1.1 PVP outrage, Bioware Rewarding AFKers with Huge PVP edge

[DragoVaughn]

If Battlemaster cost you a social life, you either...

 

A) Didn't have one in the first place.

 

B) Aren't that good at PvP.

 

This game is pretty easy to get Battlemaster, I haven't even "grinded" warzones and I'm already almost 50? We have 3 people in my guild and they don't play even CLOSE to not having a social life lol...

 

Haha, you haven't seen the ridiculous grind from 50 to 60, adds on an extra 5000 valor each level.

[mrjoemama]

Nope, poor design for the release of the PvP rewards... if they knew Ilum wasn't working as intended, then it shouldn't be a hot spot of Valor and Rewards.

 

People should have also got banned that exploited to 50 and have or almost have full Battlemaster sets. It wasn't working as intended to hit 50 in 1-2 days but every server has more than a handful of these people.

 

Point is most people with take the path of least resistance and if that was trading points on a planet why is that the players fault?

[RealAeiouy]

His complaint is valid.

 

The problem is this:

 

At max level/end game a large portion of the community has one particular goal in mind. That is progressing their character through gear. This 'feature' is a rather common idea in MMORPG's. The issue is that the most efficient way to progress ones character is through PvP. There is no lock out, you can queue up for it at anytime, and you can actually do it with friends.

 

So what is the problem?

 

The problem is that come 1.1 level 50's will only be able to queue against other level 50's. Additionally quality PvP gear will be exponentially harder to receive. This creates an atmosphere that is extensively closed off to new players. A brand new level 50 player will face an astonishing uphill battle that is nearly impossible to overcome. A new level 50 will not have the luxury of easily obtainable PvP gear nor the ability to play against players that are under-leveled and under-geared.

 

Bioware has created a major issue.

 

They are by design funneling players to PvP to obtain efficient quality pieces to advance their characters. The brick wall is that new players are facing a grind that is nearly unobtainable . Trying to start out with zero expertise at level 50 against other level 50's with expertise is a losing fight.

 

Group A: Reached level 50 and received PvP gear through (apparently easier means than SWTOR Dev's intended, hence the change). Thus they are outfitted in quality PvP gear.

 

Group B: Reached level 50 and are now playing by the new harder to obtain PvP gear through the new change in SWTOR rules/vision.

 

The question I pose is this:

 

How do you expect Group B to obtain PvP gear when stacked against a group of players that have already obtained PvP gear?

 

 

This is not what happens. This is not the first level 50 gear progression game to exist.

 

Your concerns are simply not things that are going to be problems

[Dosris]

His complaint is valid.

 

The problem is this:

 

At max level/end game a large portion of the community has one particular goal in mind. That is progressing their character through gear. This 'feature' is a rather common idea in MMORPG's. The issue is that the most efficient way to progress ones character is through PvP. There is no lock out, you can queue up for it at anytime, and you can actually do it with friends.

 

So what is the problem?

 

The problem is that come 1.1 level 50's will only be able to queue against other level 50's. Additionally quality PvP gear will be exponentially harder to receive. This creates an atmosphere that is extensively closed off to new players. A brand new level 50 player will face an astonishing uphill battle that is nearly impossible to overcome. A new level 50 will not have the luxury of easily obtainable PvP gear nor the ability to play against players that are under-leveled and under-geared.

 

Bioware has created a major issue.

 

They are by design funneling players to PvP to obtain efficient quality pieces to advance their characters. The brick wall is that new players are facing a grind that is nearly unobtainable . Trying to start out with zero expertise at level 50 against other level 50's with expertise is a losing fight.

 

Group A: Reached level 50 and received PvP gear through (apparently easier means than SWTOR Dev's intended, hence the change). Thus they are outfitted in quality PvP gear.

 

Group B: Reached level 50 and are now playing by the new harder to obtain PvP gear through the new change in SWTOR rules/vision.

 

The question I pose is this:

 

How do you expect Group B to obtain PvP gear when stacked against a group of players that have already obtained PvP gear?

 

Well this is all fine and dandy and what not but if 50's didn't get their own PVP then everyone ELSE would simply QQ constantly about having to face them, so it's a matter of the Internet having a population that will never be 100% satisfied.

 

A few people dont seem to have much faith in Bioware. They've obviously done their homework on game mechanics for MMO's, they know at least mostly what they are doing despite a few out-standing whiners drowning out everyone else with their screams that "OMG THEY RUINED TEH GAMEZ CUZ I TINK MAI WAI IZ BET0rz N DEY DUN BLEEVE ME I QUIT!!111one".

 

Besides all this is the fact the game is literally barely a month old. Where were other big-time MMO's at this stage after their launch? Probably in an ACTUAL "Bad" condition, most likely. Not some make-believe one lots of people here seem to have their mind enshrouded in.

 

People need to remember, just because it's your opinion or idea doesn't make it automatically the best way to do something . . .

[Shammus]

Currently you only get the loot randomly from battlemaster bags. You can get 16 of them per week at most and if you haven't gotten the items by Tuesday, then it appears it will take you many months to get your set. People who were a couple weeks ahead (likely due to exploiting) will be pushed months ahead.

 

 

 

The BM gear will not be obsolete. Instead it will remain the best pvp gear, but it will be harder to get and give an advantage for a longer period of time. The PVP sucking due to bugs/unresponsiveness/lack of competitive focus is another issue and also contributes to my decision to unsub. However, I figured those would be improved. The change that is the topic of this thread is different. It shows a lack of competence and respect for the players, whereas the other stuff is just about releasing the game before it was done. Patches that take steps backwards are unacceptable.

 

please I know a ton of people who don't afk in warzones or exploit and have a ton of pvp gear sets, where do you get this 16 per week at most thing from? tons of people have just gotten really lucky with their drops 1 guildy I have got every piece of gear in less then a week whereas I've opened bag after bag only to get duplicate items or whatever, this isn't wrong or unfair its just the way it is, bug or not? And since bioware has fixed it so that people can actually get gear rather then rely on this crazy rng thing what's wrong with that?

 

And then I see posts about people starting at at zero expertise @ 50.. do you guys not understand how this game works, do you not realize that you can spend commendations on lower level weapons and get expertise.. remove the mods and put them in your pvp gear set?

 

the only thing that is going to take a long time to get is the set bonus, I guarantee you just using the weapons alone will get you pretty close to your 12 percent mark.. and guess what they aren't expensive to get at all.

 

What else would you spend it on especially pvping while leveling, you can only have 1k each commendation type. and they are only 330 comms, you can pick any of the weapons with 25 expertise on them, and not be caught with your pants down in pvp there is one that every class could get a benefit from.

Edited January 14, 2012 by Shammus

[darthmorbous]

Oh let me say this first before the elitists show up too.

 

If you were TRULY a SERIOUS PvP'er, you'd have it all already.

 

 

^^ true ^^

[Aedn]

I got to BM 60 this week, sadly i have no items at all for the BM bags because i cant get a drop. Out of the weeklys & dailies i have done i have 1 BM item, plus the implants & earpiece which are buyable.

 

So i feel the pain of people who were not able to reach BM prior to the change. that said the change was going to happen, because currently getting BM gear allows players to bypass the entire PVE gear grind which is long.

 

As far as costs, it remains to be seen, how much Bm gear will cost, given that there is a severe limit on Bm bags generated on a weekly basis, or if BM bags will now be buyable for warzone/merc comms, which they should be with this change.

 

Also, most of the people i know did not afk to valor rank 60, they were just the players who had far more time then anyone else, as well as rolling in pre-mades. Anyone who did not see this change coming was being shortsighted.

[Dravinian]

This is not what happens. This is not the first level 50 gear progression game to exist.

 

Your concerns are simply not things that are going to be problems

 

The thing is they are in other games.

 

In Rift for instance the uptake of New PvP players is incredibly low. Why?

 

Because a new level 50 joins a PvP "Warzone" (Warfront in that game) and faces against players like me.

 

I have full set P8 equipment, plus every enchantment, every sigil, every crystal, I have drinks and food (Read stims) and I have a build I have worked on and know works in an overpowered way.

 

Enter newbie.

 

Newbie Die without making the barest impact. Repeat ad nauseum.

 

Newbie gets bored being face rolled, stop playing, comes back later and meets someone else, in the same position as me.

 

He does this for a few days, buys all the equipment he can, realises it makes no difference at all.

 

Quits PvP.

 

Plays PvE, finishes most of it, can't commit to the really high end stuff, gets bored after awhile and leaves.

 

That is the game life of a great deal of people that play Rift because of the way it is set up.

 

That is why they brought in ranked matches.

 

Bioware had that opportunity, they didn't take it.

 

Instead of a 50 bracket, why not a 0 and a 200+ expertise bracket?

[WatermelonJack]

1.1 notes:

 

"Battlemaster Gear Tokens have been converted into Battlemaster Commendations, which can be used to purchase any Battlemaster gear. This allows players to purchase any piece of gear instead of requiring them to purchase the piece indicated by the token.

 

Battlemaster Bags now contain Battlemaster Commendations instead of Battlemaster Gear Tokens. They still also contain Champion Commendations."

 

So, those who got Battlemaster the first couple weeks by afking in warzones 24/7 should have nearly full sets due to random drops from bags. As of the next patch, legitimate new and future battlemasters will get 1 item every couple weeks by getting 6 comms per day. This assumes the commendation prices are consistent with centurion/champion gear.

 

I won't be renewing my account if this is as it appears to be. I know some others in my guild feel the same, and any serious pvper who hasn't got battlemaster yet is going to be mad when they learn of this.

 

You're mad that other people have some gear? Deal with it, nerd.

[Tharrn]

 

Instead of a 50 bracket, why not a 0 and a 200+ expertise bracket?

 

That would be new and innovative and is thus just not in. It would also make sense, and that has to be prevented at all cost as per directive 63: bad PvPers with no life must be allowed to shine by gear advantage as they have 16 hours a day to whine on the forum and male you look bad.

[Hoodlumpriest]

We have become victims of ourselves.

 

We want shiny lootz and toys

 

They give us carrots on a stick because we keep paying.

 

Jesus H

 

Why the feck can we all not go into pvp with the same statset relative to our class and just have a good old-fashioned punchup, all the loot whoring and chasing shinies is what ruins pvp games.

[Daex]

This is simply ridiculous thread. WE have asked for this change. We don't want RNG and Bioware listened. And you are complaining?

 

Aside from the AFK-ers there are people who legitimately reached Valor rank 60 and according to you they should be punished as well?

 

Removing RNG from Battlemaster is great. That's just what we all wanted. AFK-ers are completely different issue and should be dealt accordingly. Therefore, this thread is just completely pointless.

[AdmiralBlue]

1.1 it's outrageous, truly truly outrageous.

[WatermelonJack]

Just enjoy playing the game, and hey, if you manage to get some gear out of it then good on you. I don't feel like I'm "grinding" for gear as I am actually playing and enjoying the game. Gear is not the game though it is part of the game.

[Talkative]

1.1 it's outrageous, truly truly outrageous.

 

That's a Jem.

[Bainshie]

I love how OP has ignored the posts basically proving that this change makes 0 difference in how fast gear is gained, and in fact makes it faster (You no longer get duplicates)

 

http://operatorchan.org/t/arch/src/t252153_maximum_trolling_RE_I_CHALLENGE_YOU-s720x480-14211.jpg

[Desgarden]

Bioware wants this game to not feel like a grind. Yet, this will be a ridiculous grind.

 

Who are the people designing this PvP crap, seriously? First the RNG nonsense, then this. It's not that it's just a bad system. It's stupid. I would love to sit in the room and watch these guys actually say out loud, "Players will find this fun!"

 

Yeah, no. Bad.

 

Ex Mythic workers are in charge of pvp (not from the old Mythic crew who made DAoC but those who made WAR). Are you now still surprised how Ilum, 50s with expertise with non-50s and this system could happen? I am not.

 

Most of these mistakes they made are, sorry to say that, really novice mistakes which anyone with some experience in playing pvp in mmos could have pointed out to them early.

[Sytha]

I currently do not have any level 50 characters (I have been levelling 3 characters & just logging which ever one I felt like playing that day) so do not know much about the difference between the champion gear & the battlemaster gear, is there a huge difference in stats? Not blowing my own trumpet but I would consider myself an above average pvp'er, but for argument sake if I was kitted out in all champ gear & I had a 1v1 against a mirror class in battlemaster gear would it be totally one sided? Or could due to skills, rotation etc could I win comftably?

[Mr_Gallows]

LOL as a Battlemaster myself you realize that there is a 4-6 point in stat difference from champion to BM. Stop crying its not as bad as you think. I personally wanted a gear grind in the first place to make people work for it so it separates the men from the boys.

 

... Seperated the unemployed from the employed more likely, because that's what MMOs and grinding is about... time and having too much of it to spend on a game.

[Jinnz]

This is disgusting.

 

I'd consider myself just as much of a pvper as any other 'hardcore' but i have a job, I couldnt spend Christmas holidays whoring the stupidly easy to obtain shinies...

 

... and now I'm punished?

 

*********** outrageous.

[Asilem]

If Battlemaster cost you a social life, you either...

 

A) Didn't have one in the first place.

 

B) Aren't that good at PvP.

 

This game is pretty easy to get Battlemaster, I haven't even "grinded" warzones and I'm already almost 50? We have 3 people in my guild and they don't play even CLOSE to not having a social life lol...

 

50-60 much funner to grind you'll see

[fuseku]

I currently do not have any level 50 characters (I have been levelling 3 characters & just logging which ever one I felt like playing that day) so do not know much about the difference between the champion gear & the battlemaster gear, is there a huge difference in stats? Not blowing my own trumpet but I would consider myself an above average pvp'er, but for argument sake if I was kitted out in all champ gear & I had a 1v1 against a mirror class in battlemaster gear would it be totally one sided? Or could due to skills, rotation etc could I win comftably?

 

Why draw the attention to yourself on a forum so full of trolls, don't claim any skills here my friend! You already know the answer.

[Asilem]

This is simply ridiculous thread. WE have asked for this change. We don't want RNG and Bioware listened. And you are complaining?

 

Aside from the AFK-ers there are people who legitimately reached Valor rank 60 and according to you they should be punished as well?

 

Removing RNG from Battlemaster is great. That's just what we all wanted. AFK-ers are completely different issue and should be dealt accordingly. Therefore, this thread is just completely pointless.

 

You are completely pointless by not realizing what he is saying. He is not saying that unrandomizing it is a bad thing. He is saying that making it take a week to get 1 piece of gear is. Lets act like the centurion system is going to be similar to the battlemaster comms. 3 comms a bag is what you would get and a piece of armor would cost 39. That 13 bags for 1 piece of gear. You can only get 2 battlemaster bags a day so if you start out on a fresh week and do all the dailys and weeklys you will only get a piece of loot every 6 days no matter how many hours you grind. Im sure he's all for unrandomizing it he just doesnt think the way they went about it is right.

[Csdabest]

Im good skill wise in this game. But I still have alot to learn. Where do you get all these battlemaster accomendations, and Rakata Crystal and accomendations for. Been doing Flashpoints heroics. and im like 200exp from lvl 50. The only place I can think of is Illum. which seems to be a big focus for high lvls. So do you get it from there?

[Beckwin]

No different than wow teams hoarding points to get all top tier gear at the start of a new season.

 

Except you couldn't do this...