Space Combat in The Old Republic (continued from pre launch)

[DJunior]

I didn't know there was space combat! I thought that was a coin-op video game that was on my ship!

 

But seriously, there is no space combat. Those space missions things we do on our ships are the most painfully dull way to gain xp and creds that exists in TOR.

 

SWG didn't release with any form of space combat whatsoever, and fell short at release in a million other ways as well. In fact, space combat didn't show up until the first expansion arrived a year or so later. Should we be forgiving and be more patient for better space combat in TOR? I don't know, but the current model is a borefest, and I think some form of 3-axis multiplayer will eventually be absoutely necessary. It will also be part of what sets this MMO apart from the pack if they get it done, but I also have this sneaking fear that they will be content with leaving 'well enough' alone for a long time to come.

Edited March 4, 2012 by DJunior

[shepardcomander]

nice gathering of information.

 

I am an avid daily space player on 4 toons right now. It nets me 600k daily if I complete all bonus missions and takes about 4 hours....

 

While I enjoy it...the rail system is horrible and to be honest...everything is the same everytime and I could instead record my movements for 4 hours...and bot it everyday.... I do not but I could.....This means that the combat system is a cookie

 

 

I will be at the summit and question them on this and point out your thread by pulling it up on the big screen.

 

Fair warning. If a reporter/blogger pre launch dared to ask a dev a serious question about space combat, they were never granted another interview. Even their weekend long fansite summit imposed a partial NDA. Fans could talk about anything except the fail rails.

 

If you want to go ahead but asking them about subjects they wish would go away it means a dodge of an answer plus never getting invited back.

Edited March 4, 2012 by shepardcomander

[speedracerlo]

The space combat in swtor is the most pathetic thing I've ever seen.

I have not touched any space missions for over 2 months and was seriously disappointed in it when I first tried it.

[Sarfux]

laughing at everyone who actually thinks BioWare isn't working on a huge space overhaul project to bring pvp.

 

More and more things are hinting at battlefront 2 style warzones in space, roque squadron, xwing/tie fighter stuff all mashed together...from where I'm sitting.

 

If you think they aren't working on space...you got another thing comin.

[Galius]

laughing at everyone who actually thinks BioWare isn't working on a huge space overhaul project to bring pvp.

 

More and more things are hinting at battlefront 2 style warzones in space, roque squadron, xwing/tie fighter stuff all mashed together...from where I'm sitting.

 

If you think they aren't working on space...you got another thing comin.

 

As much as I would love to believe that there is no proof of that.. at all.

 

Unless you know something we don't?

[Deewe]

laughing at everyone who actually thinks BioWare isn't working on a huge space overhaul project to bring pvp.

 

More and more things are hinting at battlefront 2 style warzones in space, roque squadron, xwing/tie fighter stuff all mashed together...from where I'm sitting.

 

If you think they aren't working on space...you got another thing comin.

Seeing how they mentioned adding more tunneled content I wouldn't hold my breath on it.

 

Although I'll be more than happy to see something better than the space duck we have now.

[Lord_Ravenhurst]

Space combat is awful in this game. A huge let down. It could have been so great but you can tell they didn't focus any real time and effort on it.

 

 

sad, but true...

[Goretzu]

Fair warning. If a reporter/blogger pre launch dared to ask a dev a serious question about space combat, they were never granted another interview. Even their weekend long fansite summit imposed a partial NDA. Fans could talk about anything except the fail rails.

 

If you want to go ahead but asking them about subjects they wish would go away it means a dodge of an answer plus never getting invited back.

 

 

 

If they do that at this guild thing then the game is doomed.

 

That was one of the issues with Warhammer Online (under Mythic, Bioware-Mythic and Bioware), them deciding what they were doing and refusing to acknowledge player feedback saying anything negative (no matter how constructive) about that path.

 

It's a road to disaster.

[Goretzu]

laughing at everyone who actually thinks BioWare isn't working on a huge space overhaul project to bring pvp.

 

More and more things are hinting at battlefront 2 style warzones in space, roque squadron, xwing/tie fighter stuff all mashed together...from where I'm sitting.

 

If you think they aren't working on space...you got another thing comin.

 

 

 

Hopefully, however if it was happening and likely to appear in 2012 I'd have thought they'd have some definate mention of it.

 

But hopefully they just being super secret for some reason.

[VonAlex]

Hmm I wonder if they neglect the fact that space part of the game would kill the entire game if they admitted they werent able to deliver what the fans and themselves would expect..

 

Kinda like when your kids ask you why the world is evil and you keep reading disney for them despite the world is far from disney

[Lord_Ravenhurst]

Hmm I wonder if they neglect the fact that space part of the game would kill the entire game if they admitted they werent able to deliver what the fans and themselves would expect..

 

 

True.. A new Star Wars game of these epic proportions just can´t get away with a simple rail shooter.

A game of this size and cost needs at least a fully fledged space sim like good old "X-Wing vs. Tie Fighter", plus real free roaming space exploration and flying and encountering new planets plus atmospheric flight and manual landing on planets, space docks, enemy ships.

Of course all set in a multiplayer universe (best would be without instances) but also offering some single player accomplishments.

 

Yes, a space game of epic proportions revoltionizing the space sim combat genre needs to be set on top what is already there - then it will eventually become a real Star Wars simulator, like Star Wars Galaxies was in its glorious times.

 

Huge multplayer raids, going on a Deathstar-trench raid or dogfighting a huge capital ship with 24 or more friendly fighters. Imagine walking around on the fleet.. a sirene starts.. you run to the fighter bays for this event, enter your ship and are seated in a cockpit. You fly out, set your course you can choose of either fleeing to another system or join the crowd in fighting an attacking guild ship or AI ship in space combat, or landing on it, getting out of the cockpit and fighting PvP there..

Edited March 5, 2012 by Lord_Ravenhurst

[VonAlex]

True.. A new Star Wars game of these epic proportions just can´t get away with a simple rail shooter.

A game of this size and cost needs at least a fully fledged space sim like good old "X-Wing vs. Tie Fighter", plus real free roaming space exploration and flying and encountering new planets plus atmospheric flight and manual landing on planets, space docks, enemy ships.

Of course all set in a multiplayer universe (best would be without instances) but also offering some single player accomplishments.

 

Yes, a space game of epic proportions revoltionizing the space sim combat genre needs to be set on top what is already there - then it will eventually become a real Star Wars simulator, like Star Wars Galaxies was in its glorious times.

 

Huge multplayer raids, going on a Deathstar-trench raid or dogfighting a huge capital ship with 24 or more friendly fighters. Imagine walking around on the fleet.. a sirene starts.. you run to the fighter bays for this event, enter your ship and are seated in a cockpit. You fly out, set your course you can choose of either fleeing to another system or join the crowd in fighting an attacking guild ship or AI ship in space combat, or landing on it, getting out of the cockpit and fighting PvP there..

 

You Sir!

just singlehandled pointed out the entire spectrum of space based content for a real star wars MMO

 

I do hope that the devs read the forums and see these options and possibilites and think about them for long term future content for the game

 

That would make this a free mmo where you can go where you like

 

Promis me that you make an MMO or at least encourige somebody to do it this way if these Devs fail

[Lord_Ravenhurst]

You Sir!

just singlehandled pointed out the entire spectrum of space based content for a real star wars MMO

 

I do hope that the devs read the forums and see these options and possibilites and think about them for long term future content for the game

 

That would make this a free mmo where you can go where you like

 

Promis me that you make an MMO or at least encourige somebody to do it this way if these Devs fail

 

Thank you.. believe it or not, once I worked in close relation to a certain game design department, but in a different field (not at all related to BW or EA, don´t worry) but there was always a management which cut down great features which "they" found unnecessary or not financially rewarding. Sadly, they often had none or only light gaming experience and didn´t know what really makes a game fun to play.

 

Anyway, if the above mentioned expansion is really in the works, and the basic ground game gets expanded too, according to the most mentioned requests, SWTOR will succeed and last a very long time with huge subscription numbers.

If not, the future may not be as bright and long lasting.

 

I suggest BW, if they are lacking experience in that field, to team up with the original "X-Wing" devs of Lucasarts (like Laurence Holland - now at "Totally Games") to build the only, epic space combat MMO out there.

There simply is none out on the market like I described. They could even consult people like Chris Roberts, who did the Wing Commander series. Money does not seem to be the problem, and the potential of new subscribers would simply be enormous.

It would fit perfectly into the SWTOR setting which is already there.

Edited March 5, 2012 by Lord_Ravenhurst

[Darthris_II]

Idk I was really excited during development about having a personal ship. The idea made me feel like it really was my own adventure more so then the typical role playing elements in this type of mmo(Fantasy, Science Fiction). Although I like most of what they have done with this game .I can't really get myself to like the ships(space combat) even though I want to.

The space combat to me feels boring. There's no real excitement to it. The first couple times you go through its kinda fun and you get determined to get those last two objectives that you missed the first few times ,but after the 4th time or when you've gone on to the fifth space combat mission it just feel repetitive. Atleast to me anyway, I feel they could change the objectives escort, destroy target, destroy ship, and it really is the same thing. I guess what I was hoping for was more freedom but other then the occasional barrel roll or moving left to right which other then dodging asteroids and obstacles in the way doesn't really do much and usually if you have decent upgrades whether you hit something 2 times or five really doesn't impact you that much. Maybe it does by the level 50 space combat missions but I really don't care to be honest.

My biggest problem is the freedom which you'd think getting a ship to explore the galaxy really gives. It feels like a glorified portal which in truth is what it always has been ,but the combat itself kills it. No dogfighting no going underside a massive ship and destroying their propulsion or getting in a close call with another small personal starship. In my opinion the space combat could have been a game unto itself which is fine but doesn't match up well with all the other things put in the rpg elements of the game. It just makes it a fun little flying ship that shoots laser beams but doesn't feel at all epic like it should.

I really wish bioware had taken the time to work on the space combat and given it the attention it deserved. Even if that meant waiting for an expansion for the combat part of owning a ship.

[Goretzu]

True.. A new Star Wars game of these epic proportions just can´t get away with a simple rail shooter.

A game of this size and cost needs at least a fully fledged space sim like good old "X-Wing vs. Tie Fighter", plus real free roaming space exploration and flying and encountering new planets plus atmospheric flight and manual landing on planets, space docks, enemy ships.

Of course all set in a multiplayer universe (best would be without instances) but also offering some single player accomplishments.

 

Yes, a space game of epic proportions revoltionizing the space sim combat genre needs to be set on top what is already there - then it will eventually become a real Star Wars simulator, like Star Wars Galaxies was in its glorious times.

 

Huge multplayer raids, going on a Deathstar-trench raid or dogfighting a huge capital ship with 24 or more friendly fighters. Imagine walking around on the fleet.. a sirene starts.. you run to the fighter bays for this event, enter your ship and are seated in a cockpit. You fly out, set your course you can choose of either fleeing to another system or join the crowd in fighting an attacking guild ship or AI ship in space combat, or landing on it, getting out of the cockpit and fighting PvP there..

 

 

 

Aye, space has so much to offer any SW game, and argueably even more for an MMO SW game.

[Galius]

What I find amusing is all the detractors that used to be on the forums telling us it was not worth expanding the game in this direction seem to not um.. be playing anymore.

 

Might be because of the lack of good end game content like SPACE???

[shepardcomander]

laughing at everyone who actually thinks BioWare isn't working on a huge space overhaul project to bring pvp.

 

More and more things are hinting at battlefront 2 style warzones in space, roque squadron, xwing/tie fighter stuff all mashed together...from where I'm sitting.

 

If you think they aren't working on space...you got another thing comin.

 

We only have Bioware's own track record to go off of. In summer 2010 Bioware announced "space combat" with much fanfare, a multipage spread and a cover of PC gamer at the largest gaming convention of the year only to deliver a single player mini rail shooter a year and a half later.

 

They announced this "new space combat" with a couple vague lines in a blog and not a peep since.

 

Is there anything to look forward to? Really?

[Kydd]

Your passion makes me wonder... were you on SS?

[GeoLager]

Even the abortion known as Star Trek Online has open space.

 

Actually space in STO is the best part of the game and its only redeeming value. It's not really an arcade style shooter, but its really interesting and really gives an epic feel to space combat.

 

I mean I don't want what STO has as far as the exact gameplay, but the model of how it handles space could so easily be translated into swtor.

Edited March 5, 2012 by GeoLager

[AlphaBraddox]

I would simply love a Space Combat mission to be troop support in which you can travel to a planet's surface and blast away. Flying in and around cities would be awesome!

 

Then add a faction based Space Combat system. Think of it as Ilum in Space in which factions fight each other to hold sectors of space or fight over space stations. Do it!!!

Edited March 6, 2012 by AlphaBraddox

[Lord_Ravenhurst]

Let's talk about this without the usual emotion or prejudice whether Bioware can handle this request or not. Money doesn't seem to be the problem, and expanding the team should be possible, if BW needs to do that. You can buy all know-how of the world with money, so you can bring on board the very best combat simulation team as well. SWTOR has a bright future, after all it is based on one of the top selling brands. Why is Star Wars the best selling brand? It made dreams come true about exploring worlds, meeting strange aliens, Jedis or Sith with superhuman abilities, a lot of other great characters going through space without limitation, the eternal fight good vs. evil. This all is Star Wars.

If BW manages to breath life into this world, it will succeed and earn the tons of money it deserves and will reinvest into expanding the game for us, the community.

Space combat and free roaming experience is an integral part of the Star Wars feeling. I think BW is smart enough and they already know that we are expecting nothing less than a SW Galaxies, X-Wing/Freelancer 2 experience, so they have my trust we will be blown away by what they have in mind for a space roaming expansion.

 

Let me fight a space battle and get out of it to find Dagobah in a huge universe, like I look for datacrons. Let me land on it manually, going through the atmosphere of the planet. Let me land in a swamp and let me get my ship out of the swamp by using the force. Let me find Yoda's grand-grandfather and do some secret, special missions for him, like crafting a special object or raiding half of the universe to get a special item to proceed the story.

Edited March 6, 2012 by Lord_Ravenhurst

[Insomnio]

I could see them implementing fights that take you through city scapes, should not be too hard to build. I recall reading that they were going to implement co op space missions in one of the dev discussions, which would be nice.

[Ubung]

Id like to post my support for this topic and give it a bump for awareness. Ive been dissapointed by the current space combat in this game, much like others in this thread its good for a short distraction but quickly becomes tiresome.

 

Im thinking something like halo reach / batlefront 2 style space would be epic. Some sort of exploration would be a bonus. I really liked the ideas for gameplay examples on page 3.

 

For people interested in open space combat with planetary transitions check out a game callled evochron mercenaries. Really epic game.

[Lord_Ravenhurst]

Id like to post my support for this topic and give it a bump for awareness. Ive been dissapointed by the current space combat in this game, much like others in this thread its good for a short distraction but quickly becomes tiresome.

 

Im thinking something like halo reach / batlefront 2 style space would be epic. Some sort of exploration would be a bonus. I really liked the ideas for gameplay examples on page 3.

 

For people interested in open space combat with planetary transitions check out a game callled evochron mercenaries. Really epic game.

 

Agree 100%

 

I really hope to get infos on what to expect out of the "special project" and at least a rough timeframe. Right now I am disappointed and need to look somewhere else for multiplayer space battles, exploration, trading and atmospheric flight. Hoping for Lucasarts again, maybe Battlefront 3.

[Trenter]

What I find amusing is all the detractors that used to be on the forums telling us it was not worth expanding the game in this direction seem to not um.. be playing anymore.

 

Might be because of the lack of good end game content like SPACE???

 

Not that I ever said something like that, but perhaps we who weren't completely up in arms on this matter are just in game, enjoying it, more than hanging on the forums?