Why doesn't swtor utilize the entire planet???????

[Shingara]

Lets look at the fundamentals for a second shall we. The areas we can explore at the moment are simply a leveling curve wrapped around the story with small side areas for boss's and lore directions as to why we are there.

 

As such the layout works out ok with the timeline and the president of what we are doing at this moment in time within the game. We are in a cold war, and thats the best way i can state it. we arnt in open war and on the face of it we are hi hello over there what a nice day but really what we are doing is going, what are they doing there im going to plant a hammer into your face the 1st chance i get.

 

So having bases quite close to each other arnt really beyond the realms of imagination, logisitcal strong points whilst the war isnt in full scope will be held by both sides incase open war does come into effect meaning that both sides have a equal advantage if things do kick off.

 

The way the maps are set up means that things can be added to them be it more zones, mobs or world boss areas. The edge of the maps nor the levels of the map indicate in any way that this is the end of the said planet and is more we cant get to there because its just to dangerous.

 

There is nothing to say that in the future for lets say nar shadda for example that another zone couldnt be tacked onto it via a new area with a taxi point or a new area accessed via lifts.

 

Onto this principle when looking upon the galaxy map there are alot more zones within the galaxy map then there are planets and areas to travel too. What this means is that within the known galaxy there is space for maybe 30 more planets, moons and satalite stations before the galaxy map we have now to become too cluttered, and i say that as 15 of those per side.

 

When you look onto this aspect too there is also the fact that in there is the unknown regions which we have in the lore already been explored. So the scope of what the can expand is only limited by time itself and what bioware are willing to develope within the scope of the game areas.

Edited February 24, 2012 by Shingara

[eklipzze]

Of course not, but at least make the planets feel like they're the size of more than one city. Take a look at Skyrim - there are varied landscapes and all sorts of places to go and that's just one small continent in the grand scheme of the entire planet. It makes the world feel like a planet, rather than just one city that you have to take a spaceship to get to.

 

Skyrim is one world. Its not realistic to think a game with around a dozen worlds can have the size or variety that you see in games like Skyrim.

 

SWG has multiple small cities on each planet but the entire planet looked pretty much the same. You didn't really find different types of terrain or anything like that.

[Kindara]

I work with real time systems for simulation training and we have to simulate the earth...if you think SWTOR runs kinda slow on your machine now imagine if it had to handle all that data for an entire planet. Planets aren't tiny and to do a full planet is ridiculous. It'd be cool for sure if they keep adding on more areas to each planet and I'm betting they will but to ask they simulate an entire planet you can circle aroudn on? Come on ...

 

Its just wasteful on resources to simulate each planet completely especially if most of it will likely NOT have any content in it.

Edited February 24, 2012 by Kindara

[Kaonis]

Ya, while I was leveling there was something off about the worlds that I just couldn't quite put my finger on. But I think it's kind of like how the OP said.

 

Then again most worlds don't feel like worlds, they feel like environments meant for me to murder stuff gratuitously in to level up because there are enemies crammed together everywhere who stand in place waiting to be murdered. Alderaan and Tatooine are about the only ones that are large enough that they feel like a planet and not just another little tiny area crammed with quests/mobs.

 

Then again Bioware really sucks at their NPC/mob placement, it's sad that on some of the maps I've already memorized where half the mobs are as I travel an area because they just stand there forever waiting to get killed. And NPC's in "towns" stay still and just seem out of place.

 

While the environments look amazing in their videos, actually playing them is sadly disappointing.

[Azzras]

I work with real time systems for simulation training and we have to simulate the earth...if you think SWTOR runs kinda slow on your machine now imagine if it had to handle all that data for an entire planet. Planets aren't tiny and to do a full planet is ridiculous. It'd be cool for sure if they keep adding on more areas to each planet and I'm betting they will but to ask they simulate an entire planet you can circle aroudn on? Come on ...

 

Its just wasteful on resources to simulate each planet completely especially if most of it will likely NOT have any content in it.

 

I'm personally not expecting a full planet sim, but I do see room for adding new areas to some of the planets...ie Coruscant.

 

Also, add new areas to existing planets that vary in level.

ie. Add a level 45-49 area to Coruscant. Add a level 30-35 area to another planet.

This would allow players to choose where to go when leveling.

The obstacle would be class quests and how to encompass them.

[Tamanous]

Short answer:

 

 

They will.

 

 

6 pages of pointless conjecture when we already see evidence of it. Low and high level areas on Coruscant already exist. Tatooine is known for it's epic areas where Krayt dragons exist so expect high level areas in the future. List goes on and on.

 

The areas would likely be based around a second space port or shuttle landing spot and would take a great deal of time to make. The areas we see now are nothing more than a small portion already. I have no clue as to why the OP would want to chop those areas up even smaller.

 

Content patches, expansions and level cap raises will bring us back to existing planets. Devs have even mentioned this in the past. People ASSUME one thing despite it going against logical direction.

Edited February 24, 2012 by Tamanous

[LizardSF]

 

Then again most worlds don't feel like worlds, they feel like environments meant for me to murder stuff gratuitously in to level up because there are enemies crammed together everywhere who stand in place waiting to be murdered.

 

They ARE.

 

That is their PURPOSE.

 

That is WHY THEY EXIST.

 

MMOs are about moving from one murderzone to another, with the reward being different colored trees and differently shaped and named victims. Also, you get to play dress-up with your character and earn the right to wear new kinds of colored and textured outfits, and also to have an ever-growing list of particle effects you can use in order to commit pixelated genocide. While committing acts of violence, you can talk to countless invisible people who natter at you incessantly, thus making playing an MMORPG pretty much indistinguishable from having advanced paranoid schizophrenia.

 

If you don't find that enjoyable, this genre of game (note I said "this GENRE", not "this GAME") is not for you.

 

I do find it enjoyable. Bring on the particle effects! I've got new zones to murder in!

 

It's no more pointless than any other leisure activity, like bowling. ("Knock down pins! Pins come back up! Knock down pins again!")

[talligan]

The planets in Star Wars movies/novels have always been small. Struggles for entire planets take place in very small areas.

 

Nar Shadaa sucked pretty hard, as did Coruscant, but expecting designers to build really, really big leveling zones for you to fly through? That's expecting waaaayy too much

[LizardSF]

Here's the thing.

 

Which adds more gameplay?

 

A new sub-zone in an existing zone, which offers new content at higher (or even lower) levels compared to the rest of the zone?

 

A new zone, of the same size of the former, offering the same amount of quests, story, etc, but with a different color palette and background textures? (Or, as you'd call it, a new "planet")?

 

The former is easier to produce; it allows for a lot of resuse of existing textures, models, and sound effects. However, it's also constrained creatively, as it must fit into the existing narrative, both aesthetically and canonically.

 

The latter requires the creation of new assets, but also offers more creative freedom, as it's a zone in itself, not an add-on to an existing zone.

 

It's hard to say which is "better" or "worse", because each has benefits and drawbacks, but it's very important to NOT think about things as "planets" or "cities", but as, to use a former poster's correct insight, "murderzones" and "murdersubzones".

 

So, what do you want more?

 

More murdersubzones added to the existing murderzones?

 

Or totally new murderzones?

 

THOSE ARE THE DESIGN CHOICES. There are no planets. There are no cities. There are no forests, deserts, or icefields. There are murderzones. The are murderzones that have a green texture, there are murderzones that have a yellow texture, and there are murderzones that have a whitish-blue texture.

[Asuka]

It's a theme park, you only need to go where the game tells you to go to get the job done. No point is wasting development time creating extra land area that doesn't serve a purpose.

[Saurakk]

Short answer:

 

 

They will.

 

 

6 pages of pointless conjecture when we already see evidence of it. Low and high level areas on Coruscant already exist. Tatooine is known for it's epic areas where Krayt dragons exist so expect high level areas in the future. List goes on and on.

 

The areas would likely be based around a second space port or shuttle landing spot and would take a great deal of time to make. The areas we see now are nothing more than a small portion already. I have no clue as to why the OP would want to chop those areas up even smaller.

 

Content patches, expansions and level cap raises will bring us back to existing planets. Devs have even mentioned this in the past. People ASSUME one thing despite it going against logical direction.

 

This^^

 

Plus they cannot allow you backstage yet or you would see the 2x4's holding up the plywood backgrounds of the set.

 

This is a game after all and not a world simulator. There is purpose to their areas as opposed to blind exploration of empty areas.

[SnapWolf]

For starters, making an entire planet would be too technical. Not only that, but you would have to make generic zones, and it would be too dull to play in that. If you think the story is generic enough as it is, then imagine on an entire planet!

[Saiaku]

Even if most of the planets would be wastelands, it would be nice to have the ABILITY to just travel endlessly like that on a speeder (whops we need faster speeders with room for friends)

 

And maybe some strange bosses and creatures can be placed in the no-man-lands, or some pirate base, or some other fodder mobs, just for the sake of immersion.

 

I want this

Edited February 24, 2012 by Saiaku

[Kaedian]

I hop in the driver's seat of my shiny, brand new, intergalactic spaceship. It's an exhilarating sensation, the first time one jumps into light speed, and I'm rifling through my star charts, giving orders, and preparing to visit the city-moon of Nar Shadaa.

 

As I arrive and my ship starts to convulse out of light speed, I gaze out of the front window of my cockpit to see a glowing ball of energy, light streaked speedways, and buildings bathed in the perpetual glow of neon. It's very exciting. The moon is enormous, and I can't wait to explore it's every locale.

 

Once I'm thoroughly done enjoying the art and design of this moon, my fascination wanes as quickly as the din of that first casino I couldn't play any mini games in. I can't travel anywhere else on Nar Shadaa but one very small city. In fact, I can't travel anywhere on any planet except one small part of the planet. Total bummer.

 

You see, friends, it's not that I don't like the art and the stories in each city. On the contrary, they're usually quite intriguing. It's just...well, I'm an explorer you see. It's in my blood. I like to run around and go to different places, travel from city to city, and keep my finger on the pulse of each planet I frequent.

 

In SW:ToR, one can travel and peruse the vagaries of a galaxy. Get to put on the shoes of each little planet, crawl in its skin, and wiggle around a bit. It's pretty cool. But I can't wiggle much.

 

I have a difficult time believing that my actions in one very small area of a planet or city are affecting my entire faction's influence on the entire planet. That would be like me going to Washington, DC, doing some errands in the surrounding neighborhoods, subverting a faction of congress, usurping one party of the bicameral system, and then lay claim that I have just taken over the entire United States of America (or the world for that matter) for the glory of the Empire. Yet, this is exactly what I did on Alderaan.

 

I'm just not getting it. In other games of this type, one stays on one world (for the most part), exploring the snow peaked mountains in high elevations, or trapping across the desert in the vast expanses between vales, valley, shorelines, and coastal capitals. It feels like I'm really exploring the enticing features of each planet.

 

I know this really isn't feasible in a franchise like Star Wars, since travel among planets is an integral part of the story. It would, however, be very helpful for one to be able to travel to separate parts of a planet.

 

So here is my suggestion: Allow for one to take shuttles to different areas of planets in upcoming game expansions. It's obviously too late now to change the way the zone system is set up. It would have been way more rad to take speeders to other areas of the planet, shuttles to different poles, and quick travel to bases or areas set up far away from the operating hub.

 

In some cases, the current system works and it makes sense. Especially in starting areas, but I'm just not really buying it on planets like Tatooine. The gigantic, arid, bowling ball of the galaxy. Where Tusken Raiders reign, and moisture farmers toil endlessly to make a living. The planet is so enormous, and the expanses are so extreme, I find it very hard to believe that I just traveled the entire planet in my questline. I'm not really sure how my actions in one very small area affect the planet on a macro level.

 

Additionally, I'm not sure why the Republic and Imperial bases would set up so close to one and other. Wouldn't they try and keep their respective capitals on different areas of the planet? Makes sense to me. Oh, you decided to build this massive Imperial base (unnoticed) in this small crevasse that just so happens to be next to one of the Republic's most notorious prisons? Get me that logistics guy, he's getting a promotion.

 

In sum, it would just have been nice to have the zones split up a bit more than they are now. Put some areas of the zones, ostensibly, on different parts of the planet. That way one feels as if they're really exploring the entire planet, absorbing the whole of the culture in that planet, and making more effectual change on the galaxy as a whole, instead of just very small parts of that planet.

 

When one clicks on a world map, it should show the world and the different areas of that world. Not just one large blob that we all expect to be our massive quest area, and that we assume is the entire planet.

 

Just a thought. Anyone else feel the same way when playing??

 

TL:DR = Put parts of zones on different areas of planet made accessible by speeder or shuttle travel. Bring the planet map up instead of one big map. Greater sense of exploration of world, versus just one small part of it.

 

It's a great idea in theory, however the game has a similar land mass as most other mmo's at launch, the difference here is its spread out amongst several planets which generates the insular feel. The game would have a much different feel if the number of planets were dramatically reduced for launch. Imagine if they'd had the same initial starting planets and then the republic stayed on Coruscant from 10-40, the Empire on DK from 10-40 (with the flashpoints and warzones being exceptions) and then both factions moving on to a final planet for 41-49 with co-factioned zones where both factions are pitted against each other as additional obstructions to completing the quests (with or without the pvp flavor) and the finale to take place on Ilum with both sides struggling to wrest control from each other.

 

The planets then could be developed as planets with a larger feel and your efforts being more local would seem to have a larger effect on something.

 

Just a thought.

[Qoojo]

Because the game is on rails. If you are looking for an exploration mmo, then this isn't the mmo for you.

[grandmthethird]

i have 2 points

 

1) have you been to every city on the planet you live on? (earth) i'm going to go ahead and guess you answer no. why would you go everywhere on all 20 planets in this game then?

 

2) by leaving places un-explored, the devs have room to expand on our game

Edited February 24, 2012 by grandmthethird

[BMBender]

Why doesn't swtor utilize the entire planet?

 

 

the Hero engine as currently modded in TOR would probably blow up your PC

[iceperson]

Personally there are a lot more planets I'd like to see added before they go back and add areas to the existing ones.

[MWidowmaker]

1. Because as small as they are now people still complain that it takes to long to get around them.

 

2. Because this gives them room to have expansions without creating a bunch of new planets. They can send us back to them into areas we havent been yet.

 

3. Because no matter what they did people wouldn't be happy.

 

this is 100% spot on, highlighted something that i sorta think will happen eventually, especially with planets with orbital stations...

[Vitellius]

This is a nice fantasy, but that's all it is....a fantasy....a pipe dream. The amount of development time to implement even a fraction of this would be immense. Even if you made large expanses of empty space to "explore" a la SWG, you'd still have to put SOME stuff in it to actually find or else once you've run through it, then you leave and start asking for more stuff. Thousands of hours of dev time for you to suck up in a day or two. Not practical.

 

SWG had all this stuff and it was dull as dish water (and yes, I was there before NGE, after NGE and was in late beta).

 

You have to pick your battles in game development. It's a tricky balance. More will be added to the planets we have but it will be in the form that we are already familiar with. This game can't be a "sci-fi reality simulator". There must be walls, limitations and boundaries. You can't pull out your Game of Life board game and complain it isn't real enough.

[Matte_Black]

Have you ever considered that they set aside areas for future growth and content?

[DarthKhaos]

There must be walls, limitations and boundaries. You can't pull out your Game of Life board game and complain it isn't real enough.

Shame a lot of people can't understand this. "Why do we have to run around this mountain?" BECAUSE IT'S A MOUNTAIN! They never mention that you can jump down. You just can't climb up.

 

All games must have rules, must have limitations, must have boundaries or your system will fry and players will exploit.

[JohnQPerson]

I don't think what the OP is asking for is unreasonable and you don't have to model the entire planet. Here's what you so. You keep the main quest zones/cities that you have now but like he was saying have other zones that you have to travel to that show they are on other parts of the planet. They don't have to be major cities, just outposts or small villages with some quests. There are already a lack of quests imo so this would be nice to see.

 

Even if you expanded the zones across large expanses you don't have to have fine detail everywhere. It's like living anywhere, you drive outside the town limits it gets rural, less features and more barren compared to the starting area. This would take relatively little time to model and create an expansive feel to the areas/game instead of being caged to a small zone on an entire planet.

 

I think even having large expanses between faction areas would be a bit more realistic then the example the OP mentioned. Having a Republic questing zone a long speeder ride across a large expanse from a Empire questing zone would give a better feel of realism to the world as a whole.

[LizardSF]

 

I think even having large expanses between faction areas would be a bit more realistic then the example the OP mentioned. Having a Republic questing zone a long speeder ride across a large expanse from a Empire questing zone would give a better feel of realism to the world as a whole.

 

So... what you're saying is... "I want to spend more time doing nothing, and paying for the privilege."

 

You're a very interesting type of customer, but I don't think you're in the majority.

 

As it is, despite speeders, quick travel, and fleet passes, people STILL want to have magic teleport to everywhere in the game. Do you really think Bioware would invest resources in *increasing* travel time, for the sake of the few players who want to feel they're in a larger world... ONCE? Because, let's face it, once you've driven through a few thousand virtual miles of procedural terrain once, you won't do it twice. So a tiny percentage of the player base will enjoy the content once, and the vast majority of the player base will hate not enjoy the content at all.

 

This is self-evidently not a wise use of resources.

 

The only people who are concerned, at all, about how far or near imperial bases are to rebel bases are open world PVPers, and they want to be sure there's high chances of meeting the opposing faction -- something that large, empty, worlds negate. I don't find the relative closeness of bases, in scale miles, any sillier than all the other MMO conventions we accept without thinking -- wild animals that drop credits and armor (and armored opponents who drop weapons or armor they weren't using), "villages" with a population of 5, "cities" with a population of perhaps a few dozen, "killing" the same boss over and over... and I'm not discussing SWTOR here, these are features of the entire game genre. Do you know how many acres of farmland you need to support a large city with medieval technology? Are there that many virtual acres surrounding the major cities in WoW, EQ, or Rift? No? Then why expect that kind of realism in SWTOR?

 

MMORPGs model a very stylized, very abstract, world, where game mechanics that serve the Skinner Box are the first priority, and everything else, including immersion, is secondary. Over the last 15 years, it's been shown in the marketplace that no matter how much people whine on message boards, when it comes to paying money, "immersion" is much less important to determining resubscription than gameplay. Those are the facts. Adam Smith pwns j00, n00b.

[Coiffio]

Thank you.

 

On another note, I have to ask ... which other happy meal MMO have the variety of minigames that everyone asks for? Gambling, racing, FPS, space sim and soon probably duck hunting. In time you might see most of these things, but bashing a game because it doesn't have virtual gambling or pod racing or space simulation right out of the box. It makes me wonder what expectations and delusions people around these forums have had. And before you start flaming away, yeah I would have loved a game that had a myriad of mini games in forms of racing, gambling, first person shooter and space simulation... but there's also something called reasonable expecations, practical limitations or common sense. Try to apply some logic into your thoughts and demands, think things through. You don't see me moaning about the fact that this game doesn't replace my own experience with that of my character when I'm playing...

 

Considering the mini games that existed already in the first kotor, it wasn't unreasonable to expect little diversions like pazaak or an instanced area for speeder racing. Even swg had speeders and areas where you could just zip around that weren't confined and filled with enemies who knock you off in one hit.