Funniest Hutt Ball hack

[TrixxieTriss]

Original Hutt Ball : Star Forge : 2.48pm AEST (12.48am EST)

Person Holotraverse’s to nobody from out of the pit and up to the ledge. No Stealths and none of my team up there. Person ran straight through the pit after picking up the ball and Holotraversed straight up and to the line.

Is this d-sync, have I gotten a Sins abilities wrong (I can’t do that on deception);or what? I’m not going to “cry” hacks because it will just get me abused.

So can someone explain what myself and whole team saw in this match. Everyone was asking if others had seen it too and everyone had. Did we all d-synced together and Sins get some cool new abilities or what?

[septru]

Well the first thing you got wrong was that Sins dont have holotraverse.

[Rafiknoll]

Original Hutt Ball : Star Forge : 2.48pm AEST (12.48am EST)

Person Holotraverse’s to nobody from out of the pit and up to the ledge. No Stealths and none of my team up there. Person ran straight through the pit after picking up the ball and Holotraversed straight up and to the line.

Is this d-sync, have I gotten a Sins abilities wrong (I can’t do that on deception);or what? I’m not going to “cry” hacks because it will just get me abused.

So can someone explain what myself and whole team saw in this match. Everyone was asking if others had seen it too and everyone had. Did we all d-synced together and Sins get some cool new abilities or what?

 

Are we absolutely certain that there was no stealther as a target?

Tbh I am a bit confused, you say ''sin'' and you say ''holotraverse''. Did you mean opeeative or dud you mean phantom stride? If it is the latter it can't target friendlies though, so in that case you could confirm the lack of target

Edited June 24, 2018 by Rafiknoll

[WayOfTheWarriorx]

Are we absolutelt certain that there was no stealther as a target?

Tbh I am a bit confused, you say ''sin'' and you say ''holotraverse''. Did you mean opeeative or dud you mean phantom stride? If it is the latter it can't target friendlies though, so in that case you could confirm the lack of target

 

I think she was joking as she was being sarcastic and pretending like she doesn't know anything because some of the other people are jerk offs to her and act like know it alls who never show evidence or anything to substantiate a claim and expect everyone else just to take them at their word and at the same time call others bads.

 

Nothing like being called a bad by someone who doesn't even know what there own DPS is. =p

Edited June 24, 2018 by WayOfTheWarriorx

[Rafiknoll]

I think she was joking as she was being sarcastic and pretending like she doesn't know anything because some of the other people are jerk offs to her and act like know it alls who never show evidence or anything to substantiate a claim and expect everyone else just to take them at their word and at the same time call others bads.

 

Nothing like being called a bad by someone who doesn't even know what there own DPS is. =p

 

Well, I don't know about the gameplay skills of Trixxie, you or anyone else here, but I do have a low opinion of the logical skills of those who conclude anything about anyone's in-game skill according to what (s)he claims to have seen. Sometimes it might indicate lack of knowledge about a certain mechanic or phenomena, but in the several cases in which it is impossible for them to give an alternative explanation, they would still say the lack of skill caused the wrong report (probably lack of skill leads to hallucinations). Oddly enough they usually don't even try to give their alternative explanation, the entire focus of the denying posts would be "mad cuz bad". [Have I mentioned my great dislike for the inability to come up with one's own phrases?]

[TrixxieTriss]

Are we absolutely certain that there was no stealther as a target?

Tbh I am a bit confused, you say ''sin'' and you say ''holotraverse''. Did you mean opeeative or dud you mean phantom stride? If it is the latter it can't target friendlies though, so in that case you could confirm the lack of target

 

Sorry I was tired when I wrote it. I did mean phantom stride. And yes, 100% sure there wasn’t a stealth there.

 

I was right on them and I kept expecting a stealth to appear and a pass and I was spamming tab target and leap (on my Jugg). I’d already slowed the Sin and they were nearly dead. Next thing they phantom stride out of the pit to the line.

I confirmed with my team that there was no one up there. The closest guy we had was on the very top platform (top of the ramp) looking down.

 

Something else I’ve been wondering. Is it possible to artificially cause d-sync? Wouldn’t it just be some lag switching, which let’s face it, is what d-sync looks like.

Edited June 25, 2018 by TrixxieTriss

[Wimbleton]

how about we don't make unsubstantiated claims for no reason and focus on the issue at hand. which in huttball is probably a desync.

 

This thread isn’t about Huttball desync, it’s about potato connections to US servers from BFE and then calling what you don’t understand a hack. Making unsubstantiated claims is exactly right...about hacks . It’s 2018.5, is running a capture program really that difficult? Nope, then BAMB, your claims are now substantiated. The “I took a survey during a huttball match” is laughable.

Edited June 25, 2018 by Wimbleton

[Rafiknoll]

Assassins can only stride to enemies, which means in our case Trixxie's friends. You can see your whole team, even the stealthed ones, so if Trixxie was attacking the carrier in melee range she would have seen the idiot teammate who supposedly let the assassin stride to him either before or after the stride, unless she didn't look before and he immediatly stuck it afterwards, which is unlikely. And dsync doesn't let you cross ledges faster than you should. In fact dsync doesn't give anyone unordinary movement at all. It just screws your visibility to other players. In other words, if a character should not be capable of moving a certain distance in a given amount of time naturally (without dsync), he can't do it with dsync. If an assassin has no enemy target or a sorc to pull him, so he can't quickly cross ledges or get a higher elevation in any viable way, dsync couldn't get him there. If he got there regardless, he either hacked or an unreported different kind of glitch happened.

 

About the ''stalker'' comment, I hardly think that the guy who made a thorough research on 2 female players enough to make a long list of their similarities gets to call anyone else a stalker

Edited June 25, 2018 by Rafiknoll

[KendraP]

This thread isn’t about Huttball desync, it’s about potato connections to US servers from BFE and then calling what you don’t understand a hack. Making unsubstantiated claims is exactly right...about hacks . It’s 2018.5, is running a capture program really that difficult? Nope, then BAMB, your claims are now substantiated. The “I took a survey during a huttball match” is laughable.

 

Do I think what trixie saw was a hack? No, more likely desync or crappy connection issues.

 

Do I think insulting someone personally and calling them someone else is just as unsubstantiated? Yes.

[WayOfTheWarriorx]

About the ''stalker'' comment, I hardly think that the guy who made a thorough research on 2 female players enough to make a long list of their similarities gets to call anyone else a stalker

 

 

Do I think what trixie saw was a hack? No, more likely desync or crappy connection issues.

 

Do I think insulting someone personally and calling them someone else is just as unsubstantiated? Yes.

 

@ Tennis Boy [Wimbleton],

 

You just got knocked the F out!

 

 

Love and Hemorrhaging,

The Stalker

Edited June 25, 2018 by WayOfTheWarriorx

[Rafiknoll]

Something else I’ve been wondering. Is it possible to artificially cause d-sync? Wouldn’t it just be some lag switching, which let’s face it, is what d-sync looks like.

 

In the theory at least, every location-changing hack could cause a dsync. Dsync can happen every time someone uses high-mobility and changes elevation (falling is also considered high mobility) and I would think illegal teleportation counts as high mobility. I am not sure now, because it was a long time ago, but I think that the hacker that stole your name used to dsync on the walls a bit after going through them, at least some of the times.

 

On a general note I think some people here give dsync powers it does not have:The full extent of dsync is that OTHER PLAYERS will see the target stuttering randomly somewhere instead of seeing his true location (the player getting dsynced shouldn't be see anything himself, but can suddenly notice that melees have stopped attacking him completely and realize that he is probably dsyncing at the moment). From the POV of the player dsyncing, he didn't get any crazy temporary ability which gives him random teleportations and the ability to cast illusions of himself all around (By the way, the ability "decoy" like in ME3 could be one funny addition to the game. Legendary utility that when you stealth out you place a decoy of yourself who has your HP and just stands there so people take 2 more seconds to realize you ran away ), he is just walking normally. That would mean, that if for example, you would see a merc on the low ground, and suddenly he dsyncs and is on the high ground (and there is no one around who might have pulled him), then it clearly involved a hack. Since the case was an assassin, the only difference is assassins do have enemy-teleport, and that raises the option that there was a target, but since the target would be in Trixxie's group, and Trixxie can see him/her, the question is why didn't she see any target.

 

You can retreat to saying she is simply lying or had such a terrible lag that she didn't see her teammate coming into stride range and than possibly getting pushed down or killed, all that while she still is lagging too hard to see it all, but then the lag stops and she sees the sin up there, but blaming it on dsync is not enough of an answer. I repeat: if the ability to get somewhere in a certain time does not exist without dsync, it does not exist with it!

Edited June 25, 2018 by Rafiknoll

[Rafiknoll]

It’s 2018.5, is running a capture program really that difficult? Nope, then BAMB, your claims are now substantiated.

 

I am sorry but you either don't understand how "then" works or what "substantiated" means.

"Then" should have a cause on the left and a certain effect of the cause on the right (unless it is a said in a conditional command). I am not sure how does the fact that recording is easy "substantiate" that Trixxie is noobishly misunderstanding what she sees (unless you meant something else by that word). In fact, it would make more sense to assume she is purposely lying than to assume she is noobishly misunderstanding. You would think she would record just to repeat the recording slowly and try to understand what she saw there or let us see it and help her understand if she is such a noob.

 

No, my friend, the most ridiculous possible conclusion would be to say she is too noob to understand what she sees. I will list the reasons again because I never wrote them all in the same place:

1. If she didn't understand what she sees, she would have recorded it, because it would help her understand or help us help her understand. Not understanding is no reason to not record.

2. She describes things very specifically, it can't a situation of her misunderstanding the situation, it is a situation of her "miss-seeing" the situation. It simply doesn't make any sense.

 

No, the fact that she is not recording is more likely to be a result of one of the following:

1. She is making all the stories up [lying]

2. Her connection isn't good enough to stream, so she can't stream, and her PC does not have enough room for recordings.

3. Her PC is on the bottom limit of the hardware required to run SWTOR in low graphics or is stretched thin on background processes regularly, and recording would make things worse on the RAM.

4. Other reasons I might not have thought of, but regardless, being a misunderstanding noob is a reason TO record, not a reason against recording...

 

And since assuming the worst about people proves the worst about oneself, I will not assume #1.

 

I am not a girl-stalking white knight, I am stalking illogical posts as a serial killer

[WayOfTheWarriorx]

I am sorry but you either don't understand how "then" works or what "substantiated" means.

"Then" should have a cause on the left and a certain effect of the cause on the right (unless it is a said in a conditional command). I am not sure how does the fact that recording is easy "substantiate" that Trixxie is noobishly misunderstanding what she sees (unless you meant something else by that word). In fact, it would make more sense to assume she is purposely lying than to assume she is noobishly misunderstanding. You would think she would record just to repeat the recording slowly and try to understand what she saw there or let us see it and help her understand if she is such a noob.

 

No, my friend, the most ridiculous possible conclusion would be to say she is too noob to understand what she sees. I will list the reasons again because I never wrote them all in the same place:

1. If she didn't understand what she sees, she would have recorded it, because it would help her understand or help us help her understand. Not understanding is no reason to not record.

2. She describes things very specifically, it can't a situation of her misunderstanding the situation, it is a situation of her "miss-seeing" the situation. It simply doesn't make any sense.

 

No, the fact that she is not recording is more likely to be a result of one of the following:

1. She is making all the stories up [lying]

2. Her connection isn't good enough to stream, so she can't stream, and her PC does not have enough room for recordings.

3. Her PC is on the bottom limit of the hardware required to run SWTOR in low graphics or is stretched thin on background processes regularly, and recording would make things worse on the RAM.

4. Other reasons I might not have thought of, but regardless, being a misunderstanding noob is a reason TO record, not a reason against recording...

 

And since assuming the worst about people proves the worst about oneself, I will not assume #1.

 

I am not a girl-stalking white knight, I am stalking illogical posts as a serial killer

 

....And the bodycount rises.....

[TrixxieTriss]

In the theory at least, every location-changing hack could cause a dsync. Dsync can happen every time someone uses high-mobility and changes elevation (falling is also considered high mobility) and I would think illegal teleportation counts as high mobility. I am not sure now, because it was a long time ago, but I think that the hacker that stole your name used to dsync on the walls a bit after going through them, at least some of the times.

 

On a general note I think some people here give dsync powers it does not have:The full extent of dsync is that OTHER PLAYERS will see the target stuttering randomly somewhere instead of seeing his true location (the player getting dsynced shouldn't be see anything himself, but can suddenly notice that melees have stopped attacking him completely and realize that he is probably dsyncing at the moment). From the POV of the player dsyncing, he didn't get any crazy temporary ability which gives him random teleportations and the ability to cast illusions of himself all around (By the way, the ability "decoy" like in ME3 could be one funny addition to the game. Legendary utility that when you stealth out you place a decoy of yourself who has your HP and just stands there so people take 2 more seconds to realize you ran away ), he is just walking normally. That would mean, that if for example, you would see a merc on the low ground, and suddenly he dsyncs and is on the high ground (and there is no one around who might have pulled him), then it clearly involved a hack. Since the case was an assassin, the only difference is assassins do have enemy-teleport, and that raises the option that there was a target, but since the target would be in Trixxie's group, and Trixxie can see him/her, the question is why didn't she see any target.

 

You can retreat to saying she is simply lying or had such a terrible lag that she didn't see her teammate coming into stride range and than possibly getting pushed down or killed, all that while she still is lagging too hard to see it all, but then the lag stops and she sees the sin up there, but blaming it on dsync is not enough of an answer. I repeat: if the ability to get somewhere in a certain time does not exist without dsync, it does not exist with it!

 

I can 100% guarantee that no team mates were there, before or after the sin “moved” from the pit and up to the ledge.

 

I was pretty sure from what I know that d-sync wouldn’t explain what I saw. But everyone always jumps down my throat if I bring up hacks. This time I thought I’d just state what I saw and let them tell me it was d-sync

[Rafiknoll]

I was pretty sure from what I know that d-sync wouldn’t explain what I saw.

 

Yeah, many people don't note that dsync is a totally visual bug and mistake it for some kind of weird /stuck-style teleportation, and then they think it is logical people will skip ledges horizontally or upward without a gap-closing ability while it is only possible downward, diagonally downward (while rolling) or horizontally on the ground. The question they should ask themselves is: "In that case: why has this never happened to ME? I don't recall skipping a ledge while carrying the ball just like that..."

Edited June 25, 2018 by Rafiknoll

[TrixxieTriss]

I am sorry but you either don't understand how "then" works or what "substantiated" means.

"Then" should have a cause on the left and a certain effect of the cause on the right (unless it is a said in a conditional command). I am not sure how does the fact that recording is easy "substantiate" that Trixxie is noobishly misunderstanding what she sees (unless you meant something else by that word). In fact, it would make more sense to assume she is purposely lying than to assume she is noobishly misunderstanding. You would think she would record just to repeat the recording slowly and try to understand what she saw there or let us see it and help her understand if she is such a noob.

 

No, my friend, the most ridiculous possible conclusion would be to say she is too noob to understand what she sees. I will list the reasons again because I never wrote them all in the same place:

1. If she didn't understand what she sees, she would have recorded it, because it would help her understand or help us help her understand. Not understanding is no reason to not record.

2. She describes things very specifically, it can't a situation of her misunderstanding the situation, it is a situation of her "miss-seeing" the situation. It simply doesn't make any sense.

 

No, the fact that she is not recording is more likely to be a result of one of the following:

1. She is making all the stories up [lying]

2. Her connection isn't good enough to stream, so she can't stream, and her PC does not have enough room for recordings.

3. Her PC is on the bottom limit of the hardware required to run SWTOR in low graphics or is stretched thin on background processes regularly, and recording would make things worse on the RAM.

4. Other reasons I might not have thought of, but regardless, being a misunderstanding noob is a reason TO record, not a reason against recording...

 

And since assuming the worst about people proves the worst about oneself, I will not assume #1.

 

I am not a girl-stalking white knight, I am stalking illogical posts as a serial killer

 

 

Logic is beyond the grasp of some people, it’s good to see another person actually knows how to use it

 

There are 2 reasons why I don’t record.

 

1. I would need to run the program continously to catch a random person doing something. Which is unreasonable when you consider how many hours I play at a time (3-12 hour or longer sessions). This would ruin my solid state hard drives as they aren’t designed to be used that way.

It’s not like I can say to the person, “hang on, I need to load my capture program”... and please, “can you do that again” just so I can record it to prove what I saw for some troll on the forums

 

2. While my system is very good, running any app or background program will still affect (even minutely) a highend system.

This isn’t such a problem if you have 30-100ms Ping because you just wouldn’t notice it.

But when you play with higher ping, you can notice the smallest hiccups in activation lag, which other services, apps or programs can cause, especially anything that is accessing, memory, hard drive or has access to the web.

My system is stream lined for pure gaming. I’ve got nearly every windows service that isn’t essential, disabled and some completely removed. I even turn my security sorfware to silent when playing because it has a very tiny affect on activation lag (which is noticeable). If I could turn off more I would.

Even my network is streamlined and I put a block on devices accessing the network while I’m gaming (annoys my wife if she wants to watch Netflix).

I also run the game with shadows turned off and other settings on medium. I want to eliminate any possible lag or interruption to activating abilities when I need them.

So I know 99.9% of the time it’s not my system when there is activation lag.

 

I’ve tried 3 programs in the past and all have some affect on performance. Some are fairly good at not causing too many problems. But I’m not going to run one constanly and take a performance hit (no matter how small it is) just to appease trolls. I already play at a disadvantage, I’m certainly not going to add more just to prove to someone who doesn’t believe me.

 

I don’t owe anyone anything, people can choose to believe me or not. Reasonable people like you will use common sense and decide on the merits of what I report seeing. Others will always doubt and cheats will always attack what I say to deflect attention from the topic and discredit me. If I’m discredited, they can continue to cheat and anything I say will be derailed as the talk of a crazy person.

 

I know this is a tactic they used to use on Icykill because she used to bring this sort of behaviour to peoples attention. They were always attacking her and saying hacks were impossible or didn’t exist. Which just made her campaign harder to prove that they did. I know she even did a hacking course (she said it was for work lol) and I believe she joined some underground forums to actually get the swtor hacks and learn how they worked. What’s sad is some of the big name players and forum posters were the biggest deniers. People who should know better considering they are “all knowing experts” on what is and isn’t possible in this game. I’ve always wondered if they were hackers, naive or just dumb.

 

It wasn’t until JeZ** made himself known and became a perpetual pest in Ranked and started spamming his exploits all over the forums, that people reluctantly agreed and then accepted that it was possible. Over night, JeZ** discredited his fellow hackers and deniers in one fowl swoop and vindicated everything Icy had been saying for “years”. We had a massive laugh at the irony. A hacker exposed his fellow hackers for what they were, hypocritical trolls. JeZ** even did a montage for Icy and posted it on the forums (which was quickly removed by the Mods). You can still find it on YouTube.

 

Now we have this d-sync excuse for everything. (d-sync was never mentioned or used as an “excuse” for 5 years as a reason for hacks or lag. It wasn’t until JeZ** exposes the hackers that they needed a new narrative because they could no longer say “hacks are impossible”.

They now use the following when ever someone posts about hacking.

Saw someone walk through a wall? “It must be d-sync”.

Saw someone flying? “It must be d-sync”

Saw someone sink into the floor and stay there so you can’t hit them? “It must be d-sync”

Saw someone teleport up lvls in HB? “It must be d-sync”

These people use d-sync to explain everything. They either don’t understand how it works, are naive, don’t believe the poster or they are hackers.

 

I’m not denying d-sync isn’t a problem or that it’s getting worse as the game gets older. But it can’t explain everything and it’s a pretty distinct effect when it happens. And because it’s so prevalent, you get to learn what it looks like, especially if you play 30+ hours a week for 6 years. You’d have to be blind and pretty stupid to not be able to tell d-sync from other weird stuff. Even internet lag causes a different effect to d-sync (if you know how to tell the difference).

 

But if you were a cheater and knew people see dysnc all the time in Hutt Ball, wouldn’t it be a great place to cheat? They can fly under the radar and anyone who mentions a hack in HB can instantly be discredited because it “must be dysnc”. Even if they aren’t 100% discredited, there is a lingering doubt unless you can provide proof in the form of a recording. And if you can’t provide it, you must be lying or delusional.

 

But let’s say I could provide proof. If I post it on the forums, I’m the one that gets banned. That plays straight into the cheaters hands because they bait you till you get banned and then have a laugh. I’m not that gullible to do something that dumb.

[septru]

In the theory at least, every location-changing hack could cause a dsync. Dsync can happen every time someone uses high-mobility and changes elevation

 

Yes. And to add: dsync can happen whenever a high mobility ability is used to change elevation and the game is unable to register where the player is. I'm no coder or game developer but I've tested dsync a lot and in my experience the easiest way to think about dsync is like this: The game is not smart enough to keep track of players that move very very fast and change elevation.

 

 

On a general note I think some people here give dsync powers it does not have:The full extent of dsync is that OTHER PLAYERS will see the target stuttering randomly somewhere instead of seeing his true location

 

No. There are other effects of dsync. The most common one's include.

 

1) player stuttering in a small 3 meter range for a couple of seconds (as you mentioned)

2) complete invisibility of the player for a couple seconds

3) complete misrepresentation of a player for a couple seconds

 

To demonstrate effect 2, in most cases (at least in ranked) if a sorc force speeds up one of the ramps in makeb mesa arena they will completely disappear for a couple seconds. There is no stuttering, no player left on the screen, no player on the target bar even if you had them targeted before; they completely disappear as if they used a stealth out ability. It is reliable dsync. The same exact effect happens every single time to the same exact class when using the same exact ability.

 

To demonstrate effect 3, (which in my opinion is the worst) in most cases (again using a ranked example) if any class uses a high movement ability in Orbital Station to move up the ramps to the second floor, their body will be misrepresented so that it looks like their body is still on the first floor, right underneath the ramp that they just moved up. Sometimes they stutter, but it looks as if the player fell off the ramp and is right underneath the ramp, where in reality they were on the second floor the whole time. It is reliable dsync. The same exact effect happens every single time to the same exact class when using the same exact ability.

 

That would mean, that if for example, you would see a merc on the low ground, and suddenly he dsyncs and is on the high ground (and there is no one around who might have pulled him), then it clearly involved a hack.

 

No. See effect 3.

 

Since the case was an assassin, the only difference is assassins do have enemy-teleport, and that raises the option that there was a target, but since the target would be in Trixxie's group, and Trixxie can see him/her, the question is why didn't she see any target.

 

My assumption is that the assassin was on the top floor the whole time. He/she probably used force speed (as any good player should) through the first fire trap on the top floor which would then cause dsync triggering effect #3. At which point his body appears on the floor, in the pit below, when in reality he was on the top ramp the whole time. Finally he just jumps off the ledge as force speed is ending, which causes more dsync, but it doesn't matter what effect of dsync is triggered because by then he is in the endzone.

 

 

 

 

Dsync has been in this game a lot longer than most players realize. As an operative duelists, dsync is the biggest problem we have faced. For us it started in early 5.0. A roll up stairs, or a roll over a ledge, ****s us over. That's when I started testing dsync because it was getting so bad that some duels would be decided by a player stuttering or going invisible. I don't know what Bioware did to the game but dsync only got worse. It then went to arenas, and then the latest Bioware warzone maps such as Odessen and Quesh Huttball, and now its present in every warzone map and I have even witnessed it in some instances in Open World, such as Illum. After the Yavin Ruins exapansion, dsync only got worse. I remember playing that map for the first time on a Madness sorc and rage quitting so hard, because I would deathfield expecting to dot spread to 4 people, but they all teleported and I spread on no one.

 

The problem with dsync is the frequency at which it is presenting itself. Bioware has made small changes to fixing dsync since the last patch, and as they have said they are aware of the problem. However, dsync AS OF RIGHT NOW is game breaking because players are able to predict dsync and use it to their advantage. In original huttball, I use dsync to remain invisible until I get to the endzone. If I can get to the top ramp, once I pass the first fire trap, I am gone, because I will roll in such a way that I can reliably cause dsync for myself. In Yavin Ruins, marauders and juggs can reliably use dsync to cap a node before you are able to target them. They first aquire the node that helps speed up the cap time, and then they maddash up the stairs on one of the side nodes, and they can reliably trigger effect 3 dsync every time. I have seen it on stream, many many times. It doesn't help that Bioware is just giving more classes more high movement abilities, such as increased speed on predation (marauder utility), increase speed on hydrolics (powertech utility), shorter cooldown on force speed (lightning sorc). The problem with dsync is the frequency at which it is presenting itself which allows players to use it to their advantage.

 

So when Trixie says she saw dsync but has no videos, no screenshots, no detailed explanation of what happened..... Yes, I am going to assume dsync over hacks. Because at the movement, dsync is much much MUCH MUCH more frequent than hacks. Bioware makes all these changes to hackers, but I see dsync breaking the game IN JUST THIS LAST EXPANSION, far more than hackers have ever. Not to mention she is an Aussie, meaning more ping, and more lag.

[Rafiknoll]

My assumption is that the assassin was on the top floor the whole time. He/she probably used force speed (as any good player should) through the first fire trap on the top floor which would then cause dsync triggering effect #3. At which point his body appears on the floor, in the pit below, when in reality he was on the top ramp the whole time. Finally he just jumps off the ledge as force speed is ending, which causes more dsync, but it doesn't matter what effect of dsync is triggered because by then he is in the endzone.

 

I knew this effect 3 you are talking about but you are describing it as if you see a man walking smoothly and normally right under the area he actually is walking on, in a way that is convincing enough that he is actually there, that when he loses the dsync and "pops" to his true location, it looks like that was the hack, and THAT I have never seen happen. All dsync I ever witnessed were closer to your type 1 or 2, in which something doesn't make any sense and you know it. Even when I witness the effect 3 it is as if the player fell and is now AFK downard, not moving at all or graphically running in place and performing the animation of the abilities he is using, sometimes stuttering and sometimes clear as day, but NEVER moving smoothly as if he really is walking there. Maybe it differs from receiving end to receiving end (you see them walking but I see them standing?), maybe the thing you are describing is simply rarer and I didn't get to see it, maybe you are lying (but I said before I never assume that unless I have to ), regardless I can accept this as a possible explanation.

 

The problem with dsync is the frequency at which it is presenting itself. Bioware has made small changes to fixing dsync since the last patch, and as they have said they are aware of the problem. However, dsync AS OF RIGHT NOW is game breaking because players are able to predict dsync and use it to their advantage. In original huttball, I use dsync to remain invisible until I get to the endzone. If I can get to the top ramp, once I pass the first fire trap, I am gone, because I will roll in such a way that I can reliably cause dsync for myself. In Yavin Ruins, marauders and juggs can reliably use dsync to cap a node before you are able to target them. They first aquire the node that helps speed up the cap time, and then they maddash up the stairs on one of the side nodes, and they can reliably trigger effect 3 dsync every time. I have seen it on stream, many many times. It doesn't help that Bioware is just giving more classes more high movement abilities, such as increased speed on predation (marauder utility), increase speed on hydrolics (powertech utility), shorter cooldown on force speed (lightning sorc). The problem with dsync is the frequency at which it is presenting itself which allows players to use it to their advantage.

 

Well, that might not be hacking (because hacking = using programs or programming skills to edit something somewhere to make things not work as they should), but it IS exploiting (= abuse the fact that as the game is, things do not work as they should), and exploiting is also reportable and punishable. The problem is the same guy needs to be witnessed multiple times before it is certain he is doing it on purpose and not by accident (sorry, that includes what you are doing, but we have a say where I come from "One cannot convict himself", so as long as I don't get a video of you dsyncing in huttball multiple times you should be fine ).

 

So when Trixie says she saw dsync but has no videos, no screenshots, no detailed explanation of what happened..... Yes, I am going to assume dsync over hacks. Because at the movement, dsync is much much MUCH MUCH more frequent than hacks. Bioware makes all these changes to hackers, but I see dsync breaking the game IN JUST THIS LAST EXPANSION, far more than hackers have ever. Not to mention she is an Aussie, meaning more ping, and more lag.

 

First of all let me thank you for focusing on logic and not the size of the other side's brain, and not calling any side any creative adjective simply because of disagreeing. Reading it all has been refreshing, truly. To be honest, I am now not certain what really happened in there. The way I was picturing her description does not exactly fit your idea, but alternative pictures do, and thus I still think the best course of action is to keep a track record for people it happens with commonly (more than once in the same match is odd), and if possible, record and send it to CSR. Since they seem to be so active recently, they might discuss with you and help each other understand if the problem should be fixed by a ban or a game update.

Edited June 25, 2018 by Rafiknoll

[AdjeYo]

I hope they choose to correct that. It will be a sad day if the conclusion of this thread would be that reporting is self-destructive...

Reporting isn't self-destructive, you just shouldn't do it on a public forum. Remember, this is on the internet and specifically naming someone can lead to them getting some considerable harassement wether they're guilty or not.

 

If you think someone is hacking by all means report them, make as much video of it as you can and send pm it to Keith or Musco or get it to Bioware in some other way, hell call them up for all I care. But don't post these things on the forums. And certainly don't post messages you get from cs concerning violations on here, that's just silly.

Edited June 25, 2018 by AdjeYo

[Mycroft-Tarkin]

please answer why shouldn't people openly report absolute proofs of hacks in public? If there is already proof then the guy should be banned and if the guy should be banned than "naming and shaming" him isn't such a big deal?

 

 

And about "Videos may be removed that encourage witch-hunting". What kind of unfair witch hunting could happen to a hacker, multiboxer or exploiter? The guy should be removed from the game, there is nothing worse players could do to him.

 

I thought I would permanently become a lurker on these... "compromised"? forums but I'm replying only because I have had experience with moderating games in the past and also with a lot players asking the exact same question as you did.

 

So yeah, WHY shouldn't "hackers" be named and shamed in public?

 

First, the obvious. If you're plain wrong, publicly calling them a "hacker" will lead to witch-hunting, death threats, yadda yadda. Basically, not a good idea. And yes, you CAN be wrong. You can NEVER be sure, as a player, that another player is hacking, no matter how "frigging smart" you are at the game. You did not write the code for the game and you do not know how it can be manipulated or errr... "intentionally glitched".

 

Secondly, even if they were a "hacker": BioWare has to do their best to protect the privacy of EVERYONE who uses their services. If someone's privacy was compromised on their platform it can be legally disastrous for them. This is why you will never get updates when you report a "hacker" to Customer Support. This is why you are not allowed to use player names on the forums.

 

Think about it this way - in civilised societies criminals are not lynched by mobs, even though some may argue that that would be a more efficient crime deterrent. Everyone regardless of what they do is subject to the same rights and laws as everyone else

[TrixxieTriss]

Let me iterate again for everyone what I saw so there can be no confusion.

 

The assassin picked up the ball and force sped into the pit, I followed with my Jugg.

Enrage (utility increases speed by 50%) - Sabre throw - force charge - force crush - chilling scream (just slow him down)

At this point I was right on him and we weren’t even half way through the pit. There was no dysnc affect at all. He is completely slowed from my attack.

Raging burst - ravage

At this point I’m expecting a stealth from his team to appear on the ledge in front of us, so I start spamming tab target and force charge. I’ve force choke and force push ready to use on them if they do.

 

Next thing he just “leaps” (phantom stride) up onto the ledge and runs to the line.

At no time was there any dysnc looking affects.

There were no Stealths in our end zone

The only other team member was at the top ramp that looks down towards the Hutt Ball Respawn. 4 others (ranged) were behind me trying to slow the sin. The rest of my team was engaged around the respawn to try and hold it.

The sin had zero support.

 

Now I can’t see how any of that can be mistaken for dysnc.

None of my team saw him dysnc and they saw exactly what I did.

 

If he had dysnc’d none of my hits would have gone off (which is what happens with people dysncing).

None of my team mates would have hit either.

None of my slow effects or teams slow effects would have affected him.

 

Therefore it wasn’t dysnc.

 

I can’t prove what I saw, I can only tell you want I saw. If you want to believe that was dysnc, well I can’t tell you what to believe. What I can say is if you think that is dysnc, then you couldn’t spot a hack if it was right in front of your nose. Which would explain why so many of you “never see them”.

Believe me or don’t. But don’t question my ability to play the game. Skill has nothing to do with what I see and report. Trying to discredit me by saying everything i see is dysnc because of my high ping shows you are close minded and aren’t open to the possibility that it was a hack. When you become complacent about such things, hackers are the winners. You are doing their job for them and covering their tracks.

 

I can’t tell you why I see more hacks than other people. From my perspective, I can only assume that it’s one of two things.

1. It’s only people playing at the time of day I do and is completely different to most of you. Which means it’s probably APAC/Asian or Central Eurasian players doing it.

2. You can’t spot a hack or know the difference between dysnc, exploits, bugs or hacks. I’m not going to fault anyone for this because if you really don’t know the difference, that’s not your fault. But you really shouldn’t be telling other people they saw dysnc if you can’t tell the difference. (Before you jump down my throat, I’m not saying anyone here is guilty of this).

I honestly believe it’s reason 1 that you don’t see them.

 

You also need to recognise, that I don’t see them “all” the time, it’s random. I can’t say, “play at this time and you’ll see them”. I’ve gone for 9 months and not seen one.

What I do know is it’s only a very small group doing it. Maybe 2-3 people and possibly a couple of their friends. It’s hard to tell because they probably have multiple Alts.

Sadly these people give their guilds a bad name and when I see certain guilds that have been away from the game all of a sudden reappear in a pvp match, I get ready to see hacks. When they do, the chance of seeing a hack increases. I can’t name and shame these guilds and I wouldn’t anyway because it’s not the guild, it’s one or two of their members and it’s not fair to paint them all as cheats. All I can do is report to Bioware, which I’m honeslty over doing because nothing is done. Or report what I saw on the forums to let other people know to keep an eye out for it.

 

Lastly, if you dont like me posting these reports or don’t believe me, don’t read them. It’s obviously a waste of your time and everyone else’s and every time you try to discredit me, you only reward the hackers out there and encourage them.

[Asaxor]

1. I would need to run the program continously to catch a random person doing something. Which is unreasonable when you consider how many hours I play at a time (3-12 hour or longer sessions). This would ruin my solid state hard drives as they aren’t designed to be used that way.

Pretty much any program can be setup to start/stop recording with a mere key combination.

 

2. While my system is very good, running any app or background program will still affect (even minutely) a highend system.

Using Shadowplay or setting up OBS to use the processor of your graphics card for recording and processing the video will have zero noticeable effect on your in-game experience.

 

This isn’t such a problem if you have 30-100ms Ping because you just wouldn’t notice it.

Ping has nothing to do with it. Recording a video doesn't add ping.

 

But let’s say I could provide proof. If I post it on the forums, I’m the one that gets banned.

Why would you get banned for posting proof? Was anyone ever banned for that? I've posted an fairly obvious video not long ago and wasn't banned.

 

Regarding desync;

Your client can never exactly know the position and movement vectors of all other players. That would require to relay your position all the time to the server which then would have to propagate it to all involved clients. This would kill network traffic quickly, hence positional updates are only made in certain intervals or after certain actions.

It boils down to your client having to show you the animation for a high mobility action without having the accurate position/direction of the subject which will be corrected only later. That's why a targeted ability like force jump doesn't suffer as much from this, your client doesn't only get the info Jug XY has activated force jump, it also gets the target of the ability and is therefor able to show a fairly accurate movement animation from A to B.

 

With an ability like op roll the server would not only have to relay 'operative xy has activated roll' but also the start and end coordinates (incl. z axis) for your client to show you an accurate animation. I'm certain this info isn't relayed, instead your client uses the latest positional data it has and just displays a 'rolling forward' animation. With an ability like force speed it'd be impossible to relay any end coordinates anyway because nothing stops you from changing direction in the middle of force speed.

 

Long story short: As long as untargeted high mobility actions exist you'll have those desync problems.

[Rafiknoll]

Pretty much any program can be setup to start/stop recording with a mere key combination.

 

Standby mode means the program is constantly in the background waiting for the single. It is in the CPU and RAM.

 

 

Using Shadowplay or setting up OBS to use the processor of your graphics card for recording and processing the video will have zero noticeable effect on your in-game experience.

 

Specifically, about shadowplay, I have a friend who uses NVIDIA and has a good PC but cannot run shadowplay because while using a good GPU, it is not among those supported to run it. I for example, have an even better PC, but cannot run the GeForce "whisper mode" because I don't have GTX 1060 or higher. IDK about the other option you mentioned, just saying that the fact something can run without impact doesn't necesarily mean it can run at all.

 

 

Ping has nothing to do with it. Recording a video doesn't add ping.

 

I suppose it makes more sense if I let her explain this one, but I was assuming she meant she doesn't want the computer latency added on top of the already handicapping internet latency that she had.

 

 

Why would you get banned for posting proof? Was anyone ever banned for that? I've posted an fairly obvious video not long ago and wasn't banned.

That's what I was saying! It makes no sense to ban people for posting undeniable proof of people needing a ban (and I repeat for those who might get triggered by this statement: If it was not a hack, there is nothing to be ashamed of. Reminds me of a guy who said I was harassing him when I told him that if he doesn't stop suiciding on purpose on GSF I would report him. He said reporting would be a harassment because there is no rule against it, the answer to that is of course: "so why do you care if I report?", same here "why would someone care if I post a video which shows him NOT hacking?", it is no different than posting my own gameplay videos in which he coincidently appears...)

 

Regarding desync;

Your client can never exactly know the position and movement vectors of all other players. That would require to relay your position all the time to the server which then would have to propagate it to all involved clients. This would kill network traffic quickly, hence positional updates are only made in certain intervals or after certain actions.

It boils down to your client having to show you the animation for a high mobility action without having the accurate position/direction of the subject which will be corrected only later. That's why a targeted ability like force jump doesn't suffer as much from this, your client doesn't only get the info Jug XY has activated force jump, it also gets the target of the ability and is therefor able to show a fairly accurate movement animation from A to B.

 

With an ability like op roll the server would not only have to relay 'operative xy has activated roll' but also the start and end coordinates (incl. z axis) for your client to show you an accurate animation. I'm certain this info isn't relayed, instead your client uses the latest positional data it has and just displays a 'rolling forward' animation. With an ability like force speed it'd be impossible to relay any end coordinates anyway because nothing stops you from changing direction in the middle of force speed.

 

Long story short: As long as untargeted high mobility actions exist you'll have those desync problems.

 

That is actually a very likely explanation, but a solution would be to prioritize information about the location of people under untargeted high-movement effects and send it more often (like "this effect can be triggered outside of the normal rate-limit, and does not respect global CD"). They could, as compensation, reduce the frequency of which slowed target report their position (unless suddenly using high mobility, naturally)

Edited June 26, 2018 by Rafiknoll

[TrixxieTriss]

Standby mode means the program is constantly in the background waiting for the single. It is in the CPU and RAM.

 

I suppose it makes more sense if I let her explain this one, but I was assuming she meant she doesn't want the computer latency added on top of the already handicapping internet latency that she had.

 

Thank you for answering those. You were 100% correct and it meant I didn’t need to explain it

Edited June 26, 2018 by TrixxieTriss

[Glower]

Regarding desync;

 

Hey man, it seems you know quite a lot. So i have a question - why does updating the information take so long even after the roll has been completed? After all, the action has already ended and the client should get the final coordinates back from server? But this can take from 1-2 to several seconds in the worst case...

 

Is there a problem with the server and the client i.e. double shame on Bioware?

Edited June 26, 2018 by Glower