What's the attraction to Arcann?

[Gebrakstkasten]

I would like to try to understand the well documented attraction to Arcann a little better. I'm typically spend my time over in the PVP forum, but ran across this in more than one string and on different websites and had to ask. If you haven't done the storyline and plan to, read no further.

 

Here is why I think so many are attracted to him:

 

 

1 – An alpha male. Arcann is a proven leader, dispassionate, and comfortable being in charge because of his drive and abilities, but not a bully to satisfy a fragile ego.

 

2 – Redemption and forgiveness. Despite his crimes, he is genuinely remorseful and sacrosanct in his new-found revelations in his core beliefs. The “Space-Hitler” comment one of the other threads, although trollish, was a valid point. I find myself asking what is unforgivable. He was mentally abused by his father and one could forgive on that basis; however, would we still pardon Darth Vader after episode 6 after watching episode 3 with the younglings? This is fiction, but there is a real line in morality being tested. Arcann doesn’t whine, or ask for anyone to make him feel better, but very matter-of-factly states his wrongdoing and completely lets up to the audience to decide. I think this taps into a natural inclination to forgive someone truly apologetic.

 

3 – Evil villain, but not lost. Arcann’s new persona possess an innocence and I think a virginal quality. Arcann suffered a form of abuse for much of his late childhood and early adulthood when his father was training him to be a super-force-user bad guy. Sith power aside, one could assume that his father would not encourage or approve of emotional surrender and expression. Senya is the counterbalance and their interaction would provide a model for future relationships, romantic or otherwise. I wouldn’t call his relationship with his mother “healthy,” but certainly the catalyst for his redemption and indicator into how he might treat a future partner.

 

4 – Senya is awesome. Who wouldn’t want her as a stepmother?! Everything good about Arcann comes from her. She was solid and completely likeable during the entire storyline. I never felt betrayed during the storyline, I was more like . . . “okay lady, you got to do what you got to do. . .”

 

 

Okay, those are my thoughts.

[serenitty]

He's a bad boy turned good and that broody voice.

Who doesn't want to put a smile on his face?

[xordevoreaux]

Scars are sexy.

[Berret_Ca]

He's not Body Type 2.

[Jagaimee]

Redemption. Most of my characters have struggled (well, in-headcanon, at least) with good vs. evil - some of them have delved far into the dark side and clawed their way back to the light through sheer force of will. Others are still stuck in darkness, but are trying their hardest to be a better person, wondering if redemption is even possible for someone as evil as they are. Seeing their own journey mirrored in Arcann makes him a very sympathetic character.

[Damask_Rose]

"If you can't be with the one you love, love the one you're with"

[IoNonSoEVero]

I agree. I honestly can't fathom it. and I don't see his history of abuse as a valid excuse, either. That in no way is a judgment on those who love him.

 

For me, these are the differences between him and Darth Vader:

 

1. Vader was a good man before he became Vader. He spent years sacrificing himself as a Jedi before things went south. Arcann never was.

2. Vader covertly does the right thing here and there even when he's Vader, which Arcann does not do - such as returning C3PO to Chewbacca (the "Thank the Maker" comics). Many of the books and comics about Vader have him mentally torturing himself for his current situation.

3. Vader became Vader for one very simple reason: he thought it would save his wife and child. Palpatine groomed him by making him feel accepted, which he didn't get from the Jedi Council. That alone gives him sympathy IMHO.

4. Most importantly: Vader finds his own redemption. Starting in Empire Strikes Back, when he talks the Emperor out of killing Luke, and ending at the Death Star. Vader doesn't actually draw a weapon on Luke until Luke draws his, and he tells Luke several times to stop fighting with him before he cuts his hand off. And then of course on the Death Star, he sacrifices himself to save his son.

 

In contrast, Arcann

doesn't do anything to actually redeem himself. His Mommy arranges a special ceremony for him to take away all his anger - killing half of Voss in the process - and that's that. No justice. No punishment. He's just supposed to join the Alliance with no further drama, and everyone's supposed to believe him when he says he's a nice guy now. He fights with the Alliance? You mean, like everyone else there is doing? That's not redemption.

 

For me, the version of the story where Arcann dies is the place he actually *is* redeemed, since he and Vaylin choose to work with the Commander to take down Valkorion.

 

[AKHadeed]

Redemption makes for an interesting Star Warsy story. I can't speak for everyone, but what I'm going for when I pick character choices (including romances) is "What would make for a fun story to watch".

 

Arcann's not my type, but he'll fit pretty well with my perfect Jedi who believes in everyone. ...Course, if she hooks up with someone, she'll stop being my perfect Jedi. Hmm.

 

Also, yeah, I totally love Senya. I will help her life stop being a trainwreck, damnit.

Edited October 18, 2017 by AKHadeed

[Quraswren]

Stockholm syndrome if you ask me.

 

He was dead as fast as I could click the button.

[Sinhammer]

He's got a cool voice, so I can see the ladies (and some of the guys) being attracted to that. As cool as it is though I felt it got a little tedious at times.

[Lunafox]

Stockholm syndrome if you ask me.

 

He was dead as fast as I could click the button.

 

Agreed.

 

I'm glad this is fantasy/game, or I'd be genuinely worried for all the women (and men) that are willing to settle for someone who is a mass murderer, who killed trillions of people the galaxy over, just because he was having a hissy fit over the Outlander. The 'space Hitler' tag for him is apt, as I highly doubt in real life that anyone would forgive the atrocities, just because he said he was sorry.

 

There is also the troubling fact that he killed his brother and (given the video) best friend, as well as his father, again, on a hissy fit. Daddy wasn't proud enough so he had to take out his anger. I'd be concerned about the anger issues and the temper tantrums.

 

I just don't see any attraction there whatsoever. The voice actor's voice is appealing to a degree, I'll say that much as a positive, but it's the only thing in a character who is not only physically unattractive and repellant but a person capable of and having done horrible things to millions of people including his family. But then I suppose there are plenty of people that lack the self-esteem to seek better for themselves and put up with that or take a risk on a psychopath. The world is filled with people who make excuses for that kind of behavior and enable it. Psychopaths never stop being psychopaths, they just learn to pretend better to pull you into an unfortunate, abusive, and draining relationship.

 

But thank goodness this is a game and he's not real. Even so, I refuse to settle. As a person and a game player, I deserve better.

Edited October 18, 2017 by Lunafox

[Suzsi]

If he wasn't a force user it would be a lot harder to forgive him, unless he genuinly suffered a mental disability that could be helped with medications and counseling.

 

However he is a force user and in the world of Star Wars that makes all the difference. He was lured by the darkside, corrupted, damaged. Those lured by the darkside are *not* in control of their actions. It consumes them, it turns them into something evil. Its like being under the influence of judgment impairing drugs. That Darkside connection can be severed, either forcefully or over time with a LOT of help.

 

In Arcanns case it was done forcefully -- now he has a clear slate. He is neither light nor dark and my force girls will do everything within their power to ensure he stays on a light path for as long as he wishes to do so. I will only romance him with another force user -- I cant see a non-force user understanding this like a force user can. They will give him the chance to redeem his past actions, they are Jedi, they know how to forgive.

[AKHadeed]

Same reason people go for Scourge... Or DS Jaesa. Or Doc. Or Kaliyo. It's all about the story, not common sense. All the red flags in the world aren't relevant, since it's just a fun plot. We don't have an analogue to the Voss ritual IRL. Maybe years of therapy, but we can't really approximate the Force and how it effects people.

 

So fer me, the reason I'm looking forward to it is that it's got all sorts of drama and tension built in. And my Jedi can always kick his butt (literally and figuratively) if the orange eyes start coming back.

[Jagaimee]

Agreed.

 

I'm glad this is fantasy/game, or I'd be genuinely worried for all the women (and men) that are willing to settle for someone who is a mass murderer, who killed trillions of people the galaxy over, just because he was having a hissy fit over the Outlander. The 'space Hitler' tag for him is apt, as I highly doubt in real life that anyone would forgive the atrocities, just because he said he was sorry.

 

And I'd say the same for all us Quinnmancers in real life. I mean, really, how many of us would willingly stick around a guy who (forced or not...) tries to kill us? ...hopefully nobody. If Quinn acted that way toward me in real life, I would get a restraining order, give my all to get his sorry behind in jail for the rest of eternity, and thoroughly freak out if he so much as glanced at me ever again.

Buuuut this is a game. XD I'm not my Sith Warrior - and as such, the rules of such behaviour in-universe is a) normal, and b) nearly acceptable in Sith society. It's a very, very different world than real life. The same goes for Arcann. In real life, I would not care how much he's changed, how many times he makes up for his atrocities - whatever. That sorry sonofa... *cough*... is dead to me. But in-game, my characters can sympathize with him (NOT excuse his past deeds*). It's a different world.

 

*"Forgiveness" doesn't mean "everything's okay now, no matter what you did, it's all behind us." If Arcann - or, heck, anyone in real life - wants to atone, he'd better show it, not just say it.

[feylyndiira]

Agreed.

 

I'm glad this is fantasy/game, or I'd be genuinely worried for all the women (and men) that are willing to settle for someone who is a mass murderer, who killed trillions of people the galaxy over, just because he was having a hissy fit over the Outlander. The 'space Hitler' tag for him is apt, as I highly doubt in real life that anyone would forgive the atrocities, just because he said he was sorry.

 

There is also the troubling fact that he killed his brother and (given the video) best friend, as well as his father, again, on a hissy fit. Daddy wasn't proud enough so he had to take out his anger. I'd be concerned about the anger issues and the temper tantrums.

 

I just don't see any attraction there whatsoever. The voice actor's voice is appealing to a degree, I'll say that much as a positive, but it's the only thing in a character who is not only physically unattractive and repellant but a person capable of and having done horrible things to millions of people including his family. But then I suppose there are plenty of people that lack the self-esteem to seek better for themselves and put up with that or take a risk on a psychopath. The world is filled with people who make excuses for that kind of behavior and enable it. Psychopaths never stop being psychopaths, they just learn to pretend better to pull you into an unfortunate, abusive, and draining relationship.

 

But thank goodness this is a game and he's not real. Even so, I refuse to settle. As a person and a game player, I deserve better.

 

Pretty much this ^^^. That said, I probably will romance him on a character just out of sheer curiosity to see how it unfolds. No idea which one though....my SW is the only one who let him live (because she refuses to throw away a powerful resource) and she's totally devoted to her husband now that he's back (even if she may never get another romance scene with him again ).

[IoNonSoEVero]

Agreed.

 

I'm glad this is fantasy/game, or I'd be genuinely worried for all the women (and men) that are willing to settle for someone who is a mass murderer, who killed trillions of people the galaxy over, just because he was having a hissy fit over the Outlander. The 'space Hitler' tag for him is apt, as I highly doubt in real life that anyone would forgive the atrocities, just because he said he was sorry.

 

There is also the troubling fact that he killed his brother and (given the video) best friend, as well as his father, again, on a hissy fit. Daddy wasn't proud enough so he had to take out his anger. I'd be concerned about the anger issues and the temper tantrums.

 

I just don't see any attraction there whatsoever. The voice actor's voice is appealing to a degree, I'll say that much as a positive, but it's the only thing in a character who is not only physically unattractive and repellant but a person capable of and having done horrible things to millions of people including his family. But then I suppose there are plenty of people that lack the self-esteem to seek better for themselves and put up with that or take a risk on a psychopath. The world is filled with people who make excuses for that kind of behavior and enable it. Psychopaths never stop being psychopaths, they just learn to pretend better to pull you into an unfortunate, abusive, and draining relationship.

 

But thank goodness this is a game and he's not real. Even so, I refuse to settle. As a person and a game player, I deserve better.

 

This is so spot on. Well said.

 

I refuse to keep him alive and in my game, for these reasons and the one I mentioned.

[Eshvara]

And I'd say the same for all us Quinnmancers in real life. I mean, really, how many of us would willingly stick around a guy who (forced or not...) tries to kill us? ...hopefully nobody. If Quinn acted that way toward me in real life, I would get a restraining order, give my all to get his sorry behind in jail for the rest of eternity, and thoroughly freak out if he so much as glanced at me ever again.

Buuuut this is a game. XD I'm not my Sith Warrior - and as such, the rules of such behaviour in-universe is a) normal, and b) nearly acceptable in Sith society. It's a very, very different world than real life. The same goes for Arcann. In real life, I would not care how much he's changed, how many times he makes up for his atrocities - whatever. That sorry sonofa... *cough*... is dead to me. But in-game, my characters can sympathize with him (NOT excuse his past deeds*). It's a different world.

 

*"Forgiveness" doesn't mean "everything's okay now, no matter what you did, it's all behind us." If Arcann - or, heck, anyone in real life - wants to atone, he'd better show it, not just say it.

 

True, I'd never date an Arcann or Quinn in real life. I'd also not have Sith behaviour in real life or be able to throw so many blaster shots in real life.

This isn't real life.

 

In game I'm willing to do all of those things. NPC's aren't victims, I don't have to apply morals or ethics​ in a game and I don't have to worry about my life in game. (Not really anyway)

That aside I think it's very fair of you not to show bias against Quinn and go ahead to say "But Quinn is different" Just because you like him!

 

I wouldn't have expected anyone to say that about a companion they adore.

 

________

 

@Ralei, I'm waiting for your post to blow all of these away.👀

Edited October 18, 2017 by Eshvara

[Suzsi]

True, I'd never date an Arcann or Quinn in real life. I'd also not have Sith behaviour in real life or be able to throw so many blaster shots in real life.

This isn't real life.

 

In game I'm willing to do all of those things. NPC's aren't victims, I don't have to apply morals or ethics​ in a game and I don't have to worry about my life in game. (Not really anyway)

That aside I think it's very fair of you not to show bias against Quinn and go ahead to say "But Quinn is different" Just because you like him!

 

I wouldn't have expected anyone to say that about a companion they adore.

 

________

 

@Ralei, I'm waiting for your post to blow all of these away.👀

 

We certainly arent force users ourselves IRL! We would have been dead at the first encounter anyways so really the whole thing would be mute! Lol

[Eshvara]

We certainly arent force users ourselves IRL! We would have been dead at the first encounter anyways so really the whole thing would be mute! Lol

 

Lol true!

[Tadagyt]

Agreed.

 

I'm glad this is fantasy/game, or I'd be genuinely worried for all the women (and men) that are willing to settle for someone who is a mass murderer, who killed trillions of people the galaxy over, just because he was having a hissy fit over the Outlander. The 'space Hitler' tag for him is apt, as I highly doubt in real life that anyone would forgive the atrocities, just because he said he was sorry.

 

But I'm not the one dating Arcann, my former Emperor's wrath is. I play my toons lives, not mine.

So he killed people? why would a DS sith care? Sith kill people all the time, I mean, it's normal for them. The sith code is about passion, strength, power... peace and serenity, being good, is weakness. She got to admire Arcann and respect him because she saw the sith in him. Power.

Also, there's the Valkorion abuse and lies they both suffered... the Emperor's wrath and the Emperor's son... both used as weapons by the same being. I can see them spending time together after Valkorion died, talking and trying to understand.

 

I love the Arcann romance for the sith warrior, because it makes sense from a story point of view.

Edited October 18, 2017 by Tadagyt

[Gearmasterblitz]

I agree. I honestly can't fathom it. and I don't see his history of abuse as a valid excuse, either. That in no way is a judgment on those who love him.

 

For me, these are the differences between him and Darth Vader:

 

1. Vader was a good man before he became Vader. He spent years sacrificing himself as a Jedi before things went south. Arcann never was.

2. Vader covertly does the right thing here and there even when he's Vader, which Arcann does not do - such as returning C3PO to Chewbacca (the "Thank the Maker" comics). Many of the books and comics about Vader have him mentally torturing himself for his current situation.

3. Vader became Vader for one very simple reason: he thought it would save his wife and child. Palpatine groomed him by making him feel accepted, which he didn't get from the Jedi Council. That alone gives him sympathy IMHO.

4. Most importantly: Vader finds his own redemption. Starting in Empire Strikes Back, when he talks the Emperor out of killing Luke, and ending at the Death Star. Vader doesn't actually draw a weapon on Luke until Luke draws his, and he tells Luke several times to stop fighting with him before he cuts his hand off. And then of course on the Death Star, he sacrifices himself to save his son.

 

In contrast, Arcann

doesn't do anything to actually redeem himself. His Mommy arranges a special ceremony for him to take away all his anger - killing half of Voss in the process - and that's that. No justice. No punishment. He's just supposed to join the Alliance with no further drama, and everyone's supposed to believe him when he says he's a nice guy now. He fights with the Alliance? You mean, like everyone else there is doing? That's not redemption.

 

For me, the version of the story where Arcann dies is the place he actually *is* redeemed, since he and Vaylin choose to work with the Commander to take down Valkorion.

 

Oh that made me so mad when that happened.

All of his evil was sucked out of him by the Voss giving him the galaxy's best bj? That's the biggest load I've ever heard of, and it ruins the plot point that Vaylin is too far gone to be redeemed. When all it takes is a meditation session to get rid of your daddy issues, that basically opens a plot hole that anybody could be saved by this ritual. It's just... stupid.

 

 

At any rate, I probably would have killed him myself, except I like Senya. She acted like you would expect a mother who feels that she failed her whole family would. Arcann is just the extra baggage that came with helping her.

[EightiesMonkey]

I like Arcaan for nostalgia reasons.

 

# Fallout3

#ThreeDog

 

I'm just a Fallout nerd and part of me even hopes for some form of Alliance "Radio" where Arcaan acts like Three Dog for the lols I just like imagining it.

 

Arcaan however does have some cool moments too. Given the potential for a redemption arc as the story continues is also of interest to me, such as how he comes to terms with everything he's done.

 

But that's just me.

[LamiaKan]

But I'm not the one dating Arcann, my former Emperor's wrath is. I play my toons lives, not mine.

So he killed people? why would a DS sith care? Sith kill people all the time, I mean, it's normal for them. The sith code is about passion, strength, power... peace and serenity, being good, is weakness. She got to admire Arcann and respect him because she saw the sith in him. Power.

Also, there's the Valkorion abuse and lies they both suffered... the Emperor's wrath and the Emperor's son... both used as weapons by the same being. I can see them spending time together after Valkorion died, talking and trying to understand.

 

I love the Arcann romance for the sith warrior, because it makes sense from a story point of view.

I also ship my sith warrior with Arcann for similar reasons! She is LS but not completely innocent. Even a LS sith has blood on her hands. There's similarity between the sith warrior and Arcann. A romance makes it all the more interesting!

[LordFell]

It seems to me that there is really no Light Side option to kill Arcann, and to me, that's ridiculous. In the SWTOR universe, even the gentlest soul has a body count. The only being you encounter more deserving of death than Arcann is the Emperor himself.

 

...given this statement, you can't think I'd be interested in any of my characters romancing Arcann. Well, my Sith Inquisitor might have, but she murdered him and Senya, because she doesn't like potential claimants to Her Throne.

[Jeweledleah]

only reason he is alive is becasue I wanted Senya back. he is pretty much yet another character in a long archetype of characters that fandom tends to get attached to over other characters because... honestly, all of the reasons I can provide are not very polite.

 

he is just another Draco Malfoy.