Why Macros belong in TOR.

[warkat]

The only reason addons/macros and literally thousands of different nice features WoW has is because BW spent all its money on voice actors and servers to hold the 40 gigs of each copy...I honestly see this game dead in 6 months, The PvP people are dieing in a stunlock when they have 450 expertise...no diminshing returns on snare/stun/knockbacks dont know whos bright idea that was. Then to top it off the Nightmare raids are just a dps check with little to no mechanics just tank n spank faceroll your way to epics. I expected so much from this game and got a 100x crappy version of WoW sad.

[ShadowSoljer]

ITT: Kids from WoW that wish to see macros

 

I emphasize kids, because you are just that.

 

 

Edit: I forgot to add that they don't know how to pvp and are ignorant.

 

Edit Edit: I forgot they came from WoW, so saying they don't know how to pvp is redundant.

Edited December 28, 2011 by ShadowSoljer

[sunsu]

Hey guys. Can anyone name me any high level pvper that does not use Macros?

 

Except yourselves ofcourse. You are all evidently such amazingly skilled pvpers.

 

But for the actual ones. You know, the ones who kill you all the time. Not close, they're at 50% after a 1v1. Can you tell me? Do they use macros?

 

Didnt know swtor had high lvl pvp. Please tell me where I can find it as I am stuck in a huttball loop the likes you have never seen.

[Untallow]

You really are insufferable. I sincerely hope you are not so stubborn and close-minded in real life as if you are I pity those who have to put up with you.

 

Ad hominum attack from someone called out for being bad/lazy?

 

Surprise, surprise! It's Lando in disguise!

 

There is no real way around it. Own your status (I'd pick lazy personally).

[Jurisnoctis]

Didnt know swtor had high lvl pvp. Please tell me where I can find it as I am stuck in a huttball loop the likes you have never seen.

 

I'm sorry I'm looking towards the future of this game. My bad. I won't do that again. Neither should BioWare.

 

 

Can't be a casual PvP when I play on a world pvp server, can I?

 

Hmmm...

 

Oh and I am ignorant too?

 

 

Come on man, you are dealing in generalizations, as there are some good remarks going on, along with some serious trollage.

 

Didn't know all the PvE/RP servers were full for you bro. I'm so sorry. I also didn't know you didn't have friends and can't level via flashpoints that pvp bothers you so much.

 

I feel your tragedy and it makes my soul cry.

Edited December 28, 2011 by Jurisnoctis

[_compton_]

Can't be a casual PvP when I play on a world pvp server, can I?

 

Hmmm...

 

Oh and I am ignorant too?

 

 

Come on man, you are dealing in generalizations, as there are some good remarks going on, along with some serious trollage.

 

I think you misinterpreted the type of macro that most of us are advocating for - I think that most of your ignorance has been alleviated at this point.

 

I am not dealing in generalizations, most of those I've seen posting in opposition to the implementation of macros have been citing examples of either Mods/Addons (which are an entirely separate entity altogether) or ridiculously complex castsequence macros, similar to those seen in Rift or other poorly developed games.

 

Statements like "all the competent WoW PvPers I know hate macros" illustrate the staggeringly lofty level of ignorance present here.

[NightHawke]

I'm sorry I'm looking towards the future of this game. My bad. I won't do that again. Neither should BioWare.

 

 

 

 

Didn't know all the PvE/RP servers were full for you bro. I'm so sorry. I also didn't know you didn't have friends and can't level via flashpoints that pvp bothers you so much.

 

I feel your tragedy and it makes my soul cry.

 

Dude, what?

[sunsu]

I'm sorry I'm looking towards the future of this game. My bad. I won't do that again. Neither should BioWare.

 

 

 

 

Didn't know all the PvE/RP servers were full for you bro. I'm so sorry. I also didn't know you didn't have friends and can't level via flashpoints that pvp bothers you so much.

 

I feel your tragedy and it makes my soul cry.

 

So why do you need macros programed into the game when you can just get a gamepad and make youre own?

[NightHawke]

I think you misinterpreted the type of macro that most of us are advocating for - I think that most of your ignorance has been alleviated at this point.

 

I am not dealing in generalizations, most of those I've seen posting in opposition to the implementation of macros have been citing examples of either Mods/Addons (which are an entirely separate entity altogether) or ridiculously complex castsequence macros, similar to those seen in Rift or other poorly developed games.

 

Statements like "all the competent WoW PvPers I know hate macros" illustrate the staggeringly lofty level of ignorance present here.

 

Trust me when I say there are some people who should not be allowed on web boards, or any public speaking of any kind.

 

But there have been some valid counter arguments to the Macro request.

 

Just don't lose your head. Who knows, maybe they will put it in game. I will still push against it, but I am a bit mature for the whole flame war thing. Not accusing you, but I am just sayin.

[Yewcantcme]

Honestly, the majority of the people I've seen post in this thread opposing macros are casual PvPers with no real concept of a macros actual function, and simply don't want to see them implemented because they could not use them effectively and it would only widen the disparity between the best, and everyone else.

 

Arguing with them is fruitless, most of these completely negative posters will remain stubbornly obstinate regardless of the information you make available to them.

 

These people don't seem like casual players to me. For the most part, they seem like they have a solid idea about what they're doing.

 

And as for them not knowing what macros are, I assure you that most of us hardcore pvpers do indeed know what they are, how they function, and purpose they serve. Quite frankly, we just are completely opposed to them. They destroy combat, make gameplay lazy, and completely take skill out of the game.

 

They're an un-neccesary mod to a game that people have become attached to because they cannot play to save their lives. If all of the macros supporters in this thread are as good at pvp as they say, then why do you want them? If you're a solid player, you would have no need for macros. Do they make combat easier? Yes, but that is the bad part. They make combat lazy, care-bearish, and catering to the players that don't know a CC from a damage ability.

[Spootybeaver]

I fully support this. I use to be a healer, but lack of mouse-over macro killed it for me, as response time is critical for those awesome last second healing saves. Those were the best moments for me as a healer, throwing up a shield on someone with less than 100HP followed by a big heal or two. With lack of macro support (and horrible fps/lag issues) all of those saving moments in PvP have turned into moments of clumsy targeting followed by choppy graphics and by the time you think you have it figured out, you and the person you were trying to save are dead.

I want to heal again. Please support Mouse-over macros and focus macros!

[GtsVash]

So much hate in this thread, I don't see a problem with enabling macro usage. Add ons are really what some bad players used to play decently essentially since it told them what ability to cast IE *KILL SHOT* or *EXECUTE* flashing when off CD. Is there something wrong with me wanting to have a button that cloaks first then vanishes? If I'm smart enough to think "hey, these moves go almost hand in hand, they should be used together" I have the right to bind them as such.

[NightHawke]

These people don't seem like casual players to me. For the most part, they seem like they have a solid idea about what they're doing.

 

And as for them not knowing what macros are, I assure you that most of us hardcore pvpers do indeed know what they are, how they function, and purpose they serve. Quite frankly, we just are completely opposed to them. They destroy combat, make gameplay lazy, and completely take skill out of the game.

 

They're an un-neccesary mod to a game that people have become attached to because they cannot play to save their lives. If all of the macros supporters in this thread are as good at pvp as they say, then why do you want them? If you're a solid player, you would have no need for macros. Do they make combat easier? Yes, but that is the bad part. They make combat lazy, care-bearish, and catering to the players that don't know a CC from a damage ability.

 

Gotta agree with this post completely. I can see the gameplay turning into this lazy "gawd gotta log in again, I am so bored... must push macro 3).

[_compton_]

These people don't seem like casual players to me. For the most part, they seem like they have a solid idea about what they're doing.

 

And as for them not knowing what macros are, I assure you that most of us hardcore pvpers do indeed know what they are, how they function, and purpose they serve. Quite frankly, we just are completely opposed to them. They destroy combat, make gameplay lazy, and completely take skill out of the game.

 

They're an un-neccesary mod to a game that people have become attached to because they cannot play to save their lives. If all of the macros supporters in this thread are as good at pvp as they say, then why do you want them? If you're a solid player, you would have no need for macros. Do they make combat easier? Yes, but that is the bad part. They make combat lazy, care-bearish, and catering to the players that don't know a CC from a damage ability.

 

Please demonstrate your sound grasp of macro mechanics by explaining the function of both focus and mouseover macros, and how they "destroy combat, make gameplay lazy, and eliminate skill from the game."

[Zarthorn]

Anyone playing above 2000 MMR in WoW, either Arena or RBG would absolutely dominate the majority of the SWTOR PvPing population that I've seen. 2000 MMR, by the way, is mid-range.

 

I'm not sure where you associated Macros with keyboard turning, but the opposite is the truth.

 

If you're talking about MMO PvP, WoW is the ONLY place you'll find it played at the highest level currently. The game is hugely popular, established over many years, has a huge population and PvPing community - and the most extensively developed competitive PvP scene in the MMO market, by far. The game also supports Macros, which are considered absolutely vital to compete at higher levels. WoW arena was a part of the MLG circuit a couple of years ago. I'd like to see SWTOR PvP be similarly popular/competitive or even more so, which is why I'm advocating for macros.

 

Actually this was proven to be entirely false when most of those "2000+" Arena ranked players moved to WAR and got beaten senseless.

 

Blizzard even said themselves the Arena was a big mistake and not something they would ever do in any other mmo title in the future, not forgetting that competitive ranking was a figure so easily manipulated by "deals" between teams that rating became a running joke.

 

That's even before I go on to talk about the fact that every top team always featured the current OP FOTM classes, if they were truly as skilled as they claimed, they woulda done it with a lesser known team setup.

 

There is a reason the Elo rating system is constantly critised in gaming, there are too many factors that play into it that you wouldn't find in what Elo was orginally designed for.....Chess!

 

At least Microsoft have the right idea by trying to work a new system using the basis of Elo into one that accounts for other factors, Trueskill > any other system based on the archaic use of Elo only.

[ShadowSoljer]

Please demonstrate your sound grasp of macro mechanics by explaining the function of both focus and mouseover macros, and how they "destroy combat, make gameplay lazy, and eliminate skill from the game."

 

From my very first response. One button all my skills hur durr win!

[Battousaien]

Push button X, enable macro to push button Y,Z,A,B now you just enabled an item buff, two attack moves and a heal. How is that not automated?

 

That is just macro lite.

 

You are talking about some serious macros with your OP. And that is just wrong.

 

Sorry but to want macros is just ridiculous. No real pvper is going to want macros!

 

How is it fun to have 1 button perform everything for you? I quit RIFT because of the damn macros. There was literally no skill at all.

 

Macros can stay in RIFT. SWtOR does not need it and is better off without it.

 

 

And people think I dont understand macros?

 

 

Let me break it down more...

 

Macro button F

 

Execute quickslot 10;

 

Execute ability jack you up;

 

Pause 1.1;

 

Execute ability jack up up more;

 

Execute emote /laugh;

 

Pause 1.1;

 

Execute ability heal me I am hurt;

 

End

 

 

Automated. Any questions?

 

Some people just don't get the point. I seriously think people argue because they like to argue.

[NightHawke]

Please demonstrate your sound grasp of macro mechanics by explaining the function of both focus and mouseover macros, and how they "destroy combat, make gameplay lazy, and eliminate skill from the game."

 

Oh and this I do not know, but there is no mouseover mechanics associate in TOR of any kind is there?

 

If not, they would have to rework code, and revamp the combat system.

 

Call me a doomsayer, but I already played that game, and it shut down December 15, 2011.

[sunsu]

Funny how things change, back in the day macro users were comsidered cheaters because it was a tool that eliminated hand eye coordination and finger speed. Now if you cant use them youre considered a noob.

[_compton_]

Actually this was proven to be entirely false when most of those "2000+" Arena ranked players moved to WAR and got beaten senseless.

 

Blizzard even said themselves the Arena was a big mistake and not something they would ever do in any other mmo title in the future, not forgetting that competitive ranking was a figure so easily manipulated by "deals" between teams that rating became a running joke.

 

That's even before I go on to talk about the fact that every top team always featured the current OP FOTM classes, if they were truly as skilled as they claimed, they woulda done it with a lesser known team setup.

 

There is a reason the Elo rating system is constantly critised in gaming, there are too many factors that play into it that you wouldn't find in what Elo was orginally designed for.....Chess!

 

At least Microsoft have the right idea by trying to work a new system using the basis of Elo into one that accounts for other factors, Trueskill > any other system based on the archaic use of Elo only.

 

Considering the majority of players I've encountered in warzones up to this point backpedal and keyboard turn, it wouldn't require any more than basic competence.

[NightHawke]

Some people just don't get the point. I seriously think people argue because they like to argue.

 

I thought I was pretty clear as well. Thank you.

[Skiie]

Even SWG had its own macro system. Although IMO pvp is unstable and laggy at best right now I think that even if they were to involve macros they would just be useless anyways.

 

I still support the Idea of macros, but I support actually showing people the battle log and UI mods more. I'm on the ropes for re subbing because Bio ware is not being honest. they're doing a horrible job of hiding their obvious flaws, Ether that or I'm going to just pve with friends.

[Avaer]

These people don't seem like casual players to me. For the most part, they seem like they have a solid idea about what they're doing.

 

And as for them not knowing what macros are, I assure you that most of us hardcore pvpers do indeed know what they are, how they function, and purpose they serve. Quite frankly, we just are completely opposed to them. They destroy combat, make gameplay lazy, and completely take skill out of the game.

 

They're an un-neccesary mod to a game that people have become attached to because they cannot play to save their lives. If all of the macros supporters in this thread are as good at pvp as they say, then why do you want them? If you're a solid player, you would have no need for macros. Do they make combat easier? Yes, but that is the bad part. They make combat lazy, care-bearish, and catering to the players that don't know a CC from a damage ability.

 

Exactly! Any decent pvper will do fine as it is currently. Requesting to make things easier says it all right there. All those who want macros simply cannot perform well unless they only have to manage 3 or for keys. There is no denying it, so don't even try.

[Zarthorn]

Funny how things change, back in the day macro users were comsidered cheaters because it was a tool that eliminated hand eye coordination and finger speed. Now if you cant use them youre considered a noob.

 

I still consider those that use Macros to win noobs, heck I used to purposely not use macros in Rift because it was more fun to beat the macro kiddies with actual skill.

 

To me and it always will be...

 

Macros is surmount to aim assist in FPS games, you are taking away a layer of complexity to dumb down to experience and thus the kill/win/whatever should be credited to the computer and not the player.

[JawaJedi]

If it hinders you, won't it hinder any other "highly competitive PvPer" as well? And as for the non-highly competitive ones, shouldn't you still be able to easily defeat them?

 

I'm a big fan of "Learn to Plan", so I'm sorta naturally against big things like this. You have to work within the system given to you. Now, I know MMOers are against this, but hey, thats it.

I'm not a huge PvPer, so I suppose my opinion doesn't really count, but that's my 2 cents.