Just dinged 50. Gear... um... wow.

[drkieros]

Please stop talking.

 

He's right you know. When I solo queue I get some groups that are full of pvp gear people like me, some that are mixed, and some where I'm the only one with expertise. Same goes for the opposite team. It tends to be less spread out when I am facing Republic on my server just because of the population ratio. Our pubs had instant queue times for a couple of weeks, and all the hardcore pvpers are in full champ/battlemaster gear.

[Sogar]

To be honest, I was able to be competitive as soon as I got 50 and was already one of the top of my side for medals/protection and even damage sometimes. There are two reasons for that :

1/ Tanks don't need gear to get medals (the tank ones and the damage ones are easy to get ... granted the 2.5k hit was a bit harder)

2/ Tanks survivability depends more on correct use of their CDs than their gear ... and that is still true for most of the classes with positioning being an obvious factor too.

 

That does not mean that gear is irrevelant and has no impact since it clearly has (on your damage/healing output mainly and your survivability a bit less) but you still bring about the same utility.

Playing together with your team and not getting cocky has incredible results.

Even if my build let me handle most of my ennemies 1v1 (even as I'm undergeared) I'd rather not because I've learned to understand that I've better things to do to help my team win.

 

Basically, most DPS/bursters class need gear to be good so just change your spec to be less gear dependant and have utility to bring on the table. Numbers aren't the sole thing that you can bring and that is mostly where you are gimped.

[ViperI]

/facepalm

 

I don't expect to *** roll face when I ding 50, I expect to have fun. Right now, it isn't fun, at all.

 

PvP from 10-49 was awesome. PvP at 50 is tedious, boring and broken. From 10-49, they had a wonderful mechanic for Warzone, you could get your gear by either PvE or PvP and mod them whoever you want too, jump in warzone and just have some good old PvP Fun.

 

Right now, you hit 50 and BAM! a completely different game, different mechanic and quite honestly it's *********** retarded.

 

The mechanics of the warzones are no different than pre-50. The difference is really that you got used to being at the top of the ladder when you were in the late 40's to now you're at the bottom of the new ladder as an undergeared 50. You act as if sub-50 warzones are so wonderful, well, maybe they are for a level 49 but they're just as tedious for a level 10 as you are finding them to be now that you're 50. Remember, you all asked for this when you whined about not having a level 50 bracket. You made you bed, now lie in it.

[WookieBob]

I recently made it to the evil 50's only bracket and did alright

 

main thing on my server is that the one's in the 50's bracket are the one's with more experiance in warzones, they focus fire, they heal, they guard, they work together and the better ones entered the 50's bracket with close to 49 valor.

 

saw a guy with valor 10 enter .... he didn't do so well

seen level 45's with valor 3 enter 10-49..guess what they didn't do so well either...

[RealAeiouy]

The problem with that is the Level 10 can go level in PvE if he doesn't like it. Is there a PvE route to Battlemaster?

 

If you don't like pvp endgame don't pvp. People keep acting like everyone on the other side is always a battle master. That is the foundation of most of these complaints which is absurd.

 

Warzones are a team sport, learn to be a team player.

[sfryman]

A lot of MMOs struggle with balancing gear. The going strat for MMOs on keeping subs depends on having a "carrot" to keep those players who play the game for virtual gear to keep playing. I personally think it's stupid, and I'd rather play on a level field, but I appear to be in the minority on this.

 

Swtor seems to have a worse than average gear discrepancy out the gate. A new 50 gets easily stomped by champion geared players. The devs likely know this by now, but it's too late to do anything about it, at least until the next major content patch. That's at least how wow dealed with it, every patch increases 5-10 levels, and gear gets reset. And he cycle repeats...

[RealAeiouy]

in wow you know how long it's gonna take to accumulate the amount of points you need for the piece you want. it's all out in the open.

 

here it is a lottery from the first piece to the last with no forward planning possible apart from 1000/1000 while leveling.

 

Lol advanced planning

[Blackpool]

MMO Capitalism, you get what you put in.

 

I leveled my toon via Warzones, so I had high valor when hitting 50. I leveled quick and I hold a great full time job and extra-curricular activities.

 

So why does someone who casually leveled up, and didn't pvp as much as me, expect to be as geared or as competitive out of the box as me? I made game-life choices to be in this position and so can any player.

 

You have to work for what you want.

[RealAeiouy]

That's nonsense. Gearing up in WoW does not takes weeks. As I and others have already pointed out, you can pretty much gear up in an AV weekend.

 

You can gear up running PVE heroics (convert justice points to honor, valor to conquest)

by running PVE Raids

by running regular BG's

by running Arena's

by running ranked BG's

by running Tol Barad bosses

by crafting or buying crafted loot

 

The options to gear up for PVP in WoW runs circles around ToR.

 

THERE IS NO COMPARISON

 

 

You can't gear up in a weekend that is silly. For the typical player it takes as long in wow as here

[BDutch]

The mechanics of the warzones are no different than pre-50. The difference is really that you got used to being at the top of the ladder when you were in the late 40's to now you're at the bottom of the new ladder as an undergeared 50. You act as if sub-50 warzones are so wonderful, well, maybe they are for a level 49 but they're just as tedious for a level 10 as you are finding them to be now that you're 50. Remember, you all asked for this when you whined about not having a level 50 bracket. You made you bed, now lie in it.

 

The only time I see someone mentioning about how imba 10-49 is is when someone that likes the 50 bracket is trying to use it as an example. If the people actually in that bracket agreed then you would see more posts about that, and less about this. The only complaints to address regarding the lower bracket are from the people not wanting to leave it.

 

It could have something to do with the bolstering system, lack of expertise, a soft cap on gear inflation, or the ability to simply do solo PvE if you want to power up before you try again. Whatever the reason is, let the level 10s complain for themselves. *crickets*

[ColdLogic]

Yep, think of yourself as a level 10 entering the 10-49 bracket.

 

Level 10's can own 49's if they are skilled actually.

Edited January 31, 2012 by ColdLogic

[Belbullab]

nothing wrong with current system. just cry babies on forum.

[Sogar]

The only time I see someone mentioning about how imba 10-49 is is when someone that likes the 50 bracket is trying to use it as an example. If the people actually in that bracket agreed then you would see more posts about that, and less about this. The only complaints to address regarding the lower bracket are from the people not wanting to leave it.

 

It could have something to do with the bolstering system, lack of expertise, a soft cap on gear inflation, or the ability to simply do solo PvE if you want to power up before you try again. Whatever the reason is, let the level 10s complain for themselves. *crickets*

 

 

Ok how about I'm having more fun doing PvP and feel less gimped on my toon who is level 50 since last week than my alt who is level 21?

 

It's not about gear or stats really but having access to those core skills or just utility. It gets a ton better when you are in the 30s but pre-30 you are gimped simply because you have access to only half of your skills and for some builds not even the core ones.

 

That being said, the problem is quite identical. Some specs need gear more than others to be effective ... some need levels more than others.

[DrekorSilverfang]

This thread is disturbing.

 

I can't fathom why anyone would think gear progression has a place in PvP. Too many PvE'ers that think everything has to have progression and you can't just PvP for the sake of being the most skilled.

 

PvP games with gear progression are widely considered as frustrating and uncompetitive. Forums are cluttered with endlessly whining and complaining back and forth

 

PvP games without any gear progression has people making a living from them and hundreds of thousands of people watching them play at major international tournaments. Forums are often cluttered with discussions of strategy and tactics.

 

Wonder which one provides a better experience for the player.

[Jestunhi]

This thread is disturbing.

 

I can't fathom why anyone would think gear progression has a place in PvP. Too many PvE'ers that think everything has to have progression and you can't just PvP for the sake of being the most skilled.

I can't fathom how anyone would get an MMORPG and expect the pvp to be pure skill / twitch by default.

 

PvP games with gear progression are widely considered as frustrating and uncompetitive. Forums are cluttered with endlessly whining and complaining back and forth

It's not a pvp game and has never been advertised as such.

 

PvP games without any gear progression has people making a living from them and hundreds of thousands of people watching them play at major international tournaments. Forums are often cluttered with discussions of strategy and tactics.

Again, not a pvp game. And believe me, people have made a living out of gear progression games too.

 

Wonder which one provides a better experience for the player.

 

Depends on the player and what he expects out of the game.

Edited January 31, 2012 by Jestunhi

[MorbidAri]

So lemme get this straight. I was lvling up. Playing both PvE and PvP. I was doing pretty well in PVP. Def holding my own. Dinged 50 and went into a WZ. SLAM! BLAM! BLAST! POW! DEAD! DEAD! DEAD! AAAAAAAAHHHHHHH!

 

So.

 

I'm just supposed to get crushed for a while until I slowly gear up over a couple hundred games?

 

Really?

 

I'll make a less than wild assumption and guess that you haven't played an MMO since EQ. Time have changed! I know you feel self-entitled to be able to face roll anyone with the first few seconds as a 50, but it's simply not like that. Let me put it into context.

 

You think that you should have everything all at once. Others have spent time to accomplish what they have. Yes you SHOULD be destroyed every single WZ. Why? Because they have earned it, and when you keep fighting for it an EARN it, you will realize that everything handed to you because you feel entitled to everything NOW is actually very unsatisfying.

 

Enjoy the gearing process. You will learn many good WF strats. Also keep of the forums with your self-entitled crying.

[slonep]

I'll make a less than wild assumption and guess that you haven't played an MMO since EQ. Time have changed! I know you feel self-entitled to be able to face roll anyone with the first few seconds as a 50, but it's simply not like that. Let me put it into context.

 

You think that you should have everything all at once. Others have spent time to accomplish what they have. Yes you SHOULD be destroyed every single WZ. Why? Because they have earned it, and when you keep fighting for it an EARN it, you will realize that everything handed to you because you feel entitled to everything NOW is actually very unsatisfying.

 

Enjoy the gearing process. You will learn many good WF strats. Also keep of the forums with your self-entitled crying.

 

Wow dude... You really assume a lot here.

 

I haven't played an MMO since Guild Wars actually.

 

I don't feel self entitled at all.

 

I don't think I should have everything all at once.

 

I was simpply wondering if there was something i was missing or if this was the experience that most people were having. It seemed odd to me.

 

You should calm down a little. Calm body dude. I'm grinding like everyone else. It's kewl.

[GRINnBARRETT]

Basically yes, working as intended. Evidently it would be unfair to let leveling players stack champion bags so they could start the 50s bracket with some gear.

[astrocanis]

How This Works in WoW:

 

Get the crafted blues with resilience and muddle through. You can start picking up epics after a few matches. If you need pants, buy pants. If you need bracers, buy bracers. Pick what is going to be an upgrade for you and plan accordingly.

 

How this Works in Rift:

 

Enjoy pvp in the various brackets as you level up as a supplement to your leveling. Hit 50 with almost none of the pvp stat on your gear. You've been earning the pvp currency this whole time and probably have enough points to buy a few pieces of gear EXCEPT ... the minimum pvp rank for the base gear set is 2, and you can't rank up until you hit 50. So, enjoy a few hundred games of getting 2 shot while listening to Rank 6 ******es yell at you for queuing in the first place, as if there were any other way to hit Rank 2 and buy the stuff.

 

Of course, once you hit rank 2 you probably have enough currency to buy most of the set and can immediately start being competitive. Also, the difference in the pvp stat between rank 2 gear and rank 6 is slight. A rank 6 geared person is going to have a small edge over a rank 2, but a skilled 2 will usually explode a nub 6.

 

How this seems to work in SWTOR:

 

10-49: hey this is fun! I could really get into this. I seem to make a real difference to my team!

 

50: Wheeeeee BOOM respawwwwwwwwn!

 

50 hours later: Sweet a bag! F**K! Wheeeeeeeee BOOOM reeeeeespaaawn!

 

Not completely accurate re: Rift, but close. Rank 2 takes about 3 wf to hit. They are also removing the level 1-2 gear and giving the R3 gear cheaply for relatively new 50s.

 

And R8 is the max - they are tough to kill and if they notice you, you're squashed like a bug. I have an R8 and a couple of R4/R5 characters there. Once you get R4 gear, you feel a little better, but R2 is just miserable.

 

PvP in Rift suffers from the 10-49 JOY JOY JOY to the 50 squashed like a bug syndrome. A new 50 feels like a level 30 against level 50s. A single well-geared warrior (VK) can down an entire team of R2s and end up at between 2/3 and full health.

[Daedricshots]

This thread is disturbing.

 

I can't fathom why anyone would think gear progression has a place in PvP. Too many PvE'ers that think everything has to have progression and you can't just PvP for the sake of being the most skilled.

 

PvP games with gear progression are widely considered as frustrating and uncompetitive. Forums are cluttered with endlessly whining and complaining back and forth

 

PvP games without any gear progression has people making a living from them and hundreds of thousands of people watching them play at major international tournaments. Forums are often cluttered with discussions of strategy and tactics.

 

Wonder which one provides a better experience for the player.

 

PvP gear progression isnt in the form of RNG champion bags.

[astrocanis]

PvP gear progression isnt in the form of RNG champion bags.

 

There is also the <potential> matter of degree of gear inflation. Progression doesn't have to mean log scale with gear. There's no reason not to make gear inflate by smaller amounts.

 

I remember in WoW when we first started into MC, rogues would go ape over a piece of gear with 10 more stamina and 12 more dex.

 

Now a level 85 is equipped in level 400+ gear. Ridonculous.

[MorbidAri]

Wow dude... You really assume a lot here.

 

I haven't played an MMO since Guild Wars actually.

 

I don't feel self entitled at all.

 

I don't think I should have everything all at once.

 

I was simpply wondering if there was something i was missing or if this was the experience that most people were having. It seemed odd to me.

 

You should calm down a little. Calm body dude. I'm grinding like everyone else. It's kewl.

 

Funny how you come to the forums and cry, and I need to calm down? Interesting.

 

Anyways I told you to enjoy it and stop whining about being entitled and that somehow makes me the person freaking out. Perhaps all those years of talking to people outside the internet has spoiled me.

 

Regardless, I was right about you being new to modern MMOs. Go to Ilum and do dailies and do WF dailies. You'll be full epics in 2 weeks if you're lucky.

 

Less time crying on the forums = more time pwning in pvp. Try it out.

[Ryotknife]

And hope youre not republic, it takes them twice as long to get gear.

 

replubic gears faster as there are fewer of them on average. meaning that there are a higher concentration of people who exploited to get gear on the repub side than imp side. most of the republic on my server are fully geared (non premade) whereas most of the imperials in a WZ are blues/greens

[Ryotknife]

Funny how you come to the forums and cry, and I need to calm down? Interesting.

 

Anyways I told you to enjoy it and stop whining about being entitled and that somehow makes me the person freaking out. Perhaps all those years of talking to people outside the internet has spoiled me.

 

Regardless, I was right about you being new to modern MMOs. Go to Ilum and do dailies and do WF dailies. You'll be full epics in 2 weeks if you're lucky.

 

Less time crying on the forums = more time pwning in pvp. Try it out.

 

ive been pvping for a solid week and ive gotten one piece of gear....

 

if this was wow i would have half a set of pvp gear by now, at least.

Edited January 31, 2012 by Ryotknife

[MorbidAri]

ive been pvping for a solid week and ive gotten one piece of gear....

 

if this was wow i would have half a set of pvp gear by now, at least.

 

Spend Cent comms and pvp moar.