In SWTOR the "Real" Game starts at level 1

[JediElf]

Those that are new to MMO's may not fully appreciate this topics title. Let me explain. In most MMO's the "Real" game does not start until you reach the highest level and begin running the "so-called end-game content". Take the king of MMOS, WoW, as an example. The road from 1-85 is an excruciating one where nothing you do will have any impact on your toon at level 85. It is called a "grind" for a reason. WoW is not the only culprit here. Most MMOs follow this same broken paradigm.

 

SWTOR breaks the paradigm and sets a new one.

 

In SWTOR the "Real" game starts the moment you see the first cut-scene of your character. Starting at level 1 the decisions you make FORM your character. Each mission, each answer you chose has an impact. The game starts at level 1 -- not at the level end-cap! People, this is HUGE! It is genre-setting! It blows away the current MMO paraqdigm of grinding to end-cap levels.

 

This is why SWTOR succeeds. It is ground breaking in its approach. It amazingly combines the single player aspect with the MMO one. Dont let the complainers fool you either. There is an absolute TON of group content in this game. Yes -- It is an MMO in every aspect of the word EXCEPT it breaks the grind.

 

Your SWTOR life begins at level 1.

 

 

This is why I love this game so much!

 

You took the words, right out of my mouth.

[Majestic_Jazz]

Your right i completely agree, that why i gave up on WOW after getting my character to only level 67 i was fed up the grind of the game having nothing to look forward to only the small benifits of level 85. I feel with SWTOR that its alot better, i enjoy playing at every level i havent yet got bored

 

Looks like someone was reading my sig.

 

But yeah, I agree and this is why I love SWTOR! In your normal MMO, you play to max level and just sit there and grind endgame forever until the next expansion comes out. With SWTOR, I have options. I can either grind endgame with my Sith Warrior, or I can start another character with a Jedi Consular and have an entirely different experience!

 

Also because of Legacy, it makes playing with new characters more fun! Because if I start another character as a Jedi Consular, I will be able to play with features/unlocks that I wasn't able to play with as my Sith Warrior because I didn't have the appropriate legacy level at the time. So I level my Jedi Consular to 50 and I decided to go back to my L50 Sith Warrior, now I have a whole new slew of legacy unlocks that I unlocked with my Consular and I can now use with my Warrior! It keeps everything fresh!

[Dayln]

yes... the game starts at level 1

 

If you bypass content, and rush to 50 as fast as you can, expect to be laughed at if you ever complain about lack of content.

[Lethality]

The problem is not so much that the game starts at level 1, but rather than it ends at level 50 (or before.)

[Goretzu]

The problem is not so much that the game starts at level 1, but rather than it ends at level 50 (or before.)

 

That looks to be what the OP discovered.

 

 

 

yes... the game starts at level 1

 

If you bypass content, and rush to 50 as fast as you can, expect to be laughed at if you ever complain about lack of content.

 

 

I don't think you can still call getting to L50 now "rushing".

Edited April 3, 2012 by Goretzu

[G-Girl]

So, WoWs end-game has been going on for the last 8 years?

WoW's raids, where less than 6% of the player base (Blizzards numbers -- not mine) ever see it, is end game?

Changing your toons play-style with every patch is end-game?

 

The only "true" end-game that any game can have is PvP. I will let you figure that statement out, as it would take a bit to explain it fully.

 

Your statement of End-Game IS the game is why MMOs of today fail. This paradigm was created by Blizzard, who because of their paradigm now has to spend months upon months and spend a huge budget in creating so called end-game content every two months. After all that time and money they sit back and watch their "end-game" players burn through it in 2 weeks then head to the forum and scream for more.

 

You have missed the point of the topic dear Sir. This Paradigm NEEDS to be broken or we will all be stuck playing WoW forever. BW took a chance with SWTOR. They have decided to attack that paradigm.

 

I for one believe they succeeded.

 

Actually Everquest was far worse for pandering to hardcore endgamers than WoW ever was. WoW added a whole load of new, fun low (>50) game content in the last expansion.

[Varnoc]

If you look at the OP posting history, it looks like he's quit.

 

That is based on posting history. If you look at last activity you will see a date of today.

[Goretzu]

That is based on posting history. If you look at last activity you will see a date of today.

 

Fair enough, if that doesn't count log in after subs.

 

Be interesting to hear his impressions now, if he hasn't anyway.

Edited April 3, 2012 by Goretzu

[Frostvein]

So, WoWs end-game has been going on for the last 8 years?

WoW's raids, where less than 6% of the player base (Blizzards numbers -- not mine) ever see it, is end game?

 

These are not Blizzards numbers.

[Rayla_Felana]

 

There are very few quests that are only go kill 10 droids. That is in there ofcourse but it is usually only the bonus quest and not compulsory to complete the quest. The context set by the dialog makes the game so much more.

 

I'm sorry you don't feel this way.

 

My thoughts.

[CorellianWannabe]

 

Your SWTOR life begins at level 1.

 

Yes it does-over and over. Get to the end of your story? Hope you like rolling alts!

[CorellianWannabe]

Looks like someone was reading my sig.

 

But yeah, I agree and this is why I love SWTOR! In your normal MMO, you play to max level and just sit there and grind endgame forever until the next expansion comes out. With SWTOR, I have options. I can either grind endgame with my Sith Warrior, or I can start another character with a Jedi Consular and have an entirely different experience!

 

Also because of Legacy, it makes playing with new characters more fun! Because if I start another character as a Jedi Consular, I will be able to play with features/unlocks that I wasn't able to play with as my Sith Warrior because I didn't have the appropriate legacy level at the time. So I level my Jedi Consular to 50 and I decided to go back to my L50 Sith Warrior, now I have a whole new slew of legacy unlocks that I unlocked with my Consular and I can now use with my Warrior! It keeps everything fresh!

 

As opposed to finishing your Warrior and rolling an Inquisitor, which is only a 15-20% different experience!

 

And if you've already created alts then prepare to delete them to have access to the new 'features', since endgame doesn't matter as much as the new alt! Hope you didn't roll Empire on one server and Republic on another, or it'll be a lot more grinding to get that Chiss Trooper or Miraluka Agent since unlocks are server-only!

[Gerandar]

The game starts at level 50. leveling was just as boring and annoying in this MMO as any other

[Fredcat]

All MMO's start at level 1. It's a shame the mentality of gamers these days. They skip all the content leveling up and think the only thing that matters is doing the same raids over and over again for loot.

 

Personally when I reach cap I start an alt and try another class or just PVP, until an expansion comes out where they raise the level cap and add high level content. I am much more interested in seeing different class stories and experimenting with different class mechanics then doing the same raid over and over again.

[halueryphi]

Those that are new to MMO's may not fully appreciate this topics title. Let me explain. In most MMO's the "Real" game does not start until you reach the highest level and begin running the "so-called end-game content". Take the king of MMOS, WoW, as an example. The road from 1-85 is an excruciating one where nothing you do will have any impact on your toon at level 85. It is called a "grind" for a reason. WoW is not the only culprit here. Most MMOs follow this same broken paradigm.

 

SWTOR breaks the paradigm and sets a new one.

 

In SWTOR the "Real" game starts the moment you see the first cut-scene of your character. Starting at level 1 the decisions you make FORM your character. Each mission, each answer you chose has an impact. The game starts at level 1 -- not at the level end-cap! People, this is HUGE! It is genre-setting! It blows away the current MMO paraqdigm of grinding to end-cap levels.

 

This is why SWTOR succeeds. It is ground breaking in its approach. It amazingly combines the single player aspect with the MMO one. Dont let the complainers fool you either. There is an absolute TON of group content in this game. Yes -- It is an MMO in every aspect of the word EXCEPT it breaks the grind.

 

Your SWTOR life begins at level 1.

I think i just cried at the beauty and truth of this post.

[Master-Nala]

What happens when you hit level cap? That is the difference between a single player game and a MMO. End game IS the game in an MMO, everything else is prologue.

 

You play another character. If alting isn't for you, the I fear neither is this game.

[Dayln]

I have 6 characters of various levels, none of them have happened to hit the level cap yet

 

And having a blast

 

Hitting the level cap is of course not any kind of goal for me at all

 

I play to have fun, and I am

Edited April 3, 2012 by Dayln

[Master-Nala]

Yes it does-over and over. Get to the end of your story? Hope you like rolling alts!

 

If you don't, then this game really isn't for you. I don't begrudge folks who like the everlasting treadmill of grinding for gear. I'm certain that those same folks find making alts pointless because they can't improve their main and thus it hurts their progression. I get it.

 

But the bitterness that a lot of players seem to feel at having a game that doesn't fit their playstyle is strange to me. I tried WoW again after Cataclysm (I've tried it at numerous points and gotten bored). I absolutely loved leveling my goblin...until level 20. The story was effectively gone then and it was grind to 85 on instances then grind instances (group and raid) for gear. I didn't like that so I quit. I didn't complain on the battle.net boards about it. That wouldn't be fair. I didn't like the game. That's not a failing of mine or the game. It's just a preference.

 

What I find so crazy about folks on these boards is that they seem to feel almost betrayed that a story based MMORPG is a story based MMORPG.

[Goretzu]

I have 6 characters of various levels, none of them have happened to hit the level cap yet

 

And having a blast

 

Hitting the level cap is of course not any kind of goal for me at all

 

I play to have fun, and I am

 

 

But not doing what you're doing is still not rushing.

 

You are simply being slow by any MMORPG scale, even if all 6 of your toons are L49 really.

 

I certainly took my time, but L50 is still a bit of a brick wall/cliff.

[amantheil]

What happens when you hit level cap? That is the difference between a single player game and a MMO. End game IS part of the game in an MMO, everything else is a different aspect, but still part of the same game.

 

Fixed that for you.

 

Yes it does-over and over. Get to the end of your story? Hope you like rolling alts!

 

Well, granted it doesn't compare to the constant variety and excitement of running the same flashpoints and ops over and over, but to each their own.

Edited April 3, 2012 by amantheil

[amantheil]

(delete - duplicate post) Edited April 3, 2012 by amantheil

[Vlaxitov]

Fixed that for you.

 

You misconstrued that for him.

 

Well, granted it doesn't compare to the constant variety and excitement of running the same flashpoints and ops over and over, but you do what you can.

 

If the play and systems were deep and satisfying enough, you wouldn't be able to say that in the third or fourth month of any mmo. IMHO there isn't enough mid game or end game.

 

Yeah the game starts at 1 and moves fast, then swiftly ends at 50.

Edited April 3, 2012 by Vlaxitov

[tekkamansoul]

As opposed to finishing your Warrior and rolling an Inquisitor, which is only a 15-20% different experience!

 

And if you've already created alts then prepare to delete them to have access to the new 'features', since endgame doesn't matter as much as the new alt! Hope you didn't roll Empire on one server and Republic on another, or it'll be a lot more grinding to get that Chiss Trooper or Miraluka Agent since unlocks are server-only!

 

Irony must escape you on a daily basis.

 

1. Even though your number is arbitrary, the fact that its 20% different for a same-faction playthrough (THAT ARE BOTH SITH) is revolutionary for any MMO, and majority of single-player RPGs, too. You think Skyrim gives a **** if your story experience is any different on a new playthrough?

 

What's different? All your skills, rotations, items, and probably crafting. All story areas. All companions. HOPEFULLY your roleplaying (but in your case I doubt it).

 

But you're totally right - its much better to have completed tiered raid content within the first few months with ludicrously low drop rates so that you get to relive that same 2% of content over and over.

 

2. You can buy racial unlocks with credits. The more you know

[amantheil]

 

If the play and systems were deep and satisfying enough, you wouldn't be able to say that in the third or fourth month of any mmo. IMHO there isn't enough mid game or end game.

 

 

Oh, I agree. If the 'end game' (however that's defined) isn't engaging then that's a big problem. Ultimately, a successful MMO should offer a variety of engaging content of different types. I mean even if you love raiding and hard-mode PVE content, you may reach a point where you just want to take a break and do something else in game.

 

But if SWTOR is going to thrive, it needs to provide a rich, engaging leveling experience AND a rich, engaging 'end game'. So people who want to level alts over and over can do that, people who want to just do stuff at level 50 should be able to do that (and of course, a lot of people will do both).

 

The fallacy that some people seem to be falling into is the idea that the game has to be about leveling OR it has to be about end-game, when in reality both should be fun.

[Matte_Black]

The game starts at Character gen and continues up through endgame and , thankfully, our choices along the way linger and matter. The reason I am playing MMOs again becuase the broke away from the competition-driven only-endgame-matters model.