TrixxieTriss Posted November 19, 2016 Share Posted November 19, 2016 (edited) You forgot to factor in that takes you just to the point you can start earning top end gear. What is especially annoying to me ( and always has been since this idiotic system was announced as a replacement for current gearing ) is many people/groups need HM level gear to do the HM operations. So ideally ( depends on tiers but let's just go with the tier 2 ) you need to reach tier 2 doing other content you might not want to be doing ( like HM ops ) just to start the RNG grind to get the gear you need ( so more avoiding HM content ). Of course if you want to try do HM under geared it becomes even worse because you get no gear drops to help you next time and all those wipes are going to award you ZERO CXP so you won't even be progressing towards this stupid RNG system ... honestly I just can't fathom the stupidity in the decision to implement this system. Oh and how about some insult to injury? You go and do 1 of only 2 fresh pieces of content we are getting when the game release i.e. the story and you get NO CXP unless you repeat something you've done already to get to 70 and run KotET over leveled ( assuming you can do that without starting KotET, you could abort mission either way ). Does anyone have any positives for this system other than "oh but now everyone can get top end gear"? Being that casuals will probably never grind out the time required to get that far oh and of course many players won't even need said gear ( so those that do get punished ... GG BWA! ). I didn't want to say anything regarding when you start earning the top gear because I didnt know enough about that. But yeah, who cares if everyone now has the "potential" to get top end gear. Like you said the casual player isn't going to get it anyway. I would define a casual player as someone who players no more than 5 hours a week and is unlikely to play the game for longer than 6 months. Which means none of them will ever be geared. So the casual players whole bull**** argument about it being more fair is rubbish. The old system would have favoured them more, especially any casual pvpers. There is nothing positive about the changes. Anyone who has brought up something positive has been shown logically how it's not. Most of them come around. The rest are just stupid if they think this helps anyone in the game. These play times are per week - Casual players 1 hour = 100 weeks or 23 months or 1.9 years 2 hours = 50 weeks or 11.5 months 3 hours = 33 weeks or 7.7 months 5 hours = 20 weeks or 4.6 months Dedicated players 10 hours = 10 weeks or 2.3 months 15 hours = 6.6 weeks or 1.5 months 20 hours = 5 weeks or 1.15 months Edited November 19, 2016 by TrixxieTriss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ludoviccb Posted November 19, 2016 Share Posted November 19, 2016 (edited) I think 134 hours is underestimating it. I've made the calculations that he is quoting and calculated the median for 3 different cases for gearing DPS since they are the ones with the highest number of possible pieces. The one that he is quoting is my best case with only 14 different pieces of gear (one per slot) at 134 crates. The other two are 21 pieces (all the 224 pieces currently available) for a median of 196 crates and 49 pieces (224 pieces + 220 random drop + 220 vendor pieces other than relics) for a median of 454 crates. Edited November 19, 2016 by ludoviccb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrixxieTriss Posted November 19, 2016 Share Posted November 19, 2016 I've made the calculations that he is quoting and calculated the median for 3 different cases for gearing DPS since they are the ones with the highest number of possible pieces. The one that he is quoting is my best case with only 14 different pieces of gear (one per slot) at 134 crates. The other two are 21 pieces (all the 224 pieces currently available) for a median of 196 crates and 49 pieces (224 pieces + 220 random drop + 220 random pieces other than relics) for a median of 454 crates. Bioware need to go out and buy themselves Mong (special needs) helmets. They've obviously been banging their heads on the ideas board too hard. Either that or they are all a bit "special" to start with. So they should have helmets anyway. It's like they just Leroy Jenkins'd the whole ideas board, wether it was a brain dead idea or a slightly less brain dead idea, I'm not sure good ideas even make it to the board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morrolan Posted November 19, 2016 Share Posted November 19, 2016 Someone posted in the pvp forum that Bioware have said they intend to extend the CXP lvl to 300 soon. I'm not sure how true this is or where the info came from. BWF Bioware. I said it upthread a bit it has been stated on reddit that it has been increased to 300, T1 is 1-79, T2 is 80 to 179 and T3 is 180 to 300. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrixxieTriss Posted November 19, 2016 Share Posted November 19, 2016 (edited) I said it upthread a bit it has been stated on reddit that it has been increased to 300, T1 is 1-79, T2 is 80 to 179 and T3 is 180 to 300. Sorry I missed it, but thanks for the info. That's all I need now to cancel my sub. Edited November 19, 2016 by TrixxieTriss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrixxieTriss Posted November 19, 2016 Share Posted November 19, 2016 Crooked Bioware We need t-shirts made "crooked Bioware" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radzkie Posted November 19, 2016 Share Posted November 19, 2016 He said it's still subjected to change as its pts, that clearly means it won't change at all. lmfao Its funny because its true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrixxieTriss Posted November 19, 2016 Share Posted November 19, 2016 lmfao Its funny because its true. It's also sad because it's true 😢 The whole thing is just a big pile of 💩 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radzkie Posted November 19, 2016 Share Posted November 19, 2016 It's also sad because it's true 😢 The whole thing is just a big pile of 💩 Nah brah. I stopped caring long ago. I eat popcorn and piss myself laughing while reading SWTOR patch notes etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swtorevolution Posted November 19, 2016 Share Posted November 19, 2016 (edited) I didn't want to say anything regarding when you start earning the top gear because I didnt know enough about that. But yeah, who cares if everyone now has the "potential" to get top end gear. Like you said the casual player isn't going to get it anyway. I would define a casual player as someone who players no more than 5 hours a week and is unlikely to play the game for longer than 6 months. Which means none of them will ever be geared. So the casual players whole bull**** argument about it being more fair is rubbish. The old system would have favoured them more, especially any casual pvpers. There is nothing positive about the changes. Anyone who has brought up something positive has been shown logically how it's not. Most of them come around. The rest are just stupid if they think this helps anyone in the game. These play times are per week - Casual players 1 hour = 100 weeks or 23 months or 1.9 years 2 hours = 50 weeks or 11.5 months 3 hours = 33 weeks or 7.7 months 5 hours = 20 weeks or 4.6 months Dedicated players 10 hours = 10 weeks or 2.3 months 15 hours = 6.6 weeks or 1.5 months 20 hours = 5 weeks or 1.15 months You're assuming that "geared" means BiS for all slots. It doesn't. Casuals will still have all they gear they need for SM FPS and OPS, and they will have that gear as soon as they hit 70. PvPers will might have problems fighting players with a far larger time investment, but who knows, maybe Bioware will adjust reward rates from crates according to time played. Edited November 19, 2016 by Swtorevolution Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhedzaban Posted November 19, 2016 Share Posted November 19, 2016 You're assuming that "geared" means BiS for all slots. It doesn't. Casuals will still have all they gear they need for SM FPS and OPS, and they will have that gear as soon as they hit 70. PvPers will might have problems fighting players with a far larger time investment, but who knows, maybe Bioware will adjust reward rates from crates according to time played. I suspect there will be a bolster system and pvp will not be as bad as most people are predicting. I'm not saying better gear will not help, I just think if your gear is adequate and you are good enough then you will compete perfectly fine. I must admit I'm getting a little down with all the doom and gloom posts lately. There seems to be a subset of embittered vet players who refuse to give the new system a chance without even experiencing it. Yes people are entitled to vent their spleen, threaten to cancel their sub etc, but there seems to be a core set of veterans here who have become so cynical that it's just not healthy. Some people need to learn to let go and move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivanhedgehog Posted November 19, 2016 Share Posted November 19, 2016 You're assuming that "geared" means BiS for all slots. It doesn't. Casuals will still have all they gear they need for SM FPS and OPS, and they will have that gear as soon as they hit 70. PvPers will might have problems fighting players with a far larger time investment, but who knows, maybe Bioware will adjust reward rates from crates according to time played. geared means at least the equivalent to current 208 gear bought with crystals. no one will have that at 70. bioware will not be adjusting anything until feb at the earliest. They drop their "year" of content and bug out on a 2 month vacation. untested and all a big surprise because they dont communicate for ****. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DragonDai Posted November 19, 2016 Share Posted November 19, 2016 hahahahahahahaha That is all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scardera Posted November 19, 2016 Share Posted November 19, 2016 (edited) CZ 198 rep item in command crate its a joke right? RIGHT? Edited November 19, 2016 by scardera Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MeNaCe-NZ Posted November 19, 2016 Share Posted November 19, 2016 I suspect there will be a bolster system and pvp will not be as bad as most people are predicting. I'm not saying better gear will not help, I just think if your gear is adequate and you are good enough then you will compete perfectly fine. I must admit I'm getting a little down with all the doom and gloom posts lately. There seems to be a subset of embittered vet players who refuse to give the new system a chance without even experiencing it. Yes people are entitled to vent their spleen, threaten to cancel their sub etc, but there seems to be a core set of veterans here who have become so cynical that it's just not healthy. Some people need to learn to let go and move on. If someone was selling actual **** and telling you it tasted like chocolate would you trial it to be sure? "trialing" it involves paying for it and that's exactly the sort of marketing companies like this would thrive on in light so said changes. Usually it might work but there is that much official information out there for people to make educated decisions ahead of time that it fails. In saying that if this were an expansion involving a couple of operations, new flashpoints and hell throw in some pvp maps in there ... people would be far more willing to give it a "trial". What is actually comes across as is BWA are pissing on our legs and telling us it's raining. If you want to pay money to test if that theory holds true, good for you. Personally I'm paying for the product I deem worth paying for ( new chapters and to "trial" uprisings" ) and that will do until something else comes along worth paying for in this game for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlaecusMcFly Posted November 19, 2016 Share Posted November 19, 2016 (edited) If someone was selling actual **** and telling you it tasted like chocolate would you trial it to be sure? "trialing" it involves paying for it and that's exactly the sort of marketing companies like this would thrive on in light so said changes. Usually it might work but there is that much official information out there for people to make educated decisions ahead of time that it fails. In saying that if this were an expansion involving a couple of operations, new flashpoints and hell throw in some pvp maps in there ... people would be far more willing to give it a "trial". What is actually comes across as is BWA are pissing on our legs and telling us it's raining. If you want to pay money to test if that theory holds true, good for you. Personally I'm paying for the product I deem worth paying for ( new chapters and to "trial" uprisings" ) and that will do until something else comes along worth paying for in this game for me. Don't waste your time trying to get your points across to these folks. These guys are all part of the same club. They go to every game and spout the same phrases over and over. They've been here since launch, for five years, saying the same phrases like a broken record. They probably have these phrases hanging on their walls, burn-etched into pieces of wood. Those phrases include: "It's only Beta!" "It's only PTS!" "They still have time to adjust things!" "I will reserve judgement." "Let's just wait and see how it goes." "I give them the benefit of the doubt." "Give the developers a chance!" You see them in every forum, for every failed game, saying the same thing despite all evidence to the contrary right in front of their faces beforehand. They will be the same people in these forums two years from now saying the same sh*t. Edited November 19, 2016 by AlaecusMcFly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Costello Posted November 19, 2016 Share Posted November 19, 2016 What do people expect, this is what they asked for. When the DvL 'Event' was rolled out and it appeared to just be a list of achievements obtained through old content, people said how amazing it was, that it felt like being back a launch! The lure for doing this list was a chance, a very very small chance to get some rare CM goodies. More like it was CM junk but people said how great that was. So for the new content its a long long interchangeable list of old content for a very small chance to get some rare loot, though more likely to get some green junk. That is what people told the devs they wanted, that is what they have got. Now is not the time to say oh wait this isn't very good, that time was when DvL was announced. This is supposedly what the masses wanted so I'm sure it will be a massive success and I hope the people that posted how great they thought the DvL event was, are still here to defend the game when 5.0 goes live. Cause this one is for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
t-darko Posted November 19, 2016 Share Posted November 19, 2016 (edited) ***? He got a bunch of greens and cosmetic shells. Where the hell is the set gear? *facepalm* :rolleyes:Please pay attention, go back and watch it AGAIN, he clearly states that he(thru cheats and the perk of being an employee) already got the best gear in the game, therefor is there no gear drops, just skins and such. The point was to show the mechanics. Edited November 19, 2016 by t-darko Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Costello Posted November 19, 2016 Share Posted November 19, 2016 *facepalm* :rolleyes:Please pay attention, go back and watch it AGAIN, he clearly states that he(thru cheats and the perk of being an employee) already got the best gear in the game, therefor is there no gear drops, just skins and such. The point was to show the mechanics. I fear you may have made yourself look a little foolish. His comments were that he was in the best gear so the stuff he got wouldn't be an improvement. Gear was dropping it just wasn't very good the gear was some cosmetic shells and some green gear. What gear he had, would have no impact on what he got, what likely would have an impact is that he was a high command rank so should be getting better stuff than at a low command rank. I don't know what your link my reference but it seems unlikely to be anything relevant as his comments in the stream were about how if he hadn't cheated then the green junk would have been an improvement on what he already had. Possibly even more worrying that the tier before even if it had a set bonus would be worse than the next tier green. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glower Posted November 19, 2016 Share Posted November 19, 2016 Level your char to 70, then grind your lucky boxes to 90. Get green crap, then grind to 180-200 to get purple bs! Do you have some of these pre-5.0 alts? Maybe 10-12 of them? Oh, you can go f yourself then! The new SWTOR is really sad. "How to kill the game in one year", 2017 year edition guide proudly presented by Bioware... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kinsal Posted November 19, 2016 Share Posted November 19, 2016 It's basically vote with your wallet time complaining doesn't get the attention of EA revenue lost that a different story Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alssaran Posted November 19, 2016 Share Posted November 19, 2016 These guys are all part of the same club. Yes, I am part of the "get information on the facts and try out the system before you doom it" faction. I'm rather proud of it to be honest. People who demonize a system before trying it are the most cancerous people known to gaming communities. They are the reason the gaming market is stagnating in recent years - developers don't want to try out "new" things because the backlash might be substantial without any factual information to boot. Agreeing with MeNaCe is like accepting the defeat of factual information and objective observation. He's using degrading language to describe a system he doesn't even know the numbers and statistical average of ("****"), and he is trying to attack people who like the new system and want to give it a chance - the same you are doing right now. Yes, I will say that it is still on the PTR. Because that is the factual truth. It's not on live. It is an ongoing system that can be tweaked and adjusted with different tokens, drop chances, XP rates, new content and safety mechanics now and after launch. It's on the PTR and it can be adjusted is the factual state of the mechanic. Saying "Bioware is so inept that they won't do it!" is a subjective opinion. Argue your subjective opinion all you want, and I certainly agree you can, but denouncing someone based on saying what is happening and what is factual correct is akin denouncing yourself in this conversation. They will be the same people in these forums two years from now saying the same sh*t. Yes, I will be. I am paying for a game I am tremendously enjoying. If you cannot deal with the fact that some people like the new changes, and you're trying to argue that those people are somewhat "worse" than you for liking/reasoning in support for the system, I suggest exiting the forum. And before you attempt to construct a false defense like "you are allowed to state your opinion, and I am allowed to state mine!": You are allowed to state your opinion on a subjective level. You can say you dislike the system. You can argue against it and propose changes. That's all fine, and I can agree for the sake of conversation. But the moment you start degrading people as white knights or as members of a "faction" that is inferior to your own (in your perception), then you have lost all right to claim "right of discussion". Actually, I don't disagree with the idea that the new system needs some tweaks. I disagree with how you, MeNaCe and some others are going about the suggestion itself. You are an armchair developer. The idea that you are part of a faction who knows better than the people who like it is so unreasonably hilarious that I can't help but smirk. And before you attempt to hide behind a mask of "red herings" and "I didn't actually write that" - there are levels of communication that are hinted at by what was said and how it was said. Those things are called "layers of communication". The fact that you regard yourself as superior and more knowledgeable than the "faction" you are calling out is as apparent from your wording as the disdain and dissatisfaction of that idea is apparent in my words. And regarding your quote: The same people who are now saying they are going to quit will be around in two years, whether with a break inbetween subscription or not doesn't matter. And they will say the same thing about another proposed system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soljin Posted November 19, 2016 Share Posted November 19, 2016 (edited) And regarding your quote: The same people who are now saying they are going to quit will be around in two years, whether with a break inbetween subscription or not doesn't matter. And they will say the same thing about another proposed system. Yeah some will still be around in two years, some will not...the question is will enough leave to take this game away from people that want to play it..... Ideally folks would be working towards resolutions rather than choosing a side....Regardless if you are a defender of "Wait and see" or you feel you know enough to be discouraged....one will effect the other regardless if anyone wants to admit it, we are all on the same side... If we agree or not...you better hope the people you are talking about in this quote actually come back.....If not, they will essentially take your ability to make a choice regarding this game with them. I have seen games with the Star Wars IP lose massive players in a matter of weeks once already....It can happen. Developers blindly moving forward with game changes the community is not happy with can kill a game...it is possible, it has happened. Edited November 19, 2016 by Soljin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Transcendent Posted November 19, 2016 Share Posted November 19, 2016 People who demonize a system before trying it are the most cancerous people known to gaming communities. They are the reason the gaming market is stagnating in recent years - developers don't want to try out "new" things because the backlash might be substantial without any factual information to boot. I mean seriously, how can you even justify this part of your post? Based on factual evidence? You only have to look at the Golden Joystick Awards 2016 (voted for by players not critics) and look at the best received new games (with new ideas!) to see how much that statement doesn't match with the reality. The point about complaining about a system being introduced for gearing, is that we've A) Already had something similar in this very game, it was attrocious. B) It isn't a new system and detracts heavily from what we already have in the game. C) Is clearly designed with BioWare and EA in mind and not the player enjoyment or experience. You are of course entitled to your own opinion, and don't take me wrong because I do welcome your opinion. However that part of your statement quoted has a detachment from the reality of the situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlrikFassbauer Posted November 19, 2016 Share Posted November 19, 2016 You only have to look at the Golden Joystick Awards 2016 (voted for by players not critics) and look at the best received new games (with new ideas!) to see how much that statement doesn't match with the reality. I've often seen good games with fresh new ideas going down - and their dev studio oftenb becomin bancrupt as well - because their fresh new idias simply did not sell. One of my favourite examples to that is Beyond Good & Evil - but that was developed by Ubisoft, they could afford a failure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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