Why is there no kill option for Lana?

[Elessara]

I'm hardly worthy of note- this is pretty much my very first time posting on this forum, but do we really need "We wanna kill X", "I really hate X" or "Can we remove X" threads every other week? I can understand that you find X boring, or annoying, or you despise them (though why pour so much energy into pixels...), but you gotta remember that this isn't a single player game, and when you want something, you have to consider how that will affect everyone else's game. So far, killing companions off has only made the game poorer. And the reason why Lana is "inflicted" on people is EXACTLY because you all wanted kill options, so towards the end, most of the main characters in KotFE/ET are as likely to be dead, as they are to be alive. We'd have more diversity if people we're a little less hostile towards the poor pixels.

 

No we don't need these threads but at this point their sort of a fixture around here. I've started to think of them as bloodsport .. a sort of gladiatorial game if you will. Everyone sharpens their knives and has a go at each other. If I bother to read the threads I usually just roll my eyes at everyone involved and have a good laugh.

[Kiesu]

No we don't need these threads but at this point their sort of a fixture around here. I've started to think of them as bloodsport .. a sort of gladiatorial game if you will. Everyone sharpens their knives and has a go at each other. If I bother to read the threads I usually just roll my eyes at everyone involved and have a good laugh.

It's ironic.

First we had million of threads about "bring character X back to life, let us save them!"

Now we have millions of threads about "Lynch character X as soon as possible, kill option!"

The forums are a beautiful mess.

Edited October 15, 2018 by Kiesu

[Goreshaga]

What.

"I think we should have more unique sexualities, but this one character should be for everyone!"

Bit of a double standard there.

As i said, i think some character should be for some genders only.

Cytharat was great for that as he's so far the only gay only character, too bad he can die never to be seen again.

So yeah i'd like to see some characters who are straight only, some who are gay only and some others whose sexuality is determined by the player, as it gives more possibilities. And even some you'll never be able to get, like Senya.

 

Scourge was not interested because of his curse where he supposedly can feel nothing, so if he can't feel anything, then he just can't fall in love. But it is also established that he fell in love at some point prior to being immortal, which means that he can be interested if freed from his curse.

But his actual sexuality is never stated, so it can be open to both genders without changing his character.

 

But if a character (whether male or female) was shown to only hit on women, then they should remain interested in women only and not opened to both genders. If a character is shown to be intersted in men only, then it should remain that way.

If it's more ambiguous, then, they can be available to both genders.

 

(I'd like to think those first love's eyes were those belonging to the Knight...because he had that vision before he went through with the ritual...yes I know it's ultra-cheesy, lol). It would make the most sense for him to be open to any player...if they're going to open him up to romance at all.

I also thought about that, and it could make sense.

I'd find it quite sweet and funny, but i'm pretty sure my JK would find it kinda creepy that a guy fell in love with her some 300 years before she was even born

I could make a clone of her just to try it out though.

Edited October 15, 2018 by Goreshaga

[Elessara]

It's ironic.

First we had million of threads about "bring character X back to life, let us save them!"

Now we have millions of threads about "Lynch character X as soon as possible, kill option!"

The forums are a beautiful mess.

 

Dammit! Now I realised I made that stupid mistake I hate making .. it's they're not their. I really hate it when I do that. That's what I get for posting before 7 am without caffeine.

[Kiesu]

As i said, i think some character should be for some genders only.

Cytharat was great for that as he's so far the only gay only character, too bad he can die never to be seen again.

So yeah i'd like to see some characters who are straight only, some who are gay only and some others whose sexuality is determined by the player, as it gives more possibilities. And even some you'll never be able to get, like Senya.

 

Scourge was not interested because of his curse where he supposedly can feel nothing, so if he can't feel anything, then he just can't fall in love. But it is also established that he fell in love at some point prior to being immortal, which means that he can be interested if freed from his curse.

But his actual sexuality is never stated, so it can be open to both genders without changing his character.

 

But if a character (whether male or female) was shown to only hit on women, then they should remain interested in women only and not opened to both genders. If a character is shown to be intersted in men only, then it should remain that way.

If it's more ambiguous, then, they can be available to both genders.

I agree with you here.

It is silly to keep changing peoples sexualities on the fly because "fans asked for it". Like Light Jaesa, she was never sexually interested in anyone previously, and I thought it was cool to have a young female companion who was just not into you, simple as that. I like it when characters have distinct preferences, just like people in real life. No matter how much we want someone to like us, they might just not be into us, no matter how many gifts and flirts we keep delivering Now light Jaesa is into everyone, just because fans wanted it to happen. I'm not a fan.

 

Scourge has had relationships in the past, so it's not like he lacks interest. And there is no information who his lover was. It could be anyone. That being said, if they decide it was a male character and he was only into guys, or a purelood lover of undefined gender and he is actually only into purebloods- I'm ok with that, not having defined preference previously doesnt mean they now must be attracted to everything just because. Or he might be into everything and everyone and used to watch steamy ewok movies, who knows.

 

I'm fine any way they want to approach his sexuality. My main worry is his curse being lifted in a poor manner. He got this gift/curse from the arguably the most powerful being on the planet. If he finds a magic datacron of undoing from under the Emperor's bed and ta-dah, done, I'm gonna be too busy being disappointed at the piss-poor writing to get any fapperinos gonig

Edited October 15, 2018 by Kiesu

[Elessara]

I agree with you here.

It is silly to keep changing peoples sexualities on the fly because "fans asked for it". Like Light Jaesa, she was never sexually interested in anyone previously, and I thought it was cool to have a young female companion who was just not into you, simple as that. I like it when characters have distinct preferences, just like people in real life. No matter how much we want someone to like us, they might just not be into us, no matter how many gifts and flirts we keep delivering Now light Jaesa is into everyone, just because fans wanted it to happen. I'm not a fan.

 

Scourge has had relationships in the past, so it's not like he lacks interest. And there is no information who his lover was. It could be anyone. That being said, if they decide it was a male character and he was only into guys, or a purelood lover of undefined gender and he is actually only into purebloods- I'm ok with that, not having defined preference previously doesnt mean they now must be attracted to everything just because. Or he might be into everything and everyone and used to watch steamy ewok movies, who knows.

 

I'm fine any way they want to approach his sexuality. My main worry is his curse being lifted in a poor manner. He got this gift/curse from the arguably the most powerful being on the planet. If he finds a magic datacron of undoing from under the Emperor's bed and ta-dah, done, I'm gonna be too busy being disappointed at the piss-poor writing to get any fapperinos gonig

 

I thought his curse was lifted b/c the Emperor is dead?

 

Edit: Also, steamy ewok movies ... would that be like midget **** for wookies?

 

Edit Edit: I had no idea p*rn ... was censored. Obviously I have never typed that word on these forums before.

Edited October 15, 2018 by Elessara

[Goreshaga]

I agree with you here.

It is silly to keep changing peoples sexualities on the fly because "fans asked for it". Like Light Jaesa, she was never sexually interested in anyone previously, and I thought it was cool to have a young female companion who was just not into you, simple as that. I like it when characters have distinct preferences, just like people in real life. No matter how much we want someone to like us, they might just not be into us, no matter how many gifts and flirts we keep delivering Now light Jaesa is into everyone, just because fans wanted it to happen. I'm not a fan.

 

Scourge has had relationships in the past, so it's not like he lacks interest. And there is no information who his lover was. It could be anyone. That being said, if they decide it was a male character and he was only into guys, or a purelood lover of undefined gender and he is actually only into purebloods- I'm ok with that, not having defined preference previously doesnt mean they now must be attracted to everything just because. Or he might be into everything and everyone and used to watch steamy ewok movies, who knows.

 

I'm fine any way they want to approach his sexuality. My main worry is his curse being lifted in a poor manner. He got this gift/curse from the arguably the most powerful being on the planet. If he finds a magic datacron of undoing from under the Emperor's bed and ta-dah, done, I'm gonna be too busy being disappointed at the piss-poor writing to get any fapperinos gonig

Can't really talk about LSJaesa as i've not finished my SW who has LS Jeasa yet.

About DS Jaesa, i don't find it difficult to accept that she could be interested in both genders as she's just starting exploring her sexuality during the SW class story and could find out that she likes both.

Nadia, i don't really know, she doesn't look like she has a lot of experience, so she may go any ways, just like SD Jaesa, but she appered to me as more interested in older men during the JC class story.

 

That being said, i'd find it really difficult to see Doc, Tharan or Jonas Balkar as anything other than straight men as the 3 of them are only ever shown hitting on women. Just as much as seeing Cytharat being interested in anything other than men would seem completely OoC.

 

Scourge, yeah he could be into anything, that would not bother me as nothing was previously stated.

 

I thought his curse was lifted b/c the Emperor is dead?

That's what i thought too.

 

After all, when you supposedly kill Vitiate on Dromund Kaas, Scourge, says that he felt nothing and that the Emperor is still alive.

Gives me the impression, that his immortality is tied to Vitiate's life and that once he's gone for good, then he's mortal again.

[Kiesu]

I thought his curse was lifted b/c the Emperor is dead?

 

Edit: Also, steamy ewok movies ... would that be like midget **** for wookies?

Omg never thought of ewoks and wookies that way.... Now I can't get the mental image out of my head. Thanks, rofl

 

Well, Emperor never really dies, so no. That's his gimmik trough the entire SW lore, his spirit simply shifts places and bodies. His actual death is way in the future from this point of time, but it's currently legends lore so he is probably still alive somewhere in Disney canon. Though, Plagueis hints he would have died.

Edited October 15, 2018 by Kiesu

[Elessara]

That's what i thought too.

 

After all, when you supposedly kill Vitiate on Dromund Kaas, Scourge, says that he felt nothing and that the Emperor is still alive.

Gives me the impression, that his immortality is tied to Vitiate's life and that once he's gone for good, then he's mortal again.

 

I thought I actually heard it from somewhere though. I could be wrong and my mind is just playing tricks on me.

[Elessara]

Omg never thought of ewoks and wookies that way.... Now I can't get the mental image out of my head. Thanks, rofl

 

Well, Emperor never really dies, so no. That's his gimmik trough the entire SW lore, his spirit simply shifts places and bodies. His actual death is way in the future from this point of time, but it's currently legends lore so he is probably still alive somewhere in Disney canon. Though, Plagues hints he would have died.

 

You're welcome

 

Also, this isn't part of canon (I always end up spelling that with two Ns ... I guess I like big guns) so the BioWare writers can pretty much do what they want within reason. And for the purposes of SWTOR he probably IS dead.

[Kiesu]

Also, this isn't part of canon (I always end up spelling that with two Ns ... I guess I like big guns) so the BioWare writers can pretty much do what they want within reason. And for the purposes of SWTOR he probably IS dead.

I doubt he is. He has died already twice in swtor (trice if you count killing his host body on chapter1), and he says he has lived trough countless lives from farmer to emperor and attempts taking over your body too. It supports his immortality-bodyshift-plot. And SWTOR is part of Legends canon, you can find swtor plot actively being updated to Legends databases, swtor still has Lucasfilms of approval, and the Emperor in swtor and the emperor in Darth Plagueis book is considered the same character.

Edited October 15, 2018 by Kiesu

[WayOfTheWarriorx]

In many (most) of these discussions, one group of players believes the actions/situations are similar but the other group of players believes they are fundamentally different. We all bring our own pasts & educations to bear on how we interpret things. Both camps should be respected. Just because you (not necessarily you you, but in general you) don't see the difference doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Just because you (again general you) don't see the importance of the difference doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Claiming people are hypocritical or biased because they see a fundamental difference in two scenarios is insultingly dismissive of those players.

 

 

 

You will be happy to know then that according to the author, Quinn did not, in fact, try to kill you. He sabotaged the droids so you would win and you killing him would save face for him. So now you can stop choking him and embrace him for the extremely loyal companion he is. Quinn is every bit as loyal as Lana, so you should be thrilled to have another such Imperial at your side.

 

Of course, the story was also written in such a way that you are also correct if you chose to believe he did try to kill you but was incompetent. The writer was sneaky that way. Uh oh! There are two versions of the same story. Which is cannon? Both were intentional and endorsed by the writer. Neither are head cannon. Neither are mistakes. Who is to say the same situation doesn't exist for Theron? Unlike the author for the Warrior story, the author for fractured alliances hasn't spoken up about it. Some times if it looks like a duck and quack likes a duck, it's a spy trying to infiltrate the flock and not a duck at all.

 

You make some good points and under those circumstances I can see people being more forgiving about Quinns action in terms of actually trying to kill you, but, that said, that doesn't get him off the hook to my mind, even conceding the previous point to you [which is thats what the author said, I do] there is still the issue of him having sworn an oath fealty to me and not telling me that Baras was planning to kill me and not warning me about Baras other 'real' apprentice.

 

In real life, my background is in law enforcement, and there is a crime called 'accessory after the fact' what this means in some cases is a person aided or assited even by inaction the planning of attempted murder [using the in game occurance', if you know someone is planning to murder someone else, even if that person is a stranger or someone whom you hate, you are obligated by law to go forth and warn law enforcement of this plan and law enforcement is that obligated by law to inform the person of the plan. . If you don't and it comes out after the person's murder or attempted murder than you were aware of it, you have commited a serious crime.

 

Quinn swore an oath of fealty to the player, the clearly broke that oath even with the amended descirption by the author himself. Quiin as well aware of the power of the force, he was well aware that Baras apprentice was going to try and kill you and he didn't warn you. He broke his oath of fealty by not informing the player that there was another apprentice of Baras that was considered his 'true' apprentice and was quite powerful.

 

There's a saying - "Bullets don't kill people, people kill people.

 

Anything short of immediately informing the player of Baras' plans, Baras's other Apprentice, and everything that Baras had said to Quinn from the first moment was disloyalty to the player and gross dereliction of duty as an Imperial officer. You are not allowed to lie you your direct superior for any reason. Even more foolish was the fact that the player was a direct subordinate to the Emperor himself and was the second most powerful authority in the Empire second tot he Emperor as the "Emperor's Wrath" and he choose Baras to back initially..

 

The droids were never the real danger to the player, conspiracy was the real danger. That alone IMO makes him guilty of betrayal and deserving of death. It's the players right to forgive him if they choose to, I wouldn't remove the choice even if I could.

 

As far as Theron is concerned, I feel confident that at best, he put the player in a position which almost certainly could have led to the players death. I watched the same cut scenes as everyone else,there can be absolutely no confusion, he shot lana because he was trying to shoot you and he absolutely could not have been even remote confident that he was not placing you in any danger. I don't care what his reasons were really, as a Sithlord [role] there are no acceptable reasons for it.

 

Bombs sometimes go off early. People sometimes trip while they try to escape from a firey death, or their shoelaced sometimes get caught on things, Windows sometimes aren't big enough for people to fit through, when you aim a gun at someone and pull the trigger, sometimes they die. Exploding trains moving at mach 5 and exploding and derailing and fall 50 stories before they actually hit the ground sometimes injure people. I can't think of one municipality, state or country in the world that would not constitute every one of those acts as massively illegal and a threat to life and limb. heh

 

People have the right to make either choice, I personally can't see how someone could find both of them not culpable for wrong doing even having heard their arguments. This is just another example of choices people can make in the game where we must sometimes agree to disagree. I don't need to agree with their reasoning to respect the right to their choice. They are both LIs and that matters and people should have that choice to preserve the comp as a love interest.

 

I do however find you pointing out about the writters intent to be a mitigating factor in terms of him trying to kill you with the droids. He didn't try and kill you with the droids. You get the clear on that one

Edited October 15, 2018 by WayOfTheWarriorx

[Gidrea]

We've been given the option for Theron and Koth (both of which didn't REALLY deserve it and I would never chose to do so). Why is there no option for Lana? She HAS deserved it a few times.

 

Because she's the dev's little darling. I would have killed her several times.

[Eshvara]

Because she's the dev's little darling. I would have killed her several times.

 

Pretty cruel, tbh.

[asiasusanna]

I was gonna stay out of this, because I promised myself that I wouldn't say anything beyond my first comment, but some things here drew my interest, and for the sake of my own entertainment, I'll just say a few things and leave it at that.

 

First off: Quinn has been accessory to Attempted Murder (and respectively murder if Baras had succeeded) from the moment that he started reporting your actions and movement to Baras. Darth Fat-a-lot knew how and when to set up his traps precisely because of said betrayal. Does Quinn feel remorse? Apparently if his behavior later is to be believed, but all of his remorse would have meant nothing if you had ended up dead. Do I hate him? Hell yeah! Do I want him dead? No-because I'm not certain that my 30 seconds worth of satisfaction would justify him being removed from the stories of people who like him.

 

Onto Theron, I feel like he really fits the "The road to hell is paved with good intentions". Basically he heard that The Order of Mentally Disabled Monkeys wants to kill us, and his desire was to protect us. So his idea includes restarting the Galactic war all over again, potentially kill his own parents over this, try to fry your brain, followed by killing hundreds of people on Umbarra, with the possibility of killing you (very high possibility if Lana had not jumped in the way of him shooting you), followed by even more death and mayhem. Then he decides to provide the Order with the map that they seek, starting a civil war in Chiss space, leading to the death of hundreds, if not thousands of innocent people, and FINALLY deciding to help activate said weapon, then realize that he in over his head, and beg for backup. Of course, he does it in such a way that you aren't prepared in the slightest for fighting a Machine God, on foot, with just Lana on hand. So yeah, he's proven himself to be unreliable in my eyes. Some might find mass murder romantic, but to me he just came off as arrogant, amoral, short-sighted and not all that intelligent, which was the opposite of the Theron pre-Iokath. Do I want him dead? No, because again, someone out there loves him and wants him in their game.

 

And finally, the actual topic of Lana. I just wish that more companions played a role in our adventure. The reason why the vanilla stories worked so well was because WE were the main characters in our own stories. No companion was more integral than us, but after SoR, Theron and Lana took over the show, and not necessarily for the best if you ask me. We're basically back to square 1, but we can't move forward simply because we're filling a hole that apparently everyone from a dumb Smuggler, to the wisest Jedi, to the terrifying Sith can fill. We're interchangeable, but Theron and Lana aren't, and that hits our egos.

 

Basically everything depends on your perspective on the matter at hand. Sorry for the long post, good luck and happy hunting everyone.

Edited October 15, 2018 by asiasusanna

[Elessara]

I was gonna stay out of this, because I promised myself that I wouldn't say anything beyond my first comment, but some things here drew my interest, and for the sake of my own entertainment, I'll just say a few things and leave it at that.

 

First off: Quinn has been accessory to Attempted Murder (and respectively murder if Baras had succeeded) from the moment that he started reporting your actions and movement to Baras. Darth Fat-a-lot knew how and when to set up his traps precisely because of said betrayal. Does Quinn feel remorse? Apparently if his behavior later is to be believed, but all of his remorse would have meant nothing if you had ended up dead. Do I hate him? Hell yeah! Do I want him dead? No-because I'm not certain that my 30 seconds worth of satisfaction would justify him being removed from the stories of people who like him.

 

Onto Theron, I feel like he really fits the "The road to hell is paved with good intentions". Basically he heard that The Order of Mentally Disabled Monkeys wants to kill us, and his desire was to protect us. So his idea includes restarting the Galactic war all over again, potentially kill his own parents over this, try to fry your brain, followed by killing hundreds of people on Umbarra, with the possibility of killing you (very high possibility if Lana had not jumped in the way of him shooting you), followed by even more death and mayhem. Then he decides to provide the Order with the map that they seek, starting a civil war in Chiss space, leading to the death of hundreds, if not thousands of innocent people, and FINALLY deciding to help activate said weapon, then realize that he in over his head, and beg for backup. Of course, he does it in such a way that you aren't prepared in the slightest for fighting a Machine God, on foot, with just Lana on hand. So yeah, he's proven himself to be unreliable in my eyes. Some might find mass murder romantic, but to me he just came off as arrogant, amoral, short-sighted and not all that intelligent, which was the opposite of the Theron pre-Iokath. Do I want him dead? No, because again, someone out there loves him and wants him in their game.

 

And finally, the actual topic of Lana. I just wish that more companions played a role in our adventure. The reason why the vanilla stories worked so well was because WE were the main characters in our own stories. No companion was more integral than us, but after SoR, Theron and Lana took over the show, and not necessarily for the best if you ask me. We're basically back to square 1, but we can't move forward simply because we're filling a hole that apparently everyone from a dumb Smuggler, to the wisest Jedi, to the terrifying Sith can fill. We're interchangeable, but Theron and Lana aren't, and that hits our egos.

 

Basically everything depends on your perspective on the matter at hand. Sorry for the long post, good luck and happy hunting everyone.

 

First ... Order of Mentally Disabled Monkeys .... bwhahahahaha! Love it.

 

Second ... I'm actually positive the writers would have liked to showcase all (or most of) the companions in a greater story role unfortunately it would probably prove to be far to expensive to give all of those companions voice. And I mean that literally, voice acting is expensive. We have a lot of companions. Sure they can afford to get them into a studio for a few lines but beyond that ...? I don't know. Also there's issues with time and availability for voice actors. They had difficulties with Jaesa because of her VA's schedule. I also know that Kira's VA does Critical Role and I think she just had a baby. There'd be riots if they got different VAs for companions.

[Gidrea]

Pretty cruel, tbh.

 

I know, right? And I'm pretty much light side. But she's annoying as hell.

[Eshvara]

I know, right? And I'm pretty much light side. But she's annoying as hell.

 

How dare?

[FlameYOL]

I doubt he is. He has died already twice in swtor (trice if you count killing his host body on chapter1), and he says he has lived trough countless lives from farmer to emperor and attempts taking over your body too. It supports his immortality-bodyshift-plot. And SWTOR is part of Legends canon, you can find swtor plot actively being updated to Legends databases, swtor still has Lucasfilms of approval, and the Emperor in swtor and the emperor in Darth Plagueis book is considered the same character.

 

Pretty sure they just vaguely mention Tenebrae, I don't remember anything about an specific date for his death. I think for the purposes of the legends "timeline" as it is, his final death is likely KOTET. Unless the writers decide to resurrect him again.

[asiasusanna]

Pretty sure they just vaguely mention Tenebrae, I don't remember anything about an specific date for his death. I think for the purposes of the legends "timeline" as it is, his final death is likely KOTET. Unless the writers decide to resurrect him again.

 

They would NEVER do that. We've NEVER had to fight an enemy that should have been dead in our timeline, only to be kept alive for centuries for cheap shock value, we've never killed said enemy, and then didn't have an entire expansion dedicated to fighting him AGAIN...

[IoNonSoEVero]

Pretty sure they just vaguely mention Tenebrae, I don't remember anything about an specific date for his death. I think for the purposes of the legends "timeline" as it is, his final death is likely KOTET. Unless the writers decide to resurrect him again.

 

Please don't put that thought into their heads

 

IIRC Charles Boyd said that Tenebrae's original body (or the one that was killed by the JK?) is still somewhere, so I wouldn't be surprised if there's one final quest to find and destroy that, just to be safe and sure that it's not one last remaining Horcrux. I also wouldn't be surprised if there are any remaining surprise weapons like Zildrog stashed somewhere. I do think they finally confirmed that Vitiate/Tenebrae is good and dead, though.

[fishpeople]

Please don't put that thought into their heads

 

IIRC Charles Boyd said that Tenebrae's original body (or the one that was killed by the JK?) is still somewhere, so I wouldn't be surprised if there's one final quest to find and destroy that, just to be safe and sure that it's not one last remaining Horcrux. I also wouldn't be surprised if there are any remaining surprise weapons like Zildrog stashed somewhere. I do think they finally confirmed that Vitiate/Tenebrae is good and dead, though.

 

What if whatever remains of his loyal followers clone him? Similar to what Palpatine did in the EU.

[Elessara]

What if whatever remains of his loyal followers clone him? Similar to what Palpatine did in the EU.

 

I'm not sure what Palpatine did in the EU but I don't think that would recreate the power he had amassed. I mean, he had to drain all life on Nathema to give himself that much power and cloning would only recreate the physical form. If you're talking about creating another body for him to inhabit I would think that cloning is superfluous as he can simply inhabit almost any body.

 

I really hope he's dead dead. I'm tired of him.

[IoNonSoEVero]

What if whatever remains of his loyal followers clone him? Similar to what Palpatine did in the EU.

 

*covers ears* Lalalalala I can't hear you...

 

It's possible, isn't it? I hadn't considered that awful possibility. But I hope that they won't do that. Really. I think most of us have probably had our fill of Vitiate and it has been tiresome that he's kept popping up like an evil wack-a-mole.

[Kiesu]

What if whatever remains of his loyal followers clone him? Similar to what Palpatine did in the EU.

That's not exactly how it works. Palpatine had made a fully automated system of clones of his chosen gene stored (the clones he has stored and prepared for his spirit to take a hold of would he previous body die, dont actually posses his gene, they're not clones of his body but processed clones of his chosen hosts body).

Edited October 15, 2018 by Kiesu