Countryfiedjedi Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 (edited) Oh man, this reminded me of how insanely awesome it was to place items into the game world. When Factions were introduced (besides just Chaos and Order), I join the Shadowlords because their base was right next to my house, outside of Yew, and was a huge PvP hotbed. Well, a friend and I decided to up the defenses of our faction base. In side the base was a long bridge enemys would have to run across in order to steal back the sigils we held. We decided to design a maze on this bridge to slow down people from just galloping across it. To do that, we strategically place wooden crates, with 400 stones of ore (so if they looted the chest to "clear a path" they would be overloaded and either drop the chest back down, or be unable to move at all), to make a single zig-zag path. After we did this, we decided to conceal the maze bu placing multiple scraps of leather on top of the chests. What this did was stack individual pieces so high that an unmounted player could stand in that stack of leather and be completely concealed. Boy do I miss those times. LOVE IT! What other MMO game can/could you do this creative crap in! UO was awesome! Like I said, UO hands down. Even look back at all the people who played DAoC AND UO... most all rank UO over DAoC. Most MMO'ers really missed out if they weren't there early with respect to PvP! Edited January 5, 2012 by Countryfiedjedi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrunchyGremlin Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Half these MMO's are carebear PvP because nothing is at stake. Add valuable resources worth protecting or lootable corpses to world PvP here and then we are talking about some great world PvP. We need somethign worth fighting for. I dont know about he carebear part but i agree with the protection and resources. DAOC was fun when protecting a relic or trying to get it back even though it had negligable effect. The idea was fun. Eve has corpse looting... Literally. And that is fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cinc Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 DAOC was easily the most fun I had in PvP. Also the worse PvE I've ever played. Pre catacombs DAOC was a grindfest of mindnumbing proportions. Waiting hours for a spot in a fin group(finlaith) because xp solo was so slow it wasnt even worth doing after level 30. Then being thrilled at getting 1/4 of a level after 8 hours there. Pre toa daoc minus the buffbots is the ideal pvp in my mind. Maybe a little better class balance but the overall form of the pvp led to so many epic fights of many different natures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonpu Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Ultima Online Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heretikzero Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 The most fun i've ever experienced in PVP was Guild Wars. I've had PVP in CoV/CoH, EQ, EQ2, APB, and Anarchy Online. So far, in my humble experience, nothing touches Guild Wars for team based equally matched PVP. I can't wait for GW2. I haven't PVP'd in this game yet outside of beta. Still trying to find the right toon for me to PVP with, really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimshock Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 DAOC 10chars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadehawk Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 DAOC by far the bestStill evaluating SWTOR vs RIFT vs WAR for 2nd and 3rd in my list but nothing to date matches DAOC :-( That saddens me greatly I played that from an Alpha tester to WAR release. PLEASE GOD LET THEM MAKE A DAOC 2 :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thejaga Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Ultima Online. Easy question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrunchyGremlin Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 have you guys read this or experienced this part of game?What we need here are three planets and a third main faction and we got DAOSW http://www.swtor.com/blog/new-year%E2%80%99s-pvp-update Open World PvP on Ilum: The planet of Ilum currently allows for open world PvP even on a PvE server, but the mechanics and incentives of the planet are not in as intended yet. We’re working on longer term goals for the planet and for other PvP areas, but expect to see some interim adjustments in January - such as more respawn points to focus conflicts, restricting Companion Characters from the area, and revisions to rewards. Ilum will also become a major source of Valor. Valor buffs will increase and decrease based on the objectives your faction owns. These buffs increase the amount of Valor you receive per player kill. However they do not give anything in and of themselves, so players will still need to defeat other players for significant Valor rewards. Additionally, daily and weekly missions will require player kills to complete. Player kills for quests and Valor credit will have diminishing returns per player killed. So, the more players that are fighting other players, the better it is for everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kimasoko Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Uo and darkfall get my vote, so fun and creative Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miami_Heat Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Runescape Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dalaroq Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 (edited) LOVE IT! What other MMO game can/could you do this creative crap in! UO was awesome! Like I said, UO hands down. Even look back at all the people who played DAoC AND UO... most all rank UO over DAoC. Most MMO'ers really missed out if they weren't there early with respect to PvP! Ultima Online. Ah...the days of "All Kill, No skill" and panicking the first time some kryss, dagger, or kat deadly poisoned you. "You are wracked with extreme pain!" With no other game could you go into PvP combat naked and still come out the victor if you knew what you were doing. Memories.. Edited January 5, 2012 by Dalaroq Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mminczes Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 (edited) 1) Asheron's Call2) Ultima Online because dying mattered, I could lose my armor or my sword. Killing someone meant something. Also Asheron's Call took real skill. You could dodge people's spells or arrows because they were actual projectiles. It was fun as **** Edited January 5, 2012 by mminczes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EasymodeX Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 I disagree. Almost all of these MMO's have a no risk factor when it comes to PvP. if you die it's not like you're losing your gear.... Risk factor? Did Shadowbane have any risk factor when gankers would use specs that had little gear relevancy, so they could PvP naked without issue? I recall having this same conversation about 8 years ago: Risk factor means that some penalty was applied for losing. In DAOC, penalty was 20 minutes waiting on the pad, porting, group up, and moving back to the game. Not to mention a rez cost. Sure, the penalties have gotten lighter over time. Hell, you look at SWTOR's open world death's and you can respawn respawn respawn respawn respawn respawn. But what is the purpose of PvP? To win. To plaster your name across the sky, in whatever ephemeral and limited fashion you can imagine. You feel like you have to punish and hurt the other player in some virtual manner to make this happen. I find that more sadistic than anything. I find it superfluous to the winning itself. Winning does not automatically entail demeaning your opponent, or taking away what they're carrying. Winning means you won. It means I AM TEH WINNAR. Who cares about dropping items? Ooooh look, it's so hardcore it makes me giggle! There's no more skill with hardcore mechanics. There's no more challenge. There's no more glory. Why? To piss off goonsquad ******* of course. Heh. I personally think it's fine that some people feel "more excitement" when they can have their nuts chopped off for losing. Personally, I get pretty excited in an open PvP area when enemies are likely to be present, regardless of whether I'd lose "nothing" or all my cash and gear. I respect a player's choice of UO/SB/DF -- in my eyes, it wasn't about the griefing and "hardcore-ness". I like UO because of its flexibility and variety -- refer to the guy's box traps for example. UO had a huge amount of variety because it was basically a graphical MUD. And because players killed unkillable NPCs, huehuehue. The "hardcore" aspect wasn't very relevant to me, except as it involved zzz grinding, etc. However, I see it as pretty jeuvenile to bash on MMOs with "carebear" mechanics, since they are equally (cough, potentially) as competitive, skill-straining, exciting, etc, as any "hardcore" flavor. Because at the end of the day, ego is the #1 reason to PvP. Unless you think that stroking your sadistic side has any relevance to PvP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mminczes Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 (edited) ^Utterly disagree. Death penalty increases the stakes. Having the possibility to lose things that you've worked for, like gear creates greater tension. Sure SWTOR pvp can still be competitive but not nearly to the degree that a game like Asheron's Call was. Sadistic? I don't want to kill my enemy and have them respawn instantly with no repercussions, I want to kill my enemy and then remove their armor from their body and sell it to the vendor and give them the credits. Edited January 5, 2012 by mminczes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajic Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Don't forget Shadowbane. R.I.P. my favorite! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sassymcgee Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 (edited) Shadowbane by far. I have respect for Daoc/UO but i never played it. Why they scaled pvp is beyond me(i know the why, i think its awful and the worst decision they made). Pvp would be fun, but its absolute garbage until you are 50 now. Wasn't the case in well made mmos. Edited January 5, 2012 by Sassymcgee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EasymodeX Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Death penalty increases the stakes. What stakes? It's an electronic game that costs $14.95 and I'm pretty sure item loss doesn't stop someone from logging in and playing. In the games that you're referring to, the gear was designed such that their loss wasn't a huge deal like it would be if you lost Thunderfury, Blessed Blade of the Windseeker. Having the possibility to lose things that you've worked for, like gear creates greater tension. Sure SWTOR pvp can still be competitive but not nearly to the degree that a game like Asheron's Call was. You know what else creates tension? Losing a relic. Or better yet, trying to carry a relic solo across 2 frontier zones when 200 enemy players are looking for you. Pretty sure carrying the hopes of 400 realmmates on your shoulders as you hoof it across the wilderness gives you a better high than "oh no, I could lose my gloves". And yet DAOC is 'carebear'. Despite, of course, plastering your IRS, RR, and RP/week on an external website for the world to see. The only reason why losing gear "creates" tension is because gear 'matters' (to you, and to other lootwhore/carebears). Tension, at the end of the day, is the potential loss of something that matters. You're not hardcore. You're a sadistic carebear, because gear pixels give you a stiffy, and losing gear makes you mad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AriasImmortal Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 TBC-era WoW (Season 3, specifically) or immediately post-pub 9 SWG. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thejaga Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Ultima Online. Ah...the days of "All Kill, No skill" and panicking the first time some kryss, dagger, or kat deadly poisoned you. "You are wracked with extreme pain!" With no other game could you go into PvP combat naked and still come out the victor if you knew what you were doing. Memories.. And around 1997, at least on Lake Superior, it was the Dreads versus everybody else, but the Dreads were the only ones who actually knew how to PvP, because they did it all the time. It did not matter how many irate Blues rolled up to the Crossroads to "teach those ganker kiddies a lesson," they always ended up dead and naked on the ground. Age of Conan was broken in more ways than I can count, but I do have to give props to its melee combat system -- moderately aim-based with the combo requirements meant that there was an actual skill gap. In melee vs. melee, skill dominated. Fun times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torothin Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 In eve-online if you got killed the killer was able to loot some of your wreck which contained the gear on your ship. Now the mechanics for that game are way different but because you risked losing things it made PvP more risky and more fun. I mean sure it's fun to get killed with zero consequences but it gets old really fast. Anyone can engage anybody and the worst that is going to happen is that you're going to re spawn without losing anything. Where is the fun in that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlazzinBob Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Hands down Ultima Online. Unfortunately nothing will ever compare Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
copasetic Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 You know what else creates tension? Losing a relic. Or better yet, trying to carry a relic solo across 2 frontier zones when 200 enemy players are looking for you. Pretty sure carrying the hopes of 400 realmmates on your shoulders as you hoof it across the wilderness gives you a better high than "oh no, I could lose my gloves". And yet DAOC is 'carebear'. Despite, of course, plastering your IRS, RR, and RP/week on an external website for the world to see. The only reason why losing gear "creates" tension is because gear 'matters' (to you, and to other lootwhore/carebears). Tension, at the end of the day, is the potential loss of something that matters. You're not hardcore. You're a sadistic carebear, because gear pixels give you a stiffy, and losing gear makes you mad. I found this post both very true and hilarious. Upvote for you sir. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuceHason Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 top three: 1. DAoC 2. UO 3. EVE I have to agree with your #2 and #3 picks. I am torn on which of those would be #1 in my book. The fact of UO just being able to poind anyone you wanted anywhere "Out of city limits". Oh and the house traps to get people! Ohhh yeah there was PvP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuceHason Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 What makes PvP so worth while in Ultima Online (UO) and EVE-Online is the fact that the risk reward is so great! You die youre out! Your killer gets to loot your corpes/wreck to reap the spoils of war! Games like this there is NO, NONE, ZIP, ZILTCH risk. This you die, rez/spawn and have MINOR damage to your gear is blah!.... SNORE, ZzzzZZZZ, BORING. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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