PSA: Don't be critical of the devs

[RJWidowMaker]

If you do decide to question them or in general post any criticism you will only find the handful of dedicated defenders dismissing any concern you have.

 

You won't be heard and you will have your opinion vilified by said defenders. Morale of the story? Your feedback doesn't matter and the defenders on this forum will be sure to make sure you don't hurt their friend's, BW and EA, feelings.

[Galbsadi]

It is sad when people respond that way.

 

I believe they think they're "protecting" the game somehow.

 

I don't know if they realize that they're actually hurting it, preventing valuable feedback that could make it better from getting to the devs.

[WHTJunior]

The mantra that I go by, is that it's fine to be critical of a game, and to provide feedback about that game. That being said, there is no need to make it personal. Now, I've never seen anyone go after a specific dev here, but I have seen it for other games, where the criticism seems more about the person, rather than feedback about the game. Never make it personal. That's how I approach it.

[RJWidowMaker]

The mantra that I go by, is that it's fine to be critical of a game, and to provide feedback about that game. That being said, there is no need to make it personal. Now, I've never seen anyone go after a specific dev here, but I have seen it for other games, where the criticism seems more about the person, rather than feedback about the game. Never make it personal. That's how I approach it.

 

And that is a respectable way to go about it

[Prapcaster]

I'm probably guilty of being over critical of class changes. But at the end of the day this is just a video game. Even if 7.0 was to kill the game which it won't, oh well. The devs are just a group of people that got a job from EA to work on a star wars game they're not boogiemen trying to ruin your life.

[RJWidowMaker]

I'm probably guilty of being over critical of class changes. But at the end of the day this is just a video game. Even if 7.0 was to kill the game which it won't, oh well. The devs are just a group of people that got a job from EA to work on a star wars game they're not boogiemen trying to ruin your life.

 

Who make decisions for the game that have been historically unsuccessful in MMOs. When people give the feedback that it is an unwanted change and explain why that is still feedback. Not something to belittled by assigning the value that giver of said feedback believes the developers are boogieman.

 

Thank you for proving my point.

[Prapcaster]

Who make decisions for the game that have been historically unsuccessful in MMOs. When people give the feedback that it is an unwanted change and explain why that is still feedback. Not something to belittled by assigning the value that giver of said feedback believes the developers are boogieman.

 

Thank you for proving my point.

 

Not even remotely my point but okay

[BRKMSN]

Let me try to fit in here.

 

I agree with all criticism. Will you be my friend now?

[MadDutchman]

If you do decide to question them or in general post any criticism you will only find the handful of dedicated defenders dismissing any concern you have.

 

You won't be heard and you will have your opinion vilified by said defenders. Morale of the story? Your feedback doesn't matter and the defenders on this forum will be sure to make sure you don't hurt their friend's, BW and EA, feelings.

 

Funny, I could say about the exact opposite.

 

People who genuinely look forward to the 7.0 changes being belittled or dismissed because they are only story players. Doesn't matter what they want when PVP and Ops players, the elite of the elite, are disturbed right?

[Nortumberland]

The last time I put my trust in Devs, they've butchered my beloved Bounty Hunter. No more Flamer for Merc, no more DFA, Dart or Unload for PT. My second fav - Operative - lost the awesome Orbital Strike. Now they are taking away Overload Shot and Sleep Dart. SLEEP DART. This time I'd rather get all the hate I deserve but keep posting my criticism on their Great Pruning Plan.

[BRKMSN]

Funny, I could say about the exact opposite.

 

People who genuinely look forward to the 7.0 changes being belittled or dismissed because they are only story players. Doesn't matter what they want when PVP and Ops players, the elite of the elite, are disturbed right?

 

People just can't believe that another person could possible have an opinion contrary to their own. It amazes me how often I see posts like this OP. I see a lot of posts by people that I feel represents my opinion on a topic. If their reply says everything I would have said, I don't bother to reply. So when I do reply, it's more often to disagree with someone's opinion (which is discussing). I will go back and forth with a lot posters debating one thing or another. Many times, I've been accused of "being a troll" or "just wanting to argue for the sake of argument." The truth is, I just have my own strong opinions. I'm going to continue to share them when I feel like it.

 

So If I defend the Devs in this forum, it's because I don't share someone else's disappointment. I don't defend them because they should be worshiped like some deity or something. That notion is ridiculous. If you are so sure that you have presented a great argument, then you should not mind contrary replies at all. You should be able to further validate your point. The problem, though, is when the argument is just based on an emotional reaction and full of fallacy. When those types of arguments are exposed, people turn on the opponent and make topics just like this one.

Edited August 26, 2021 by BRKMSN

[Hadsil]

If people only heard from those who agree with them problems will persist. No one is above criticism. You can double down your position and disagree with the criticism, but barring being rude and insulting you don't tell people to shut up because they disagree with you.

 

As it happens the developers do read the comments here, but just because people criticize something doesn't mean they have to change what's bugging them. You can't please everyone, and the developers are perfectly fine with having the disgruntled few because the developers find it a desired feature to keep what they are complaining about. However, it's also possible the developers can agree with the criticism and fix the problem. They did that most recently fixing the difficulty of Spirit of Vengeance in Story mode, primarily the Final Boss Battle. In Eternal Throne people kept kvetching about the Mouse Droid quest. They couldn't/wouldn't get rid of it, but they gave you a stun power to help you get through it easier to get it over with. It took awhile, but they also fixed the Walker Quest on Voss so that it's no longer a frustration of continuous deaths to get through it.

 

It is a disappointment and frustration when the developers do not/will not change the Thing you complain about, but don't let anyone tell you how dare you complain and should shut up about it. Be mindful you're not being a donkey cavity yourself in your complaint.

Edited August 26, 2021 by Hadsil

[TrixxieTriss]

If you do decide to question them or in general post any criticism you will only find the handful of dedicated defenders dismissing any concern you have.

 

You won't be heard and you will have your opinion vilified by said defenders. Morale of the story? Your feedback doesn't matter and the defenders on this forum will be sure to make sure you don't hurt their friend's, BW and EA, feelings.

 

LoL, when I read the thread title I actually thought it was bait and you’d be posting about how great the devs were so you could white knight and argue with people. But I see I was completely wrong.

May I ask, in what recent threads did this happen to you. I don’t recall seeing you post anything controversial towards the devs.

[RJWidowMaker]

LoL, when I read the thread title I actually thought it was bait and you’d be posting about how great the devs were so you could white knight and argue with people. But I see I was completely wrong.

May I ask, in what recent threads did this happen to you. I don’t recall seeing you post anything controversial towards the devs.

 

It's a general sentiment. While venting frustration, I didn't plan on calling out names. To the poster above this reply, I don't intend on hashing it out with you either.

[Tsillah]

PVP and Ops players, the elite of the elite

But sweeping generalizations are ok apparently.

[Rion_Starkiller]

Funny, I could say about the exact opposite.

 

People who genuinely look forward to the 7.0 changes being belittled or dismissed because they are only story players. Doesn't matter what they want when PVP and Ops players, the elite of the elite, are disturbed right?

 

It's not just story players looking forward to 7.0. Raider & regstar here. I'm ok with the 7.0 class changes because I've been playing these stale specs since the dawn of time. The set bonuses and tacticals in 6.0 pointed out how antiquated classes/specs have become over the years.

 

Plus Chris hinted at new combat styles? Sign me up.

Edited August 26, 2021 by Rion_Starkiller

[Ardrossan]

By your logic, if you aren't praising the devs, you don't care about the game and shouldn't post your concerns. That by some means you should just give up and quit? No, that isn't usually the case.

 

lol no, that's not "by my logic". Rather that's by your logic that "I will take everything personally and assume that quitting is equivalent to 'giving up'" lmao. You very kindly made a second example in this thread of your irrationality so we have something to compare to:

 

Who make decisions for the game that have been historically unsuccessful in MMOs. When people give the feedback that it is an unwanted change and explain why that is still feedback. Not something to belittled by assigning the value that giver of said feedback believes the developers are boogieman.

 

Thank you for proving my point.

 

Here's a wild idea: maybe no one, or very few people, are actually defending the devs. Maybe you're just crazily obsessed and anyone who questions your hyperbolic claims , you immediately dismiss as a white knight because you can't handle disagreement? Ikr, mindblowing.

[timovdt]

I'm probably guilty of being over critical of class changes. But at the end of the day this is just a video game. Even if 7.0 was to kill the game which it won't, oh well. The devs are just a group of people that got a job from EA to work on a star wars game they're not boogiemen trying to ruin your life.

 

as a sorc player since 1.0 i kinda want to disagree with the boogiemen part XD.

Being a dev on an mmo is a bit different to being a dev on any other kind of game as you are dealing with allot of things other kinds of games don't deal with and it is still there responibility to do the best they can for the player base while still making a profit .

 

sadly most game devs these days do not care about the first part anymore and will force there ideas regadless of them being good or bad on the game and thats something that is more harmfull in the hands of a mmo dev then any other kind people spend hundreds, thousands of hours in an mmo verry few games can match sutch numbers .

 

and devs responsible for failiures should be punished, if you are a cook and you serve 1000 costumers a raw steak you won't keep your job verry long , the same should be for devs if you fail to do your job one to many times you should be punishd otherwise you end up with stuff like thats going on at blizzard and i don't think anyone wants that

[DjiiniTwo]

The last time I put my trust in Devs, they've butchered my beloved Bounty Hunter. No more Flamer for Merc, no more DFA, Dart or Unload for PT. My second fav - Operative - lost the awesome Orbital Strike. Now they are taking away Overload Shot and Sleep Dart. SLEEP DART. This time I'd rather get all the hate I deserve but keep posting my criticism on their Great Pruning Plan.

 

To this day I will never forgive them for removing channeled Flamethrower. Legit the biggest part of Powertech class fantasy and it's just goooone.

[MadDutchman]

But sweeping generalizations are ok apparently.

 

This is a thread created on a sweeping generalization. Which is part of the point I was trying to make.

 

If the OP is going to share their general perspective on the state of the topic, I think it's fitting to do the exact same thing

[RikuvonDrake]

devs can of course make mistakes but the reality is that they have all the data and statistics that no player has access to, so them making changes etc. is by far more often the correct decision regardless of what a few people think despite their anecdotal evidence

 

of course, people can still complain but it's pretty ironic if you look at the pts forums, everyone is whining so much about the changes instead of giving feedback despite the devs clearly highlight that everything is early in development and subject to change

[WHTJunior]

if you are a cook and you serve 1000 costumers a raw steak you won't keep your job verry long

 

This is not even close to the same thing. If you want to relate this to food, raw meat is not the same as what game devs give you.

 

To equal raw meat in an MMO, it would be like removing all taunts from the tank, and telling them to git gud, when they literally have no aggro abilities.

 

If you want to go the opposite way, for the food reference, it would be like the chef limiting the menu to their best entrees, but when you go there, you don't like them. You've never worked in the food/dev industry, so you can't explain why you don't like it. Complain all you want, they will say they know better than you, because they know the data, the struggles with code, the dealings with executives, and the time constraints.

 

In this way, it is fine to provide feedback about the things you don't enjoy, and how you feel they could be improved. It just breaks down when people think their ideas are better than the devs', because the ideas exist in a vacuum, which doesn't include all of the information that the devs have.

[BRKMSN]

Anybody else getting hungry?

[Damask_Rose]

of course, people can still complain but it's pretty ironic if you look at the pts forums, everyone is whining so much about the changes instead of giving feedback despite the devs clearly highlight that everything is early in development and subject to change

 

Where is the irony? The developers asked for feedback on what is on the PTS. People are giving feedback on what is on the PTS. Negative feedback is still feedback. If the developers didn't want feedback on an early and incomplete version, they shouldn't have put it on the PTS and asked for feedback.

[eabevella]

More like the chef says

"now you can put pineapple on your italian pizza and cheese in your chinese fried rice"

"but we'll remove tomatoes from the italian pizza options and egg from the chinese fried rice options"

and call it food innovation.

 

While we seemly have more options (combat styles), we also see important skills (sleep dart) being removed from the skill trees, which makes me wary of the change.