Change back the changes!

[Nemmar]

You don't need friends to start a group. Just sit on fleet and advertise for a few people to do the daily with. If you're the one building the group then you can remove anyone who you feel is being disruptive to your group. You may never interact with these folks again, but then you might actually find people you like to group up with. I mean, that's how we did it in MMOs before group finders...

 

TL;DR: Be your own pug premade.

 

Implying that when you queue solo you aren't playing with others. Problem aren't pugs, it's organized groups.

 

In fact, there is a premade vs premade mode, but alas it's deserted. So, if that mode is deserted it means there isn't enough interest eh? It doesn't entitle you to come ruin the fun of those queuing randomly on their own mode for casual pvp.

This is like a kid that broke his toy and then is trying to break the toy of the kid next to him too.

 

It's gonna be fun when there is no more toy for anyone cause of that selfishness. The mode is supposed to be fun for all, not just for the few that exploit it. Especially with the penalty now, people will just stop queuing for that nonsense.

 

Oh and btw, back in the day there were no voice coms and min-maxing. We live in a different world now.

Edited September 15, 2020 by Nemmar

[AocaVII]

Snipy snip......[Nemmar ]"Implying that when you queue solo you aren't playing with others. Problem aren't pugs, it's organized groups.

 

So, if that mode is deserted it means there isn't enough interest eh? It doesn't entitle you to come ruin the fun of those queuing randomly on their own mode for casual pvp.

This is like a kid that broke his toy and then is trying to break the toy of the kid next to him too.

 

It's gonna be fun when there is no more toy for anyone cause of that selfishness. The mode is supposed to be fun for all, not just for the few that exploit it. Especially with the penalty now, people will just stop queuing for that nonsense."

 

 

Ya there's gonna be no PVP reg toy I think shortly LOL:

 

It's happening already. I waited 10 mins for a pop 10 pm at night EST. I did 4 wzs. Two of them were OP premades of ranked caliber players vs pugs, awful pugs so that did not go well. I mean tbh I don't really have the time to organize groups.

 

I mean some people actually have work and have other things to do lol

 

I want to log on and play. I don't have to time to do this BS LOL

 

I wouldn't even want to q with a OP premade. It's too unbalanced.

 

My feeling is pugs and people who do objectives are not quing because of the OP premades. It's a waste of time. It's very unbalanced.

 

The pug team should have a least 5 good players, and the premade should have the other 4 the worst but it doesn't seem to happen like that.

 

It's causal PVP. You log on and play that's how it's always been. It's not WW3 get super op group, not anymore.

 

Like I think you are alluding to. The OP premades will eventually make people stop pvping. I've seen this happen in another game where it's so unbalanced that people just stop quing and there was no pvp. I believe that's where we are headed.

 

So keeping making the OP premades because after a while you going to be the only ones in q. LOL

 

I mean, it's not people fault they want to make strong premades BUT the player base is not good enough to handle this, match matching does not work correctly for it, and eventually this will be RIP for PVP regs. LOL

 

I used to be in a guild "Ban Premades" (no longer exists no TOS vio) as a joke for the people that were complaining but this is not that time. The game is different and the players can not handle good or OP premades.

Edited September 15, 2020 by AocaVII

[AocaVII]

:cool:Ugh LMAO you can't delete posts on these forums............ hahaha

Sorry about that!

Edited September 15, 2020 by AocaVII

[Pallais]

Implying that when you queue solo you aren't playing with others. Problem aren't pugs, it's organized groups.

 

In fact, there is a premade vs premade mode, but alas it's deserted. So, if that mode is deserted it means there isn't enough interest eh? It doesn't entitle you to come ruin the fun of those queuing randomly on their own mode for casual pvp.

This is like a kid that broke his toy and then is trying to break the toy of the kid next to him too.

 

It's gonna be fun when there is no more toy for anyone cause of that selfishness. The mode is supposed to be fun for all, not just for the few that exploit it. Especially with the penalty now, people will just stop queuing for that nonsense.

 

Oh and btw, back in the day there were no voice coms and min-maxing. We live in a different world now.

 

You may infer that, but I did not imply that. Putting together your own group is a premade. Yes, it's a pickup group, but it's still premade. It's is just so funny that some forum posters think that groups playing group content are the 2nd greatest evil in PvP (with Operatives being 1st ). People claim there's a problem with premades, yet when folks point there is an easy solution people throw their arms in the air and say they can't do that. It feels like some just want to whine about the 'evil premades in warzones' instead of actually, you know, grouping up for ... group content. It's certainly a first to see someone claim grouping for warzones is trying to "exploit it".

[AocaVII]

You may infer that, but I did not imply that. Putting together your own group is a premade. Yes, it's a pickup group, but it's still premade. It's is just so funny that some forum posters think that groups playing group content are the 2nd greatest evil in PvP (with Operatives being 1st ). People claim there's a problem with premades, yet when folks point there is an easy solution people throw their arms in the air and say they can't do that. It feels like some just want to whine about the 'evil premades in warzones' instead of actually, you know, grouping up for ... group content. It's certainly a first to see someone claim grouping for warzones is trying to "exploit it".

 

Look at one time it was viable but I going to repeat myself this player base of pvpers CAN NOT handle good premades.

 

Make the groups see what happens in a few months LMAO

 

It's not some type of evil but people doing the premades are digging their own graves bc they will sit in q when no one wants to play anymore lol

 

Maybe people have to see it to believe what happens but I have seen in quite a few instances over a few MMOs including granked and yolo in this one.

 

Again repeating LOL, the matchmaking system is b r o k e n. If you q 3-4 good players in a premade the other team should get 5 good players. It doesn't happen. You get 6-7 BAD players vs 3-4 man premades and other good players. It don't work.

 

TBH really could care less. I just avoid the premades and go off killing people where ever they are not in that area of the wz lol

 

I'm trying to explain what happens so people here can avoid it LMAO!

 

We are going to have to find out the hard way I think LOL

Edited September 15, 2020 by AocaVII

[KendraP]

I have no idea how this became a pre-made thing rather than a lockout is good/bad thing, but the only times I have PvPed in the last 3 months or so was when there were at least 2 of my friends on.

 

I also run the guild that used to be the most notorious for grouping in regs on harbinger. Has PvP gotten better since the prior changes last year put my guild essentially under? It certainly doesn't seem like it.

 

And for whatever record in my experience, my group does get matched with the sorcs with defense stims, maras with one Saber, and idiots who actively try to lose the match for us.

Edited September 15, 2020 by KendraP

[Raansu]

Implying that when you queue solo you aren't playing with others. Problem aren't pugs, it's organized groups.

 

In fact, there is a premade vs premade mode, but alas it's deserted. So, if that mode is deserted it means there isn't enough interest eh? It doesn't entitle you to come ruin the fun of those queuing randomly on their own mode for casual pvp.

This is like a kid that broke his toy and then is trying to break the toy of the kid next to him too.

 

It's gonna be fun when there is no more toy for anyone cause of that selfishness. The mode is supposed to be fun for all, not just for the few that exploit it. Especially with the penalty now, people will just stop queuing for that nonsense.

 

Oh and btw, back in the day there were no voice coms and min-maxing. We live in a different world now.

 

Oh get over it. A premade is only 4 people. Half the team and 99% of the people premading are not doing perfect groups. They are just queuing with whoever and having fun. I can't remember the last time I was in a premade and we actually had a healer or tank in the group and we never use voice comms.

[Sappharan]

Oh get over it. A premade is only 4 people. Half the team and 99% of the people premading are not doing perfect groups. They are just queuing with whoever and having fun. I can't remember the last time I was in a premade and we actually had a healer or tank in the group and we never use voice comms.

 

You're oversimplifying the issue. There have been teams with premades that have contributed NOTHING to the win. These teams have lost -- I have been on those teams but not part of the premade -- because their focus is damage farming. They're actually a detriment to the team they're on. There have been teams with premades that just roflstomp the opposing team as well. I have been against those teams also (as part of the premade...though years ago).

 

I am not really arguing for or against premades. They can be a bane for the team they're on too, is all. We need to redirect the conversation to class balance and MUCH more importantly, matchmaking. When a tank is on one team, a tank should be on another. Same for healers...if there is one tank and one healer in queue, matchmaking should NOT put them both on the same team. If they're both part of the premade, the matchmaking should favor the solo queuers' side more to balance the expected cooperation of the premade side.

 

Side note, I almost exclusively solo queue now. The last premade I was in happened a couple of weeks ago. A streamer I was watching was kind enough to let me in with his party. Had a blast, but don't remember whether we won or not...and you're right, Raansu, no voice communications were used. We just stuck around each other...I followed them where they went.

 

After this excursive rambling, I would suggest that premades tend to exacerbate the matchmaking problems that have been around for a long time. It's not a simple question of whether premades are a problem, but one of team balance and, honestly class balance as well.

 

...but all this has been argued before.

Edited September 15, 2020 by Sappharan

[KendraP]

Lol and here when I was running premades the problem was premades won too much.

 

Which is it? Premades win too much or not enough?

[Sappharan]

Lol and here when I was running premades the problem was premades won too much.

 

Which is it? Premades win too much or not enough?

 

Counterintuitive, I know, but I have witnessed it on streams and while I have played on both sides.

[AocaVII]

Oh get over it. A premade is only 4 people. Half the team and 99% of the people premading are not doing perfect groups. They are just queuing with whoever and having fun. I can't remember the last time I was in a premade and we actually had a healer or tank in the group and we never use voice comms.

 

I don't think all of a sudden this many people would be complaining...Idk what game or server you are playing on

 

Last night 2/4 matches that I waited longer than usual had a tank and healer with 2 very good dps LOL plus 4 other decent/good players vs me and 6-7 BAD players. That's not normal LMAO

 

Comms aren't even relevant; you don't need them anymore in regs like you USE TO LOL

 

The premades would be fine if the pugs were better or matchmaking worked. I've seen plenty of times;. I mean like 5 years ago LOOOL that pug teams vs premade with another good 4, win and have higher dps and heals.

 

Peeps gotta bring in Seal Team SIx to fight unarmed civilians LOOOOOOOOOOL

 

Personally, I myself would not be making premades of that caliber because it's just not needed to win or farm people.

 

I been on hundreds on premades, probably thousands of premades but at a certain point the player base is not going to keep letting you steam roll them. They quit or do something else.

 

I really don't give a sheet but if people want pvp to be a thing in this game something has to change either the match making or what ever I can't be bothered figuring it out. IK plp will not stop with the OP premades until no one qz.

 

LMAO IG people have to experience something when it happens or they will never believe you. I seen this happen time and time again....

 

I'll give an example: Bad group pugs highest dps 3.5 k, healing 5-8k ish Premade highest dps 10k, healing hps 8-12k. I think some people are in denial lol

Edited September 16, 2020 by AocaVII

[KendraP]

Oh that's an even better reason. In a game that no longer allows you to leave a match without a penalty, let's keep people from grouping to avoid the idiots.

 

I agree the issue is the average swtor player frankly sucks. Maybe a better solution is for the sorcs to not use defense Stims, for maras to run two sabers, for mercs to not attempt a stealth cap, and in general for people to learn to have an inkling of situational awareness.

Edited September 16, 2020 by KendraP

[-Bob-]

oh that's an even better reason. In a game that no longer allows you to leave a match without a penalty, let's keep people from grouping to avoid the idiots.

 

I agree the issue is the average swtor player frankly sucks. Maybe a better solution is for the sorcs to not use defense stims, for maras to run two sabers, for mercs to not attempt a stealth cap, and in general for people to learn to have an inkling of situational awareness.

+1000

[Wolvel]

I mean the new deserter just makes me run around trolling on objective maps that I dont like (huttball/voidstar) wouldnt it be better for me to just drop and get someone who wants to play the game mode in?

[AocaVII]

I wouldn't fret about it. Less people will be in q and the OP premades will fight each other. One of them has to lose.

I played with these people for many many years; they don't like losing I mean THEY really don't like it.. Once they start to lose, they get pissed off and turn on each other then you don't see them anymore LOL

 

I would suggest putting the premades and/or guild on your friends list wait till you see them in a match then q; q dodge them let them fight each other and spread the love LMAO

 

I seen the nicest people get raged upon and lots of drama when our group and/or guild qd and lost or vice versa If you are quing a premade or guild premade, you better be winning it or the sheet will hit the fan LMAO

 

I can't be bothered with plp like that.

 

This is how guilds are destroyed, and people get hated on. It basically turns into ranked so to speak.

 

My headphones would almost get blown out when we would lose 1 match or you could feel the tension to win every match, and then everyone rage logs off LMAO

 

I mean I been cursed out for no legit reason many times by my own guildmates LOL

 

I thought everyone was so nice till they started to lose , and these weren't kids mostly people in 20-40 age range LOL

 

Believe it or not you still have power in this situation if you just q dodge them, you won't have to fight any OP premades, and be in these pointless matches. Also, watch their play patterns when they play and just do something else or play when they don't LOL

Edited September 16, 2020 by AocaVII

[Nemmar]

Oh get over it. A premade is only 4 people. Half the team and 99% of the people premading are not doing perfect groups. They are just queuing with whoever and having fun. I can't remember the last time I was in a premade and we actually had a healer or tank in the group and we never use voice comms.

 

No? Why do i need to get over it? They need to get over the fact that no one wanted to play with them and it doesn't entitled them to come ruin other people's experiences.

 

Btw it's time to realize that there is a difference between a random pug and an organized pre-made. This is not about your silly group that is just messing around. It's about organized arena groups that focus burst targets in 2 seconds and are geared to the teeth with ideal comps and peels.

Warzones are not competitive arenas. Those people have no business in casual PvP with their premade. They should have to follow the rules everybody else is. The only way to enforce it is to limit how many can queue at once and force them to fight each other as much as they can fight together.

Edited September 16, 2020 by Nemmar

[Raazmir]

They've stated more than once they don't intend to do more to discourage people from playing with their friends. Granted that was years ago but i see no reason that design philosophy will ever shift.

[Raansu]

Warzones are not competitive arenas. Those people have no business in casual PvP with their premade.

 

Well then tell them to bring 8v8 ranked back. Why should I be forced to go play arenas, a mode I hate, just to appease your inability to make friends?

[KendraP]

Well then tell them to bring 8v8 ranked back. Why should I be forced to go play arenas, a mode I hate, just to appease your inability to make friends?

 

this has pretty much been my feeling for years

[AocaVII]

People shouldn't have to come up with a premade on steroids to even be competitive every time they log on and want to PVP. It's not feasible at this point in the game. There are not enough good players to have a steroid premades ready to go once you log on so what are people supposed be forced fight OP premades and get farmed for 15 mins clips for 4 hours? LOL

 

It's punishing new players and casuals which are the bulk of PVPers.

 

Why not have rewards/missions for participating and separate ones for winning?

 

They're goal is to make regs more competitive but the player base and match making at the current time can not support this notion.

 

People saying everything is fine just leave it etc. It hasn't been fine for YEARS LOL

 

It's like the drug addict half dead with a needle in his arm saying " everything is just fine the way it is."

Edited September 17, 2020 by AocaVII

[AocaVII]

this has pretty much been my feeling for years

 

You don't need 8v8 ranked you already have it. It's called regs now LMAO

 

What was the end result of ranked 8v8? I was on the biggest server so large sample size. I saw what I'm seeing now people getting globaled right and left; and a huge gap in talent. Eventually, no pugs, casuals, and new players qd. It dies.

Edited September 17, 2020 by AocaVII

[AocaVII]

They've stated more than once they don't intend to do more to discourage people from playing with their friends. Granted that was years ago but i see no reason that design philosophy will ever shift.

 

Triple posting, I'm going to go to jail for this. I'm using this as a distraction atm forgive me LOL

 

IDK what to say LMAO when no one is quing and people are waiting for a pop for 10 mins maybe then they will understand. These are the signs I've seen in other games just before the pvp dies. Apparently people need to see it happen to believe.

Edited September 17, 2020 by AocaVII

[JattaGin]

No, the requirement to win is fine.

 

I tried PvPing again after a longer break, trying to get my last missing valor ranks.

 

However, after 2 hours of PvPing, I am still at 0/1 for the daily. Rep side is completely outmatched. Not even remotely did we have a chance in any of the played warzones.

 

Since you say it's fine, please tell me what's my incentive to play PvP if I never progress my missions? And don't say it's my fault. I did my job well in all the played warzones. I can't carry a team of 8 alone.

 

My question is rhetorical, by the way. There is no inventive to continue playing PvP for me. So I don't. It is a pity. My Steam achievements will forever remain one short of perfect, because I won't grind to valor 100 without getting any other rewards.

[Shevaresh]

I tried PvPing again after a longer break, trying to get my last missing valor ranks.

 

However, after 2 hours of PvPing, I am still at 0/1 for the daily. Rep side is completely outmatched. Not even remotely did we have a chance in any of the played warzones.

 

Since you say it's fine, please tell me what's my incentive to play PvP if I never progress my missions? And don't say it's my fault. I did my job well in all the played warzones. I can't carry a team of 8 alone.

 

My question is rhetorical, by the way. There is no inventive to continue playing PvP for me. So I don't. It is a pity. My Steam achievements will forever remain one short of perfect, because I won't grind to valor 100 without getting any other rewards.

 

As a returning player myself, I completely agree with you. I used to enjoy (unranked) PvP, but now the win requirement just sucks the fun completely out of it. Before the change, getting a bad match-up and end up losing because of it, you could just "take it on the chin" and move on (or even have some fun) as you were still getting some progress.

 

Now with the "do or die", there truely isn't any incentive to play PvP, unless you're running a premade and focusing only on winning, rather than being able to enjoy some random shenanigans with a random group of people online.

 

I really don't get why unranked PvP has to be so "serious business", rather than a place to have fun and learn how to PvP? Do Bioware think this will somehow get people more engaged to PvP and/or more competitive, by making it less fun and punishing mistakes, rather than rewarding participation and having fun? Sure, for that small minority of very skilled players, for whom playing with anyone of less skill (on their own team) is painful, it's probably an awesome change. For those who aren't very skilled or play for other reasons than to become a PvP-legend, I really don't see any appeal in this change.

[Nemmar]

I tried PvPing again after a longer break, trying to get my last missing valor ranks.

 

However, after 2 hours of PvPing, I am still at 0/1 for the daily. Rep side is completely outmatched. Not even remotely did we have a chance in any of the played warzones.

 

Since you say it's fine, please tell me what's my incentive to play PvP if I never progress my missions? And don't say it's my fault. I did my job well in all the played warzones. I can't carry a team of 8 alone.

 

My question is rhetorical, by the way. There is no inventive to continue playing PvP for me. So I don't. It is a pity. My Steam achievements will forever remain one short of perfect, because I won't grind to valor 100 without getting any other rewards.

 

There is no such thing as a republic side. Warzones are mixed with both factions.

 

They've stated more than once they don't intend to do more to discourage people from playing with their friends. Granted that was years ago but i see no reason that design philosophy will ever shift.

 

Flawed, one sided argument. No one is stopping you from playing with your friends in the modes for pre-made groups. It does not entitle you to ruin the experience of those that want to have a quick casual drop in drop out experience.

Edited September 17, 2020 by Nemmar