[Morevil]

Let me just point this out, since there's confusion about it.

 

The 1.1.2. bag changes have reduced the RNG element on drops DRAMATICALLY. Exactly what you guys asked for.

 

Instead of hoping to get specific item tokens, you now get (more) commendations that you can turn into an item of your choice. That is a lot more deterministic and reliable than opening bags and hoping for a token.

 

-- Georg

 

Unfortunately, this is not what we asked for. You need to completely remove RNG. It's not fun.

 

Here is how the PVP gear system should work.

 

Centurion gear - Each piece of this gear should cost X amount of warzone and X amount of mercenary.

 

Champion gear - Requires Champion tokens. To get them, you purchase Champion bags at a cost of 200 warzone and 200 mercenary tokens or from the daily/weekly. These bags give you X champion tokens.

 

Battle Master gear - Requires Battle Master tokens. To get them you need to do the weekly quests and have a valor 60+.

 

You could also do this.

 

If you have Centurion gear and you want to upgrade to Champion gear, you would get a discount.

 

Say you have the Centurion head piece and you want to upgrade to the Champion head piece. Instead of paying full price for the Champion head piece of lets say 50 Champion tokens, you could trade your Centurion head piece and 30 Champion tokens for the Champion head piece.

[Budizzle]

It doesn't matter what you think you're supposed to do, in reality Centurion gear is pretty crap outside of a small amount of expertise.

 

I don't know how you can understand that.

 

Yes, and that's intended. How can you not understand that?

 

It.

 

Is.

 

Intended.

 

The expertise is only worth the sacrifice in pvp. It's not supposed to be a viable option for pve. Hence why it is a PVP set.

[Ternk]

Let me just point this out, since there's confusion about it.

 

The 1.1.2. bag changes have reduced the RNG element on drops DRAMATICALLY. Exactly what you guys asked for.

 

Instead of hoping to get specific item tokens, you now get (more) commendations that you can turn into an item of your choice. That is a lot more deterministic and reliable than opening bags and hoping for a token.

 

-- Georg

 

Good change. It will be nice to get the Centurion set so I can get competitive gear without having to do a crap-ton of grinding, which I don't have time to do. I was beginning to feel pushed out of PvP by my casual play schedule, but with the new changes, it sounds like things are improved for folks like me.

[---AlterEgo---]

Let me just point this out, since there's confusion about it.

 

The 1.1.2. bag changes have reduced the RNG element on drops DRAMATICALLY. Exactly what you guys asked for.

 

Instead of hoping to get specific item tokens, you now get (more) commendations that you can turn into an item of your choice. That is a lot more deterministic and reliable than opening bags and hoping for a token.

 

-- Georg

 

Have you not realized people don't want to use Centurion gear? Centurion gear is like the welfare gear that no one wants. At least the RNG, as broken as it may be, gave people HOPE for decent gear.

 

You have now replaced hope for a good gear with a welfare ticket. Not exactly a good change. I know you guys planned for Centurion to be the 1st gear set for 50 pvp but it's not viewed like that. I'm guessing because you guys called it a CHAMPION BAG, instead of Centurion Bag.

 

Stop with the randon items non-sense, make the random champion pieces that come from bags the same way battlemaster bags are handled, meaning tokens so we can buy exactly what WE want rather than getting tons of the same item over and over. Or what you could do is put a lvl requirement to the Centurion and Champ gear, that way Cent gear doesn't feel like welfare gear.

[Stongrel]

Now I can get Centurion gear much faster than before, then I can make the leap to 60 Valor and get Champion gear.

Stop pretending you pvp, because you don't. Now you can "make the leap to 60 valor"? Surely you're trolling, because nobody could be this stupid.

[Kllashaa]

The 1.1.2. bag changes have reduced the RNG element on drops DRAMATICALLY. Exactly what you guys asked for.

 

Instead of hoping to get specific item tokens, you now get (more) commendations that you can turn into an item of your choice. That is a lot more deterministic and reliable than opening bags and hoping for a token.

Hi Georg,

 

Thanks for adding some clarification to the debate. I have mixed feelings about the change. On one hand, this is positive because it removes the RNG element and makes things more predictable, which is what a lot of people wanted all along. Psychologically, I think people are more equipped to deal with work/grind as long as it's expected. On the other hand, it's probably a net negative solution because it only lengthens the time it'll take for a new 50 to bridge the gap to those who were fortunate enough to get to full champion/BM early in the game. Yes, we realize that the changes means that the divide won't be quite as large, but the divide will now last longer, which is why the responses are negative overall.

 

I understand that you can't make any significant changes to valor otherwise you'll have people who can't reequip their items, among other undesirable effects. I have a few simple suggestions I hope your team will consider.

 

Centurion Bags

1) Add a centurion bag that is openable (preferably pre-50) which awards centurion comms (and possibly a RNG for a centurion gear token). There's no point adding the 50 blue PvP set back in if centurion gear is the new starter set.

 

Champion Bags

2) Adjust the champion bag to reward a small but reasonable amount of champion comms, with a chance of a champion token. I don't understand why a champion bag awards centurion comms. It's logically inconsistent and confusing for players, especially because there are no in-game tutorials explaining these systems. Centurion gear should have nothing to do with champion bags.

2a) Add a valor requirement of 50 (or 40) to open champion bags.

 

Battlemaster Bags

3) BM Bags: Increase the amount of champion comms with BM bags, as well as a chance at a BM token.

3a) Tbh, I would prefer scrapping champion comms in BM bags. It would be better to have a BM comm/token system consistent with (1) and (2).

 

Other

4) Let people choose between centurion, champion, or battlemaster bags upon completion of dailys and weeklys.

4a) Consider doubling the amount of centurion bags for completing dailys/weeklys since it's tougher (eg, takes longer) for fresh 50s to complete the objectives than geared 50s.

5) It'd be nice to have a lv30 PvP set for people who want to level through warzones. I've met many of these people on my server.

 

The genie's out of the bottle and there are a lot of people with lots of champion gear now. I think people would feel better if they saw a solution that accomplishes the following two goals:

- Make it easier for a fresh 50 to get into a rating 126 + 400 expertise set (possibly available upon hitting 50, which would encourage 10-49 wz participation)

- Make the champion gear grind more predictable without lengthening the time it'll take to acquire the set

 

I know there are a lot of options to gear up (HM FPs, heroics), but let's be realistic. Ilum is not fun for anyone, so warzones are the only entertaining timesink available. The goal should be to lessen the cold water shock of getting into 50 warzones, and make the progression into champion and BM gear more predictable (without making it seem like you guys have just doubled or tripled the grind length).

 

TL;DR

Commendations and tokens should be consistent with the name of the bag, and champion and BM gear should probably have valor requirements. Since you can't put a valor requirement on champion gear, the bags are the next best choice. We need a centurion bag, not nerfed champion bags.

Edited February 2, 2012 by Kllashaa