SWTOR is incredibly underrated

[foxmob]

I've always had trouble with ESO. I bought it for PC and played beta on PC, but it feels like a console port. I haven't ever leveled much in it. it feels like I should be using an xbox controller not a mouse and keyboard. so much so that I get annoyed by it and do something else.

[FlameYOL]

I find it funny that all the responses to this thread so far are all complete bashing posts....yet those people are still here everyday playing the game. Thats the behavior ill just never understand.

 

*raises a glass to all the 40 year olds*

 

SWTOR forums, SWTOR forums never changes.

[Damask_Rose]

Not really.

 

The way the system works is great the things that ruin it are the details. for instance, lazyness of stories(some feel like they just didn't really even care about capturing the audience but an attempt to quickly finish the job so they can say they finished), the extremely poor acting(not all of it ofc), terribly easy content(this one for me is BIG one, i just don't get a kick out of pushing 1 button to kill 1 mob, that is the worse, i mean... i have 3 full bars of skills but only, really, need to use my resource spammable, that point alone says a lot and should resinate very deep to the developers who are in charge of the difficulty), literally no challenge(most people enjoy some level of challenge),

 

Some stories are just so damn bland that i wanna just smash my keyboard on the face of the person who developed the story. I would much rather have 1 breath taking story than to have 50 subpar stories that will inevitably turn me away from the game.

 

One of the biggest issues that i imagine why so many people (including myself) turn away from this game is because they realize this community are so set on how the system works now. They don't want changes to the difficulty and in fact want it easier, they don't want to consider people's point of view. The community give the developer no wiggle room to try new things. This community is made up for 40 year olds with the fear of change and as the saying goes, you can't teach old dog new tricks.

 

Teenagers, and young adults don't get a kick out of this passive, braindless grind. It doesn't stimulate their brains or their bodies in any way shape or form. And all this is meant to be brutally honest just based on what ive observed. Take my observation with a grain of salt.

 

The game and the way it works, amazing but the details is what ruins it and those can easily be changed and enhanced, thats the good part. They can make breathtaking DLC's/Chapters, they can increase the difficulty(not impossible but somewhat challenging to the point that fights are at least semi-technical, perhaps not the regular world mobs but end of story bosses should be technical battles, this is what makes all games that have ever existed fun, you get to the last fight and you knew for a FACT that battle was going to need some sort of strategy, and SWTOR storyline is the complete opposite, dont fix what isn't broken this system has existted since tetris and its worked since, that is why no games except for this one apparently attempt to change the model, why?).

 

TL;DR game is amazing if they had worked it well and took advantage of it but most of the content is made in a lazy manner it appears to me clearly. And too much of it is easy, story should be the cherry on top of the gameplay not the core and dependent variable. It clearly does not work as good as it should if you had invested more time in improving the challenging and rewarding part of it, and the mental stimulation.

 

 

It sounds like you came to this game long after a lot of changes were already made and don't really know what you are talking about. The game was harder and made much easier over time. Some of us old timers would love to see it go back to the way it was, but we are in the minority. Many of the people who liked the changes are people who like to race to end game. Harder solo leveling content would just slow them down. Different people like their challenge in different places. It's not an older vs. younger player thing. Those of us who have played the game for a long time have seen a lot of change for the worse. Change is not always good. Dollars to donuts, if Bioware suggested some genuinely good changes, the vast majority of older, veteran players would be on board.

 

I disagree whole-heartedly about where story should be in the priority list. Challenging or not, the story is rewarding all on it's own. It is the crown jewel of this game. It's what draws people in and what sets it apart. Now, I fully agree that the story content for the past 4 or 5 years has been pretty slip-shod, but the answer isn't to deprioritize it further, but to try and return it to a higher quality. (And we need more challenging end-game content as well. Eggs should never be put in just one basket!)

[Ardrossan]

I came back to play some of the base story (starter planet to Corellia, by far the best story content in the game) and clicked a referral link (which are going away tomorrow.) If I know someone really likes SW, I will recommend subbing for 30-60 days and playing the 8 original class stories and all the planets arcs. Beyond that, it isn't really worth playing. And even the original story is now so easy it isn't even funny. As preferred I was level 22 leaving Tython. But, the original stories are pretty good and can be played for nothing in whatever gear you pick up.

 

I can not in good conscience recommend the newer content at all (KOTFE and newer.) KotFE, like Last Jedi, destroyed characters and story and there's just no going back from that.

 

I agree with everything said here. Also here on referral. And it makes me curious about ESO because I've never tried it. Heard the story is nothing to write home about.

[OlBuzzard]

Sadly I’m no longer 40 either.

 

You will notice in my criticism of the game, I also said it was good, just not polished like the games suggested in the OP.

 

As someone whose been here non stop since day one, my perspective is a little different to players who come and go every few years or haven’t been here through all the good and bad stuff as it happens.

 

My critique was an honest portrayal of some core issues that have held this game back from greatness. At no time in my critique did I bash the game or state anything that’s not true.

 

The game has some great story, content, systems and is unique. But over the years it’s gathered a lot of bad baggage that diminishes its potential. My criticism is that the game should and could be so much better with the right resources and corporate leadership.

 

It’s because we love the game that we are still here. But it’s not good enough to keep everyone here who can see the issues. If you are not willing to honestly look at the problems and love it anyway, then you will also leave like it everyone else has.

 

 

HA !! Wait a few more years !! You'll be ignored by almost everybody!! ... But that's just life !!

 

Yes the potential for the game is still there !!

NO ... it's not growing to that potential !! And for the most part this is VERY puzzling !! IMO ... Disney should be all over this !! It could easily set people up with such a positive experience in game that the rest of their Star Wars Galaxy / Experience would be another avenue to travel !! ( I wonder how many BUGS are ignored daily in that place ?? )

 

IMO it has nothing to do with the abilities of the development team or the MANY who are involved in the actual production of the game.

 

There is definitely "something rotten in Denmark" !!

 

 

:rak_02:Let’s also not forget that swtor doesn’t charge for expansions or updates like WoW does. This is major difference between the two games. Plus swtor is free to play for a vast majority of the player base.

At the end of the day, the saying goes, “you get what you pay for”.

 

Sadly this has been a major issue for swtor development. Without the budget and resources that comes from full subscription services and paid expansions, swtor was always doomed to a cycle of far less content and less often than a game like WoW.

 

I would throw my money at a $50-$60 swtor expansion if they were as big as WoWs and BioWare cared enough about making the game fun again over cash shop micro transactions and punishing gambling mechanics.

I think many of us long time subscribers would pay if BioWare showed they still cared about what the players want. Which is to have fun playing an enjoyable game to unwind and lose yourself in the Star War universe. It’s certainly not playing a game like it’s a second job that has lots of small annoyances that degrade the fun experience.

 

Heck ... I'm on a fixed income (retired old fart ) ... and I'd pay up to ( but not over) $100 for the real deal expansion !! IF IT HAD the real deal in it again !! They could even keep their (sacred) cash cow !!!

 

Please note: most of the suggestions that most of make are not that good ! I get that !! But there are SEVERAL which really do have merit !!

 

BW could easily take those ideas and run all the way to the bank (with their pockets full) !!! Make those ideas their own !! BUT above ALL !! Do it with style and do it right !!

Edited April 27, 2021 by OlBuzzard

[DarkTergon]

I agree with everything said here. Also here on referral. And it makes me curious about ESO because I've never tried it. Heard the story is nothing to write home about.

 

I've tried it, admittedly didn't get very far in it, thought it would be like skyrim, but the controls didn't feel as good.

Not putting the game down, it's possible I just didn't give it enough time. The next time they've a free trial period again, I'll probably give it a go, as it is, I spend a lot less time here.

Edited April 26, 2021 by DarkTergon

[DarkSabrina]

It has it's moments, but as people have said, it does have it's issues, and it appears the team keep compounding them, Edited April 26, 2021 by DarkSabrina

[Kalnarius]

I have played many MMOs of the yrs. This is the 1 that kinda stuck for me even longer than i stuck with WoW. And i played wow nonstop from classic-early cata and have return a couple of times since but WoW has always be a bugfest at times. They break the game more than people seem to realize or acknowledge and even when they are releasing content since wotlk they have made a lot of errors that people complain more about that than Swtor player can even manage to complain about the entire list of flaws with this game. No game is without its flaws, bugs or mistreating of the game and player base. At the end of the day it all comes down to how to maximize profits with as little needed funds for any MMO. Sure some companies invested more into their products but they do the exact same thing as EA and Bioware people are just oblivious to it.

 

As for the areas Swtor needs to address is more voice actors, characters, more story depth more than just 1 operation or 1 big operation a 1 boss operation per expansion. Need a good 3 but they would rush operations into a imperfect form so better gearing system (even as much galactic command was imperfect it was a superior gearing system to what we have now. plus we have had the same item level this entire expansion thats kinda dropping the ball on that aspect. will say some of the sets were improvements but a lot of the classes would have been better off with the classic-ossus set bonus gear.) or more either cosmetic reward drops meaning armor, weapons, mounts and etc. Some reason to actually do operations other than for the fun of them at times. Nostalgia only goes so far with them when you have done the same ops 100s of thousands before. They were also limited to what Disney actually allowed EA/Bioware to actually do with content even though they had freedom with it Disney did have a big say in this game after they bought Lucasarts/film. So this game was as much handcuffed by EA as it was by Disney. It was a cash maker which Bioware hoped would be the case for Anthem but that didnt go right so now they are redevoting resources to here because they need wins on the board. They can't exactly count on Dragon Age or the new Mass Effect coming out to fix their woes. Swtor needs to be front and center for Bioware. Which is good and bad for the game. Sure there has been a lot of bad stuff in the past with the game but also a lot people just never really got into the game through gameplay standards because they were so use to be handicapped with UI mods from wow and other games.

 

What this game does well is storytelling is a lot richer than most of other games out there and the voice acting is way better than a lot of games. Could it be better? Absolutely no question any game could say that even the best games. Could do with some more features replay of previous content not just Kotfe/kotet chapters but the ability to replay any part of the story. More companions could have a bigger role than just be collecting dust on Odessen after they are obtained. Dont see class stories returning to the game in forseeable future though aspects of original class stories for each class could make up for that something that ties in the old stories with the future direction of the game. Return to classic worlds like Coruscant, Dromund Kaas, Hoth, Alderaan, Balmorra, Taris, Tatooine. Going to planets rich in the storyline like Kaysheek, Ruins of Malachor, Endor, more jedi and sith stronghold worlds that were part of the ancient orders and the big 1 Mandalore the planet itself.

 

I am agree that this game is underrated but also has untapped potential even still 10 yrs after launch. The fact it is still alive when other MMOs have been launched and died out since and people still want this to die out much almost the same way people want WoW to just die both games keep dragging on. Because there is something that attracts people to games and holds them even if others cannot really see what it is keeping fans loyal to games, that is on the individual player and only they truly know why they stick around. I like swtor for what it is, not a mmo but a choice based voice acted rpg that just happens to have some MMO features adapted to it. By no means would i count swtor a mmo and i think that is actually a good thing for it.

[OlBuzzard]

I have played many MMOs of the yrs. This is the 1 that kinda stuck for me even longer than i stuck with WoW. And i played wow nonstop from classic-early cata and have return a couple of times since but WoW has always be a bugfest at times. They break the game more than people seem to realize or acknowledge and even when they are releasing content since wotlk they have made a lot of errors that people complain more about that than Swtor player can even manage to complain about the entire list of flaws with this game. No game is without its flaws, bugs or mistreating of the game and player base. At the end of the day it all comes down to how to maximize profits with as little needed funds for any MMO. Sure some companies invested more into their products but they do the exact same thing as EA and Bioware people are just oblivious to it.

 

As for the areas Swtor needs to address is more voice actors, characters, more story depth more than just 1 operation or 1 big operation a 1 boss operation per expansion. Need a good 3 but they would rush operations into a imperfect form so better gearing system (even as much galactic command was imperfect it was a superior gearing system to what we have now. plus we have had the same item level this entire expansion thats kinda dropping the ball on that aspect. will say some of the sets were improvements but a lot of the classes would have been better off with the classic-ossus set bonus gear.) or more either cosmetic reward drops meaning armor, weapons, mounts and etc. Some reason to actually do operations other than for the fun of them at times. Nostalgia only goes so far with them when you have done the same ops 100s of thousands before. They were also limited to what Disney actually allowed EA/Bioware to actually do with content even though they had freedom with it Disney did have a big say in this game after they bought Lucasarts/film. So this game was as much handcuffed by EA as it was by Disney. It was a cash maker which Bioware hoped would be the case for Anthem but that didnt go right so now they are redevoting resources to here because they need wins on the board. They can't exactly count on Dragon Age or the new Mass Effect coming out to fix their woes. Swtor needs to be front and center for Bioware. Which is good and bad for the game. Sure there has been a lot of bad stuff in the past with the game but also a lot people just never really got into the game through gameplay standards because they were so use to be handicapped with UI mods from wow and other games.

 

What this game does well is storytelling is a lot richer than most of other games out there and the voice acting is way better than a lot of games. Could it be better? Absolutely no question any game could say that even the best games. Could do with some more features replay of previous content not just Kotfe/kotet chapters but the ability to replay any part of the story. More companions could have a bigger role than just be collecting dust on Odessen after they are obtained. Dont see class stories returning to the game in forseeable future though aspects of original class stories for each class could make up for that something that ties in the old stories with the future direction of the game. Return to classic worlds like Coruscant, Dromund Kaas, Hoth, Alderaan, Balmorra, Taris, Tatooine. Going to planets rich in the storyline like Kaysheek, Ruins of Malachor, Endor, more jedi and sith stronghold worlds that were part of the ancient orders and the big 1 Mandalore the planet itself.

 

I am agree that this game is underrated but also has untapped potential even still 10 yrs after launch. The fact it is still alive when other MMOs have been launched and died out since and people still want this to die out much almost the same way people want WoW to just die both games keep dragging on. Because there is something that attracts people to games and holds them even if others cannot really see what it is keeping fans loyal to games, that is on the individual player and only they truly know why they stick around. I like swtor for what it is, not a mmo but a choice based voice acted rpg that just happens to have some MMO features adapted to it. By no means would i count swtor a mmo and i think that is actually a good thing for it.

 

A lot of good points !!

 

SWTOR is, however, a MMO ... of sorts !! MMO's are changing / evolving !! IMO that is a good thing !! And (once again) SWTOR has the potential to capitalize on that as well !!

 

Sooooo why are they NOT doing that ??

[HiltoftheDragon]

A lot of good points !!

 

SWTOR is, however, a MMO ... of sorts !! MMO's are changing / evolving !! IMO that is a good thing !! And (once again) SWTOR has the potential to capitalize on that as well !!

 

Sooooo why are they NOT doing that ??

 

From one old buzzard to another.....i agree with this.

You would think anything with "Star Wars" on the label would be a huge incentive enough to pour more resources into this involving hot rod. It doesnt baflfe the mind why though....its the gaming business like it or not im afraid.

[HiltoftheDragon]

SWTOR forums, SWTOR forums never changes.

 

Ah, i found a Fallout player. Another fine and colorful community over there as well lol .

[OlBuzzard]

From one old buzzard to another.....i agree with this.

You would think anything with "Star Wars" on the label would be a huge incentive enough to pour more resources into this involving hot rod. It doesnt baflfe the mind why though....its the gaming business like it or not im afraid.

 

True !!

 

But still .. just think of the satisfied customers (which translates into a BIGGER CASH...cow !!!)

 

Well ... there is one reason that "might" make sense... especially in the game industry! (I'm just not sure it's a good idea to go there right now!!)

Edited April 26, 2021 by OlBuzzard

[HiltoftheDragon]

True !!

 

But still .. just think of the satisfied customers (which translates into a BIGGER CASH...cow !!!)

 

Well ... there is one reason that "might" make sense... especially in the game industry! (I'm just not sure it's a good idea to go there right now!!)

 

Youre right, its not. Bringing stuff up like that is at times worse than political talk in DK or coruscant chat.

[Darkbloom]

True !!

 

But still .. just think of the satisfied customers (which translates into a BIGGER CASH...cow !!!)

 

Well ... there is one reason that "might" make sense... especially in the game industry! (I'm just not sure it's a good idea to go there right now!!)

 

Yeah see, here's how I look at things.

 

A lot of people want to use WoW as a comparison, but WoW is just the wrong comparison for any game. It was a once-in-forever phenomenon that now moves along due to its legacy. And then there's ESO, which is just a terrible PC MMO. So I don't think that's a good comparison either.

 

No, the right comparison is FFXIV. Both had famous IP's. Both had difficult launches. Both recovered, at least to some extent, where other MMO's with famous IP's just flopped and stayed down.

 

But it sure seems like FFXIV gets a lot more attention and resources than SWTOR does. Why?

 

Well, to me, the answer is how important FFXIV is to Square Enix versus how important SWTOR is to EA. And I mean, there's just no comparison. FFXIV is far more important to the overall image of Square Enix.

 

I think that, as far as the corporate heads at EA are concerned, SWTOR has been a success since it went free-to-play. Now others may have a different opinion, of course. But even if you don't think SWTOR has been a success, let's be real. SWTOR isn't even one of the top Star Wars failures for EA! They screwed up that one game so badly it got real national press. Disney had to step in and send their goons down to the EA offices to smack some fools around.

 

But EA is EA, and they have a million things going on. Star Wars is just one of several properties for them. It's not a flagship like Final Fantasy is to Square Enix. For a lot of gamers, Square Enix IS Final Fantasy. I mean, I didn't even know they did anything else until I googled it.

 

So for the most part I really try to not get post about the fact that I feel SWTOR gets shortchanged. But who knows. For what it's worth, if I was trying to frame why SWTOR should get more resources, here's how I'd do it:

***

Look, we all know a PC MMO is never gonna be the next big thing. But even though it's an aging market, it's also a surprisingly stable market. And it's a market with a brutally high barrier to entry.

 

Amazon just canceled their Lord of the Rings MMO, and that comes right after they already had canceled their other attempt at an MMO. There isn't gonna be another triple-A MMO for who knows how long.

 

So realistically, investing in SWTOR is a low-risk, medium-reward proposition. WoW still dominates the MMO space, but its subscriber base is famously cyclical. If SWTOR came out with a nice-sized expansion during one of WoW's predictable downturns, it would lead to a big influx of subscribers and cartel purchases.

 

That's how I'd frame it.

[OlBuzzard]

Youre right, its not. Bringing stuff up like that is at times worse than political talk in DK or coruscant chat.

 

NOPE !! (sorry wrong on that one !!)

 

Frankly: NOTHING is any worse than the DK or Coruscant chat !!

 

Bottom line:

 

The potential for this game is yet untapped !! I would also suggest that the game is at a cross road ! The next few months will reveal the truth. It will either bring excitement and applause for unveiling a new chapter in the story of SWTOR (in more ways than one) ... or it will see the final hope of the games future falter and weaken what is left !!

 

If you've read very many of my posts in the past you know that deep down in side many of us (like myself) are hoping for the best ! Some of us ( like myself ) find it a bit puzzling as to why some issues have not been resolved and some other choices ( that I will NOT go into ) have been made !!

 

Well ... we're starting to rehash this a bit ... sooo I'll just let the rest go !

 

BTW... thanks for the discussion ! Good to be able to speak openly (and civil) on such matters !! Refreshing !!

[/two thumbs up]

[TrixxieTriss]

BioWare are about to make another stupid change that’s going to drive some players away or stop others from having fun.

 

Patch notes 6.3

PvP brackets have been merged into two brackets instead of three: 1-74 and 75.

This would only make sense if they boost all players in lowbie to lvl 74 to give them all abilities and utilities of lvl 74.

 

But there is nothing in the patch notes to say that is happening. So this is just another example of BioWare F*********g with players fun that will make the game fail faster.

Edited April 27, 2021 by TrixxieTriss

[Rion_Starkiller]

BioWare are about to make another stupid change that’s going to drive some players away or stop others from having fun.

 

Patch notes 6.3

 

This would only make sense if they boost all players in lowbie to lvl 74 to give them all abilities and utilities of lvl 74.

 

But there is nothing in the patch notes to say that is happening. So this is just another example of BioWare F*********g with players fun that will make the game fail faster.

 

I'm guessing it's to help with queue pops, but I'm secretly excited to find out if a level 10 IO-Merc spamming basic attack will out dps some 70-74 toons. :D

Edited April 27, 2021 by Rion_Starkiller

[TrixxieTriss]

I'm guessing it's to help with queue pops, but I'm secretly excited to find out if a level 10 IO-Merc spamming basic attack will out dps some 70-74 toons. :D

 

You will have zero mitigation’s or DCDs. Anyone sub 50 will be free kills for any above lvl 70

[eabevella]

BioWare are about to make another stupid change that’s going to drive some players away or stop others from having fun.

 

Patch notes 6.3

 

This would only make sense if they boost all players in lowbie to lvl 74 to give them all abilities and utilities of lvl 74.

 

But there is nothing in the patch notes to say that is happening. So this is just another example of BioWare F*********g with players fun that will make the game fail faster.

 

Best timing for me to try PVP!

My lv75 306gear toons can annihilate those poor sub lv50 toons even if I have ZERO skill. Yay!

(I was being sarcastic but on the other hand, maybe I should try to complete some pvp achievement after 6.3)

[TrixxieTriss]

Best timing for me to try PVP!

My lv75 306gear toons can annihilate those poor sub lv50 toons even if I have ZERO skill. Yay!

(I was being sarcastic but on the other hand, maybe I should try to complete some pvp achievement after 6.3)

 

It’s lvl 1-74 (probably a type-o and should say lvl 10-74). So no lvl 75s with 306 gear 😉

 

I would say you’ll get a week at most if you want to get your kill achievement done on a lvl 70-74 before people below lvl 50 stop queuing.

Edited April 27, 2021 by TrixxieTriss

[eabevella]

It’s lvl 1-74 (probably a type-o and should say lvl 10-74). So no lvl 75s with 306 gear 😉

 

I would say you’ll get a week at most if you want to get your kill achievement done on a lvl 70-74 before people below lvl 50 stop queuing.

 

Oh no... only lv74.. I would never recruit 4X or Pierce on my lv75 toons

I might take out some old refrigerated toons just to try it anyway because I have 0% pvp achievement.

[Ardrossan]

BioWare are about to make another stupid change that’s going to drive some players away or stop others from having fun.

 

Patch notes 6.3

 

This would only make sense if they boost all players in lowbie to lvl 74 to give them all abilities and utilities of lvl 74.

 

But there is nothing in the patch notes to say that is happening. So this is just another example of BioWare F*********g with players fun that will make the game fail faster.

 

tbh I did my first match since the original wins only / deserter lockout changes to pvp from several months ago. It was Huttball at lvl 75 and it was atrociously bad, both teams death matching. It cured me of doing any more pvp for another 6-8 months.

[Rion_Starkiller]

You will have zero mitigation’s or DCDs. Anyone sub 50 will be free kills for any above lvl 70

 

I imagine the matchmaking system will prioritize the lowest leveled toons in the same match.

Edited April 27, 2021 by Rion_Starkiller

[BonnerFett]

I’ve been around SWTOR since 2012. I’ve left at times for FF14 and WOW. Both great games. But while those games get the proper respect why is SWTOR always an afterthought?

 

I’ve left wow because of shadowlands. The gearing rng is ridiculous. The grind for legendaries and upgrades is ridiculous. The taking away of flight at the beginning of each expansion is ridiculous. All the while the community puts up with it while Ion tells them he knows best.

 

SWTOR gives players what they want. The best gear available for every player. Great mounts and armors for every player. Great perks through the legacy system. QOL improvements.

 

Almost everything you want is obtainable in the game some things will take time but the grind for them is nothing like other MMOs.

 

Tons of content. Yes, the newer content is not as abundant but if you’ve never played this game can keep you bust for a long time.

 

I'm having a blast in SWTOR. I've played WOW since launch. Never going back. This game is really great. I'd like some PVP changes and class balance tweaks - that's my only request.

 

Just wish the PVP player base was larger.

 

I really enjoy this game.

[TrixxieTriss]

Just wish the PVP player base was larger.

.

 

It use to be until, Bioware drove many of us from the game with poor decisions or we stopped playing pvp because of said choices.