Slicing post-nerf, please look at the numbers BW

[fnyxaren]

Unfortunately things will still be bought off of GTN as this nerf will push more folks toward the gold sellers.

 

Yes, I'm sure the gold sellers are ecstatic that their main source of farmed gold is nerfed.

 

Slicing was too profitable, Bioware likely overnerfed it a bit but I can live with that considering all my friends running around with millions of slice-money. They'll probably buff it a bit in the future, hopefully not to the pre-nerf levels though.

[Pegleg]

Slicing's intent as i perceived it as was to stop gold selling companies and stimulate the economy. A big step in the right direction with this game was less time spent doing professions, lets face it none likes to pick herbs or skin animals to make their game currency. So what it did well was give those that didn't want to waste countless hours doing a way to make currency without much effort.

 

I will agree with the countless masses yes the amount you could make slicing was a bit much however i think we needed it opening week to help stimulate spending, without the ridiculous amount of credits not a lot of people would have been able to get their level 25 speeder at 25; For anyone that hasn't reached at least Tatooine yet you would know why it is such a big deal. The planet is huge.

 

The main reason i picked up slicing in the first place was because i ended up being at 300 credits at level 25, which meant no speeder. Which i was like how is that even possible? I had biochem, diplomacy and bioanalyis. It was the mission costs that were killing me softly, and slowly. I hadn't bought anything on the GN, so all i had done was crafting and buying my class skills. Slowly but surely the costs added up and forced me to pick up slicing. People say you can make money off the GN but none had money to pay for worthless med-kits. They were a luxury not a necessity. So now with no deep pocket slicers who's going to buy another lowbies med kits?

 

So something has to change:

 

The cost of the missions across the board meaning all crafting skills

 

Revert the nerf back by a bit and increase the time by double to complete the missions, even triple the time if it was taken back to how it was.

 

Increase the incentive for augment's and make lockboxes become more schematic friendly, however this could flood the market making schematics far less coveted for.

 

Make it so a level 15 can't do the level 49-50 missions. Make it so you need the appropriate level to craft in that level bracket.

 

 

I just think this nerf in the long run will hurt everyone. None wants a daily system of grinding like WoW, or the need for bot programs and chinese farmers to take over. Slicing would have been made less profitable given time because credits would have saturated the market becoming less valuable compared to raw materials. The nerf was too much, even though it needed one. A skill based on making credits should always yield a return unless the companion fails the mission; Never a negative profit.

[Smashface]

Yes, I'm sure the gold sellers are ecstatic that their main source of farmed gold is nerfed.

 

Slicing was too profitable, Bioware likely overnerfed it a bit but I can live with that considering all my friends running around with millions of slice-money. They'll probably buff it a bit in the future, hopefully not to the pre-nerf levels though.

 

Gold sellers don't farm for credits anymore. They just keylog account info and steal it. By nerfing legitimate ways of getting gold in game, you help gold sellers.

[darkneeds]

again sum1 who doesnt understand crafting. all the gathering u do, all the crafting u do at low lvls, SHOULD BE an investment for the high end items that you will be able to craft and sell. your not losing money your only investing and should make your money back. the difference is that i cant take the negative return that i got from slicing and go make a weapons or armor out of it. its just a straight loss in income.

 

show me the high end items from slicing. Its random and there for a straight loss in credits now

 

If i was crafting another class I would know the return but there is none becasue everybody else is crafting the same item

[Frontplayer]

I just wish that mods and Augments would decay with no chance to repair so that they had to be replaced.

 

With all these permanent gear crafting skills only the comumable goods will turn a profit in the long turn cos at some pont everybody will be "out geared". I want some SWG crafting back where I had to buy a crate of swoops every week. A crate of guns every other day. And get buffs/stims every day. Not that was a great economical system. The crafters had a bloe crafting ans running a shop. This WoW style crafting where you have to press one buttona and all is done is very....bleh.

[SilverWF]

bioware did things w/o thinking before ><

[darkneeds]

again sum1 who doesnt understand crafting. all the gathering u do, all the crafting u do at low lvls, SHOULD BE an investment for the high end items that you will be able to craft and sell. your not losing money your only investing and should make your money back. the difference is that i cant take the negative return that i got from slicing and go make a weapons or armor out of it. its just a straight loss in income.

 

except jere is your problem everybody else can do the same crafting so there is no investment.

 

It like opening a Mc donalds 2 steps from another mc donalds

[Ditoxic]

 

Make it so a level 15 can't do the level 49-50 missions. Make it so you need the appropriate level to craft in that level bracket. [/b]

 

 

I completely agree, though I think being able to run a level bracket above so that levelers can make gear for themselves as they play is still a viable option.

 

If they don't change this kind of thing level 10 off characters are going to be farmed for main accounts, and guilds will have dedicated crafters that they use to keep from buying other players mats and crafts. That will take away from the game and really impact the economy.

 

Just like the real world any economic structre is difficult to comprehend and harder to control, they have created an entire economy within a week that is completely different depending on server pops and it has only been one week post real launch. Give it time to balance out and don't condemn the company for a patch that came very early in response to a large amount of complaints.

[scottthejedi]

except jere is your problem everybody else can do the same crafting so there is no investment.

 

It like opening a Mc donalds 2 steps from another mc donalds

 

^This^

[GumBoil]

That's good. Maintaining credit flow should be a good challenge

 

If it was cheap then there wouldn't be any purpose to buying those now would there?

 

You are wrong. That might suit you of course if so great. If I wanted to grind for cash to afford my skills and 'mount', I would go and play a grind game. I want 'fun' from my mmo not 'work'. I may be in the minority but I do not think so. Constraining skills and abilities by cash is not the sort of 'hardcore' game play that I am looking for in a casual theme park game.

 

Seems like a lot of the crew skills are pretty worthless (all?), not surprised that slicing went that way too.

 

Slicing gave a leg up in cash early game but produced pocket change for a level 50 character. Limit mission levels by character levels and you would not have a problem. You could abuse it by logging on alts and having them all splicing. They should have put in measure to prevent the abuse rather than simply make the skill itself worthless. Actually any one that goes through the tedium of repeatedly sending 40 companions on missions probably deserves the cash.

 

Worse thing? It shows that they studied at the 'knee jerk' school of 'game design and balancing', that does not bode well for my future enjoyment of the game.

[darkneeds]

Slicing's intent as i perceived it as was to stop gold selling companies and stimulate the economy. A big step in the right direction with this game was less time spent doing professions, lets face it none likes to pick herbs or skin animals to make their game currency. So what it did well was give those that didn't want to waste countless hours doing a way to make currency without much effort.

 

I will agree with the countless masses yes the amount you could make slicing was a bit much however i think we needed it opening week to help stimulate spending, without the ridiculous amount of credits not a lot of people would have been able to get their level 25 speeder at 25; For anyone that hasn't reached at least Tatooine yet you would know why it is such a big deal. The planet is huge.

 

The main reason i picked up slicing in the first place was because i ended up being at 300 credits at level 25, which meant no speeder. Which i was like how is that even possible? I had biochem, diplomacy and bioanalyis. It was the mission costs that were killing me softly, and slowly. I hadn't bought anything on the GN, so all i had done was crafting and buying my class skills. Slowly but surely the costs added up and forced me to pick up slicing. People say you can make money off the GN but none had money to pay for worthless med-kits. They were a luxury not a necessity. So now with no deep pocket slicers who's going to buy another lowbies med kits?

 

So something has to change:

 

The cost of the missions across the board meaning all crafting skills

 

Revert the nerf back by a bit and increase the time by double to complete the missions, even triple the time if it was taken back to how it was.

 

Increase the incentive for augment's and make lockboxes become more schematic friendly, however this could flood the market making schematics far less coveted for.

 

Make it so a level 15 can't do the level 49-50 missions. Make it so you need the appropriate level to craft in that level bracket.

 

 

I just think this nerf in the long run will hurt everyone. None wants a daily system of grinding like WoW, or the need for bot programs and chinese farmers to take over. Slicing would have been made less profitable given time because credits would have saturated the market becoming less valuable compared to raw materials. The nerf was too much, even though it needed one. A skill based on making credits should always yield a return unless the companion fails the mission; Never a negative profit.

 

 

LOL Yet to see 1 gold sellers in game

 

and there not gold sellers there credit sellers

 

I

[SirFlashington]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Ag6DSToE8ms5dEY1V05ERUp4OGFPZ1Q4VE1CVk9HaWc

 

Currently Level5 Lockboxes are reaping more on average (in credits/minute) than Class2. Thanks a ton to everyone who is contributing to the data and graph

 

Class1: 9.52 c/min

Class2: 20.82 c/min

Class3: -1.4 c/min

Class4: 20.61 c/min

Class5: 21.38 c/min

Class6: 4.52 c/min

[scottthejedi]

Another smart thing to do is to get other gathering skills and stock pile tons and tons of mid level mats. on my (light) server everyone in my guild is constantly out of aluminum laminid things like this (yes i know, these are low level, but think of when they level up.).

[Pegleg]

LOL Yet to see 1 gold sellers in game

 

and there not gold sellers there credit sellers

 

I

 

Oh really? have you checked out IGE? 10k credits $15? They exist smarta** troll, any non noob to MMO's knows they will always be there.

[DragonDai]

Worse thing? It shows that they studied at the 'knee jerk' school of 'game design and balancing', that does not bode well for my future enjoyment of the game.

 

I hadn't even registered this till I read your comment. This is very very very worrying...

[Swixer]

"Hello there, I'd like to get this £100 note exchanged into two £50 notes."

 

"Sorry sir, but we can't do that. We can, however, take your £100 note and give you back a single £20 note."

 

"That's not fair..."

 

"Yes it is! You can always go out and work for the remaining £80! As long as you can do that, there's no valid reason to give you back your change."

 

"That doesn't make sense."

 

"Stop crying, you baby, now you know how the rest of us feel when we buy a product and get our money's worth."

[darkneeds]

Hmm guess i'll have to stop buying stuff from the trade network now and invest the little saving I had left to get a different crew skill.

 

Such a waste of a perfectly good skill if this is true...

 

Sure it seems like a lot of credits when you're level 20-30ish or even lower if you're doing lv 40-50 slicing missions.

But is that true for when you actually are level 50? (How my companions are able to do level 40+ missions when still under 40 is still a bit beyond me.)

 

I don't even want to know what prices crafted (artifact, custom etc.) gear will sell at when more people reach 50.

 

Seems like this is a lack in the crew skill system if they can't just change the succes rate according to the level of your companion. Level 30 companion doing a leven 42-48 quest should mean the chance to succeed is lower.

Just cutting all profits is bluntly said a dumb excuse for a solution.

 

a far point

 

maybe with the nerf I might accually send a crew member on at augment run.

 

Green returns selling on the ah for less then vendor

 

Blues selling for same as vendor

 

Burples selling cheep as

 

There might me a market for greens now. I am going to sit on my purples now and wait it out.

 

I expect the cost of greens / blues / epics to go thur the roof now

[KroganElite]

This is why slicing sucks (with actual numerical proof)

 

Popular arguments:

 

-"You make money by slicing nodes on the map"

>That makes the crew management and sending them off completely broken for slicing then. What is the point of it? Either buff it to reasonable levels or remove it from the game.

 

With the reduced flow of money into the economy, it will deflate. This doesn't help the fact that the AH interface is not user friendly and scares off most people from trying it.

 

Who do you think bought your stuff from the AH? Most likely a slicer. If you play the AH, expect to get reduced profits at least until more people reach or near lvl 50.

Edited December 28, 2011 by KroganElite

[CRNphg]

LOL Yet to see 1 gold sellers in game

 

and there not gold sellers there credit sellers

 

I

 

I've seen them during pre-release. Haven't seen any since then though.

[scottthejedi]

I've seen them during pre-release. Haven't seen any since then though.

 

doing a google search turned up lots. in game i have not seen them, but im in a very sheltered server.

[darkneeds]

I completely agree, though I think being able to run a level bracket above so that levelers can make gear for themselves as they play is still a viable option.

 

If they don't change this kind of thing level 10 off characters are going to be farmed for main accounts, and guilds will have dedicated crafters that they use to keep from buying other players mats and crafts. That will take away from the game and really impact the economy.

 

Just like the real world any economic structre is difficult to comprehend and harder to control, they have created an entire economy within a week that is completely different depending on server pops and it has only been one week post real launch. Give it time to balance out and don't condemn the company for a patch that came very early in response to a large amount of complaints.

 

DO YOU THINK

 

i KNOW WHOLE GUILDS DOING THIS

[smulx]

I've just woke up. Has anyone from BW said anything about this?

[Swixer]

I've just woke up. Has anyone from BW said anything about this?

 

Of course not.

[Smashface]

This is why slicing sucks (with actual numerical proof)

 

Popular arguments:

 

-"You make money by slicing nodes on the map"

>That makes the crew management and sending them off completely broken for slicing then. What is the point of it? Either buff it to reasonable levels or remove it from the game.

 

With the reduced flow of money into the economy, it will deflate. This doesn't help the fact that the AH interface is not user friendly and scares off most people from trying it.

 

To me, 20 credits per minute is NOT that bad. With 5 companions running, that's 6000 credits/hour, which you get while doing other things. And that doesn't even account for getting schematics and mission discoveries.

 

No, I don't feel like I can just go buy whatever the hell I want anymore, but I SHOULDN'T feel like I can buy whatever I want. Slicing was to a point that you felt like you had unlimited credits. The only reason I saved is I knew the nerfbat was coming.

[GumBoil]

One thing to add. Apart from this being heavy handed and a 'knee jerk' reaction it some how managed to escape the patch notes. So heavy handed and under handed, nice.

 

Leaving aside whether it was needed, I am getting a queasy feeling in the pit of my stomach. I seldom (if ever) have enjoyed an MMO long term where the devs have taken this approach to the ongoing care of their game.

 

Worried, not because of splicing but because of the 'culture' at BW. Some openness and transparency please.