Why is there no kill option for Lana?

[IoNonSoEVero]

That's why many people use the term "playersexual". However you envision the character is no skin off the nose of the next person and so on and so forth...unless that particular character comes out and expresses interest to define their sexuality. Because, of course, not everybody in the real world is bisexual, but in video-game land...it is the most fair way to handle romances.

 

I see pros and cons to both systems.

 

I prefer the terms bisexual and pansexual because 'playersexual' implies that sexuality is something to be changed at a player's whim. With bisexual and pansexual they are still open for all genders, but it's implied that their orientation is a defined part of who they are. But there are some very heated debates about it and in my mind it's not something to jump down anyone's throat about. Regardless of the term used, it doesn't affect whether the character is available to the PC.

 

Looking at all the factors involved - representation of LGBT+ people, having a variety of choices for players - I agree that making everyone bisexual in the game is the fairest system, IMHO.

 

But I also think it's fair for the sake of characterization to ensure that not every companion is romanceable.I appreciated that none of the DvL or reward companions, like Hexid and Shae, were romances. I like that neither Acina nor Senya is available for a player romance. I like seeing couples that are scripted into the game as being totally into each other and have nothing to do with the player, like Hylo and Gault.

 

Having said that, Scourge is a companion who has been requested as a romance for a long time, and in the context of his characterization and backstory, having his orientation revealed as bisexual and interested in the player would not be out of character. He never specifies the gender of his previous love, for example.

[Mevan]

You forget about Cytharat.

ALL of the M/M characters are able to be killed. So why not Lana?

 

Because she's one of the few well-written characters and the option to kill her off would kill her off for everyone, not just those who wanted rid of her. I pray we never get the option.

[FlameYOL]

Please don't put that thought into their heads

 

IIRC Charles Boyd said that Tenebrae's original body (or the one that was killed by the JK?) is still somewhere, so I wouldn't be surprised if there's one final quest to find and destroy that, just to be safe and sure that it's not one last remaining Horcrux. I also wouldn't be surprised if there are any remaining surprise weapons like Zildrog stashed somewhere. I do think they finally confirmed that Vitiate/Tenebrae is good and dead, though.

 

Yep, I'm interested to see if he is just teasing us or if he will ever do anything with it.

 

What if whatever remains of his loyal followers clone him? Similar to what Palpatine did in the EU.

Sidious himself started the clone process, it was his back-up plan. It's possible his(as in Tenebrae not Sidious, just noticed the ambiguity now) followers could try to resurrect him, but I doubt they would use a clone.

Edited October 15, 2018 by FlameYOL

[fishpeople]

It's been awhile since I read it, so pardon me for my ignorance on that story. All I recall are the clones and the metal eating rancors.

[FlameYOL]

It's been awhile since I read it, so pardon me for my ignorance on that story. All I recall are the clones and the metal eating rancors.

 

No problem. It's been a while since I read about it as well.

[Jdast]

Because she's one of the few well-written characters and the option to kill her off would kill her off for everyone, not just those who wanted rid of her. I pray we never get the option.

 

You assume a causal relationship that is often repeated, but not proven. There is just as legitimate an argument to make that the reason they allow you to abandon or kill her is precisely because they have already decided her story arc is done and she is just another cookie cutter companion.

 

As such, my RP options across my multitude of alts are limited. I have a F/F romance with her. I have a M/F romance with her. I have neutral ones as well as those who want to abandon her and one who wants to kill her.

 

If the constant is that she is not part of the main story arc anymore, then she is not going to interact in any meaningful way regardless. As such they should allow the variable of player choice.

 

I do not harbor ill will to Lana. I am not an edge lord. I have 16 characters that I play consistently. I view NPCs through the lens of my pixels, not my personal lens as a human being. Hence the term -- role play.

 

Moreover, the theory that a kill option means the character disappears is disproven by both Arcann and now Khem.

 

Edit: You can also leave open the possibility of a return in the same way they did Theron. I think it's fair to say his fate is still quite ambiguous, even if you did the kill option because "you leave him to die."

 

Dasty

Edited October 15, 2018 by Jdast

[JakRoanin]

And hopefully Shara. Seriously folks I'm actually thinking of romancing Lana with my Male Cathar Consular just to try it.

[Salphidor]

First off: Quinn has been accessory to Attempted Murder (and respectively murder if Baras had succeeded) from the moment that he started reporting your actions and movement to Baras. Darth Fat-a-lot knew how and when to set up his traps precisely because of said betrayal. Does Quinn feel remorse? Apparently if his behavior later is to be believed, but all of his remorse would have meant nothing if you had ended up dead. Do I hate him? Hell yeah! Do I want him dead? No-because I'm not certain that my 30 seconds worth of satisfaction would justify him being removed from the stories of people who like him.

There is no doubt in me that given the option in the classic game I would've killed Quinn with my first Sith Warrior. I was so pissed first at him, then at Bioware, that that was not an option. I did not see it coming. By now I have 4 SW (only one finding Quinn's betrayal normal, since she is also very crazy), but never used the kill-option on Iokath for two reasons. One, it's been years, and a lot has happened, so forgiving him seems right... also I have a crush on the VA

 

Onto Theron, I feel like he really fits the "The road to hell is paved with good intentions". Basically he heard that The Order of Mentally Disabled Monkeys wants to kill us, and his desire was to protect us. So his idea includes restarting the Galactic war all over again, potentially kill his own parents over this, try to fry your brain, followed by killing hundreds of people on Umbarra, with the possibility of killing you (very high possibility if Lana had not jumped in the way of him shooting you), followed by even more death and mayhem. Then he decides to provide the Order with the map that they seek, starting a civil war in Chiss space, leading to the death of hundreds, if not thousands of innocent people, and FINALLY deciding to help activate said weapon, then realize that he in over his head, and beg for backup. Of course, he does it in such a way that you aren't prepared in the slightest for fighting a Machine God, on foot, with just Lana on hand. So yeah, he's proven himself to be unreliable in my eyes. Some might find mass murder romantic, but to me he just came off as arrogant, amoral, short-sighted and not all that intelligent, which was the opposite of the Theron pre-Iokath. Do I want him dead? No, because again, someone out there loves him and wants him in their game.

What Theron did was stupid and not at all like he handled himself before. However he had good intentions. He was trying to save the PC and the Alliance. He just messed up really badly, and while he deserves to go to bed without supper, killing him was taking it too far (I did it with my Sage though, because I wanted to see that part of the story, and my Sage has gone insane). I personally would've liked it more, if he really had betrayed me, and it would be a really good reason to kill him. Don't get me wrong, I love Theron and have romanced him with several characters, but his death seemed just wrong. He did not try to shoot me on the train, he was aiming for the window, which he shot after, to actually make me jump. Wasn't his fault Lana jumped in, but as I said... stupid, just stupid. It was really bad writing.

 

I also always had the feeling, this is what the writers had planned all along. Playing the first few chapters of KotFE it always feels like Koth' part was mostly written for Theron and they only later decided to change that to a new character (Koth). I i.e. never got why Koth says "Here we go again", when you leave Asylum.... why again? If that were true, then Theron's betrayal was meant to come earlier (which is now Koth' betrayal), and that for whatever reason is something they changed.

 

And finally, the actual topic of Lana. I just wish that more companions played a role in our adventure. The reason why the vanilla stories worked so well was because WE were the main characters in our own stories. No companion was more integral than us, but after SoR, Theron and Lana took over the show, and not necessarily for the best if you ask me. We're basically back to square 1, but we can't move forward simply because we're filling a hole that apparently everyone from a dumb Smuggler, to the wisest Jedi, to the terrifying Sith can fill. We're interchangeable, but Theron and Lana aren't, and that hits our egos.

I didn't like nor trust Lana during SoR, but she has proven herself. I see absolutely no reason to kill her. However, if you want her to be really evil, try flirting with both Lana and Theron at any option during SoR. It will feel like she throws Theron to the wolves just out of jealousy.

[JakRoanin]

And hopefully Shara. Seriously folks I'm actually thinking of romancing Lana with my Male Cathar Consular just to try it.

[Salphidor]

And hopefully Shara. Seriously folks I'm actually thinking of romancing Lana with my Male Cathar Consular just to try it.

Please do. I mostly romance Theron, but I actually created a Sith Assassin just to romance Lana. I wanted to see how it goes, and you really see another side of her.

[IoNonSoEVero]

You assume a causal relationship that is often repeated, but not proven. There is just as legitimate an argument to make that the reason they allow you to abandon or kill her is precisely because they have already decided her story arc is done and she is just another cookie cutter companion.

 

As such, my RP options across my multitude of alts are limited. I have a F/F romance with her. I have a M/F romance with her. I have neutral ones as well as those who want to abandon her and one who wants to kill her.

 

If the constant is that she is not part of the main story arc anymore, then she is not going to interact in any meaningful way regardless. As such they should allow the variable of player choice.

 

I do not harbor ill will to Lana. I am not an edge lord. I have 16 characters that I play consistently. I view NPCs through the lens of my pixels, not my personal lens as a human being. Hence the term -- role play.

 

Moreover, the theory that a kill option means the character disappears is disproven by both Arcann and now Khem.

 

Dasty

 

Correlation does not equal causation, and there are certainly valid reasons to kill someone off in a story (ie, Katha Niar on Makeb), but there have been a few characters, such as Koth and Quinn, who seem to have met the long end of the lightsaber after fans repeatedly complained and called for their demise. Others, such as the Torian/Vette choice, seem to have been done for shock value, and not story value.

 

I don't think either Arcann nor Khem can be used as an argument against bricking being real, either. Arcann notably was a specific writer's pet. She was in his corner and actively lobbied for his romance and more inclusion for him, and thus was miraculously able to find space for him in the Nathema flashpoint when Koth was not given the same air time. Khem hasn't been seen in more than two years unless he was a killable Nathema bit of fuel for SIs who made specific story choices, and there's no evidence that he's going to be anything more than an Alliance Alert (I'm convinced the devs are trolling the fanbase to see how much hysteria they can evoke with the romance option comment).

 

All of the others - Koth, plus any class story LIs who have been returned - have not appeared in a cut scene since the end of KOTET and have been completely silent since Umbara.

 

Theron is the wild card, and if he's included in 5.10 I will be willing to accept that Bioware is willing to write for killable characters, at least for some LIs/companions. But that hasn't been the case for the most part.

 

It's an untenable situation either way. There are now 23 LIs and trying to find a way to include even a fraction of them in the main plot would be absurd. But having them get no content at all, even as a side quest or add-on option, is also something that negatively impacts a lot of fans.

[fishpeople]

We could kill Kaliyo and she still got some activity in KOTET but she had very few lines. Which is what I expect Theron will get too.

[Salphidor]

Correlation does not equal causation, and there are certainly valid reasons to kill someone off in a story (ie, Katha Niar on Makeb), but there have been a few characters, such as Koth and Quinn, who seem to have met the long end of the lightsaber after fans repeatedly complained and called for their demise. Others, such as the Torian/Vette choice, seem to have been done for shock value, and not story value.

 

I don't think either Arcann nor Khem can be used as an argument against bricking being real, either. Arcann notably was a specific writer's pet. She was in his corner and actively lobbied for his romance and more inclusion for him, and thus was miraculously able to find space for him in the Nathema flashpoint when Koth was not given the same air time. Khem hasn't been seen in more than two years unless he was a killable Nathema bit of fuel for SIs who made specific story choices, and there's no evidence that he's going to be anything more than an Alliance Alert (I'm convinced the devs are trolling the fanbase to see how much hysteria they can evoke with the romance option comment).

 

All of the others - Koth, plus any class story LIs who have been returned - have not appeared in a cut scene since the end of KOTET and have been completely silent since Umbara.

 

Theron is the wild card, and if he's included in 5.10 I will be willing to accept that Bioware is willing to write for killable characters, at least for some LIs/companions. But that hasn't been the case for the most part.

 

It's an untenable situation either way. There are now 23 LIs and trying to find a way to include even a fraction of them in the main plot would be absurd. But having them get no content at all, even as a side quest or add-on option, is also something that negatively impacts a lot of fans.

I really have high hopes for 5.10 when it comes to the romances, because they clearly stated that we should get our romances in order before starting 5.10. Maybe we all get a side-story with our chosen second half... like the class-story bit on Rishi.

[IoNonSoEVero]

I really have high hopes for 5.10 when it comes to the romances, because they clearly stated that we should get our romances in order before starting 5.10. Maybe we all get a side-story with our chosen second half... like the class-story bit on Rishi.

 

If they really did that, I'd be very happy and it would restore a bit of my faith in them. A side story would be lovely.

[Damask_Rose]

As i said, i think some character should be for some genders only.

Cytharat was great for that as he's so far the only gay only character, too bad he can die never to be seen again.

 

Here is the thing. We don't know that Cytharat is gay only. What we know is that when male Imperials flirt with him, he is receptive. Since female Imperials don't get a chance to flirt with him, we don't know how he would react. He never initiates flirting and he never says who or what he likes. Is it only that guy he likes? Is it all guys he likes? Does liking one guy mean he doesn't like any women? Was he being polite to get you to do your job? Maybe he was crushing on Katha Niar and wanted to make her jealous and he wasn't really interested in you at all? Or maybe since he expected to die he'd take any last comfort he could? We don't know. You can't make assumptions about a person's sexuality based on their interactions with one person.

[Estelindis]

I really have high hopes for 5.10 when it comes to the romances, because they clearly stated that we should get our romances in order before starting 5.10. Maybe we all get a side-story with our chosen second half... like the class-story bit on Rishi.

That would be amazing. I cannot possibly make myself hope for it because the tiny trickles most vanilla romances have been getting have engineered me not to expect too much... and if I do expect more and don't get it I'll just feel sad. But it would truly be wonderful to get this.

[Salphidor]

Here is the thing. We don't know that Cytharat is gay only. What we know is that when male Imperials flirt with him, he is receptive. Since female Imperials don't get a chance to flirt with him, we don't know how he would react. He never initiates flirting and he never says who or what he likes. Is it only that guy he likes? Is it all guys he likes? Does liking one guy mean he doesn't like any women? Was he being polite to get you to do your job? Maybe he was crushing on Katha Niar and wanted to make her jealous and he wasn't really interested in you at all? Or maybe since he expected to die he'd take any last comfort he could? We don't know. You can't make assumptions about a person's sexuality based on their interactions with one person.

I think they officially stated that he is gay

[Damask_Rose]

I think they officially stated that he is gay

 

I missed that one. Was it an interview or a live stream?

[Salphidor]

I missed that one. Was it an interview or a live stream?

I don't really remember... I'm sure I read it somewhere. It's been a long time ago It was around the time I played the story with a male character for the first time, and was highly confused to have flirt options. This is when I googled it.

[Kiesu]

I missed that one. Was it an interview or a live stream?

It even says so in his own wiki page.

[JennyFlynn]

Here is the thing. We don't know that Cytharat is gay only. What we know is that when male Imperials flirt with him, he is receptive. Since female Imperials don't get a chance to flirt with him, we don't know how he would react. He never initiates flirting and he never says who or what he likes. Is it only that guy he likes? Is it all guys he likes? Does liking one guy mean he doesn't like any women? Was he being polite to get you to do your job? Maybe he was crushing on Katha Niar and wanted to make her jealous and he wasn't really interested in you at all? Or maybe since he expected to die he'd take any last comfort he could? We don't know. You can't make assumptions about a person's sexuality based on their interactions with one person.

No, we don't know for certain and while I saw the other person's post, I don't recall the devs ever explicitly stating this but I do tend to zone out while they yap on so who knows? It's a risky subject though; there have been several male LGBTQ+ players who have thrown massive, and abusive fits over the mere notion Cytharat *could* be bisexual. They feel he is theirs exclusively and that the idea of him being/making him bisexual/SGR is an insult and disgrace to his character, a denial of his orientation and identity.

 

Personally, I see it as quite possible and while I fully support SGR stuff, I've always found it crummy that Cyth was exclusively gay while his Republic counterpart, Lambada whatsherface, was player sexual. There would have been no harm in making both player sexual.

[Lunafox]

I also thought about that, and it could make sense.

I'd find it quite sweet and funny, but i'm pretty sure my JK would find it kinda creepy that a guy fell in love with her some 300 years before she was even born

I could make a clone of her just to try it out though.

 

It's not so creepy or cheesy, in my opinion, it's a thought I originated six years ago in The Well of Undying.

[WayOfTheWarriorx]

This string jumped 10 pages in one day heh

 

Who says the Forums are dead!

Edited October 15, 2018 by WayOfTheWarriorx

[Salphidor]

No, we don't know for certain and while I saw the other person's post, I don't recall the devs ever explicitly stating this but I do tend to zone out while they yap on so who knows? It's a risky subject though; there have been several male LGBTQ+ players who have thrown massive, and abusive fits over the mere notion Cytharat *could* be bisexual. They feel he is theirs exclusively and that the idea of him being/making him bisexual/SGR is an insult and disgrace to his character, a denial of his orientation and identity.

I really don't see a reason to be offended by that suggestion. Fact is, the players were angry about the classic companions not being player sexual from the start, a thing Bioware probably did, because they were afraid of the outrage had they made them player sexual. I'm therefore very happy, that the players in general are so open minded, something you just don't get in all communities. It doesn't really matter, if a character is bisexual, homosexual, or really any other than heterosexual, if you wish to promote and support LGBTQ (gosh, this seems to get more letters by the hour). It is very important to me how the LGBTQ community feels inside the SWTOR community, and it seems to me they are accepted. This is what really counts.

[WayOfTheWarriorx]

Well, spellcheck doesn't always catch everything, but it's nice to know the grammar police are on the scene.

 

I'm doomed.