Changes to Operation Drops in 5.2

[Rion_Starkiller]

What's your problem? Why is easy, quick gearing a problem? Unless you can't stand seeing other people get the gear they want? This seems to be not just jealousy but the basest desire to deny other people what they want. You should look into yourself, there's a serious character flaw here that might be extending into your real life.

 

Not sure why you're taking this personally, but look:

 

Eternity Vault

Annihilation Droid XRR-3 – Belt

Gharj – Gloves

Ancient Pylons – Earpiece

Infernal Council – Boots

Soa – Offhand

 

Karagga’s Palace

Bonethrasher - Bracers

Jarg & Sorno - Boots

Foreman Crusher - Earpiece

G4-B3 Fabricator - Legs

Karagga – Chest

 

Just like 4.x, farming these two operations will give you every piece except MH and Implant. I guess you like the EV/KP farm? What about the other operations that drop the same pieces?

 

My suggestion is to have 3/5 bosses in EV/KP drop random pieces. I feel that these two operations are tremendously easier than other operations. I also believe that easy equals boring.

Edited March 3, 2017 by Rion_Starkiller

[Quraswren]

Easy gear and lack of group content made me burn out faster in 4.x. I think by end of August I had seen a huge decline in raid guild population (my perspective, maybe not yours).

 

We saw a decline in gamers but it was not because we were getting gear in HM OPS. No amount of gear we could get was the problem.

 

No new content was the issue. 2 years of nothing new except story (which our guys didnt' care for) and the eteranl championship was a complete joke except for thefew achievement hunters. bw simply didn't or couldn't produce content that had repeatability. Thats were we saw the decline when gamers were doing the same old 2-4 year old content. None left because they could easily gear mains and alts. Thats what got the remaining of our guild to stay. Gearing their ALTS and many with multiple sets of gear to play whatever role they needed to, to fill out any group.

 

You want easy gear now,

I don't want easy gear, I just know getting easy gear is not some detriment to the game when you look at how little content this game actually gets that is also worth repeating.

 

but what will you do in 5 months when the difficulty of the game stays the same while your gear continually improves?

In 4.0 I would have played ALTS, I have so many. Problem is again not because I can get easy gear, its because now not only is there no new content but GC and CXP was designed to KILL ALT play. What will happen in 5 months when the difficulty is the game and I have gear. Well, since bw massive lack of vision, design and development ability, I would probably leave the game.

 

Again, not because of gearing fast or because we move through 2-5 year old content with ease (we have been killing it for ages) but because the lack of new content and the killing of ALT because of GC not being legacy. Nothing to do with gear or how hard or easy it was to get it.

 

Tier 5 gear will be god-mode for bads. Actual fight mechanics will be thrown out the window. "Use a DCD and heal through it!"

 

So what about it? I find gamers that clear content no matter how it's done are fine. IT's when it's the same old content, rehashed content that gamers get tired of.

 

Every gamer wants gear in a game like this. Max level doesn't stop or hinder that want but once a company like bw falls into having so little new content produced, that is the real problem. Casuals or whatever you want to call no-HC players who Ignoring mechanics, defeat bosses and get more gear are usually very happy because so many want to deny them that when for the most part, their lacking of skill is what hinders them from kill the hardest bosses which they still want. Skill will always be greater than gear. Who cares if they roll SM or some bosses in HM. They can't clear NM with just gear alone.

Edited March 3, 2017 by Quraswren

[Tsillah]

Alright, I hadn't seen this post yet.

 

This is good. Gearing via operations normally is back on the table. I'm not sure what to say but sufficeth to say I'm glad.

[Rion_Starkiller]

We saw a decline in gamers but it was not because we were getting gear in HM OPS. No amount of gear we could get was the problem.

 

No new content was the issue. 2 years of nothing new except story (which our guys didnt' care for) and the eteranl championship was a complete joke except for thefew achievement hunters. bw simply didn't or couldn't produce content that had repeatability. Thats were we saw the decline when gamers were doing the same old 2-4 year old content. None left because they could easily gear mains and alts. Thats what got the remaining of our guild to stay. Gearing their ALTS and many with multiple sets of gear to play whatever role they needed to, to fill out any group.

 

 

I don't want easy gear, I just know getting easy gear is not some detriment to the game when you look at how little content this game actually gets that is also worth repeating.

 

 

In 4.0 I would have played ALTS, I have so many. Problem is again not because I can get easy gear, its because now not only is there no new content but GC and CXP was designed to KILL ALT play. What will happen in 5 months when the difficulty is the game and I have gear. Well, since bw massive lack of vision, design and development ability, I would probably leave the game.

 

Again, not because of gearing fast or because we move through 2-5 year old content with ease (we have been killing it for ages) but because the lack of new content and the killing of ALT because of GC not being legacy. Nothing to do with gear or how hard or easy it was to get it.

 

 

 

So what about it? I find gamers that clear content no matter how it's done are fine. IT's when it's the same old content, rehashed content that gamers get tired of.

 

Every gamer wants gear in a game like this. Max level doesn't stop or hinder that want but once a company like bw falls into having so little new content produced, that is the real problem. Casuals or whatever you want to call no-HC players who Ignoring mechanics, defeat bosses and get more gear are usually very happy because so many want to deny them that when for the most part, their lacking of skill is what hinders them from kill the hardest bosses which they still want. Skill will always be greater than gear. Who cares if they roll SM or some bosses in HM. They can't clear NM with just gear alone.

 

I read your entire reply post and I don't disagree with you, but I do think that the gear treadmill is a major part of "new content" that BW produces.

 

All I'm suggesting is to slow down the drops on EV/KP.

Edited March 3, 2017 by Rion_Starkiller

[_Shaddai_]

Looking at the list. I don't see any boss that drops the 248 Mainhand. Is that going to be exclusively given through Command and/or upgrades via PVP or was that left off by mistake.

 

You currently have Rav/ToS/SNV as the mainhands for Veteran. The only raid that has a Master mode is SNV and you have boots listed instead. Is this something that was intentional or is this simply an oversight?

 

Just curious mostly as the mainhand is probably one of the more (if not the most) important pieces.

 

Edit - Actually looks like the offhand was also left off from the 248 list. Same question applies here.

Edited March 3, 2017 by _Shaddai_

[Andryah]

While I know this is a popular remedy with players.........

 

What exactly is the value really though.... given severe lack of any new Operations content?

 

Gear up faster, and then devolve into tantrums again about the lack of new Ops content?

 

/gluttons for punishment I guess.

Edited March 3, 2017 by Andryah

[Rion_Starkiller]

Looking at the list. I don't see any boss that drops the 248 Mainhand. Is that going to be exclusively given through Command and/or upgrades via PVP or was that left off by mistake.

 

You currently have Rav/ToS/SNV as the mainhands for Veteran. The only raid that has a Master mode is SNV and you have boots listed instead. Is this something that was intentional or is this simply an oversight?

 

Just curious mostly as the mainhand is probably one of the more (if not the most) important pieces.

 

Edit - Actually looks like the offhand was also left off from the 248 list. Same question applies here.

 

Great question! I'm curious too.

 

While I know this is a popular remedy with players.........

 

What exactly is the value really though.... given severe lack of any new Operations content?

 

Gear up faster, and then devolve into tantrums again about the lack of new Ops content?

 

/gluttons for punishment I guess.

 

Gear up quickly! to do..... nothing new.

[mperantie]

Thank you for this much needed change. One problem I have noticed is that none of the master mode bosses drop an offhand. Terror changes to legs, Brontes to gloves, and Soa has no master mode. Looks like our only offhands are from random drops from Golden Fury and Monolith. Is this intended? I guess raiders have to pvp if they want offhands.

[Quraswren]

I read your entire reply post and I don't disagree with you, but I do think that the gear treadmill is a major part of "new content" that BW produces.

 

All I'm suggesting is to slow down the drops on EV/KP.

 

Im not saying I couldn't get behind that but I just don't think thats this games problem as the gear for pretty much any MMO Ive ever played was not the reason games left the game. To slow many, RNG gearing hell yea gamers leave but not because it was too quick.

 

You could have handed out any and all gear freely and a rare few ultimate HC raiders with a look at me attitude would have yelled and caused a fuse. The bulk would have been fine because gear alone doesn't clear harder content.

 

The gear tread mill while a nice incentive (and should be used to some extent just not in this example) wasn't the deciding facter to stay or leave. IT was content. How much new came out for the consumer money and was it bugged or not. Gear was just frill to get into content but not why gamers left.

 

So nerf EV/KP because it has high gear. Who cares. I'd rather they up the difficulty than nerf the drops because in the end, getting that gear doesn't really matter if thats all the content they have to play except on a different difficulty level (and thats considered old content as well)

[RiVaN_]

So this thread has gone from, "thanks for giving us our loot drops back... 2 months from now..." To, "gearing is still gonna be too easy because all we gotta do is farm EV and KP 8 times and we have everything we need." Or the other side of that comment where folks are saying, "it ain't' about gear being to easy to obtain, it's about no new content.

 

It's all of it really.

 

Yes, Thank you BW for putting Boss loot drops and tables back in the game, they should have never been removed in the first place and 5.2 is what you should have released with 5.0. If you had your, "2017 is the year of Group Content!" Would be off to a better start.

It wasn't really broke, why did you bother trying to fix it? I mean highlighted hard modes NEEDED to go away, that just made the whole gearing thing WAY too easy, seriously. But to remove loot drops from bosses completely? Dumb, dumb, dumb...

 

Seriously this isn't a revolutionary change, you are just returning to a system that has worked since the dawn of video games, (Kill boss, get loot. Kill next boss get more loot, so on and so forth until you have all the loots). Once Boss loot and loot table are reinstated we will be back to the same problem we had this time last year. The vast majority of our group content is super old...

 

Yes, They are working on it, I know.

This is a good step, but unless they get their heads out of the sand and get some great, massively replayable group content out FAST I'm afraid the ship will continue to sink.

 

This decision closed the floodgates I'm sure, but the hull is still leaking and I'm not sure you have enough cork.

[THAT_EPIC_GUY]

Is there any plan to change the tuning/difficulty of the current operations in response to the higher gear they will drop?

[kopalame]

All looks good but do this please:

 

Please reduce the drops from EV and KP. The difficulty of hose two operations is a joke, especially for HM raiders. Otherwise, we will have the same problem as 4.0 -- easy, quick gearing.

 

You can get full set bonus from EV/KP, gives little reason to ever play any of the other veteran modes. Let them stay at tier 2, their difficultty is pretty much on par with story modes. And then consider upping rewards for veteran Revan, master & blaster and Cora.

[AscendingSky]

I have been very negative towards EAWare lately, so in the interests of being fair I'd like to say this in response to the news about operations gear drops:

 

Thank you. Thank you for finally listening. While this doesn't fix all the problems with gearing and this game right now, it is a big step in the right direction, and I am glad it is happening. You have saved my subscription with this action, at the very least; I was going to drop it this month.

 

I would request that you take a look at distributing loot drops a bit better; other people have already noted a lack of Master-level mainhand and offhand drops, which I'm guessing was probably unintentional on your part and is something easily fixed before 5.2 is released.

[Tadagyt]

Thank you. This is something we've been asking for.

[FlameYOL]

Hey folks,

 

If you haven’t read it yet, we recommend you head over to the “Tier 4 in Game Update 5.2” thread and learn about the new Tier of gear coming next Update. Along with the new Tier of gear, we are making quite a few changes to what gear drops in Operations. For endgame PvE players we know there is a desire to gear primarily through Operations.

 

The first change we are making is specific Unassembled Gear Pieces will now drop on each Operation boss in the game (except Golden Fury and Colossal Monolith). This means when you kill a boss in an Operation, you will know exactly what is going to drop and you can plan to run specific Operations if you are seeking a specific slot. Click the spoiler tag(s) at the bottom of the post for a full list of what drops where.

 

The second change is bosses will no longer have a random chance to drop Unassembled Gear Pieces. Each boss in an 8-player Operation will drop 1 piece and the last boss will drop 2; this number is doubled to 2 and 4 respectively in 16-player. Previously with Game Update 5.1, each boss except for the last boss only had a chance of dropping gear pieces.

 

The third change is with the introduction of a new Tier (Tier 4), we needed to ensure Operation players had a way to acquire this gear directly. This is especially true since Tier 4 will help substantially in being able to clear Veteran Mode Tyth along with future Gods from the Machine bosses, and all other Master Mode bosses. Here is a basic breakdown of where the gear will drop:

 

For existing Operations (Tier 1 will no longer drop in Operations)

• Tier 2 Legendary Gear - Story Mode
  
• Tier 3 Legendary Gear – Veteran Mode
  
• Tier 4 Prototype and Artifact Gear – Master Mode (Non-final bosses)
  
• Tier 4 Legendary Gear – Master Mode (Final bosses)
  

For Gods from the Machine Operations:

• Tier 3 – Story Mode
  
• Tier 4 – Veteran Mode
  

 

As you can see there a lot of changes with Operation gear drops in 5.2! Let us know your thoughts on these changes.

 

-eric

 

Below is a list of each Operation and what drops from each boss – note that this work is still in-progress and details may change before the release of Update 5.2:

 

Eternity Vault

• Annihilation Droid XRR-3 – Belt
  
• Gharj – Gloves
  
• Ancient Pylons – Earpiece
  
• Infernal Council – Boots
  
• Soa – Offhand
  

Karagga’s Palace

• Bonethrasher - Bracers
  
• Jarg & Sorno - Boots
  
• Foreman Crusher - Earpiece
  
• G4-B3 Fabricator - Legs
  
• Karagga – Chest
  

Explosive Conflict

• Zorn & Toth – Implant
  
• Firebrand & Stormcaller – Relic
  
• Colonel Vargath – Helm
  
• Warlord Kephess – Chest
  
  • Implant in Master Mode
    

Terror From Beyond

• Writhing Horror – Belt
  
• The Dread Guard – Relic
  
• Operator IX – Helm
  
• Kephess – Implant
  
• Terror From Beyond – Offhand
  
  • Legs in Master Mode
    

Scum and Villainy

• Dash’roode – Bracers
  
• TITAN 6 – Gloves
  
• Thrasher – Implant
  
• Operations Chief – Legs
  
• Olok the Shadow – Relic
  
• Cartel Warlords – Chest
  
• Dread Master Styrak – Mainhand
  
  • Boots in Master Mode
    

The Dread Fortress

• Nefra - Belt
  
• Draxus – Gloves
  
• Grob’thok – Earpiece
  
• Corruptor Zero - Legs
  
• Brontes - Offhand
  
  • Gloves in Master Mode
    

The Dread Palace

• Bestia – Bracer
  
• Tyrans – Boots
  
• Calphayrus – Helm
  
• Raptus – Relic
  
• Dread Council – Chest
  
  • Earpiece in Master Mode
    

The Ravagers

• Sparky - Belt
  
• Quartermaster Bulo – Boots
  
• Torque – Earpiece
  
• Master and Blaster – Legs
  
• Coratanni – Mainhand
  

Temple of Sacrifice

• Malaphar – Bracers
  
• Sword Squadron – Gloves
  
• Underlurker – Helm
  
• Revanite Commanders – Implant
  
• Revan – Mainhand
  

Golden Fury and Colossal Monolith

• Chance to drop any slot
  

The Gods from the Machine

• Tyth - Relic
  

 

 

Here is a list of each gear slot and what bosses drop it:

 

Ear

• Ancient Pylons – Eternity Vault
  
• Foreman Crusher – Karagga’s Palace
  
• Dread Fortress – Grob’thok
  
• Torque – Ravagers
  

Implant

• Zorn & Toth – Explosive Conflict
  
• Kephess – Terror From Beyond
  
• Thrasher – Scum and Villainy
  
• Revanite Commanders – Temple of Sacrifice
  

Bracers

• Bonethrasher – Karagga’s Palace
  
• Dash’roode – Scum and Villainy
  
• Bestia – Dread Palace
  
• Malaphar – Temple of Sacrifice
  

Belt

• Annihilation Droid – Eternity Vault
  
• Writhing Horror – Terror From Beyond
  
• Nefra – Dread Fortress
  
• Sparky – Ravagers
  

Relics

• The Dread Guard – Terror From Beyond
  
• Firebrand & Stormcaller – Explosive Conflict
  
• Olok – Scum and Villainy
  
• Raptus – Dread Palace
  
• Tyth – The Gods from the Machine
  

Helm

• Colonel Vorgath – Explosive Conflict
  
• Operator IX – Terror From Beyond
  
• Calphayus – Dread Palace
  
• Underlurker – Temple of Sacrifice
  

Chest

• Karagga – Karagga’s Palace
  
• Kephess – Explosive Conflict
  
• Warlords – Scum and Villainy
  
• The Dread Council – Dread Palace
  

Gloves

• Gharj – Eternity Vault
  
• TITAN 6 – Scum and Villainy
  
• Draxus – Dread Palace
  
• Sword Squadron – Temple of Sacrifice
  

Legs

• Fabricator – Karagga’s Palace
  
• Operation Chief – Scum and Villainy
  
• Corruptor Zero – Dread Fortress
  
• Master & Blaster – Ravagers
  

Boots

• Jarg & Sorno – Karagga’s Palace
  
• Infernal Council – Eternity Vault
  
• Tyrans – Dread Palace
  
• Bulo - Ravagers
  

Mainhand

• Revan – Temple of Sacrifice
  
• Styrak – Scum and Villainy
  
• Coratanni – Ravagers
  

Offhand

• Terror From Beyond – Terror From Beyond
  
• Brontes – Dread Fortress
  
• Soa – Eternity Vault
  

All tokens

• Golden Fury and Colossal Monolith
  

 

Thanks a lot for the info Eric,however I do have to ask.Since tier II will be dropping from story mode does that mean that tier I will not be enough to run casual content like master flashpoints,veteran uprisings and sm operations.What about the new daily area and raid?will tier I be enough for them in SM?

[realleaftea]

Thats my thinking. With the 250% boost to CXP soon to be gone in 5.2, Unassembled Components would be a much better incentive than the paltry CXP gains from heroics or dailies or weeklies in general PVE areas that many tend to shy away from now.

What makes you think the CXP boost will be gone. They've changed the system from a multiplicative one into an additive one, so there's no real 'going back' anyways.

 

What's your problem? Why is easy, quick gearing a problem? Unless you can't stand seeing other people get the gear they want? This seems to be not just jealousy but the basest desire to deny other people what they want. You should look into yourself, there's a serious character flaw here that might be extending into your real life.

So why bother with OP loot tables. Make the gear tradeable... or give it away for free! Likewise, make housings free as well and let's make every cosmetic and every cartel market item available for credits, since it would be just jealousy or basest desire to deny other people what they want. Do you see how unobjective such a response is?

 

IMO it's a good question, who decided to allocated the items the way they are. And that includes the question why EV and KP has only a small overlap compared to other OPs. EC & TfB f.e. have three items: Relics, Implants & Helms that can be obtained by either OP.

 

IMO, it's questionable why the Ancient Pylons in EV are even considered a separate boss. You could state that these are the 'mob group' or 'secondary threat' the Infernal Council is missing (compared to other boss fights). And last but not least, SOA is the only final boss a 8man team can easily defeat running a 16man mode.

 

@Eric

Is it correct to assume that you won't fix any of the 4.0 shenanigans with 5.2. I.e. adding character-bound mods into a legacy gear in order to bypass this limitations and being able to equip alts that had never run an OP? And to shift your gear between multiple characters of the same class to bypass the weekly operation limit? If so, do yourself a favor and remove both the weekly limit and the item/mod limitations right away. This would at least avoid the quarrel about unmoddable items like implants, relics and earpieces.

Edited March 4, 2017 by realleaftea

[GalacticKegger]

I apologize in advance for all of the questions. So with these changes, what exactly are the roles of Galactic Command, Command Crates and CXP now? And do we still need the tokens from GC to get the set pieces from Ops drops?

 

edit: I found my answer. Thx.

Edited March 6, 2017 by GalacticKegger

[FlavivsAetivs]

I applaud the return to ops bosses actually dropping dedicated unassembled pieces.

 

~ Eudoxia

[masterceil]

Why are so many people opposed to easy gearing? I think the gist of another recent request was asking if the set-bonus armoring could be BoP and disallowed from Legacy gear? If a group of players want to gear up with EV and KP, what business is it of yours?

 

TBH, I wouldn't want people running the harder ops with me solely out of "obligation" to get the best gear. If they're content to run EV and KP, let 'em. There are still people willing to run Rav and ToS for the sheer pleasure of running those ops, and they're the ones I'd rather run with, anyway.

 

Yall just lookin' to punish people for not wanting to run harder ops with you? So because they won't play on your court, you have to take their ball away? They take nothing from you in gearing up solely with EV/KP - why do you want to take away from them?

[JabbaWabbA]

are these guaranteed drops

[Tsillah]

are these guaranteed drops

 

Yes, as per the second change Eric described.

[DarthWoad]

Pretty much sums up that the past few months have been a complete waste of time as you've gone back to the old system in which everyone has been asking for.

 

Clearly somethings bad happening with the subscriber numbers if you're having to return to the older system, but you're too afraid to admit that the command drop system was a huge mistake.

[AscendingSky]

Why are so many people opposed to easy gearing? I think the gist of another recent request was asking if the set-bonus armoring could be BoP and disallowed from Legacy gear? If a group of players want to gear up with EV and KP, what business is it of yours?

 

TBH, I wouldn't want people running the harder ops with me solely out of "obligation" to get the best gear. If they're content to run EV and KP, let 'em. There are still people willing to run Rav and ToS for the sheer pleasure of running those ops, and they're the ones I'd rather run with, anyway.

 

Yall just lookin' to punish people for not wanting to run harder ops with you? So because they won't play on your court, you have to take their ball away? They take nothing from you in gearing up solely with EV/KP - why do you want to take away from them?

 

My thoughts exactly. People being able to gear up in a consistent manner doesn't hurt ANYONE. Sure, I'll laugh at anyone who says they need BiS top tier gear to run solo heroics or something, because that's silly... but the fact they can get that gear in the first place doesn't hurt me any. I can do the exact same thing if I want. So can anyone else. If someone more 'casual' about the game than me has BiS gear... who cares? It doesn't matter one bit to me. I worry about my own characters' gear and other people can worry about theirs.

Edited March 4, 2017 by AscendingSky

[josephxp]

The first change we are making is specific Unassembled Gear Pieces will now drop on each Operation boss in the game (except Golden Fury and Colossal Monolith). This means when you kill a boss in an Operation, you will know exactly what is going to drop and you can plan to run specific Operations if you are seeking a specific slot. Click the spoiler tag(s) at the bottom of the post for a full list of what drops where.

 

The second change is bosses will no longer have a random chance to drop Unassembled Gear Pieces. Each boss in an 8-player Operation will drop 1 piece and the last boss will drop 2; this number is doubled to 2 and 4 respectively in 16-player. Previously with Game Update 5.1, each boss except for the last boss only had a chance of dropping gear pieces.

 

FINALLY! took you guys long enough to make token drops drop 100% of the time. Good job

 

You now gave everyone some love, new operation (you guys should make one each X.0 patch even if its in pieces like this one we pve players are happy having something then nothing), gearing from opperations, etc. Plus you had us worried about Tier 4 gear thinking it would require a ton of work of grinding more ranks, just leaving it at 300 very good. Just dont drop tier 5 in, keep it at tier 4. Overall i can't wait for 5.2 will be telling alot of my pve guys who left that we are getting a new ops and gear drops are 100% of the time for ops bosses.

[josephxp]

My thoughts exactly. People being able to gear up in a consistent manner doesn't hurt ANYONE. Sure, I'll laugh at anyone who says they need BiS top tier gear to run solo heroics or something, because that's silly... but the fact they can get that gear in the first place doesn't hurt me any. I can do the exact same thing if I want. So can anyone else. If someone more 'casual' about the game than me has BiS gear... who cares? It doesn't matter one bit to me. I worry about my own characters' gear and other people can worry about theirs.

 

We finally have a good gear set up now imo. I was ok with Galactic Command so long as they kept operations drops at 100% and gave a way for pvp'ers to get gear just as fast, which the UC's as a bundle is a good idea for them too gear.

 

Now we have a great balance for gearing, PvE'ers can run operations and get token drops 100% of the time, less fighting. PvP'ers from 5.1.2 have UC bundles which gives them a boost for gearing as actively doing pvp (just need to do the same for GSF). And galactic command is just a chance at bonus gear for everyone or a way for casual players to gear. Overall this is what we have been wanting for a while.