Bioware's unshaken confidence is troubling

[Makade]

Here's the deal: I want SWTOR to survive and flourish. I really like the game overall. However, there are GLARING issues with this game (I'm not going to rehash them here...no point in repeating it) and yet Bioware seems to be blissfully (blindly?) boastful of their game. I get how PR works, blah, blah (so don't attempt to give me a lesson), but I have seen ZERO humility on Bioware's part that indicates that they have heard their customers. Look at Trion. Whether you like Rift or not (I found it to be rather bland myself) that is a company working its a*s off for your $15 a month. They have approached the community with humility and open ears, and it has paid off. Meanwhile, Bioware is too busy spinning the hype machine and patting itself on the back to approach the community's concerns humbly and comprehensively.

 

Please know that I am writing this post as a fan of the game (and Bioware) and I really want the game to succeed. In my life, I have never seen an individual or entity succeed in the long term by avoiding self-reflection and constructive criticism.....ever.

[Wolfmann]

I think they should be proud of their accomplishment. They have brought a very complex product to market, have thoroughly tested it, and broken records while doing it.

 

I do not see significant "glaring" bugs that in my mind should humble them and say, "Ooops, yeah we knew this would happen, but wanted to sneak it out. " This is not Star Wars Galaxies.

 

I think you opinion comes from a good place, but really...let them pat themselves on the back and say, "We did good."

 

WOW certainly was not this refined on launch, and certain bugs are to be expected. It's software development, it's not rocket science.

[Calimwulf]

Nope, no glaring issues that I can see either. So how many posts are you going to write today saying exactly the same thing? I'm curious.

[fullfordim]

I think they should be proud of their accomplishment. They have brought a very complex product to market, have thoroughly tested it, and broken records while doing it.

 

I do not see significant "glaring" bugs that in my mind should humble them and say, "Ooops, yeah we knew this would happen, but wanted to sneak it out. " This is not Star Wars Galaxies.

 

I think you opinion comes from a good place, but really...let them pat themselves on the back and say, "We did good."

 

WOW certainly was not this refined on launch, and certain bugs are to be expected. It's software development, it's not rocket science.

 

/agree

[louisfriend]

yeah ...it's not like they didn't just launch a massive game after extensive development to generally rave reviews, with near zero issues at launch.... to large/promising playerbase.

 

 

...nothing to be confident about there.

 

 

it's also GLARINGLY obvious that the game has been out less than a month. if this is your first MMO. maybe you don't know.

 

but the first 1-6mo of a new MMO is basically... paid beta.

 

expect. odd graphics glitches. bugged/missing content. rash class imbalance and totally borked game dynamics/exploits to be found.

 

 

also... GLARINGLY obvious. that the first month or so. any patch that comes down the line. will be to fix something that they can fix. or an emergancy type issue that has to be fixed.

 

also GLARINGLY obvious. users will QQ endlessly. talk as if they know stuff. make up facts, figures, and stats. claim they're unsubbing. worst game ever. server population is abandoning ship. sky is falling et al.

 

 

...so honestly. this is all par for the course.

 

but as always. if you're not having fun. no one is forcing you to play. and if you're not having fun. probably shouldn't get overly upset about it. and just not play

[Knickerus]

There are issues, but they're not "glaring".

 

They ARE working on fixes, however. Just give it some time.

[Jimer_Lins]

You have an overly inflated sense of the relevance of your opinion, OP.

[Drakos]

I've learned long ago that this company is going to hype this game to the moon regardless of its quality or - in some cases - the relative validity of their claims. I don't think TOR is awful, and so I don't expect there to be any backlash from this overall beyond a small population being significantly more wary of any and all forms of advertisement from them in the future: myself included.

[Laeris]

Here's the deal: I want SWTOR to survive and flourish. I really like the game overall. However, there are GLARING issues with this game (I'm not going to rehash them here...no point in repeating it) and yet Bioware seems to be blissfully (blindly?) boastful of their game. I get how PR works, blah, blah (so don't attempt to give me a lesson), but I have seen ZERO humility on Bioware's part that indicates that they have heard their customers. Look at Trion. Whether you like Rift or not (I found it to be rather bland myself) that is a company working its a*s off for your $15 a month. They have approached the community with humility and open ears, and it has paid off. Meanwhile, Bioware is too busy spinning the hype machine and patting itself on the back to approach the community's concerns humbly and comprehensively.

 

Please know that I am writing this post as a fan of the game (and Bioware) and I really want the game to succeed. In my life, I have never seen an individual or entity succeed in the long term by avoiding self-reflection and constructive criticism.....ever.

 

So, you're basically saying you're willing to pay them to ignore you and you wonder why they're ignoring you?

[DarthSublimitas]

I think they should be proud of their accomplishment. They have brought a very complex product to market, have thoroughly tested it, and broken records while doing it.

 

I do not see significant "glaring" bugs that in my mind should humble them and say, "Ooops, yeah we knew this would happen, but wanted to sneak it out. " This is not Star Wars Galaxies.

 

I think you opinion comes from a good place, but really...let them pat themselves on the back and say, "We did good."

 

WOW certainly was not this refined on launch, and certain bugs are to be expected. It's software development, it's not rocket science.

 

Well duh, of course not. WoW came out in what, 2003-4 and we're in 2012 - they had better get it right seeing the advancement in technology.

[Drallbait]

LOL, they successfully launched this MMO which is pretty amazing considering the effort it takes to do that, and the fact so many people are gonna hate on it whether it good or not.

 

MMO players want perfection. It is a normal side effect of MMOs being a virtual world that in part can replace reality. People want their virtual world to feel like their internal picture of a perfect alternative reality where they are important.

 

Anyhow, they are clearly taking fixing stuff really seriously. Just read Dev Tracker.

 

Are they going to apologize to you personally that the game didn't meet your expectations? No.

[SoupyNuggs]

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=1275271#edit1275271

 

One instance of humility and listening to the community in addressing the #1 most requested issue among many found on:

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/devtracker.php

 

Biased OP is biased. Next?

[NotLuke]

They are tightening up their game man, have you even been paying attention?

 

They have released fixes for exploits and game issues, announced new patches to fix many issues being complained about and have even been trying to balance the in-game economy.

 

Are there things I want in the game? Sure, but I am in no way disappointed with their pacing at this point they are trying to cover all the bases they can and so far they are doing a respectable job imho.

 

Maybe down the road they may deserve critiscism (like if full scale pvp/space expansion isn't implemented ), but for now I myself think they are doing a heck of a job.

Edited January 13, 2012 by NotLuke

[Mannic]

Ohlen attributing virtually all performance issues to low-end systems and low metacritic scores to a vast conspiracy to take down TOR doesn't help. Stephen Reid telling a player who was concerned about the potential lack of viability of a level 50 bracket in Warzones given current population to "reroll" also comes off as smug and somewhat arrogant. Bioware's PR is designed to hype the game, but they unintentionally piss people off more than any other dev I've seen.

[TheHeadCapper]

Nope, no glaring issues that I can see either. So how many posts are you going to write today saying exactly the same thing? I'm curious.

 

A few bugs, but i'm still having more fun in this MMO then every other. It seems the OP thinks if he doesn't like something no one else is allowed to.

[Vitellius]

You can please some of the people some of the time, but you can't please all of the people all of the time.

[photometrik]

Here's the deal: I want SWTOR to survive and flourish. I really like the game overall. However, there are GLARING issues with this game (I'm not going to rehash them here...no point in repeating it) and yet Bioware seems to be blissfully (blindly?) boastful of their game. I get how PR works, blah, blah (so don't attempt to give me a lesson), but I have seen ZERO humility on Bioware's part that indicates that they have heard their customers. Look at Trion. Whether you like Rift or not (I found it to be rather bland myself) that is a company working its a*s off for your $15 a month. They have approached the community with humility and open ears, and it has paid off. Meanwhile, Bioware is too busy spinning the hype machine and patting itself on the back to approach the community's concerns humbly and comprehensively.

 

Please know that I am writing this post as a fan of the game (and Bioware) and I really want the game to succeed. In my life, I have never seen an individual or entity succeed in the long term by avoiding self-reflection and constructive criticism.....ever.

 

This isn't the impression I have been getting. Sure, they're proud of their work, and they should be. But it seems like they actually are listening to their customers. At least, that's what I've seen in their blogs and posts here on the forums. They're working on a 3 or 4 week old game and are making changes right and left, as well as providing us with constant updates on what they are doing. I know there are issues, and some people might think one issue is more of a problem than any other, but Bioware is taking this one step at a time and trying to get it right. They'll get around to fixing the problems, I have no doubt...and probably sooner than most MMO companies will, I'd wager.

[VicSkimmr]

Ohlen attributing virtually all performance issues to low-end systems and low metacritic scores to a vast conspiracy to take down TOR doesn't help. Stephen Reid telling a player who was concerned about the potential lack of viability of a level 50 bracket in Warzones given current population to "reroll" also comes off as smug and somewhat arrogant. Bioware's PR is designed to hype the game, but they unintentionally piss people off more than any other dev I've seen.

 

You're taking all of those instances grossly out of context just to further your agenda.

 

SR told that guy to roll an alt as a temporary solution while that dude waited for more people got to 50. Newsflash, if you rush to 50, you don't have any right to complain about how lonely it is there.

 

Ohlen's assessment of performance issues is likely accurate. After all, they're the ones with the data, not us. If they say only about 5% of people are having issues with the game, I'd tend to believe them over you. I know I personally haven't had any issues with performance on either my new PC or my 4 year old Macbook Pro.

 

The game got loads and loads of 0/10's from random internet morons. It isn't a conspiracy at all. Some people did it because they just don't like the game, some people did it because they were stuck in queues and lashed out any way they could, some people did it because they're diehard WoW fans and don't want anything else to compete with their obsession. Obviously the game deserves more than a 0/10, anyone with even the slightest bit of cognitive skill would figure that out.

Edited January 13, 2012 by VicSkimmr

[Calimwulf]

A few bugs, but i'm still having more fun in this MMO then every other. It seems the OP thinks if he doesn't like something no one else is allowed to.

Sorry, I was 'speaking' to the OP .)

[Argolith]

You're taking all of those instances grossly out of context just to further your agenda.

 

SR told that guy to roll an alt as a temporary solution while that dude waited for more people got to 50. Newsflash, if you rush to 50, you don't have any right to complain about how lonely it is there.

 

Ohlen's assessment of performance issues is likely accurate. After all, they're the ones with the data, not us. If they say only about 5% of people are having issues with the game, I'd tend to believe them over you. I know I personally haven't had any issues with performance on either my new PC or my 4 year old Macbook Pro.

 

The game got loads and loads of 0/10's from random internet morons. It isn't a conspiracy at all. Some people did it because they just don't like the game, some people did it because they were stuck in queues and lashed out any way they could, some people did it because they're diehard WoW fans and don't want anything else to compete with their obsession. Obviously the game deserves more than a 0/10, anyone with even the slightest bit of cognitive skill would figure that out.

 

 

I just wanted to quote the truth. It's nice to see someone who posts well thought out, grammatically correct and relevant non-conspiracy theory thoughts.

[oflow]

OP: fanbois dont see the glare because they have on their CE edition rose-colored Peril Sensitive Sunglasses.

[Kabjat]

Here's the deal: I want SWTOR to survive and flourish. I really like the game overall. However, there are GLARING issues with this game (I'm not going to rehash them here...no point in repeating it) and yet Bioware seems to be blissfully (blindly?) boastful of their game. I get how PR works, blah, blah (so don't attempt to give me a lesson), but I have seen ZERO humility on Bioware's part that indicates that they have heard their customers. Look at Trion. Whether you like Rift or not (I found it to be rather bland myself) that is a company working its a*s off for your $15 a month. They have approached the community with humility and open ears, and it has paid off. Meanwhile, Bioware is too busy spinning the hype machine and patting itself on the back to approach the community's concerns humbly and comprehensively.

 

Please know that I am writing this post as a fan of the game (and Bioware) and I really want the game to succeed. In my life, I have never seen an individual or entity succeed in the long term by avoiding self-reflection and constructive criticism.....ever.

 

 

I must say I agree with this sentiment. I am in LOVE with and addicted to the game, however it's impossible to overlook the problems others have had. I myself have not experienced such issues but my husband has as well as a few of our friends. Regardless of how I feel about 'the other mmo that many of us left', I can't help be reminded of how in touch with the player base the devs were. Whether you loved them or hated them, they talked to us. Bioware's automated responses and surgical removal of all unconstructive forum posts seems to be the extent of their communication with the players.

 

A little bit of frank disclosure and humble, THOROUGH explanation of WHAT exactly Bioware is doing to fix these issues would go a LONG way, IMO....and I'm no expert, just a married mother on a budget that expects to get what she pays for.

Edited January 13, 2012 by Kabjat

[Feskitt]

While TOR is much, much better, it was the same thing with Dragon Age 2. BW PR + fanboi zealotry = blissful ignorance.

 

Now the game (DA2) is pretty much a joke of the RPG world to all but the most brown-nosed sycophants.

 

TOR won't go F2P anytime soon though... hell, STO lasted 2 yrs before going F2P and that game is as shallow as a mud puddle LOL! Also, due to the investment, I think BW will be forced to add things, weather they like it or not. (especially on the PvP side of things; intentional queuing, nerf Biochem, pre-made brackets, etc)

 

 

[Keaper]

OP ?

What Glaring issues ?

UI, yes we know.

Seriusly, thast teh ONE Glaring issue i can see in the game.

Bacicly almost All the others seems to be more down to peoples machines.

 

Of Course they should be proud.

This certainly is The most polished launch of a MMO in the last 5+ years, maybe ever.

Sure we need more End game.

But seriusly come on !!

 

I am lvl 25 as my highest toon.

Why.

I play 10 hours a day.

But, i also love the classes so much i can not decide a main.

I can not think of another MMO that has had that hook.

 

Seriusly, i gave AoC 6 months.

I am definely willing to give this amazing game the same leway.

[Mannic]

You're taking all of those instances grossly out of context just to further your agenda.

 

SR told that guy to roll an alt as a temporary solution while that dude waited for more people got to 50. Newsflash, if you rush to 50, you don't have any right to complain about how lonely it is there.

 

I have never heard a dev tell a player to reroll because of failings in end-game content. That's just the wrong answer. It blames the player for the problem which is the worst sort of business. Better for the developer to say nothing at all than suggest that the player re-roll. All that does is tend to confirm suspicions that Bioware's "end-game" is to start the game over.

 

Ohlen's assessment of performance issues is likely accurate. After all, they're the ones with the data, not us. If they say only about 5% of people are having issues with the game, I'd tend to believe them over you. I know I personally haven't had any issues with performance on either my new PC or my 4 year old Macbook Pro.

 

There is no way for Bioware to know what constant FPS people are getting in their game. Your mythical "data" that Bioware uses doesn't exist. They will have data on things like system crashes and technical errors, but they cannot counter "I am getting drops to 23 FPS regularly" with metrics.

 

The game got loads and loads of 0/10's from random internet morons. It isn't a conspiracy at all. Some people did it because they just don't like the game, some people did it because they were stuck in queues and lashed out any way they could, some people did it because they're diehard WoW fans and don't want anything else to compete with their obsession. Obviously the game deserves more than a 0/10, anyone with even the slightest bit of cognitive skill would figure that out.

 

Every game gets loads and load of 0/10's on metacritic. The problems affecting TOR affect every other game out there. Fact is, TOR's Metacritic user score is lower than average. Ohlen would have been much better off saying, "we don't lend much weight to the user scores on Metacritic due to the margin of error of self-selection polls." Instead, he concocts a very detailed exercise in industrial paranoia to try to make it sound like TOR suffers from some vast conspiracy that affects only TOR. Even if that is actually true, it's just a stupid thing to say publicly.

Edited January 13, 2012 by Mannic