Gunslingers... is there a way to dps without covering?

[gixxgp]

Hello.

I'm levelling a Gunslinger right now, but I'm not a big fan of the actual cover mechanic, and I'd like a more fluid and movement oriented gameplay. Is there one of the 3 skill trees suitable for not using cover?

Thanks.

[Gridfire]

Gunslingers are the Cover class. Scoundrels don't use cover much, and I believe Dirty Fighting for Gunslingers doesn't use it as much as the other trees, but I'm afraid the Cover mechanic is central to a Gunslinger. If you really don't like it your best option is to pick another class.

 

I have seen many Gunslingers say that by altering their keybinds - changing F to "cover-in-place" from "roll to nearest cover" - makes the mechanic less hateful.

[SilentKitty]

Wait a min... you can do that? It is possible to choose just to cover in the spot even if there is some place you can roll to? How did I miss that, it sounds great!

 

There has been a couple of times when I didn't look where my IA or smuggler would end up before I rolled, ended up rolling into a new group of mobs, life quickly get's interesting then =)

[Gridfire]

Yeah, I think Shift-F does that by default. You just kneel wherever you are standing. You won't get proper cover as if you were behind something, but you will be able to use all the abilities that require cover.

[hadoken]

Dirty Fighting doesn't require cover at all.

[KryloKillian]

Wait a min... you can do that? It is possible to choose just to cover in the spot even if there is some place you can roll to? How did I miss that, it sounds great!

 

There has been a couple of times when I didn't look where my IA or smuggler would end up before I rolled, ended up rolling into a new group of mobs, life quickly get's interesting then =)

 

Not only that, but if you kneel behind cover (even sometimes cover that won't have the green man pop up by it) you still get full natural cover benefits. You can tell because a green shield pops up over any enemies you're getting natural cover benefits against.

 

So yeah, I'd remap it to F and rolling to cover to Shift-F, as the normal ducking is generally much more useful once you realize that. Unless you're trying to kite someone, in which case the "WARP SPEED ROLL" can be useful.

[vierton]

I agree that some of the auto-cover places are poorly possitioned, but I have actually found if useful alot. It is great for that quick repossitioning. Another option you have as well is to find a hard cover item (rock, box, etc) that YOU want to use as cover and kneel behind it before you select a target. If you do not have a target selected, then you automatically cover where you are standing and do not roll anywhere.

[joshbyrd]

Also, if you cover before targeting, you will cover on the spot, rather than roll to another area

[Avianpixie]

Without cover?

 

Dirty Fighting.

[hadoken]

Also, if you cover before targeting, you will cover on the spot, rather than roll to another area

 

You can accomplish this by using your "Take Cover In Place" key (shift F by default).

[Awakelol]

Dirty Fighting doesn't require cover at all.

 

This is not true at all.

 

Speed Shot

Aimed Shot

Sab Charge

Knockback

CC immunity cd

AoE defensive shield

Force Leap immunity

 

All require cover, even as DF.

[Amonet]

This is not true at all.

 

Speed Shot

Aimed Shot

Sab Charge

Knockback

CC immunity cd

AoE defensive shield

Force Leap immunity

 

All require cover, even as DF.

 

^

This

 

@ OP anyone that tells you not to use cover, no matter what spec you are as a gunslinger is a total and complete noob. As gunslingers we rely on cover not just for dmg dealing, but for all the things the gentleman i quoted above lists as well. If you are really that much against using cover i suggest rolling another class because like it or not, you will be using cover a lot in order to be remotely effective as a gunslinger, no matter which tree you spec into.

[hadoken]

This is not true at all.

 

Speed Shot

Aimed Shot

Sab Charge

Knockback

CC immunity cd

AoE defensive shield

Force Leap immunity

 

All require cover, even as DF.

 

And absolutely none of them have anything to do with the dirty fighting tree's dps, try again.

 

Are you more effective in cover? Of course, it's a cover based class. You don't need it to do dps with the skills that Dirty Fighting gives and modifies in the tree, however.

Edited January 28, 2012 by hadoken

[Awakelol]

And absolutely none of them have anything to do with the dirty fighting tree's dps, try again.

 

Are you more effective in cover? Of course, it's a cover based class. You don't need it to do dps with the skills that Dirty Fighting gives and modifies in the tree, however.

 

If you don't use Sab charge or speed shot as DF, then you are doing it wrong.

 

The other abilities are a given. I don't see why you wouldn't use them.

 

I didn't even mention the fact that if you don't use cover you have the potential to be interrupted, particularly wounding shots. For that reason alone you should be in cover as much as possible to be immune to interrupts.

 

If you are standing still and are not using cover, then you are playing incorrectly even as DF.

 

No Gunslinger spec or build does NOT use cover.

Edited January 28, 2012 by Awakelol

[dougan]

Wait a min... you can do that? It is possible to choose just to cover in the spot even if there is some place you can roll to? How did I miss that, it sounds great!

 

There has been a couple of times when I didn't look where my IA or smuggler would end up before I rolled, ended up rolling into a new group of mobs, life quickly get's interesting then =)

 

This is something that a lot of GSs don't know about--and it helps huge.

 

Also, in your General tab, "Crouch" will also sit you down into cover wherever you are.

[DocterMadmac]

a good hybred build between sb and dirty fighting allows you alot of movemnt only have two abiltys that require cover.

 

all my dots and bombs dont require cover.. cover is very useful..and you have abiltys that help your freinds or guild.. but there are raid and hm boss that need you to move alot do to aoe etc.

 

But yes to your question there are specs out there that dont req much cover any anyoine that says your a noob or have no idea what your talking about my full rataka gear says otherwise.

Edited January 29, 2012 by DocterMadmac

[Arehonn]

If you don't use Sab charge or speed shot as DF, then you are doing it wrong.

 

The other abilities are a given. I don't see why you wouldn't use them.

 

I didn't even mention the fact that if you don't use cover you have the potential to be interrupted, particularly wounding shots. For that reason alone you should be in cover as much as possible to be immune to interrupts.

 

If you are standing still and are not using cover, then you are playing incorrectly even as DF.

 

No Gunslinger spec or build does NOT use cover.

 

I respeced back into DF. My first run, I loved it, but I missed Sharpshooter. With my second time around, I think I'm going to stay DF.

 

I don't use Sab charge because of the high energy cost and the already energy-intensive spec that DF can be and I still manage to pump out DPS just fine.

[Alistain]

If you don't use Sab charge or speed shot as DF, then you are doing it wrong.

 

The other abilities are a given. I don't see why you wouldn't use them.

 

I didn't even mention the fact that if you don't use cover you have the potential to be interrupted, particularly wounding shots. For that reason alone you should be in cover as much as possible to be immune to interrupts.

 

If you are standing still and are not using cover, then you are playing incorrectly even as DF.

 

No Gunslinger spec or build does NOT use cover.

 

I disagree wholeheartedly. As a DF Gunslinger I will duck in-and-out of cover when I need to use Speed Shot but that is the ONLY ability I utilize that requires cover. Using Sab charge after throwing Flourish Shot, Vital Shot, and a Shrap Bomb is much too energy intensive; especially if you Wounding Shots after.

 

Not to mention, Sab Charge, Charged Shot, and Aimed Shot have ABSOLUTELY NO synergy with the Dirty Fighting tree. DF creates synergy with Wounding Shots, Vital Shot, Shrap Bomb, Quick Shot, Hemo Shot, and Speed Shot. Everything else is horribly unnecessary and a waste of energy unless you're sitting on a pool (Which indicates you're doing it wrong as you would so kindly say )

 

It doesn't take much thought or play time to understand this concept.

[Awakelol]

I disagree wholeheartedly. As a DF Gunslinger I will duck in-and-out of cover when I need to use Speed Shot but that is the ONLY ability I utilize that requires cover. Using Sab charge after throwing Flourish Shot, Vital Shot, and a Shrap Bomb is much too energy intensive; especially if you Wounding Shots after.

 

Not to mention, Sab Charge, Charged Shot, and Aimed Shot have ABSOLUTELY NO synergy with the Dirty Fighting tree. DF creates synergy with Wounding Shots, Vital Shot, Shrap Bomb, Quick Shot, Hemo Shot, and Speed Shot. Everything else is horribly unnecessary and a waste of energy unless you're sitting on a pool (Which indicates you're doing it wrong as you would so kindly say )

 

It doesn't take much thought or play time to understand this concept.

 

Every DF build should be picking up Independent Anarchy from the 2nd tier in the Saboteur tree. This increases the dmg of Sab Charge and your Shrap Bomb by 15%, as well as all of your other AoE abilities.

 

If you are dps'ing as DF, Sab charge is your priority number 1 energy dump filler when you have DoTs on target and wounding shots is on cd. Yes, even before speed shot. It does better damage per energy and is instant, unlike the channeled cast of speed shot.

If you find yourself too energy starved to use Sab charge ever as part of your rotation, then you are either doing your rotation incorrectly, or don't have enough crit to get enough energy return from the Fighting Spirit talent and shouldn't be specced DF yet to begin with.

 

Also, Quick Shot should not be a part of your normal rotation. In fact it should hardly be used ever, with any tree. It's possibly gunslingers worst dmg per energy ability across the board. I recommend you stop using it immediately.

 

The point of all this comes down to yes, Dirty Fighting is cover reliant. Just not near as much as Sharpshooter. By not utilizing cover as DF you are gimping yourself in almost every possible way imaginable.

Edited January 30, 2012 by Awakelol

[Grimgrey]

You can change the hotkeys for Crouch (cover in place) and Take Cover (dive to whatever spot is indicated) in the Preferences-> Controls -> Key Bindings menu. I swapped them so F crouches and shift-F dives to cover.

 

It makes the cover mechanic far, far less irritating.

[Arehonn]

Every DF build should be picking up Independent Anarchy from the 2nd tier in the Saboteur tree. This increases the dmg of Sab Charge and your Shrap Bomb by 15%, as well as all of your other AoE abilities.

 

If you are dps'ing as DF, Sab charge is your priority number 1 energy dump filler when you have DoTs on target and wounding shots is on cd. Yes, even before speed shot. It does better damage per energy and is instant, unlike the channeled cast of speed shot.

If you find yourself too energy starved to use Sab charge ever as part of your rotation, then you are either doing your rotation incorrectly, or don't have enough crit to get enough energy return from the Fighting Spirit talent and shouldn't be specced DF yet to begin with.

 

Also, Quick Shot should not be a part of your normal rotation. In fact it should hardly be used ever, with any tree. It's possibly gunslingers worst dmg per energy ability across the board. I recommend you stop using it immediately.

 

The point of all this comes down to yes, Dirty Fighting is cover reliant. Just not near as much as Sharpshooter. By not utilizing cover as DF you are gimping yourself in almost every possible way imaginable.

 

What is your crit ratiing/surge rating at normally?

[Neidzwiedz]

You can change the hotkeys for Crouch (cover in place) and Take Cover (dive to whatever spot is indicated) in the Preferences-> Controls -> Key Bindings menu. I swapped them so F crouches and shift-F dives to cover.

 

It makes the cover mechanic far, far less irritating.

 

Just be aware that by not rolling to the little green man you are losing almost all of cover's defensive ulility. Also they have fixed the Aimed Shot bug, I haven't had any issues since 1.1.

[KryloKillian]

Just be aware that by not rolling to the little green man you are losing almost all of cover's defensive ulility. Also they have fixed the Aimed Shot bug, I haven't had any issues since 1.1.

 

Not really. You can crouch behind natural cover to get it, or even just have natural cover anywhere between you and your enemy. As a result it's sometimes easier to get natural cover bonuses by NOT rolling.

 

A green shield appears above an enemy if you're getting natural cover bonus.

Edited January 30, 2012 by KryloKillian

[Elyons]

Wait a min... you can do that? It is possible to choose just to cover in the spot even if there is some place you can roll to? How did I miss that, it sounds great!

 

There has been a couple of times when I didn't look where my IA or smuggler would end up before I rolled, ended up rolling into a new group of mobs, life quickly get's interesting then =)

 

 

Look in your ability tree and click the skill that says crouch, should have a small green man hiding behind a cover screen

Edited January 30, 2012 by Elyons

[Awakelol]

What is your crit ratiing/surge rating at normally?

 

I'm siting at about 35% crit and 67% surge unbuffed. With raid buffs and stims I'm slightly over 40% crit. With Black Market Mods talents my DoTs have about a 53% chance to crit each tick, so the energy regen from fighting spirit is pretty good. Even better during AoE.

 

You could probably get much higher, but most of the PvE gear comes with loads of accuracy, which is needed for raiding. I'm in practically full Rakata gear though.