SWTOR $1 million decrease in subscription

[Christie_Swift]

Nothing to see here...1% of 100% almost a spec...why flame the community with innuendos. Lots of players are F2P anyways and they make majority of money from cartel markets not subs in this game.

[FourPawnBenoni]

Nothing to see here...1% of 100% almost a spec...why flame the community with innuendos. Lots of players are F2P anyways and they make majority of money from cartel markets not subs in this game.

 

If they didn't care, they wouldn't try and offer subscriber perks

[TUXs]

Nothing to see here...1% of 100% almost a spec...why flame the community with innuendos. Lots of players are F2P anyways and they make majority of money from cartel markets not subs in this game.

A few things...that 1% was off of EA's total revenue. SWTOR got called out by name for costing them that one million dollars. Investors hate losing out on one million dollars. Yes they make $ off the CM, but those sales are overwhelmingly from subbed players, not the F2P or Pref players. When subs drop, so does CM revenue.

[dr_mike]

SWTOR got called out by name for costing them that one million dollars.

 

And that's after all those times the game's not mentioned at all in the quarterly reports.

 

I'd do lookups but it's "Which kid can scream louder" day here at the library. I'm doing my GTN stuff and going home.

Edited November 15, 2016 by dr_mike

[DarthDymond]

July - Sept 2015: EA brings in $84 million in subscription net revenue.

 

July - Sept 2016: EA brings in $83 million in subscription net revenue.

 

Significant contributor to that (1%) change is that during that quarter SWTOR brought in less than it did during the quarter when its subscriptions had spiked by 31%.

 

Oh me, oh my, the sky, it is a-fallin' - SWTOR didn't do quite as well, by comparison, as it did during one of its best quarters in the prior three years.

Edited November 15, 2016 by DarthDymond

[Alec_Fortescue]

If they added MMO elements to an mmo game and more iconic Star Wars elements to a Star Wars game (JEDI ROBES!!!!!) maybe it would have been different.

[Malkosha]

First off, the Dev team has all the data. They know what people actually play and how they play it ... and it's obviously different from what the forum trolls think it is. They created the current game play from that data. Just because you don't like it doesn't mean they are wrong.

 

Second, that report is a little vague and no amount of "filling in the blanks" will make it less so. It only allows people to spin the info into what they want it to be instead of what it actually is. for instance, the 1 mill loss on subs could have been offset by CC spending or perhaps after the last chapter, people went preferred until the newest expansion. I can spin it just like you and the end result is the same BS.

 

Finally, the sky has been falling from day one and according to some of you the game should have gone bankrupt years ago. At this point, while some of the posts are humerus considering the lack of knowledge, you can only cry wolf so much before the villagers stop listening.

[MayhemofChaonus]

So here we go again, go get your pitchfork, light your torch, we're off to burn down the wind mill, and this time we're really gonna kill the monster!!!

 

Those who tries to reason, drown in the crowds unisonlly cry to; KILL, KILL, KILL . . .

 

And once again, these forums does not reflect the player base.

 

 

No, they tend to reflect the most intelligent and dedicated sections of the player base (with certain exceptions of course). People who use the forums tend to be that much more interested, involved, and dedicated to the game. Those who don't tend to be the kind of people who don't care about the game all that much and just play casually or for something to play. (again, there are a few exceptions)

 

Players who use the forums tend to be the kind of people that love the game enough to provide feedback and try to make it better for everyone. Players who don't just play the game and "eat whatever is in front of them" like good little consumers.

[dr_mike]

Thought you were leaving for reedit?

 

First off, the Dev team has all the data.

 

With all due respect, we don;t know what data they do have. Previously staff has had a hard problem telling a current subscriber from a lapsed one.

[kodrac]

July - Sept 2015: EA brings in $84 million in subscription net revenue.

 

July - Sept 2016: EA brings in $83 million in subscription net revenue.

 

Significant contributor to that (1%) change is that during that quarter SWTOR brought in less than it did during the quarter when its subscriptions had spiked by 31%.

 

Oh me, oh my, the sky, it is a-fallin' - SWTOR didn't do quite as well, by comparison, as it did during one of its best quarters in the prior three years.

 

Look, I know you're trying to bring reason here, but this is the internets. That's just not gonna fly around these parts.

[AlienEyeTX]

July - Sept 2015: EA brings in $84 million in subscription net revenue.

 

July - Sept 2016: EA brings in $83 million in subscription net revenue.

 

Significant contributor to that (1%) change is that during that quarter SWTOR brought in less than it did during the quarter when its subscriptions had spiked by 31%.

 

Oh me, oh my, the sky, it is a-fallin' - SWTOR didn't do quite as well, by comparison, as it did during one of its best quarters in the prior three years.

 

Right. And, the thread title is misleading (shocker!), as SWTOR was not the sole reason for the $1mm drop, but was a significant contributor. So, we really just know that something fewer than 66,667 subs left... or at least stopped subbing. During a time which corresponds to schools and universities resuming classes.

 

The other thing that we don't know is how much the game was or is bringing in through subs. We don't have real context of what the basically unknown number even means.

 

But, obviously, the game is shutting down tomorrow and I just wasted my time typing this.

[MeNaCe-NZ]

Ultimately WoW is always a terribly choice for a comparison.

 

Indeed which makes it odd it came up as context for this discussion.

 

 

 

but in the scope of SWTOR this drop of 1% in this particular quarter is not as I said "a harbinger of doom". It would need to be a downward trend that cuts through the months and quarters. At this stage this is simply a dip with some reasons that could be explained. To avoid it becoming a trend BWA will have to do something. I guess we'll find out what that is in this January live stream they referred to.

 

Yes not necessarily a harbinger of doom but I can't help thinking that if 5.0 were being really positively received perhaps more people would be like "oh well they lost some subs but 5.0 will bring them back" but for most it's 5.0 will drive away more.

 

At this stage I don't see Q3 getting anywhere near last year either because they had their biggest sub level during that quarter this year ( and torstatus had heavy servers from Late Sept - Feb, we've had none since ) and we aren't even close to touching that. December would actually to out perform that highest sub point by a massive factor to out do last year because we had a good solid 2+ months in the quarter last year of high player numbers that we've not seen at all this year.

 

I get that the expansion is a month late and instead we'll see a boost in Q4 over the previous Q4 ( and no doubt it will be reported as such ) but at this stage the financial year itself looks like it will struggle to come close to the previous year.

[curulz]

July - Sept 2015: EA brings in $84 million in subscription net revenue.

 

July - Sept 2016: EA brings in $83 million in subscription net revenue.

 

Significant contributor to that (1%) change is that during that quarter SWTOR brought in less than it did during the quarter when its subscriptions had spiked by 31%.

 

Oh me, oh my, the sky, it is a-fallin' - SWTOR didn't do quite as well, by comparison, as it did during one of its best quarters in the prior three years.

 

To be fair, we don't know all the details of their financial accounting. We don't know what all is included in their "net subscription revenue" and how they calculate subs. "other " revenue could be included in their monthly sub charges. The "other" could be their growth and offsetting the traditional sub revenue loss. or sub revenue could be the same and the other is what caused the drop. And we don't know how they calculate their sub counts. Do they use an EBU model to account for free or discounted subs, currency conversion rates, etc. ? So the link between revenue and sub count can be misleading.

 

Without more insight into their accounting, difficult to tell if its meaningful or not. On the surface though, a 1% drop isn't likely significant or a good measure of health (one way or the other). So its not that I disagree with you, I'm just agreeing with you!

[TUXs]

So, we really just know that something fewer than 66,667 subs left... or at least stopped subbing. During a time which corresponds to schools and universities resuming classes.

Wait...I thought summer was when populations dropped...that's what we were told last spring. People were going outside and had things to do...so now you're saying we drop in the fall as well? When do we see a spike exactly? When does the population ever come back? We're 2-weeks out from an expansion...where are all the people that can quit again in spring?

[MeNaCe-NZ]

Wait...I thought summer was when populations dropped...that's what we were told last spring. People were going outside and had things to do...so now you're saying we drop in the fall as well? When do we see a spike exactly? When does the population ever come back? We're 2-weeks out from an expansion...where are all the people that can quit again in spring?

 

His post is moot either way because it's YoY and thus the events mentioned happened the year before also.

[killershrike]

Combat in SWTOR is still exceptional, which is why I love PvP and Ops still...

 

Sorry for the threadjack, but are you serious?

SWTOR has one of the worst and unfun combat systems I encountered in more than 10 years of playing MMORPGs.

[TUXs]

His post is moot either way because it's YoY and thus the events mentioned happened the year before also.

Doh! You're correct >.<

[TUXs]

Sorry for the threadjack, but are you serious?

SWTOR has one of the worst and unfun combat systems I encountered in more than 10 years of playing MMORPGs.

I was serious. W0W is one of the ***est looking games I've ever seen, yet it's the largest MMO by far...it's all subjective. I love the vast number of skills...I like the way most of it 'feels' too. I find it far better than some, inferior to others...but overall, I actually do enjoy it.

[Jadescythe]

How many subscription games do you think EA has that lost signifcant revenue this quarter compared to last year? I don't even think they have that many subscription games atm, much less games dropping sub revenue. SWTOR was at least 50% of that loss if not more. And keep in mind, this should have been a quarter with much higher sub revenue since you could unlock all chapters by being subbed for a single month (August) at the end of the expac. Wouldn't you expect a spike for a month or two while people who weren't subbed the full time of the expansion complete the story?

 

And KotFE didnt even release until October 27th, 2015, which is after the reporting period we are talking about. Unless we're suggesting SWTOR was pulling in record subscriber numbers for the 3 months leading up to the month before expac release, then sub revenue wasn't even that high as we were still in the SoR content drought. I'd expect to see an even bigger revenue drop on the next quarterly report like this unless KotET pulls in as many subs as KotFE did at the end of last year.

[DarthDymond]

Wait...I thought summer was when populations dropped...that's what we were told last spring. People were going outside and had things to do...so now you're saying we drop in the fall as well? When do we see a spike exactly? When does the population ever come back? We're 2-weeks out from an expansion...where are all the people that can quit again in spring?

Yeah, even though I stand by what I said about this being all blown out of proportion, the "time of year" reasoning doesn't really hold up - seeing as this is comparing the same time of year in two different years.

 

(But this is also the Quarter that includes July and August, so if there is a 'summer lull', it would be in effect here relative to other Quarters.)

 

Edit: MeNaCe beat me to it

Edited November 15, 2016 by DarthDymond

[DarthDymond]

And KotFE didnt even release until October 27th, 2015, which is after the reporting period we are talking about. Unless we're suggesting SWTOR was pulling in record subscriber numbers for the 3 months leading up to the month before expac release, then sub revenue wasn't even that high as we were still in the SoR content drought. I'd expect to see an even bigger revenue drop on the next quarterly report like this unless KotET pulls in as many subs as KotFE did at the end of last year.

Yes, they explicitly were pulling in exceptional numbers during that Quarter: After KOTFE was announced in June 2015, subscriptions went up a remarkable 31% for the July 2015 - September 2015 Quarter, which is why this 1% dip relative to that Quarter is hardly the doom and gloom scenario people are painting it as.

Edited November 15, 2016 by DarthDymond

[Jadescythe]

Yes, they explicitly were pulling in exceptional numbers during that Quarter, after KOTFE was announced in June 2015, subscriptions went up a remarkable 31% for the July 2015 - September 2015 Quarter, which is why this 1% dip is hardly the doom and gloom scenario people are painting it as.

 

Yes, subscriptions increased ~30% during that period, but not to the record numbers they discussed. 30% of what was playing prior to the KotFE release was peanuts.

 

“In Q3, STAR WARS™: The Old Republic grew to its highest subscriber level in nearly three years.”

 

Q3 being the quarter ending December 31st, 2015. This also coincides with the release of Force Awakens.

[AlienEyeTX]

Wait...I thought summer was when populations dropped...that's what we were told last spring. People were going outside and had things to do...so now you're saying we drop in the fall as well? When do we see a spike exactly? When does the population ever come back? We're 2-weeks out from an expansion...where are all the people that can quit again in spring?

 

Point taken, but that wasn't the most noteworthy part of my post.

 

The point is, we don't have concrete information and we don't have concrete information for comparison. All that's being done here is people are speculating. Nowhere was it mentioned that this is alarming or that the game doesn't still have a healthy subscriber base and/or healthy revenue.

 

As long as the game is not shutting down, I assume they are making decent money. If the game does shut down, I'll find something else to do. Either way, BW is not going to listen to my opinion of how to make things better. There isn't much we can do to help, except to play the game and encourage others to do the same.

[PlasmaJohn]

Yes, they explicitly were pulling in exceptional numbers during that Quarter, after KOTFE was announced in June 2015, subscriptions went up a remarkable 31% for the July 2015 - September 2015 Quarter, which is why this 1% dip relative to that Quarter is hardly the doom and gloom scenario people are painting it as.

Getting called out in a quarterly report may not be doom and gloom for the game but it's certainly not sunshine and roses for management. If they don't correct whatever caused the trend their jobs are on the line. A short term bump isn't going to satiate their Corporate Overlords.

 

*looks at the 5.0 changes*

 

So about that new management team. It could be a good thing or a very bad thing. Clearly the current crew thinks the bulk of their players come from Asia. How it all turns out depends on if they have a clue how to run a Western MMO and aren't there to transition to MX mode.

[Dewlmenow]

Yes, they explicitly were pulling in exceptional numbers during that Quarter: After KOTFE was announced in June 2015, subscriptions went up a remarkable 31% for the July 2015 - September 2015 Quarter, which is why this 1% dip relative to that Quarter is hardly the doom and gloom scenario people are painting it as.

 

Subscriptions were up due to the pre order sub rewards, yes, but since revenue wasn't mentioned as being up over the previous year, I don't think that means anything. Regardless, being called out negatively in the quarterly report isn't a good thing no matter how it's spun.

 

Especially since they had a one time opportunity to gain more loyal subscribers with the flood of new players due to TFA, and being worse off than they were the previous year shows that KOTFE was anything but a positive.

Edited November 15, 2016 by Dewlmenow