An update on the development of SWTOR

[Toraak]

Thank you for your response. It is much appreciated.

[OlBuzzard]

3 minutes ago, jedimasterjac said:

It’s unfortunate that they probably can’t say anything until a deal’s finalized. Hell, who knows how much they even know?

I'd say you're closer to the fact here! Unquestionably the team has been given a directive to hold comments (for now).

I won't be hateful to the team ... but I will NOT budge off of my posts that I have made this time around!  Enough is enough!

Additionally: None of us asked for this bombshell!  IMO it's not unreasonable to get some actual facts / proof in hand to make a decision regarding this game.  It's not unreasonable to expect something more forthright concerning SWTOR.  One only needs to take a look at the pile of brokenness, disappointments, cutbacks and steady stream of incidents ignoring player feedback to simply conclude that THIS TIME ...  I wait for proof before I take any more action!

[jedimasterjac]

5 minutes ago, OlBuzzard said:

I'd say you're closer to the fact here! Unquestionably the team has been given a directive to hold comments (for now).

I won't be hateful to the team ... but I will NOT budge off of my posts that I have made this time around!  Enough is enough!

Additionally: None of us asked for this bombshell!  IMO it's not unreasonable to get some actual facts / proof in hand to make a decision regarding this game.  It's not unreasonable to expect something more forthright concerning SWTOR.  One only needs to take a look at the pile of brokenness, disappointments, cutbacks and steady stream of incidents ignoring player feedback to simply conclude that THIS TIME ...  I wait for proof before I take any more action!

I agree. It’s just a tough situation. We have reason not to take BioWare at their word, the initial statement was vague and NOT reassuring, and there’s really just so little to go off of behind the fact that the intended studio is small and does nothing with the properties they own. 

Edited June 7, 2023 by jedimasterjac

[DawnAskham]

2 minutes ago, OlBuzzard said:

I'd say you're closer to the fact here! Unquestionably the team has been given a directive to hold comments (for now).

I won't be hateful to the team ... but I will NOT budge off of my posts that I have made this time around!  Enough is enough!

Additionally: None of us asked for this bombshell!  IMO it's not unreasonable to get some actual facts / proof in hand to make a decision regarding this game.  It's not unreasonable to expect something more forthright concerning SWTOR.  One only needs to take a look at the pile of brokenness, disappointments, cutbacks and steady stream of incidents ignoring player feedback to simply conclude that THIS TIME ...  I wait for proof before I take any more action!

Agree - though spending $15 a month on the game as long as you are enjoying it and having fun isn't a big commitment.

On the flip side, while I've never dumped cash into the game through the store, I'd double down on my general commentary that doing so is stupid, and at this point in time, would be really, really stupid.

[OlBuzzard]

1 minute ago, jedimasterjac said:

I agree. It’s just a tough situation. We have reason not to take BioWare at their word, the initial statement was vague and. It reassuring, and there’s really just so little to go off of behind the fact that the intended studio is small and does nothing with the properties they own. 

Exactlly ...

We were supposed to have a great 10th anniversary!  Right?  After all of the hype and when 7.0 dropped...
[/facepalm].

IMO there are numerous recent incidents that have simply compounded the situation.  I respect the team .. but this sort empty promise after BEOKEN promises has gone on long enough now! 

[jedimasterjac]

Just now, DawnAskham said:

Agree - though spending $15 a month on the game as long as you are enjoying it and having fun isn't a big commitment.

On the flip side, while I've never dumped cash into the game through the store, I'd double down on my general commentary that doing so is stupid, and at this point in time, would be really, really stupid.

Yeah, I saw some people saying “now’s the time to start whaling” and I really don’t get it. 
 

the game’s condition is more precarious than ever and you wanna dump more money into it? Huh?

[jedimasterjac]

Just now, OlBuzzard said:

IMO there are numerous recent incidents that have simply compounded the situation.  I respect the team .. but this sort empty promise after BEOKEN promises has gone on long enough now! 

Exactly. I really don’t fault the developers here. But things keep going wrong and promises keep getting broken.  

[OlBuzzard]

Just now, jedimasterjac said:

Yeah, I saw some people saying “now’s the time to start whaling” and I really don’t get it. 
 

the game’s condition is more precarious than ever and you wanna dump more money into it? Huh?

Say what??

(oh my stars) ...

Hopefully that was meant tongue-n-cheek (???)  Maybe???

[Enomars]

Y'all being silly.  That article cannot be 100% true there is NO WAY 80 developers were working exclusively on the this  game NO WAY. 

80? I mean 20 maybe? but 80? Do you realize what 80 developers can accomplish in a year?   What 80 humans can accomplish in a year?  No.  I will wait and see what transpires.  Half truths are not truth for me.  Did you know that in sign language there is no word for exaggerate?  ASL just uses the word LIE!   I will wait and see what is truth and what is real. 

[DawnAskham]

4 minutes ago, jedimasterjac said:

I agree. It’s just a tough situation. We have reason not to take BioWare at their word, the initial statement was vague and NOT reassuring, and there’s really just so little to go off of behind the fact that the intended studio is small and does nothing with the properties they own. 

I mentioned to some friends that absent some sort of release with more details about the deal, the face value of what we can see is not encouraging (reducing the staff by half, moving to a tiny studio that does minimal maintenance on old games).

Sure, maybe Broadsword has plans to grow beyond a studio where decades-old games go to live out their lives as museum relics, but making the kinds of assumptions that would see this as some sort of great opportunity for the game with what we do know would be more akin to speculative fiction than fact.

[OlBuzzard]

30 minutes ago, codydmaan said:

Everyone knows whats going to happen they just want to deny it before it happens. 

I'm guessing that is one example of "plausible deniability"?   It kind of sounds like it to me!

[jedimasterjac]

2 minutes ago, Enomars said:

80? I mean 20 maybe? but 80? Do you realize what 80 developers can accomplish in a year?   What 80 humans can accomplish in a year?

It’s really not unbelievable. 
 

the base game had 800 staffers prior to release:

 

https://www.gamespot.com/articles/star-wars-the-old-republic-cost-200-million-to-develop/1100-6348959/#:~:text=New report recounts creation of,to bring game to market.

WoW has several hundred:

 

https://www.laptopmag.com/news/wow-plans-to-add-100-new-staff-members-via-blizzard-acquisition-what-does-this-mean-for-dragonflight

 

we can split hairs over the use of “developer” (the article is probably conflating developers and all FT staff) but the reality is 80 people on the team is not unrealistic  

 

 

[jedimasterjac]

4 minutes ago, DawnAskham said:

Sure, maybe Broadsword has plans to grow beyond a studio where decades-old games go to live out their lives as museum relics, but making the kinds of assumptions that would see this as some sort of great opportunity for the game with what we do know would be more akin to speculative fiction than fact.

It would be super cool if this was an intended step to reinvent the studio! I truly hope it is. But that would be… very surprising. 

[DawnAskham]

3 minutes ago, Enomars said:

Y'all being silly.  That article cannot be 100% true there is NO WAY 80 developers were working exclusively on the this  game NO WAY. 

80? I mean 20 maybe? but 80? Do you realize what 80 developers can accomplish in a year?   What 80 humans can accomplish in a year?  No.  I will wait and see what transpires.  Half truths are not truth for me.  Did you know that in sign language there is no word for exaggerate?  ASL just uses the word LIE!   I will wait and see what is truth and what is real. 

I imagine it's 80 FTE, as in full-time equivalents allocated to Bioware Austin by Bioware / EA, not 80 actual full-time coders and artists creating content. 

As in the stated number could include administration, management, systems, other overhead, part-time employees, contractors, maybe the custodial staff, some partial allocation of Bioware / EA management, etc. 

[sithBracer]

1 hour ago, KeithKanneg said:

Whoa whoa everyone... I was hoping me telling you about the upcoming releases would help you understand this is a new beginning, not the end.

We have more stories, modernizations, and MMO content already being planned out beyond 7.4.  While details are being discussed and finalized behind the scenes, let's not spin this into incorrect theories.  I am asking you to hang tight and we'll follow up later with more details when we can.

-Keith

Ok, you do know that we have to pretty little thing called google right? And we can look up broadsword, who they are and what they do, right?

Do you honestly expect us to believe that you cutting the development team in half-and lets be honest it will end up being even less than that-and sending them off to a company that does nothing but keep games in maintenance mode, doesn't add anything other than more microtransactions and p2w schemes being bad for the player base is an "incorrect theory"?

We already know what your plans are after 7.4, because was saw broadsword do it before. Nothing but p2w microtransactions. So what is it going to be? Reskinned p2w armor or platinum augments you can only buy in the cartel market? We know it definitely is not going to be any actual content, fixes to current content/balance, not even one new flash point.

Cancelling my sub and definitely not buying any more coins.

[Drew_Braxton]

Is that code for something? Are we going to see Jackie as one of Flo's coworkers in future Progressive commercials?

[GeneralGyro]

i wanna know what happens with seasons after the acquisition

[LtGeneralGezlin]

1 hour ago, KeithKanneg said:

Whoa whoa everyone... I was hoping me telling you about the upcoming releases would help you understand this is a new beginning, not the end.

We have more stories, modernizations, and MMO content already being planned out beyond 7.4.  While details are being discussed and finalized behind the scenes, let's not spin this into incorrect theories.  I am asking you to hang tight and we'll follow up later with more details when we can.

-Keith

I'm glad to hear more from you Keith, I will say, I wish this had been part of yesterday's post. Would have cut down on some of the doom and gloom posting (Well, maybe not).

But, the more I hear from both current and former SWTOR Devs, and look into Broadsword, the more... optimistic I am about a potential move.

[CrazyScruffy]

Just now, LtGeneralGezlin said:

I'm glad to hear more from you Keith, I will say, I wish this had been part of yesterday's post. Would have cut down on some of the doom and gloom posting (Well, maybe not).

But, the more I hear from both current and former SWTOR Devs, and look into Broadsword, the more... optimistic I am about a potential move.

Yes I'm sure all the Devs former and Current are reaching out to YOU personally to make you feel better about this deal... please enlighten the rest of us, as we've done the research and there is not a shred of evidence that points to optimism

[sithBracer]

4 minutes ago, CrazyScruffy said:

Yes I'm sure all the Devs former and Current are reaching out to YOU personally to make you feel better about this deal... please enlighten the rest of us, as we've done the research and there is not a shred of evidence that points to optimism

I think he just snapped.

[CrazyScruffy]

1 minute ago, sithBracer said:

I think he just snapped.

That or this is an inactive account that the Devs use to post positive comments for them

[ReKabNad]

1 hour ago, OlBuzzard said:

Thing is .. (as the old saying goes) ... "fool me once ... shame on you ... fool me twice!!  Shame on me!"

Fool me 3,000 times, you're a Meteorologist! 😜

[JakRoanin]

1 hour ago, OlBuzzard said:

I don't fault @KeithKanneg for his attempt to quiet things down a bit.  Yet most of us who have even been on the management side of similar situations know that it's just not good at all.  If I were to meet him or @JackieKo either one I'd still be as kind as possible.

BUT:  with all of the smoke and mirrors we have seen in the past it's time to get some straight up answers!  It's time to get real with customers like myself and many others who have been here since the beginning!

The game is about to be put out to pasture!  It's just that simple.  I don't need someone jerking my chain as though I'm totally ignorant of the matter!

AND YES ... it is also true that when the outside media is providing more information than what we are receiving here that really compounds the situation in a hugely negative fashion!!  IF EA is hamstringing the team and telling them to keep quite ... just exactly what sort of reaction can anyone expect to get?

** Does the team really expect us to sit quietly by this time?  (I don't think so .. not this time)  The game is ending (from all indications).
** No need to apologize BW ... just shoot straight with us and stop stonewalling!

BTW... it should be noted that posting this is not much fun at all!

I think @JackieKo is one of the nicest people I have ever talked to. But, it is weird that the SWTOR staff is muzzled when EA blabs. I feel sorry for @KeithKanneg and @JackieKo, but truth is truth and some real answers would be great.

[Gwena]

Thank you Mr. Kanneg for the clarification, but this news is still very disheartening. From what I have seen posted here about Broadsword, I am . . . not optimistic.

That said, I still have a lot of content to do in SWTOR so I will stick around as a month-to-month sub for awhile at least. Hopefully by the time FFXIV puts out their next expansion it will be apparent whether or not SWTOR is truly going into maintenance mode or not, so I can decide if I want to go back to XIV or not. I really love Star Wars, and would prefer a Star Wars MMO, but not a dead one. Time will tell, I suppose!

[Headstylez]

29 minutes ago, LtGeneralGezlin said:

I'm glad to hear more from you Keith, I will say, I wish this had been part of yesterday's post. Would have cut down on some of the doom and gloom posting (Well, maybe not).

But, the more I hear from both current and former SWTOR Devs, and look into Broadsword, the more... optimistic I am about a potential move.

I, too, feel more optimistic the more I look into Broadsword.  For instance, their website looks like it hasn’t been updated in 20 years, which must mean they don’t bother with such nonsense and instead spend all their time working on the two, historic titles within their purview. This makes sense because everyone knows that when it comes to MMORPGS that are more than 10 years old, Dark Age of Camelot remains the premier choice above all others.