So long and thanks for the fun times

[ZeroPlus]

(I've never bothered to write something on the forums when I've quit an MMO. I just move on. But in this case...)

 

I've just terminated my subscription and will stop playing SWTOR.

 

After 5 years I have stopped enjoying the game.

 

Strangely enough this has to do with the story being told.

I like the rest of the game (the gameplay, the classes, the flashpoints, etc), but that is no longer enough to keep me here.

 

When the game launched it had 8 different class stories.

I got to be the Commander of Havoc Squad, the Barsen'thor, the Voidhound, the Hero of Tython, Darth Nox, the Emperor's Wrath, the Grand Champion of the Great Hunt and Cypher Nine. They were great stories that tied into each other and every class had a part to play in the grand story that only truly became revealed once all classes had been played.

 

Now... now the story is only one. The individuals we became in the beginning are now diluted. There is no difference between them. They all become one. They have lost their charm.

There is no longer the military story, the Consular diplomat story, the smuggler story, the grand Jedi Knight story, the slave who rose to power story, the Sith who became the Emperor's enforcer story, the greatest Bounty Hunter to live story or the master spy story.

 

There is just one story. A story that doesn't make sense for most of the characters. A story that dilutes everything they were and makes them... the same...

 

Will I ever come back? Maybe. 2 things might make me come back:

1) the reintroduction of individual class stories (although considering where Bioware has taken the characters, I don't see them taking the characters back down to what they were).

2) the possibility of Advanced Class change (maybe...).

 

I wish you all the best of luck. Thanks for all the fun.

 

May the Force be with you (or forever serve you, if you prefer ).

[JennyFlynn]

Your post makes me sad because it touches on some of my bigger gripes with the game currently as well. I'm personally not giving up yet but I can fully understand where you're coming from and I feel it too.

 

Thank you for a civil and well constructed post and I hope you find something else out there that does fill those gaps or has what you're looking for in a new adventure if that's where you're going. Take care.

[gumnutza]

I agree with OP 100%.

[TUXs]

I'm sorry to see you go. I hope you have reason to return some day...

[eriksarcasm]

In your post I see my own future. I've only played KOTFE and KOTET on one toon for that reason. While playing with my Consular I couldn't help thinking many times how would this story make sense on my Hunter? My Smuggler?

 

Sure, different classes allow for different play styles, and I myself have yet to experience several of those, but I've already found myself disliking certain styles (God how i hate Vanguard). I'd like to continue individual stories on my preferred toons.

 

Sorry to see you go, random stranger. It always dismays me to see people lose interest in something they love. Hope you find something good out there that makes you as happy as SWTOR did. May the Force be with you.

[Tsillah]

Yeah you are right about that.

 

Back in the level 1-50 days, your class choice really meant something more than just the mechanics.

 

I enjoyed playing the various stories and because of the variety it had a great replay value as well. I also enjoyed learning about events in one story line via another story line.

 

Starting with RotHC the stories were never the same anymore. It all turned into a JK story and stuff the rest basically. KotET had good moments but after a DS and LS playthrough, why would I ever play it again?

 

It was cool to become a jedi master or a dark council member....but outlander? commander? empress of an alliance?

 

No, none of that rings true. It gives me food for thought, cause I was so taken aback by the RNG gearing, but this has been a nagging problem for much longer...

[Johnycat]

Well put OP... sorry to see you leave.

 

Hope there is interest to return in the near future. You are always welcome back!

 

MTFBWY!

Cheers,

J

[DarthSpuds]

I enjoyed playing the various stories and because of the variety it had a great replay value as well. I also enjoyed learning about events in one story line via another story line..

 

This was for me one of the best aspects of the 1-50 experience.

 

You see the start of "something" on one class, get a hint about it on another, and another and really only pull all the pieces together once you'd played all the classes.

 

It maximised and incetivised replayability - it was nothing short of brilliant.

 

When was the last time anyone really thought "OMG, I can't wait to play that story arc on another class to see what is really going on"?

 

This game NEEDS that back as a matter of urgency IMO; it was one of the early game's defining features.

 

All The Best

[Damedius]

They have killed replayability with their mono story. One of the more enjoyable things about the game is alts. You had eight different stories to try. Now there is just one and then it becomes the spacebar mash.

 

This exacerbated by the fact that KotFE stops giving experience after level 66.

[Transcendent]

The individuals we became in the beginning are now diluted. There is no difference between them. They all become one. They have lost their charm.

 

Hopefully BioWare Austin will address this in the future, perhaps with our missing companions being a class specific story / chapter. With each class getting recognition and something different and appropriate to each companion.

 

We can hope, until then I wish you well in your future endeavours.

[Singori]

Can I have your stuff?

[grania]

The game was never supposed to be like this. One of their early assurances was that yes of course there would be more class stories - heck the lines are even recorded already! That was the game I signed up for.

 

Companion reunions held a lot of promise for me and I got one. Then they made him killable, all the important ones are killable. Are they trying to tell me something?

 

Anyway I don't feel like ranting and getting all down, it can still be a very fun game and have some very good moments. And hope never dies, blah blah blah. They've made some impressive progress with their cutscenes - fancy camera angles and facial expressions and emotes and I love it. Though, I can't help but think back to my favorite class stories and how we mostly just stood there talking, and it was still so good.

[sendrant]

Yeah, I have the same feelings like the OP. My subscription ends these days, perhaps even today, but to be honest: I don't care any more.

 

In the glorious days of classic, the game had it's flaws, but you had 8 different stories. Stories that even changed a bit, depending on your decisions. In RotHC there were at least two stories, the Empire and the Republic side of Makeb invasion. But with Revan they even scrapped the 2 stories approach. Now? It's one size fits them all that offers no replayability. Yes, I know there are differences how DS and LS work out, but those aren't enough to play the same dump pipe-like levels with lot's of stupid enemies that simply act as story-breaks again and again.

 

The new companions are also a bad joke. We had companions with unique stories and character, some we liked and some we would have preferred to kill. They took those away, decided to not return most of them. And the ones returning are mostly the more annoying ones. Your character doesn't even get informations about what happened to his (or her) love-interest. Instead they bombard us with generic husks that all act the same and have no impact on the overall story or at least some talk. After recruiting a star fortress char or an alliance alert guy, he's never ever mentioned again. In Classic you had conversations and learned more about your companions, about their characters and motives. Also I really enjoyed finding appropriate looking gear for the companions. Hell, I even bought cartel stuff just for them, still have a lot of old dresses stored for new chars companions. But not one of the new companions is customizable.

 

In the old days before 5.0, when I completed a chars story arc, I normally used him mainly for raiding or some credit farming via dailies. There where to many different, interesting stories to play. So yes, I have a lot of characters. Over 30 in different places in their personal story. Now Bioware wants to tell me to only play one char and do the same things again and again, hoping for look with their gambling gear system, if I want equipment. No, thank you. I want to decide what I like to play. If the command system would have been linked to the legacy and experiencing the classic story on another char would still bring some CXP, perhaps I would have thought about renewing the subscription. But their solution punishes me for enjoying the old stories by forcing me to play the same stuff I already played for years...

And believe me or not, but here's a big difference between playing the same bounty hunter story the fourth time and playing the same heroics some dozen times or even more often!

 

But hey, I can still enjoy the classics story as f2p-player...

[DarthSpuds]

But hey, I can still enjoy the classics story as f2p-player...

 

If I play at all that will be what I do.

 

My first toon, which is still my main, was a LS Jedi Sage. However, playing through it some of the DS options seemed equally interesting, so I may play a DS Sage and see what happens to the class story that way.

 

All The Best

[merovejec]

Can I have your stuff?

 

Dang i was too late

 

Anyway, always sorry to see a long time player go, but its been so frequent these days that I consider it normal by now. Well enjoy your free time and hope you will find a reason to come back.

[Vaerah]

I have to say I liked the KOTFE and KOTET "stories".

 

They'd be very cool and masterfully done (except for Vaylin exaggerated "childishness") if this had NOT been a Star Wars based game.

 

 

 

 

But this is a SW based game. As a PvP oriented player, I immediately laughed at defeating a demi-god and being proclaimed "king" of a galactic empire and then 2 minutes later I'd get totally smashed to bits by some random guy in a WZ.

 

And I have enjoyed it on my Sage but I can't even want to start it on my non force users. What's the point of a blatantly force oriented, grand epic story being played by a smuggler! Or bounty hunter!

 

"Hey, I smuggle fake dolls on Tatooine but for some reason I became Emperor of the Infinite Empire". BAH!

 

Also, I hate what have they done to Satele Shan!

She was my "model" and she got corrupted and dealing with a Sith lord and no option to get her free! I get it for Arcann and plenty of minor characters throughout the original classes stories, why not for her!

 

 

Edited December 22, 2016 by Vaerah

[Cmder-Shepard]

Op I do agree with you.

 

1-50 is the best the game was in terms of story and the game as awhole.

 

KOTFE and KOTET are fun and it was a good story but it just felt so out of place if your doing it as a Bounty Hunter for example. Why I've only done it on one character I don't see the need to replay the same story again with a different class.

 

I still have 3 more 1-50 stories left to do and those should be fun to see. But it would be nice if Bioware would bring more idividual stories back to our classes again. More so go back to how the planets were in the 1-50 leveling rather than tunnel levels they became

[Voblat]

Yes, its a shame.

 

Don't get me wrong, I really loved the KOTET story as it played out, it was a great experience.

 

But out of 14 toons, I have done it twice now, and that is it. I don't really want to do it again, in fact, only 5 of my toons have done kotfe, simply because I don't want the others to lose their important companions, and after the fifth pay through that I did just for DvL, I have kind of had my fill of that story too. Asylum was really cool the first couple of times I played that chapter, but by the fifth I was sick of going backwards and forwards to the ship. I won't be doing it again.

[DogMeat]

Can I Haze yer stuff?

[mathisk]

While I did enjoy the stories of KoTFE and KoTET, I also really miss my characters each having their own special stories.

 

I kind of hate it when all of my characters are forced to play through the same stories. Especially when that same story applies to both factions.

[Hathur]

While I would love to see individual class stories come back, the logistics reality is it will NEVER happen. It took Bioware years to put the class quests together.. each class quest from level 1-50 is about 20 hours long (dialogue & cutscenes only, gameplay cut.. this is based on my own youtube recordings of class stories). Thats 20 hours per class.. and it took them years to write it, design missions for each class, make cutscenes for each etc.

 

Kotfe chapter 1-16 is just a bit over 7 hours long (gameplay cut, only dialogue and cutscenes). It took them over a year to write, animate, design missions etc for that. It is also worth noting the production values of the expansion are drastically higher than the original game (original class quests where 95% just static cameras centered on character faces, with it swapping angles once in awhile.. the whole time characters just stood still in once place for most of it).. Kotfe and Kotet employed cinematic scenes - characters walk & talk, cameras pan and shift, characters walk from one set location to another in cutscenes... there is a LOT more going on during dialogue scenes in the expansions.. this also means a lot more work for animators and level designers since characters are just standing still in the exact same spot 90% of the time.

 

KoTet is about 4 hours 30 minutes long (again, just dialogue and cutscenes, no gameplay).. That took about a year of production as well.

 

Now take those 2 expansions and think about making one for every class.. they're going to all be different, thats an immense undertaking. For Bioware to make a KotET or Kotfe level of expansion for EACH class would probably take 5+ years if not more... it just isn't realistic to expect them to do that because I cannot fathom how it would be financially viable... they effectively made the idea of expanded class stories impossible when they made SWTOR for the simple fact there are too many classes & too many companions to feasibly write for in expansion material without incurring enormous costs that likely would not bring a viable financial return. Perhaps if SWTOR had achieved World of Warcraft levels of success then perhaps the money would be there to do it.. but the reality is it just isn't there nor will it ever be.

 

The best they can do is either keep doing these mono campaign stories, or stop the stories entirely and move onto making a new game (I enjoyed swtor's run... but frankly I'm ready and eager for a whole new game.. tired of this outdated engine, outdated visuals, outdated gameplay). It was good while it lasted, but I think it just needs to be put out to pasture and they need to reboot with either a proper KOTOR single player game or a whole new SWTOR (one with fewer class stories so that it becomes viable to expand the game after release).

Edited December 23, 2016 by Hathur

[DarthWoad]

 

It was cool to become a jedi master or a dark council member....but outlander? commander? empress of an alliance?

 

 

My characters already have a story, there's 8 of those stories, and now Bioware has given us all of those characters the same story for the sake of being "cool" and I agree with the OP, it's just made them meaningless and diluted.

 

As this is an MMO, my story after the individual class stories begins end game, where i do raids, where I make friends, where I meet new people. Thats MY story. But now that story feels just wrong as now everyone has the exact same story and experience in game.

[JennyFlynn]

While I would love to see individual class stories come back, the logistics reality is it will NEVER happen..

 

I agree we're not likely to ever see 8 individual stories again. I do recall that originally there were going to be more (a friend PM'd me some 'uncovered' data) where for instance the Sith Warrior would meet Lord Scourge and be confronted with his knowledge of the Emperor IIRC but all of this was scrapped in favor of Rise of the Hutt Cartel, unfortunately. And I do think these days they simply lack the time and resources for creating 8 individual stories.

 

That said, it would be nice to have at least 2 different ones. Republic vs. Empire or even Force Users vs. Non Force Users. Those gifted in the Force could all have their own quest relating to Sith/Jedi business or whatnot while Troopers, Smugglers, IAs and BHs are focused on a different issue in the galaxy that's more along the lines of their skill sets. Which is just an example but it would be nice to have some differences at least where we're not all shoved into the exact same story the way we were for FE/ET. I mean in that respect even SoR was more enjoyable because sure for most part it was the same (though Imp cutscenes vs. Rep cutscenes and some dialog was different) but at least it had the small class story continuations.

 

And don't get me wrong, FE/ET was enjoyable and as a story, I did like it but not a 3rd or 4th time around and not so much on some of my classes.

[StarwarsHunterxx]

Farewell ZeroPlus, we will all miss you. I do hope you will decide to join us once more in time, but I also hope you have a wonderful time and find something you love and enjoy to do. I think I can say for all of us, that we are all happy to have helped make the game a fun and awesome experience. Farewell once more.

[Dashtardly]

I, like a lot of other people (and I imagine the OP too), have played through each class multiple times because the story is good, there's variations (Sith Warrior as Dark Side vs. Light Side) or DPS vs HEALs etc. I've complete the KofFE/KotET on my Agent and the story just wasn't as good and didn't fit my character. It's an interactive movie (B grade). I MAY do it again on one of my dark and light side force users but it has zero interest and appeal to do over and over again (even with the "hard" mode option).

 

Sure, it may have required a lot of resources and investment to make the original game (with the 8 classes). However, that resulted in a game with a feature set that brought in a lot of revenue over a long period of time (i.e., keeping you subscribed and playing different character stories). The current investments being made are not appealing to me (nor for a lot of other people judging from the forum postings I've seen). Bioware has made a "Second" game on top of the carcass of the first and for marketing reasons has just chosen NOT to tell everyone the first game is dead, we switched you over to a second game.

 

Time to unsub.

Edited December 23, 2016 by Dashtardly
Corrected statement to not imply I'm speaking "for everyone"