Ioulaum Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 This really is a major issue as the OP has stated, i have played games since the early 90's, i have been through almost any and every MMO with at least a months time invested per MMO. As a Juggernought tank the responsiveness issues completely frustrate me in any group instances, sometimes even in hard solo battles and really makes me question what i have chosen as my main class, and game. If there were a brief cast bar to assist me with the delay or timing it would be a little better, but honestly it needs to be smooth and as instantly reacting as it can be, otherwise this issue is going to push a lot of players away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Korzald Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 The biggest issue I tend to see with this is that my whole bar (even abilities that are suppose to be off global cool down) goes grey every time I use any ability. Due to this issue I had to stop playing my gunslinger as getting into and out of cover was not happening as fast as I was pressing the keys resulting in very poor game play. I have similar issues with other classes but none as class breaking as that one. I use key press for most my actions not using the mouse for much but target and movement. And I find the responsiveness of the game is very lacking. If I use my mouse to hit buttons then it tends to be a little better but then my game play declines. Just my 2 cred on the issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob-ombaFett Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 Yes, this is a very accurate description -- much "animation", little "control".... aw... I was hoping for a lawl. better luck next time, I suppose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xcore Posted December 30, 2011 Author Share Posted December 30, 2011 aw... I was hoping for a lawl. better luck next time, I suppose. Oh my fiancee and I lol'd, the awesome part is that I couldn't stop watching it for like 2 minutes straight... its hypnotic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tinkersw Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 (edited) The video that shows the heal/movement is perfect -- it shows exactly what is meant with responsiveness. Look at how long it takes after the cast is completed for the heal to land... its quite "ridiculous". I have no idea why you are arguing these facts, you come off as very contrarian to me. There is nothing difficult to understand here, also, yes it is many issues culminating into "one" definable as unresponsive combat system... there is also nothing difficult about this (to understand), to fix, sure is... Very, very, very important to understand -- if "you" don't experience something that is being discussed here in this thread or seen in a video that "does not" mean that it is not a correct issue. Over the course of this thread we have collectively proven the unresponsive nature of the combat system. And we have give discernible details, which Bioware/Georg should have no problem understanding or deciphering (I would be more than willing to help if desired). There are not that many posts at all that are flat out wrong, if there are -- please point them out instead of making this blanket statement as I can't help in that case. This ^^is all fact It is a stupid the amount of people that pop in here with absolutely nothing of value. Edited December 30, 2011 by Tinkersw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olzmo Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 (edited) I think I found a good example of how I feel while PvPing with the current situation of character responsiveness. http://gifsoup.com/webroot/animatedgifs/162192_o.gif Completely erratic yet perfectly precise – that's one unbeatable technique. Edited December 30, 2011 by Olzmo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
veevito Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 The video that shows the heal/movement is perfect -- it shows exactly what is meant with responsiveness. Look at how long it takes after the cast is completed for the heal to land... its quite "ridiculous". I have no idea why you are arguing these facts, you come off as very contrarian to me. There is nothing difficult to understand here, also, yes it is many issues culminating into "one" definable as unresponsive combat system... there is also nothing difficult about this (to understand), to fix, sure is... Very, very, very important to understand -- if "you" don't experience something that is being discussed here in this thread or seen in a video that "does not" mean that it is not a correct issue. Over the course of this thread we have collectively proven the unresponsive nature of the combat system. And we have give discernible details, which Bioware/Georg should have no problem understanding or deciphering (I would be more than willing to help if desired). There are not that many posts at all that are flat out wrong, if there are -- please point them out instead of making this blanket statement as I can't help in that case. I never said that because I didn't experience some of it that it didn't exist. I've gone out of my way to say that it should be fixed regardless of ones own perception. And even that I have indeed experienced it in some abilities and only have an issue with it being portrayed as some sort of universal delay across all abilities. That does nothing to serve your goal and only muddies the already cloudy stream. If i'm contrarion, then I guess you could be considered very headstrong. But, you're right, it should be addressed for the abilities it delays. Never really argued that. If i've made a blanket statement reagarding half truths in posts, it's because of the huge number of posts here. As you so often say, if you want to re read both threads, you will find them. I'll leave you to your thing here. I hope it all works out. I really do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xcore Posted December 30, 2011 Author Share Posted December 30, 2011 (edited) I would really just like to post this, as I am slightly "p*ssed off" atm. So I have not been playing much over the past couple of days due to my focus on this thread and trying to work on this awareness and resolve this entire issue etc. But, I just entered a Warezone and "my god" this is so glaringly obvious its amazing... I mean I don't even have to try to notice this, its incredible... within 2 minutes: Aldaraan Civil War: lvl32 Gunslinger - I head to middle, because I'm a god **** sheep - Since everyone Empire plays a Sith Inquisitor, there are a few around the middle - I do a decent job on rooting one while I run into position (no problems, smooth!) - I get a good vantage point quickly, set up into cover (cover takes .5 to .8/9 too long) - Battle going on, few peeps in middle, I kill first target (Sith Inquisitor -- Sorcerer) - Sith Inquisitor comes out of stealth on me and stuns me (Stupidly I didn't pre-emptively "Hunker Down" or w/e) -- So far, fairly smooth and you'd have to be "above average" perception to notice any issues -- - Bounty Hunter meanwhile also opened up on me, I just got stunned by the Assassin - My reaction time (I'm not Professional) is about .6-7 (avg with reg. distraction) after -- (Here is where it goes to ****) *My immediate reaction/plan, trinket the stun (I am no longer in cover), get into cover, knockback/hunker down, either one first). This should all happen within about 1.5-2 seconds* Trinket = Instant, no GCD, Cover = Instant + 1.5 GCD, Knockback = Instant. So with my speed about 1.8 seconds to 2 seconds "max"* - So, I hit my PvP Trinket (w/e) within about .6-8 following stun. This is not supposed to trigger GCD - I spam cover -- nothing happens noticeably for about .4-6 seconds (possibly more) - Meanwhile Assassin/BH beating on me -- While I'm waiting for my dude to kneel? I'm not sure... - I am already spamming Knockback ability (sorry pretty intense, I can't watch him kneel and then hit it nice and slow). - The Cover Ability had a 1.5 GCD trigger which felt like 2.3-2.6 seconds.... - Knockback triggers on my bars! hurrah! -- however, no-one appears to be knocked back NOR did the animation happen! BUT MY CD IS ON IT AS IF IT DID!!? - About .6-1 second later knockback happens! and the animation is delayed by what feels about .5 I am dead, but the Assassin did get rooted by my knockback, it was worth it... ? So, basically something that was so simple, should've taken me no more than 1.8-2 seconds to execute (keybound and everything) took me 3.7 (generous) to 4.3 (realistic). This is UNACCEPTABLY FRUSTRATING... Alright, I didn't want to rant but I wanted to share what I've just experienced about 5 minutes ago. I am by "far" no PvP Pro but I do have everything (including mounting up etc.) keybound and I am acutely aware of my abilities, timings etc. (or so I believe)... My point is... what the hell?... EDIT: Dear god, I just realized how foolish I was... Cover does not have a GCD Trigger... so where did all that time go!? Instant (No GCD) + Instant (No GCD) + Instant (GCD) = 3.8-4.5 seconds?! Edited December 30, 2011 by Xcore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StormDragonlord Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 (edited) I advice you to simply play until the free month is up, if they haven't fixed this by that time, just unsub, like I will ( no this is not a threat nor am I hating on the game, I actually love this game really bad and I wish hard that they would fix this, but I can't see myself raiding or PvPing with such a horrid combat.) and problem solved really. I'm almost sure Bioware doesn't come to these forums themselves and they just receive feedback from in game or something else. Why.. why can't they fix this or at least tell us if it's possible or not.. are you guys so greedy that you realize you can't fix it and will stay quiet to see how many people stay and pray that you will fix this? I don't want to think this but the utter lack of communication from you people is astounding. Feels like developers think of themselves like higher humans because low peasants are playing something they created.. the only MMO I've seen that actually has people working and communicating frequently is RIFT. Edited December 30, 2011 by StormDragonlord Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xcore Posted December 30, 2011 Author Share Posted December 30, 2011 I advice you to simply play until the free month is up, if they haven't fixed this by that time, just unsub, like I will ( no this is not a threat nor am I hating on the game, I actually love this game really bad and I wish hard that they would fix this, but I can't see myself raiding or PvPing with such a horrid combat.) and problem solved really. I'm almost sure Bioware doesn't come to these forums themselves and they just receive feedback from in game or something else. Well, we did get response from Georg on Page 123... lets see... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob-ombaFett Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 Wouldn't it suck if the only fix for this will require BioWare to revamp the game engine entirely, a la FFXIV? It wouldn't be nearly as bad with SWTOR as it is with FFXIV though. SWTOR already has some wonderful things going on for it. The wait wouldn't be too bad, I don't think... I haven't been able to play FFXIV since its launch month because it sucked so much. I will definitely be trying again once 2.0 comes out at next year though (after all, they are pretty much rebuilding the entire engine). Let us hope SWTOR does not bear the same fate that SquareEnix has... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MinatureHero Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 getting similar **** happening to me constantly, for example escape aka pvp trinket rarely ever works the moment i press it, taking cover and interrupting seems to take forever is well. it really does ruin the game for me, but the fact that it affects all combat aspects off the game should hopefully prove for it to get fixed or at least properly addressed soon. also trying to fake cast ppls interupts feels pointless is well, if you cancel before they interrupt you still seem get interrupted. :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren_Kitlor Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 This issue is under active investigation. The complication is that there are actually a number of different issues with very different causes and potential resolutions lumped together in this thread. All we can say for now is 'we are actively working on the topic of character responsiveness'. Glad to see it's being worked on. Would the devs like to share their insights into the causes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kotodama Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 I can't deal with this delay any more. It takes over 3 seconds for my toon to use any ability I command it to, my latency is under 30. This is absolutely ridiculous, no way am ai going to continue playing like this. I've been at A LOT of mmorpg launches and this is the only one that suffers huge delays like this. Utterly disgraceful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xcore Posted December 30, 2011 Author Share Posted December 30, 2011 getting similar **** happening to me constantly, for example escape aka pvp trinket rarely ever works the moment i press it, taking cover and interrupting seems to take forever is well. it really does ruin the game for me, but the fact that it affects all combat aspects off the game should hopefully prove for it to get fixed or at least properly addressed soon. also trying to fake cast ppls interupts feels pointless is well, if you cancel before they interrupt you still seem get interrupted. :/ Fake casting is a "no-go" roun' here... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samdbtto Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 with it being this bad, have to wonder how fixable it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lusiferz Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 (edited) Just as an aside: LotRO, also a promising project once, also had this issue from the beginning: long-winded combat animations and no direct control over your character. It was a game where you watched your character doing sth. rather than actually doing sth. Turbine realized that this was a core problem and changed it, made "instant" abilities truly instant or "immediate" as they then phrased it. These immediate skills/abilities interrupt every on-going animation and acts out the ability at the BEGINNING of its animation. Combat felt much smoother, directer than before but still nothing like WoW, which is really a shame since both LotRO and TOR have much more potential story-wise than WoW but nothing beats WoW's gameplay smoothness/direct responsiveness at the moment (at least nothing I have played and I play A LOT). Coming from someone that canncelled WoW and doesn't want to go back to a world of Pandas (even though Chuck Norris almost had me going back . Also wen they changed combat was already too late.I will never forgive Turbine for making the best fantasy story (for me) a cheap WOW clone. I wish if ever Cristofer Tolkien wants to give the rights of SIlmarilion then a good company can make Silmarilion online (epic game). ps1:i hope it will not take so long to fix this in swtor cause we all know what happend to Lotro (free to play).Also lets hope this will not be Warhammer 2. ps2:sorry for my English Edited December 30, 2011 by Lusiferz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MinatureHero Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 Fake casting is a "no-go" roun' here... well hopefully this wont be the case if this gets sorted. this games got so much potential imo if they can smooth out the combat so its on par with wow's responsiveness, they should have a major success on their hands. also give valor for world pvp kills Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samdbtto Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 Fake casting is a "no-go" roun' here... yeah fake casting ain't happening, that is one thing for sure, more than likely you will get a "not ready yet" popup if you are doing it the way most are used to. Going from movement to a quick cast is terrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hisashii Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 I canceled. I love the game but this is unacceptable. Glad to see they are working on it but until it is fixed, I don't really care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sundorian Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 I absolutely agree that the responsiveness of the mouse to movement on screen is not up to the par of WoW. That being said I really doubt that they will do much about it. Its prob in the core engine and rewriting would just be too much. Now, That being said! -- I agree that if somthing isnt done many would be swtor players will revert back to WoW when MoP launches. Personally I am enjoying this game and will continue for the forseeable future. After playing wow for the past 7 years, this is something that is new and unique to some degree and I have really love the game so far. I DO think the responsiveness is an issue that should definately be looked at though. Make or break ---not quite sure, we will see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Putok Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 This issue is under active investigation. The complication is that there are actually a number of different issues with very different causes and potential resolutions lumped together in this thread. All we can say for now is 'we are actively working on the topic of character responsiveness'. Thank you. I look forward to hearing more from you all on this topic when you have more to say. I hope it is sooner, rather than later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xcore Posted December 30, 2011 Author Share Posted December 30, 2011 Also wen they changed combat was already too late.I will never forgive Turbine for making the best fantasy story (for me) a cheap WOW clone. I wish if ever Cristofer Tolkien wants to give the rights of SIlmarilion then a good company can make Silmarilion online (epic game). ps1:i hope it will not take so long to fix this in swtor cause we all know what happend to Lotro (free to play).Also lets hope this will not be Warhammer 2. ps2:sorry for my English English is fine, I agree... disappointed with LotRO as well when that came out... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kotodama Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 Woah woah wait a sec, are you guys saying the terrible responsiveness....was intentional?....You GOT to be kidding me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xcore Posted December 30, 2011 Author Share Posted December 30, 2011 Woah woah wait a sec, are you guys saying the terrible responsiveness....was intentional?....You GOT to be kidding me... The BDF, does not kid... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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