EA Might Lose Their Star Wars License?! What Does That Mean For SWTOR?

[LordTurin]

Reading the article, it definitely sounds like it is more of a "EA loses its exclusivity" as opposed to "EA loses the SW license completely".

 

I think this means nothing for SWTOR in the short term (next couple years). Does SWTOR survive past EA losing the license in 2023? Not without a boatload of extra effort put into Star Wars games by EA. But that's a lot of years away, and a lot could change.

[PennyAnn]

I see, so shutting it down and rebooting it under either Ubisoft or Activision wouldn't be possible either? I saw some talks here once that there was another MMO (Final Fantasy I think? Not sure) that shut down for half a year or something and was later rebooted and a huge success. Could that work for SWTOR?

 

That was a different scenario entirely, as the same studio revamped it that made it originally. This would be another studio taking over, and that is not likely at all.

[IanArgent]

Please explain. I've played several games during their launch and SWTOR's was probably the smoothest I've experienced. I've seen where others criticized the game's launch. But show me a game that launched with no problems and I'll buy you a tarisian ale in the cantina.

 

I didn't mean to imply that the launch was not technically smooth, but they built it and the customers did not come. There were high hopes for subscriber numbers (WoW-level) at the beginning, that never happened.

[LordTurin]

I didn't mean to imply that the launch was not technically smooth, but they built it and the customers did not come. There were high hopes for subscriber numbers (WoW-level) at the beginning, that never happened.

 

My understanding was they did come, they just blew through the original content in a very short period of time, and then left because there was no endgame. I wasn't here at the time, but that is what everything I've read has said.

[DarthSpuds]

LotR Online has been going for 11 years and went through a total of 5 publishers. Eleven years and five publishers. The game is still running, and released a major expansion (Mordor) last year. It's my opinion that it has endured this long for three reasons: a very loyal player base, the willingness to transfer the license to a new studio to continue content development, and EA has never gotten their claws on it.

 

I actually played LOTRO for a while a few days back and it's not bad.

But it is showing its age.

Compared to newer titles like SWTOR, Wildstar and ESO LOTRO combat feels slow, and I mean SLOOOOOOOOOOOOW, like watching continents move.

 

It needs an overhaul - especially in combat. But what they are doing visually with an 11 year old engine is quite remarkable.

 

All The Best

[IanArgent]

My understanding was they did come, they just blew through the original content in a very short period of time, and then left because there was no endgame. I wasn't here at the time, but that is what everything I've read has said.

 

I can accept that as well; I wasn't here at the time and am going by somewhat patchy histories and oral tradition. In either case, the expected long-term player base either never materialized or vanished. First or second step, the game still tripped and faceplanted painfully, and never really recovered.

[Vandicus]

I can accept that as well; I wasn't here at the time and am going by somewhat patchy histories and oral tradition. In either case, the expected long-term player base either never materialized or vanished. First or second step, the game still tripped and faceplanted painfully, and never really recovered.

 

<Here from the beginning.

 

By spring of 2012(game released in dec 2011) SWTOR had sold 2.4 million copies, but 1.3 million had remained subscribers. By the end of summer we were around 1 million and alarms were sounding for EA so we were put on a path to a sub/f2p hybrid model. This whole cycle had resulted in a massive server increase shortly after launch, and then a series of server consolidations afterwards(probably a contributing but hardly sole factor in the player population decline).

 

To put this in context, EA had previously said they were aiming for 1 million long run subscribers(this was the goal and the basis on which the project was done), the game was survivable at 500k, and they'd be ecstatic to have 1.5 million. Survivable doesn't mean desirable, so f2p was their option to increase their revenue per subscriber, which by all accounts it has been very successful at doing.

 

Content wise delivery was pretty fast at the time, and SWTOR had, and continues to have, some of the longest and most enjoyable leveling content of any MMO. We started with 1 raid(EV), within a month had our second(KP), and a few months later our third(EC). We went f2p slightly before the launch of our 4th raid, Terror from Beyond. The Ancient Hypergates and Novare Coast warzones are also both from 2012.

 

Back then raids weren't managed to keep them all at progression(of some form), but I'm skeptical it was an absence of raiding content that lead to the sharp player decline. The number of raiders is after all a relatively small portion of the MMO population, and SWTOR's player decline is actually not unusual in proportional terms as you're generally looking at losing 2/3rds of your subscribers(that is people who actually subscribed not just bought the game and played the 1st month) in the first year.

 

Furthermore, population has since been much more stable, declining slowly and increasing around patch and expansion times, then it was in the first year, despite a massively slower release of content.

 

The way I see it is that people bought the game hoping for a certain experience(many of them hoping for different things), and didn't find it or moved on after having their fill. We didn't have hundreds of thousands of people complete the early raids on the hardest difficulties and then leave, we had a bunch of people who didn't like how the game played or really wanted certain features that simply weren't present and left, many without every hitting max level(remember that leveling was much slower back then).

 

*EDIT

 

To be sure, large numbers of the raiding community left quickly(to other new MMOs in the circles I played at the time), but their reasons for leaving were likely different from other people's.

 

*EDIT2

It was very popular at the time for raiders, pvpers, and open world pvpers to say that the game was losing subscribers because their particular form of content was not being produced fast enough. Similar claims(although much smaller in volume) were made regarding the absence of a space combat feature in the fashion of GSF.

 

Content speed for the first two I don't think could have been reasonably faster in the first year, and so if that was the reason for leaving, it would've been impossible to satisfy them regardless. For open world pvp, SWTOR's attempts at it were a trainwreck, sometimes fun, but a trainwreck nevertheless. Anyone hoping for something like GSF had every reason to leave at the time.

Edited February 15, 2018 by Vandicus

[Ylliarus]

Probably not because the OP didn't multi-post rumor-mongering as fact. He's genuinely seeking information / input from other people. In other words, he's not trolling.

 

Thank you for the vote of confidence!

 

Yes, definitely, and I already have seen some very interesting discussions pop up in this thread about the subject which have given me much insight in how the community thinks about this issue.

 

It is indeed mostly a rumour and rumours often turn out to be just that, nothing more. The most likely scenario is indeed that the contract will expire naturally and parties like Ubisoft or Activision will be next in line or both will receive contracts. I do wonder how they'd handle the franchise as I haven't played many Ubisoft games and none from Activision. That is, if they are even considered as it might turn out the entire article is fake and EA renews their contract with Disney.

Edited February 16, 2018 by Ylliarus

[SaerethDL]

After that sad excuse for a roadmap, I hope they do lose the license, they don't deserve it.

[Darkside]

<Here from the beginning.

 

By spring of 2012(game released in dec 2011) SWTOR had sold 2.4 million copies, but 1.3 million had remained subscribers. By the end of summer we were around 1 million and alarms were sounding for EA so we were put on a path to a sub/f2p hybrid model. This whole cycle had resulted in a massive server increase shortly after launch, and then a series of server consolidations afterwards(probably a contributing but hardly sole factor in the player population decline).

 

To put this in context, EA had previously said they were aiming for 1 million long run subscribers(this was the goal and the basis on which the project was done), the game was survivable at 500k, and they'd be ecstatic to have 1.5 million. Survivable doesn't mean desirable, so f2p was their option to increase their revenue per subscriber, which by all accounts it has been very successful at doing.

 

Content wise delivery was pretty fast at the time, and SWTOR had, and continues to have, some of the longest and most enjoyable leveling content of any MMO. We started with 1 raid(EV), within a month had our second(KP), and a few months later our third(EC). We went f2p slightly before the launch of our 4th raid, Terror from Beyond. The Ancient Hypergates and Novare Coast warzones are also both from 2012.

 

Back then raids weren't managed to keep them all at progression(of some form), but I'm skeptical it was an absence of raiding content that lead to the sharp player decline. The number of raiders is after all a relatively small portion of the MMO population, and SWTOR's player decline is actually not unusual in proportional terms as you're generally looking at losing 2/3rds of your subscribers(that is people who actually subscribed not just bought the game and played the 1st month) in the first year.

 

Furthermore, population has since been much more stable, declining slowly and increasing around patch and expansion times, then it was in the first year, despite a massively slower release of content.

 

The way I see it is that people bought the game hoping for a certain experience(many of them hoping for different things), and didn't find it or moved on after having their fill. We didn't have hundreds of thousands of people complete the early raids on the hardest difficulties and then leave, we had a bunch of people who didn't like how the game played or really wanted certain features that simply weren't present and left, many without every hitting max level(remember that leveling was much slower back then).

 

*EDIT

 

To be sure, large numbers of the raiding community left quickly(to other new MMOs in the circles I played at the time), but their reasons for leaving were likely different from other people's.

 

*EDIT2

It was very popular at the time for raiders, pvpers, and open world pvpers to say that the game was losing subscribers because their particular form of content was not being produced fast enough. Similar claims(although much smaller in volume) were made regarding the absence of a space combat feature in the fashion of GSF.

 

Content speed for the first two I don't think could have been reasonably faster in the first year, and so if that was the reason for leaving, it would've been impossible to satisfy them regardless. For open world pvp, SWTOR's attempts at it were a trainwreck, sometimes fun, but a trainwreck nevertheless. Anyone hoping for something like GSF had every reason to leave at the time.

 

I'd also like to add that the original devs didn't have a clear definition of what to do beyond the story content. They gave the impression that they didn't think that far ahead, and they certainly didn't expect players to gobble through the content as fast as they did. They were expecting to have a lot of time to figure things out with what they thought was a lot of playable content.

[lightSaberAddiCt]

ubisoft or activision.. really? they can't do any better. how about obsidian or CDPR.

 

I dream CDPR would get a SW franchise, but the thing is, they wouldn't take it. They produce their own content, at their own publication rate. They don't care.....they will not release a game until it is ready. Yeah, they would make an awesome game, but it wouldn't come out for like 8 years.

[numbahten]

I just woke up from a lovely sleep, grab my phone and Google shows me a link to this article:

 

http://www.cinelinx.com/game-rumors/item/11988-report-disney-lfl-talking-with-2-new-game-developers-for-star-wars.html

 

According to this article, Disney and Lucasfilm are unhappy with what EA has been doing with the franchise in the gaming world and are supposedly looking at ways to take the exclusive right to make Star Wars games away from them. Instead, according to the article, they are considering to give the right to make Star Wars games to Ubisoft or Activision.

 

So this is yet another rumour/article that shows there is a storm going on behind the scenes that we are barely aware of. But the important question I want to ask is what this will mean for SWTOR. If EA loses their right to make Star Wars games does that mean Bioware will have to shut down Star Wars The Old Republic? Or is there a possibility that the SWTOR title will be taken over by Ubisoft or Activision and continue under their care?

 

EDIT: Also, to be clear, I am reading in the posts that there was another poster who had been spamming the forums with the same rumour earlier. To be clear, I am not that same poster and I wasn't aware there had been a poster spamming the forums with this rumour. I do apologise however for unknowingly and unwillingly spamming the same rumour they spammed. Had I known that something of the sorts had happened I would not have made this thread!

 

 

I can say this is an iffy situation. I used to be heavy in STO as well. It started off as an Atari license but eventually went to Cryptic, then Perfect World. Since Perfect World, new content has been a little dry and micro transactions increased. Monthly paid subs are still available, but you have to do a google search to find it as it's not anywhere on the main site. Even so, the best gear is still in the zen store(micro transactions) and that's the only way to get a tier 6 ship other than the standard cruiser gifted to veteran players. All though SWTOR has the cartel, most items are cosmetic for the most part and doesn't cut a whole portion of the game off just because you have to have the right tier of equipment that happens to only be acquired through micro transaction or veteran gift which only works well enough for the story, but not group play. If Bioware is no longer able to run SWTOR, it will either be shut down, or in a likely scenario, it may be housed in a small server for the new company to manage but not really any new content so the profits can still come in from the subs and micro transactions.

[Andryah]

I'd also like to add that the original devs didn't have a clear definition of what to do beyond the story content. They gave the impression that they didn't think that far ahead, and they certainly didn't expect players to gobble through the content as fast as they did. They were expecting to have a lot of time to figure things out with what they thought was a lot of playable content.

 

Yep. Rookie mistake by a studio that had never done an MMO before.

[TheLexinator]

It would be shutdown

 

Yep, no more SWTOR.

 

Hopefully it doesn't happen. The game already has virtually no active developers working on it, this would be the end.

[Ylliarus]

After that sad excuse for a roadmap, I hope they do lose the license, they don't deserve it.

 

The Roadmap is rather underwhelming indeed. Then again it confirms most of the devs at Bioware are preoccupied with working on Anthem and only a small team is maintaining SWTOR.

[fishpeople]

The Roadmap is rather underwhelming indeed. Then again it confirms most of the devs at Bioware are preoccupied with working on Anthem and only a small team is maintaining SWTOR.

 

Yeah

[Darthanimus]

I pray that EA lose ALL rights to star wars games. Their performance with SW:tor deserves widespread condemnation.

[TrixxieTriss]

I don’t think Disney will revoke the licence for the current SW games under the EA banner. It’s more likely they realised their mistake in granting an exclusive licence to EA instead of negotiating with individual studios to get games made. When everything was still under the Lucas Arts banner, there was no one exclusive licence.

I think it will be healthy for SW games in general if EA loses their exclusivity because then they will actually need to try and make better games and support them if they want anymore deals from Disney. Monopolies breed indifference and mediocrity.Competition breeds support, innovation and customer satisfaction.

Disney will likely find a loop hole to allow other studios to make SW games and EA will continue with what they have for the meantime. It’s akin to EA being passed over for that “all” important promotion. They will either learn from it and pick up their act or they will stay in the dog house and eventually be fired.

If EA were to turn things around with their current SW stable of games, then maybe Disney will consider letting them make more Disney owned games, not just SW games. Hopefully EA will learn from the experience and pump some money back into swtor and support this game like they should be.

But I think we know that’s wishful thinking. Only a complete overhaul at the top of EA will purge that bad attitude at the top and change how EA do business. Hopefully the other rumours of Microsoft buying EA turn out to be true. Then maybe there would be changes that could end up benefiting swtor. Otherwise I’m afraid the next stop for this game in the not to distant future, will be server shut down.

[xordevoreaux]

I don’t think Disney will revoke the licence for the current SW games under the EA banner. It’s more likely they realised their mistake in granting an exclusive licence to EA instead of negotiating with individual studios to get games made. When everything was still under the Lucas Arts banner, there was no one exclusive licence.

I think it will be healthy for SW games in general if EA loses their exclusivity because then they will actually need to try and make better games and support them if they want anymore deals from Disney. Monopolies breed indifference and mediocrity.Competition breeds support, innovation and customer satisfaction.

Disney will likely find a loop hole to allow other studios to make SW games and EA will continue with what they have for the meantime. It’s akin to EA being passed over for that “all” important promotion. They will either learn from it and pick up their act or they will stay in the dog house and eventually be fired.

If EA were to turn things around with their current SW stable of games, then maybe Disney will consider letting them make more Disney owned games, not just SW games. Hopefully EA will learn from the experience and pump some money back into swtor and support this game like they should be.

But I think we know that’s wishful thinking. Only a complete overhaul at the top of EA will purge that bad attitude at the top and change how EA do business. Hopefully the other rumours of Microsoft buying EA turn out to be true. Then maybe there would be changes that could end up benefiting swtor. Otherwise I’m afraid the next stop for this game in the not to distant future, will be server shut down.

 

Were I a game developer, having just contracted with Disney to make a fully-fledged SW MMO, I know where my loyal Star Wars MMO fans would be -- on SWTOR. Just like SWG had to die before SWTOR came to be, I wouldn't want my potential customer market (i.e., that SW MMO fan base) to have its attention divided between my game and a competitor's, even if that competitor is on the way out. Everyone playing SWTOR would be one less person playing my game, so I'd want assurances from Disney that the competitor's game would be shut down prior to my game launching before I spent dollar number one on development.

[TrixxieTriss]

Were I a game developer, having just contracted with Disney to make a fully-fledged SW MMO, I know where my loyal Star Wars MMO fans would be -- on SWTOR. Just like SWG had to die before SWTOR came to be, I wouldn't want my potential customer market (i.e., that SW MMO fan base) to have its attention divided between my game and a competitor's, even if that competitor is on the way out. Everyone playing SWTOR would be one less person playing my game, so I'd want assurances from Disney that the competitor's game would be shut down prior to my game launching before I spent dollar number one on development.

 

You are assuming that it would be an MMO SW game that Disney would licence out.

You are correct though, its possible that Disney would try to put a halt to swtor if another studio was about to release a SW MMO to compete with it. But remember, a new game (not sequel) takes many years to developer from the idea to a released game. Most of the really good games take 5+ years from the idea phase, especially these days.

Disney haven’t even signed anyone on yet and that might take 12 months of courtship till contracts are signed. I don’t think we will see another SW MMO from a different studio in less than 5 years.

Edited February 16, 2018 by TrixxieTriss

[Quraswren]

I'd also like to add that the original devs didn't have a clear definition of what to do beyond the story content. They gave the impression that they didn't think that far ahead, and they certainly didn't expect players to gobble through the content as fast as they did. They were expecting to have a lot of time to figure things out with what they thought was a lot of playable content.

 

This is a decent read about what was going on during that time if you are interested (and maybe thats where you got your info from).

 

https://www.pcgamer.com/bioware-gdc-panel-star-wars-the-old-republic/

 

bioware simply made way to many mistakes. Too many assumptions.

[TrixxieTriss]

This is a decent read about what was going on during that time if you are interested (and maybe thats where you got your info from).

 

https://www.pcgamer.com/bioware-gdc-panel-star-wars-the-old-republic/

 

bioware simply made way to many mistakes. Too many assumptions.

 

And then never listened to player feed back to this day

[Quraswren]

And then never listened to player feed back to this day

 

Not when it mattered anyway.

 

Take a look at that article. How bioware didn't learn that story could never carry the game by itself is beyond me. They relied so much on story to the detriment of the game, that this game went F2P nearly faster than any other game (except one I know of) but to then years later to go back to that same warped mentality of story only in kotfe/kotet.

 

It just boggles the mind they thought story only would be the lifesaver of swtor. It couldn't do it at launch and it didn't do it years later.

 

You have to have story. We all know that. It's a major piece of the MMO puzzle but there are other major pieces as well. All those pieces together make a nice pictures but when you start losing pieces and forgetting where some are the pictures gets screwed up and what do you do with a puzzle missing pieces? You throw it away and find something else to do that has all the pieces.

 

Kinda like what the majority of the 1.7 million gamers did here. They found something else to do that has more of the major pieces.

[IanArgent]

The alternative view is, they decided to play to their strengths, and put story first. The old saw about "In times of trouble, go with what you know." This is not always good advice - but it is something, which is better than nothing.

 

It's a darn shame they decided to do a Standard Bioware Epic in Star Wars Clothing, and then bungled the execution with the Knights.

 

I maintain that the issues we see in stark relief today were there from the beginning, but covered up by the gigantic initial investment EA and BW put into the game, which ran out around 3.x After that, they've been running in damage control mode, and the ship is still above water, and that's about all I can say about it.

[Darkside]

This is a decent read about what was going on during that time if you are interested (and maybe thats where you got your info from).

 

https://www.pcgamer.com/bioware-gdc-panel-star-wars-the-old-republic/

 

bioware simply made way to many mistakes. Too many assumptions.

 

No I haven't read that before, so thanks for the link. That was just my observations that I remember from that time.