Why did BW not make the early chapter companions same-sex romanceable?

[Aeristash]

Oh for the love of... Guys just drop it. Feelings on the matter are obviously getting very tender and this word dance seems to be spinning to some very dark regions.

[Asmodesu]

And here we have why I am no longer for separated "diverse" romances and wish everything was just "everyone can go and enjoy that character's romance arc" , too much arguing over things that don't need arguing over.

 

It's too late to change the vanilla now, but hey every single new romance since SoR started has been for anyone interested in it. They just need another gal next.

[TrixxieTriss]

They just need another gal next.

 

Agreed +1.

 

It’s a shame they wouldn’t let me try and romance the Sith Empress. She thought it cute I kept trying

Edited April 30, 2018 by TrixxieTriss

[Asmodesu]

Agreed +1.

 

It’s a shame they wouldn’t let me try and romance the Sith Empress. She thought it cute I kept trying

 

If she'd reciprocated the casual flirts she may have even managed to reel some of my characters in! I got an amused vibe from her.

[TrixxieTriss]

If she'd reciprocated the casual flirts she may have even managed to reel some of my characters in! I got an amused vibe from her.

 

Imagine the possibilities of a romantic partnership that brought the Imperial Empire and the Alliance empire together to be the “first galactic empire”. You could rule side by side, you as the Empress and her as your queen (with nearly the same amount of power).

That would have made for an awesome story and you could even see the Galactic Empire story reverting to an Imp v Pub type situation. That way you don’t have to give up your alliance you’ve built.

On the flip side, at the end of the story where..

you get to chose to be Empress or not

.. you could determine if you formed a permanent alliance with either the pubs or the Imps.

Your character would then be limited to one or the other factions fleet. If you were a Jedi or Sith, it doesn’t matter because you’ve already...

become more than a Jedi or Sith with your trials with Satele and Marr

... all it would mean is you are a Jedi or Sith based on the opposite faction you Started on.

I think that would make for an interesting situation and inject some life back into the choices mattering in the game,

It also solves the third faction situation where people don’t want to lose their alliance to go back to being just Pub or Imp.

[BRKMSN]

Oh for the love of... Guys just drop it. Feelings on the matter are obviously getting very tender and this word dance seems to be spinning to some very dark regions.

 

lol

 

 

Well played!

[Seireeni]

I'm not sure how they missed Juhani (perhaps for a singleplayer game they were paying less close attention, or perhaps it was sufficiently hidden), but RotHC was released half a year after Disney bought Star Wars. That seems like plenty of time to me to add in those tiny snippets if they were already inclined to, but leashed by LA.

 

That timing had always felt like supporting evidence to me.

 

Welp, thanks for the correction - - I could have sworn it was later than that. now one would only need to dig up the old "same gender romance discussion" - thread and see at what point did Bioware start saying that it would be a thing. If it's around the same time Disney bought it, that could support further.

 

Anyway, I'm on board for the next LI be a female if it's Acina. I actually have a character already dedicated for her (because the other options just don't suit that character ).

Edited April 30, 2018 by Seireeni

[MajMattMason]

Why did BW not make the early chapter companions same-sex romance options? Well, if I recall the discussions at the time - BW seemed to find the request odd, as if it really hadn't occurred to them that anyone playing a RPG based on Star Wars would want that. They didn't design for it. If George Lucas was against SS romancing, I'm hardly surprised - I don't think "sex" in any form or manner has ever made an appearance in any official Star Wars movie or series - unless Anakin got nasty with Padme onscreen and I missed it. Once you introduce gay folks to the story you have to acknowledge that "sex" does happen in Star Wars. Or at least that's the common straight narrative. Which again isn't all that surprising.

 

If we gay folks would conduct ourselves more properly and primly and not flaunt our sexuality all the time, anything "same-sex" wouldn't by it's perceived nature be considered "sexual". Which, of course, is actually nonsense. The day to day life of a gay person isn't hyper-sexualized (well mine isn't, perhaps sadly ), but get a bunch of 1/2 naked gay men having a parade and out come the cameras.

 

I can say to some degree this lack of giving me options to play Star Wars my way was one of the reasons I left the game early on. I found BW to be tone deaf on the SS subject, but they did pledge to do better, and ultimately, I think they did. For a RPG set in the Star Wars universe, I think BW did a pretty good job with SS romance in the expansions. I think it's about time Star Wars grew up and became an adult.

Edited May 1, 2018 by MajMattMason
typo

[SteveTheCynic]

but get a bunch of 1/2 naked gay men having a parade and out come the cameras.

I'm pretty sure that if a bunch of half-naked *straight* men decided to have a parade, the cameras would be out in force.

[MajMattMason]

I'm pretty sure that if a bunch of half-naked *straight* men decided to have a parade, the cameras would be out in force.

 

But for a lot of straight folks all they see of gay life are the parades and associated antics. I would claim that real world "sex" has never had a place in the Star Wars cinematic universe that most everyone is familiar with. It's just not there in any but the most peripheral way. And, right or wrong, anything that would fall under "gay" also would be referring to sex because that's how our society views gay people and their "lifestyle". You can have a complete Luke without any sexual context to his life. If Luke was GAY? Maybe he was - you really just don't know because it had practically nothing to do with his story. And that's how I'm sure George Lucas saw it, and most likely BW as well. And I'm not condoning or apologizing for anyone's choices, I'm just pointing out why I think there were no SS relationships in vanilla SWTOR.

Edited May 1, 2018 by MajMattMason

[Antonfourteen]

There's no point, Swtor is kind of in its last few years anyway. Besides the vanilla companions have been established as straight characters, changing them now would be lore-breaking. I don't like this whole narrative that everybody has to be bisexual which is what we've been getting recently with the new characters, it just doesn't feel organic and feels like it has been done to score brownie points with SJWs.

 

I prefer the Dragon Age approach where everybody has their own sexuality instead of 'Everybody must be bisexual!' Swtor approach. I think a lot of people are confusing Swtor with a dating simulator now...

[SteveTheCynic]

There's no point, Swtor is kind of in its last few years anyway. Besides the vanilla companions have been established as straight characters, changing them now would be lore-breaking. I don't like this whole narrative that everybody has to be bisexual which is what we've been getting recently with the new characters, it just doesn't feel organic and feels like it has been done to score brownie points with SJWs.

 

I prefer the Dragon Age approach where everybody has their own sexuality instead of 'Everybody must be bisexual!' Swtor approach. I think a lot of people are confusing Swtor with a dating simulator now...

The only bisexuals in the game are player characters. If the player character is male, then Lana is straight and Theron and Koth are gay, and if the PC is female, then Lana is lesbian and Theron and Koth are straight.(1)

 

The PC, on the other hand, can follow a straight romance during the class story and a gay/lesbian one (as appropriate) in KotFE/ET.

 

(1) I call this orientation "playersexual", that is, a sexuality that is compatible with romancing the player.

 

Supplementary note: The game has nineteen romanceable straight companions, four playersexual companions, a variety of flirtable straight NPCs (mostly in the base class and/or planetary stories), one flirtable lesbian NPC and one flirtable gay NPC.

[SithKoriandr]

SERIOUSLY! With all the problems this game has, THIS is what you focus on

 

I don't know. I think going back and allowing it with some characters would get lots of players going...

 

"Well, I did all this for this character, I'm 100 Valor, Social X, but now that I can finally romance such and such original crew member...TIME TO REROLL!"

 

I know, no matter how far along my Knight is, if given the option to romance Kira, I'd reroll

[FabulousDoctor]

There's no point, Swtor is kind of in its last few years anyway. Besides the vanilla companions have been established as straight characters, changing them now would be lore-breaking. I don't like this whole narrative that everybody has to be bisexual which is what we've been getting recently with the new characters, it just doesn't feel organic and feels like it has been done to score brownie points with SJWs.

 

There are a few characters though, in the vanilla companions, such as Kaliyo, Akaavi, and Torian, who do light flirting even with same gender BHs, the BH just has no way to respond to it. I don't think anyone is asking for every companion to be gay, but I don't think it's that unlikely that some of them maybe could have it.

 

It's mostly too late, obviously - the only ones that could possibly be changed are the ones that haven't returned for expansions yet, because this would not only make bioware go back and record tons of chapter 1-3 dialogue, but some chapter 4 dialogue, some chapter 5, and then reunion dialogue.

[xakrepx]

And frankly, I'm getting tired of justifying my right to exist in public to people who have no care for me or others like me.

 

Good night. I hope you get over your stigma.

-

 

No one is arguing against your right to exist. You're being very alarmist for what was a discussion about artistic freedom. There is no need to get all SJWy here.

[xakrepx]

There's no point, Swtor is kind of in its last few years anyway. Besides the vanilla companions have been established as straight characters, changing them now would be lore-breaking. I don't like this whole narrative that everybody has to be bisexual which is what we've been getting recently with the new characters, it just doesn't feel organic and feels like it has been done to score brownie points with SJWs.

 

I prefer the Dragon Age approach where everybody has their own sexuality instead of 'Everybody must be bisexual!' Swtor approach. I think a lot of people are confusing Swtor with a dating simulator now...

 

Agreed 100%. It's fine as it is because these characters are there to be more than just a romance.

[BlastBoomArt]

No one is arguing against your right to exist. You're being very alarmist for what was a discussion about artistic freedom. There is no need to get all SJWy here.

 

I wasn't being alarmist. You're missing out on some context because a few of those posts were removed by the mods. (Which I will not discuss further for obvious reasons) Our discussion ended on a rather civil note anyway so I don't really see where you're going with this..

-

[BlastBoomArt]

And here we have why I am no longer for separated "diverse" romances and wish everything was just "everyone can go and enjoy that character's romance arc" , too much arguing over things that don't need arguing over.

 

It's too late to change the vanilla now, but hey every single new romance since SoR started has been for anyone interested in it. They just need another gal next.

 

Agreed and agreed.

 

I think it's very interesting (and great representation!) when Bioware introduces characters that are of all different sexualities, but in my experience (having lived through all the hype leading up to each new DA and ME game) the in-fighting that pops up among fans is just NOT worth it.

 

I don't really understand the problem with making romance options 'player-sexual' anyway. All it means is that no one has to be disappointed when they can't romance their fave. *shrugs*

-

[Antonfourteen]

There are a few characters though, in the vanilla companions, such as Kaliyo, Akaavi, and Torian, who do light flirting even with same gender BHs, the BH just has no way to respond to it. I don't think anyone is asking for every companion to be gay, but I don't think it's that unlikely that some of them maybe could have it.

 

It's mostly too late, obviously - the only ones that could possibly be changed are the ones that haven't returned for expansions yet, because this would not only make bioware go back and record tons of chapter 1-3 dialogue, but some chapter 4 dialogue, some chapter 5, and then reunion dialogue.

 

Kaliyo makes it pretty clear in KOTFE that she's not interested in women romantically. I can't remember exactly what she says but she says a certain line of dialogue if you flirt with her as a female when you return to Odessen and speak in the bar. As for Torian and Akaavi, I don't recall ever hearing any "light flirting" and I've played as a female Smuggler and male Bounty Hunter.

Bioware needs to add what's going to make money aka story and group content. Going back and redoing companion dialogue (which will cost TONS of money which they're lacking at the moment) to cater to same sex romance isn't going to bring in a tsunami of new players apart from some thirsty players who want to watch two virtual girls kiss...

 

Also another point to bring up is most of the companion voice actors are leaving after voicing their returning characters in KOTFE/KOTET. So at this point, it's next to impossible. I'm staunchly against breaking the lore of characters for social justice reasons.

[SithtobeJedi]

Kaliyo makes it pretty clear in KOTFE that she's not interested in women romantically. I can't remember exactly what she says but she says a certain line of dialogue if you flirt with her as a female when you return to Odessen and speak in the bar. As for Torian and Akaavi, I don't recall ever hearing any "light flirting" and I've played as a female Smuggler and male Bounty Hunter.

Bioware needs to add what's going to make money aka story and group content. Going back and redoing companion dialogue (which will cost TONS of money which they're lacking at the moment) to cater to same sex romance isn't going to bring in a tsunami of new players apart from some thirsty players who want to watch two virtual girls kiss...

 

Also another point to bring up is most of the companion voice actors are leaving after voicing their returning characters in KOTFE/KOTET. So at this point, it's next to impossible. I'm staunchly against breaking the lore of characters for social justice reasons.

 

Kaliyo was romantically involved with Ona whom is a female. But she ran away, as she always did.

Edited May 25, 2018 by SithtobeJedi

[AdornedBlood]

The only bisexuals in the game are player characters. If the player character is male, then Lana is straight and Theron and Koth are gay, and if the PC is female, then Lana is lesbian and Theron and Koth are straight.(1)

 

The PC, on the other hand, can follow a straight romance during the class story and a gay/lesbian one (as appropriate) in KotFE/ET.

 

(1) I call this orientation "playersexual", that is, a sexuality that is compatible with romancing the player.

 

Supplementary note: The game has nineteen romanceable straight companions, four playersexual companions, a variety of flirtable straight NPCs (mostly in the base class and/or planetary stories), one flirtable lesbian NPC and one flirtable gay NPC.

 

Would "playersexual" be an appropriate definition for a player who's straight in real life but somehow gay ( or bi) in game?

[SithtobeJedi]

And here we have why I am no longer for separated "diverse" romances and wish everything was just "everyone can go and enjoy that character's romance arc" , too much arguing over things that don't need arguing over.

 

It's too late to change the vanilla now, but hey every single new romance since SoR started has been for anyone interested in it. They just need another gal next.

 

If we're talking about new companions to do such with, I'll go out on a limb and say Thana Vesh and Mia Hawkins would be my obvious picks.

 

However one of the most intriguing ones imo that I'd want the most would be Ona Querit aka "Menace" Kaliyo's rival Bounty Hunter, as well as former best friend and love interest. If you've forgotten about her here you go http://swtor.wikia.com/wiki/Ona_Querit

 

All things considered I would love to be able to have Ona as my companion, as well as a romanceable option for my fem Bounty Hunter.

 

I always use Ona as the example when people say Kaliyo says she doesn't like women for romanctic reasons, because it's very heavily implied that Kaliyo and Ona were a romantic couple, but Kaliyo ran away, as she always did.

 

So I'd like my Bounty Hunter to have a chance hehe

 

Besides, Ona has all the makings of an AWESOME companion character imo. Especially given the backstory with her family, Kaliyo and everything else.

[Raynezazki]

The only bisexuals in the game are player characters. If the player character is male, then Lana is straight and Theron and Koth are gay, and if the PC is female, then Lana is lesbian and Theron and Koth are straight.(1)

 

The PC, on the other hand, can follow a straight romance during the class story and a gay/lesbian one (as appropriate) in KotFE/ET.

 

(1) I call this orientation "playersexual", that is, a sexuality that is compatible with romancing the player.

 

Supplementary note: The game has nineteen romanceable straight companions, four playersexual companions, a variety of flirtable straight NPCs (mostly in the base class and/or planetary stories), one flirtable lesbian NPC and one flirtable gay NPC.

 

If Lana, Theron and Koth are playersexual it's in the form of the *only* person they ever express interest in is the PC. Not them being gay/straight but as in literally ONLY being sexually interested in the player character. That said this is true for a lot of SWTOR's LI's. Quinn shows no interest in anyone other than the female SW, Corso for the femSmug but no one would call them playersexual. I'm tired of playersexual being used to sling shade at any bi LI that doesn't scream from the treetops that they're bisexual but a straight LI that does the same thing is just fine.

 

What you're talking about is something like with Anders where he literally does not mention his relationship with another man if you play female protagonist. Theron, Lana and Koth don't express interest in anyone outside the PC (that said I always thought Lana and Koth had something going on anyway). There's no sexuality expressed for them to contradict. (Which can be considered playersexual of a sort if one simply doesn't assume they're not interested in anyone other than the protagonist for a multitude of reasons but not of the contradictory type. )

Edited May 25, 2018 by Raynezazki

[SithKoriandr]

I thought it was out right stated that Lana and Koth had something, if one doesn't date one of them.

 

It heavily implies anyways, making them bi.

 

Theron would be the player sexual one.

[Raynezazki]

I thought it was out right stated that Lana and Koth had something, if one doesn't date one of them.

 

It heavily implies anyways, making them bi.

 

Theron would be the player sexual one.

 

I always felt it was implied they used to have something regardless but yeah they're at least bi.

 

And given the position he's in when we meet him him ignoring romance outside of the protagonist (which starts before things go completely pear shaped) isn't that strange.