Troll Thrower -Arena

[Darkestmonty]

1 hour ago, krackcommando said:

 2m or 3m grp joins arena. doesn't like 4th teammate. INSTANT kick. INSTANT. ridiculously easy. not that you need the premade for this. it's ridiculously easy for 2 or 3 ppl to scapegoat someone. really. get out of here with this vote to kick garbage. I really don't care what has or hasn't happened to you.

3 randos inspect gear. don't like the 306 in their midst. INSTANT kick.

edit: it's much more difficult to get consensus kicks in WZs to the extent that the mechanism was useless. ofc, being useless makes bringing it back pointless as well. but w/e. at least it isn't an easy abuse case.

what type of player gets immediately kicked by 3 random people before the game even starts? It's not like there are people lined up for Arena, most of the time when someone left, that was it, you were stuck with a 3 person team.

I never saw people insta-kick a fourth person in arena before the match started. We kicked loudmouths that refused to fight but that's it. You really have to be toxic for 3 random people to decide to kick you before the first round.

Lets say you saw 3 people insta-kick a person from Arena. How many times have you seen this happen? Did you see people abuse the kick function more or less than the current amount of people afking in warzones and arena? Currently I see 1-2 people per warzone AFK. They start to lose the game and completely give up. Some instantly run for a corner to hide the whole game. Arena I've only seen a few people flat out refuse to fight and waste everyones time but it's much more rare than AFKers in warzones.

Edited November 10, 2023 by Darkestmonty

[krackcommando]

8 hours ago, Darkestmonty said:

what type of player gets immediately kicked by 3 random people before the game even starts? It's not like there are people lined up for Arena, most of the time when someone left, that was it, you were stuck with a 3 person team.

I never saw people insta-kick a fourth person in arena before the match started. We kicked loudmouths that refused to fight but that's it. You really have to be toxic for 3 random people to decide to kick you before the first round.

Lets say you saw 3 people insta-kick a person from Arena. How many times have you seen this happen? Did you see people abuse the kick function more or less than the current amount of people afking in warzones and arena? Currently I see 1-2 people per warzone AFK. They start to lose the game and completely give up. Some instantly run for a corner to hide the whole game. Arena I've only seen a few people flat out refuse to fight and waste everyones time but it's much more rare than AFKers in warzones.

you seem to be under this ridiculous impression that players only use vote to kick when a player is throwing. you are wrong. full stop. players regularly lash out at others for their gear (before the match even starts) and again between rounds after some turd got globalled and ruined any hope for a victory. I know numerous players (most of whom play arenas in groups on a regular basis) who would kick any "bot" that rando'd onto their 2m and 3m teams.

furthermore, if a player sees that there's is a vote kick coming, all he has to do is /stuck, and under your new proviso, he can no longer be kicked. do you see the catch-22 here? the player being discussed in this thread and those like him can only be addressed on an individual basis...OR...let players leave when they see him. 

[Darkestmonty]

2 hours ago, krackcommando said:

you seem to be under this ridiculous impression that players only use vote to kick when a player is throwing. you are wrong. full stop. players regularly lash out at others for their gear (before the match even starts) and again between rounds after some turd got globalled and ruined any hope for a victory. I know numerous players (most of whom play arenas in groups on a regular basis) who would kick any "bot" that rando'd onto their 2m and 3m teams.

furthermore, if a player sees that there's is a vote kick coming, all he has to do is /stuck, and under your new proviso, he can no longer be kicked. do you see the catch-22 here? the player being discussed in this thread and those like him can only be addressed on an individual basis...OR...let players leave when they see him. 

yeah, sometimes we used /kick when a player sucked and was being toxic.

I remember one guy who would accuse me of throwing after I returned from 4.0 to 6.0. I wasn't great but he would immediately /stuck and start yelling that I was working for the other team throwing games. The irony was he would /stuck both rounds. We just left in on the floor screaming like a child. I enjoyed watching him throw a tantrum as he would /stuck every single round before the game even started.

The funniest part was I made a point of killing him first (as did my whole team) when ever we had him as an opponent. Dude could not PvP and would not shut up but we all found it funny and never bothered kicking. There wasn't a replacement that last season, so we just let him rage and laughed.

There is no single fix for every exploit in the game but vote kick greatly limited people who would run into a match and go AFK while in some corner.

Now that /stuck has a timer in PvP along with a few tweaks, /vote kick will be a lot more useful than the 1-2 AFKers we see constantly in warzones and people who refuse to fight in arena.

Edited November 10, 2023 by Darkestmonty

[krackcommando]

1 hour ago, Darkestmonty said:

yeah, sometimes we used /kick when a player sucked and was being toxic.

😄 "sometimes." you either have a very selective memory, or you don't play arenas nearly as often as I do, because players would be vote kicked every 3rd match on SF, and SF is the "kindest" of the servers (from what I gather). to add insult to injury, players incur a deserter debuff for being kicked. simple math: you don't make heavy handed (i.e., draconian) decisions that adversely affect 4 out of 5 players just to get at the 1 player you're targeting. Or on SF, that would be more like adversely affecting 9 out of 10 players to get at that 1 in every 10 who actually hides or tries to prolong the fight.

last time I reply to you on this crusade of yours, because it is become increasingly circular: if you can figure out a way to ensure that vote to kick cannot be abused or adversely affect players who are not actually afk, then I'm all ears. but, at least in arenas, you have not presented any argument that does so. I'm not eating a deserter debuff b/c nikana and his budd(ies) feel like it. gth out of here with this. you're never going to make it work in arenas. I don't think you'll make it work in WZs either, unless it's something incredibly obvious like the guy this thread is about...which is like 1 in 30 or 40 players on SF and certainly not worth creating an easily abused draconian system over. just do your job Biosword ToS, and ban the account.

edit: no. that's not fair. WZs are a lot worse. but on the other hand, why wouldn't someone afk when it's <no idea insert a guild here> smashing a bunch of pugs? or it's a map you just have no interest in playing but you're forced to b/c you have no choice over maps?

perhaps instead BS could maybe address the underlying conditions that encourage AFKing (as it often happens not as the aforementioned troll uses it), like not reward quest completion for losses. not design a system that "forces" players who don't want to pvp into pvp in the first place?

 

Edited November 10, 2023 by krackcommando

[Darkestmonty]

50 minutes ago, krackcommando said:

😄 "sometimes." you either have a very selective memory, or you don't play arenas nearly as often as I do, because players would be vote kicked every 3rd match on SF, and SF is the "kindest" of the servers (from what I gather). to add insult to injury, players incur a deserter debuff for being kicked. simple math: you don't make heavy handed (i.e., draconian) decisions that adversely affect 4 out of 5 players just to get at the 1 player you're targeting. Or on SF, that would be more like adversely affecting 9 out of 10 players to get at that 1 in every 10 who actually hides or tries to prolong the fight.

last time I reply to you on this crusade of yours, because it is become increasingly circular: if you can figure out a way to ensure that vote to kick cannot be abused or adversely affect players who are not actually afk, then I'm all ears. but, at least in arenas, you have not presented any argument that does so. I'm not eating a deserter debuff b/c nikana and his budd(ies) feel like it. gth out of here with this. you're never going to make it work in arenas. I don't think you'll make it work in WZs either, unless it's something incredibly obvious like the guy this thread is about...which is like 1 in 30 or 40 players on SF and certainly not worth creating an easily abused draconian system over. just do your job Biosword ToS, and ban the account.

edit: no. that's not fair. WZs are a lot worse. but on the other hand, why wouldn't someone afk when it's <no idea insert a guild here> smashing a bunch of pugs? or it's a map you just have no interest in playing but you're forced to b/c you have no choice over maps?

perhaps instead BS could maybe address the underlying conditions that encourage AFKing (as it often happens not as the aforementioned troll uses it), like not reward quest completion for losses. not design a system that "forces" players who don't want to pvp into pvp in the first place?

 

Stop acting like a victim. Ranked PvP no longer exists. Those toxic teams you remember kicking random new people out for being innocent first timers are no longer around.

By the time I came back in 6.0 Ranked PvP was already 2 seasons from being closed down permanently. Even by then new people were no longer being kicked before games even started. Toxic trash that refused to help and /stuck every round was a problem but we dealt with them in our own way.

Vote kick now would be a welcome addition back to the game with a few tweaks.

Edited November 10, 2023 by Darkestmonty

[darksidenerd]

@JackieKo 

 

He was on again last night. Doing the same thing. I was in 2 matches against and 3 matches with. While on my team I just didn't play and lead the other team to him while he stealthed. 

How is that, "investigation" going? 

[darksidenerd]

On 11/9/2023 at 6:24 PM, Darkestmonty said:

there used to be a great function called "Vote Kick" which stopped this behavior.

Rules included

• Vote Kick could not be spammed
• Vote Kick had a timer then the ability to vote was canceled
• If you were in combat it was impossible to vote kick you
• If you entered combat it the vote kick was canceled
• If you were earning defender points, the vote kick was canceled
• If you healed a team mate still in combat, the vote kick was canceled
• If you were defending a player being attacked, the vote kick was canceled
• You needed at least 50% of the team to vote yes or the vote kick was canceled

It was actually very hard to vote kick people. The only exploit I heard about were people vote kicking a dead player. This can be an easy fix, can't vote kick a dead player. But this would not completely stop people from throwing games. Vote kick did stop them from wasting everyone's time in Arena by letting the rounds time out and AFKing in a corner during Warzones.

There were more than a few times we ran into players like this and we would vote kick them if they refused to help us fight in Arena or AFKed in a warzone.

Love this.   wish they would bring it back.  

[RACATW]

18 minutes ago, darksidenerd said:

@JackieKo 

 

He was on again last night. Doing the same thing. I was in 2 matches against and 3 matches with. While on my team I just didn't play and lead the other team to him while he stealthed. 

How is that, "investigation" going? 

I reported him for ban evasion because it seems to be a new account with an unnamed legacy (but I could be wrong).

Maybe they just gave him a slap on the wrist instead of a permanent ban against an obvious bad faith actor?

[darksidenerd]

40 minutes ago, RACATW said:

I reported him for ban evasion because it seems to be a new account with an unnamed legacy (but I could be wrong).

Maybe they just gave him a slap on the wrist instead of a permanent ban against an obvious bad faith actor?

@JackieKo   If it's a matter of making $$ off players. I bettchu you my left kidney that this 1 player doesn't spend nearly as much if anything compared to the 50 other players he is trolling.  You and the others, "investigating" really think banning him will...what? Result in a loss of $$ ? please... please..

[TrixxieTriss]

1 hour ago, RACATW said:

I reported him for ban evasion because it seems to be a new account with an unnamed legacy (but I could be wrong).

Maybe they just gave him a slap on the wrist instead of a permanent ban against an obvious bad faith actor?

This is why they should never have opened PvP up to F2P accounts that aren’t grouped with subscribers. Or they  should be severely limited on how many matches non subscribers can play. It stops people ban evading for doing the wrong thing. 

[krackcommando]

1 hour ago, TrixxieTriss said:

This is why they should never have opened PvP up to F2P accounts that aren’t grouped with subscribers. Or they  should be severely limited on how many matches non subscribers can play. It stops people ban evading for doing the wrong thing. 

comically, the only reason for me to sub at this point is to post here, and I'm doing it on a different account anyway. no need to resub when the time comes unless the rules change. so I'll take the small victories.

[RACATW]

1 hour ago, TrixxieTriss said:

This is why they should never have opened PvP up to F2P accounts that aren’t grouped with subscribers. Or they  should be severely limited on how many matches non subscribers can play. It stops people ban evading for doing the wrong thing. 

I mean, it's pretty suspicious when someone spends 15 minutes in stealth doing absolutely no damage every single arena...

Not too hard to build in some small counter measures or force acid after 1 minute of inactivity.

[Darkestmonty]

On 11/13/2023 at 1:03 PM, TrixxieTriss said:

This is why they should never have opened PvP up to F2P accounts that aren’t grouped with subscribers. Or they  should be severely limited on how many matches non subscribers can play. It stops people ban evading for doing the wrong thing. 

People have been AFKing and hiding in Arena and Warzones since release but we used to solve that problem quickly with Vote Kick.

This issue became impossible to counter when Vote Kick was removed in 2020, two years prior to FTP and Preferred having unlimited access to PvP. Ever since 2020 every other game has people AFKing or hiding in a corner refusing to do anything.

The issue isn't unlimited access to PvP for FTP (who are limited to level 60) or Preferred. The issue is Vote Kick no longer exists and the current system of dailies/weeklies/PvP season promotes AFKing because it rewards players for their lack of participation.

Either add Vote Kick back in, hire someone to actively monitor players, or make the act of not participation/afking unrewarding.

Edited November 14, 2023 by Darkestmonty

[TrixxieTriss]

4 hours ago, Darkestmonty said:

The issue isn't unlimited access to PvP for FTP (who are limited to level 60) or Preferred

Preferred aren’t limited to lvl 60. They are limited to which ever expansion they last subbed for. 

[Darkestmonty]

35 minutes ago, TrixxieTriss said:

Preferred aren’t limited to lvl 60. They are limited to which ever expansion they last subbed for. 

I never said preferred were limited to 60, only FTP.

[TrixxieTriss]

@JackieKo you guys need to address the AFK trolls in PvP. 

[RACATW]

5 hours ago, TrixxieTriss said:

@JackieKo you guys need to address the AFK trolls in PvP. 

I think (or hope) they just might be starting too. I saw someone complaining about being banned on the steam swtor forums and then admitting they "trolled pvp".

[TrixxieTriss]

1 hour ago, RACATW said:

I think (or hope) they just might be starting too. I saw someone complaining about being banned on the steam swtor forums and then admitting they "trolled pvp".

It’s the same guy that was in the video that was linked here. Real similar name 😞. 

[Jonito]

where is the report function these days?

 

[krackcommando]

5 hours ago, Jonito said:

where is the report function these days?

 

in-game, you need to create a ticket. don't right click for harassment. that just takes a chat snapshot and sends it to CS without being able to explain the situation. supposedly the pvpreports@swtor.com is also "in use." I received no response or acknowledgement at all from that one. filling out a ticket will result in a generic response from the in-game system. don't bother trying to report anything on the forum though. you'll just get a warning or an infraction point...which is kinda a good thing in that it's the most lively response I've encountered from Biosword.

supposedly you can DM jackie, but as she's already stated, she's just a forum mod and has no power or, apparently, knowledge about how to actually effect change.

Edited November 15, 2023 by krackcommando

[TrixxieTriss]

2 hours ago, krackcommando said:

in-game, you need to create a ticket. don't right click for harassment. that just takes a chat snapshot and sends it to CS without being able to explain the situation. supposedly the pvpreports@swtor.com is also "in use." I received no response or acknowledgement at all from that one. filling out a ticket will result in a generic response from the in-game system. don't bother trying to report anything on the forum though. you'll just get a warning or an infraction point...which is kinda a good thing in that it's the most lively response I've encountered from Biosword.

supposedly you can DM jackie, but as she's already stated, she's just a forum mod and has no power or, apparently, knowledge about how to actually effect change.

Youre right of course. But it would be so much easier if it just let you update the Harassment report with extra info. Ie, right click it then go edit. Which is what I tried to do yesterday where it lets you actually open the edit window. I wrote a nice big explanation of what was happening, clicked save & it says there was a problem editing it & you lose everything you wrote. Really put some effort into that essay & couldn’t be bothered writing it out again. 

[DragoslavRadanov]

3 hours ago, TrixxieTriss said:

Youre right of course. But it would be so much easier if it just let you update the Harassment report with extra info. Ie, right click it then go edit. Which is what I tried to do yesterday where it lets you actually open the edit window. I wrote a nice big explanation of what was happening, clicked save & it says there was a problem editing it & you lose everything you wrote. Really put some effort into that essay & couldn’t be bothered writing it out again. 

I tried that too, I didn't make an essay, but it was along the lines of "(name here) intentionally hides in stealth and waits out the timer without contributing at all," but I got the same error message and just let it go and hoped since other people were also reporting him it'd go somewhere without the need to try to edit in extra info

[LordDaemon]

Couple things.

1. its awesome that even though it wasn’t the response from devs we wanted to hear, the fact that they responded says they DEFINITELY handled it, or is handling it. I know exactly who everybody is talking about and i haven't seen that guy in a while. Makes me wanna believe it’s been taken care of. 
 

2. (To the devs as well) in order for something like this to stop happening, GET RID OF SOLO QUEUE FOR ARENAS! Because whether it’s the guy we are all talking about, or the ingrates who hit /stuck before the match starts when they cant get their way, it ruins the experience for those who actually try to play and win. 

[LordDaemon]

On 11/13/2023 at 10:00 AM, darksidenerd said:

Love this.   wish they would bring it back.  

Me too! Because now we have people abusing /stuck as a means to throw temper tantrums

[darksidenerd]

Looks like we have another one in our server, same stealth class that just hides the whole match until the end.
The player who was my reason for starting this post isn't around anymore. I assume Devs actually did their jobs? I'm assuming this new troll is the same guy just made a different toon..


Maybe yall wont take so long this time.

 

Better yet, BRING BACK TO VOTE TO KICK!