Changes Coming to Packs with 4.1

[Nothing_Shines]

So, you are removing bronze tier gear from future packs and replacing it with a chance to get bronze, silver or gold tier gear from all of the previous cartel packs? The packs I already have complete sets of? I currently own every single armor set the CM packs have to offer. Why would I spend more money to get crap I already have? The whole point of each cartel pack is to get NEW gear.

 

What you've done here is lower the amount of gear in upcoming packs, which is better FOR YOU, not customers. And you've removed a tier of gear, which effectively makes silver gear going forward the new common tier, but you're keeping in place the current unlock costs of silver and gold tier gear, which is better FOR YOU, again. Why should we be excited about this? You have to design less gear, but get to charge the same amount for it.

 

Actually, you know what this reminds me of? Back when cartel packs were new and each subsequent pack in the current series was full of the crap gear from each previous pack. You know how people HATED that? Remember when you changed things because people complained LOUDLY that there was too much useless older gear clogging up the latest release? And your big innovative plan going forward is to hit rewind and go back to clogging up the packs with OLD crap? Brilliant move. I'm sure your sales will skyrocket now.

 

There must be posters on the walls in the BW Austin offices that proclaim: If it isn't broke, BREAK IT!

 

---and no, this isn't directed at Eric. Unless he suddenly joined the cartel market team.

Edited January 27, 2016 by Nothing_Shines

[JasonNH]

Here is some feedback , for what it's worth. Every time you change the way these packs work, I go on hiatus from buying any of them. It takes time to analyze the drop rates and value. A little stability someday soon would be nice.

[TX_Angel]

Here is some feedback , for what it's worth. Every time you change the way these packs work, I go on hiatus from buying any of them. It takes time to analyze the drop rates and value. A little stability someday soon would be nice.

 

Amen... Too many changes, to quickly... It reeks of "fiddling" to get the recipe just right.

 

Call me when dinner is actually ready, not when you want me to taste it again.

[TX_Angel]

Eric, none of the CM changes post 4.0 have been good ones, IMHO.

 

If you simply returned to the pack system you had before 4.0, with cartel cents, rep items, etc. I think you'd be better off.

[Madistein]

I do not like this. when I buy a new pack, I want new items. not a chance to get some rare crap from an older pack. If I buy a new pack and get old stuff I will be pissed.

[Eillack]

Another day, another disappointment.

[Brayla_Sana]

Yuck. This is awful. I liked the original packs. When you changed to the yucky new ones, you made up for it with the bronze, silver and gold packs. Then you took them away. Now you are making packs worse. At this point, unless an item is for direct sale that I like, I am not buying any of it anymore.

[Master-Nala]

This is a terrible change. Nested packs? Really?

 

I have a question based on that. What is the difference really between:

 

2 items - either a new item from pack OR 1 item from any previous CM pack

...

 

AND

 

2 items- either a new item from the pack (Mounts, Decorations, etc) or a Grand Chance Cube (more on this in a second)

 

That's what you're doing right? Why are you making this more difficult than it needs to be?

[AlrikFassbauer]

as we are no longer building new Bronze items.

 

Hello,

 

this implies that the low-cost unlock-price of 60 Cartel Coins disappears as well ?

[arunav]

I'd already been a bit put off at the unlock increases for many items from 240 to 400 CCs. Simply waiting on one of their sales, I ended up with sets and mounts I would have unlocked go to the 400 CC price in 4.0 with no warning.

 

Now a lot of the common items that could be to unlocked for 60 CCs are going away, too, with any future packs.

 

Fully admitting I have no idea what the finances are BW has to deal with, this comes across as a bad deal for BW's players/consumers. It lessens the value of a subscription even more, when content is already less than it used to be, by making the subscriber CC grant not go very far.

 

Alongside the removal of moddable equipment and weapons from much of the game, including planetary vendors and heroic rewards, this makes it feel like a BW basically takes for granted the subscribers it has left, and wants to force the ones that don't buy CCs or do so maybe once or twice a year to purchase more, in order to have the experience for customization and enjoying their characters' cosmetic appeal as much as in the past, since the CM launched.

 

An employee stated when the CM had started up and was successful they thought it was implemented in such a way that wasn't really going "dark side." As a long-time sub, the changes that have been ongoing since 4.0 are distasteful and make me less likely to buy coins at all.

 

EDIT: Leveling up for the first time since 4.0, I reached Voss. I always looked forward to one heroic there on each faction that granted really nice class-based lightsabers (for those of us who prefer the launch-era ones, instead of CM weapons). With no real surprise, these had also been removed. The same goes for an Area 4 mission in the Starship Graveyard on Hoth. It's things like this that make one ask, why stay a subscriber? Many of us have amassed enough credits to simply buy all the useful unlocks, and come back in August when season 1 is finished. I prefer supporting the game, out of principle, but BW/EA's policies make this less appealing since KotFE arrived.

 

Imho, in trying to get more money out of their remaining (and loyal) subscriber base, the changes since 4.0 are driving even these diehard fans away.

Edited January 27, 2016 by arunav

[Beltane]

As a heavy consumer of packs I really am not impressed with this change still. The grand packs are nice but I like them being separate from the cartel packs. I want the NEW stuff, not a chance to get the old stuff I probably already have if I wanted it.

 

I used to buy 1-2 hypercrates per pack release and I've only been buying some packs for about $20 the last few releases since I dislike the new systems so much.

 

And yes, PLEASE bring back cartel certificates. I can no longer buy anything I want off of those vendors...

[exfell]

We have heard in the past few months a lot of feedback from players that they really like the functionality of the “Grand Packs.”

 

I think you may have entirely missed the point why people liked them. Or I would really like to see the posts where people ask for greater randomness instead of less.

[Gzerro]

Hey folks,

 

We have heard in the past few months a lot of feedback from players that they really like the functionality of the “Grand Packs.” ]

 

So, they have gotten feedback that people really like the "Grand Packs", and the first thing they do is remove them from the game and replace them with something much worse

 

/boggle

[Eillack]

I think you may have entirely missed the point why people liked them. Or I would really like to see the posts where people ask for greater randomness instead of less.

 

Something something, "metrics."

[KyaniteD]

So we will get no new items with low unlock costs? That really cuts down my desire to collect mounts and armor sets

 

Precisely. And I don't really understand why that is because it's more likely that I spend 240 coins on unlocking 4 bronze sets than I am to spend 240 on unlocking 1 silver set (let alone 960 on 4 silver sets). If 240 gets me only 1 set unlocked, I'm less likely to spend them at all.

 

I'd say I'd go back to looking into non-cartel armor outfit combinations, but they removed the flashpoint/heroic/commendation gear, so clearly stearing us toward the cartel market for customized outfits, and there making the minimum unlock cost for new sets 240.

 

I wonder when they'll start removing the social armors and iconic (named) world drops.

 

tor-fashion.com already looks very sad with the number of grayed out (=no longer available) items.

[Transcendent]

Let me know if you have any questions on how these new packs work and I will work to clear up any confusion.

 

Has there been any internal discussion about adding back the Cartel Market Certificates and / or adding in a new reputation (including new titles)?

 

Of note, there seems to be an entire disconnect between the old Cartel Market packs and these newer ones, both in the contents provided as well as other factors such as new reputations / new vendors / new gear available from those vendors / new titles available in addition to the ones provided within the packs themselves.

 

I get that you're trying to make these appeal to new players to the game, by giving them the chance to get older gear sets, no issue with that. Seems like you're missing the chance of adding a "hook" to collect the new armour sets and get the new packs by not including these little QoL improvements.

[Rankyn]

Not a big fan of this.

 

When I buy a pack, I want an item from THAT pack, not a chance on something that I may or may not already have, even if it's a chance at the really rare stuff.

 

If you want to put a chance for one of these cubes in ADDITION to what should normally be in the pack, that'd be fine.

Replacing the content with a cube? Not so much.

 

I used to buy a hypercrate of every new shipment.

I stopped because:

- No reputation to earn

- No certificates

 

Granted, I like the change to armor boxes instead of the individual pieces, but without reputation and certificates, I'm content just to buy the stuff off the GTN and save my money.

 

Ultimately, it sounds to me like you had a good thing going with the way things worked pre-4.0 but you started messing with it and sales dropped off and now you're trying to scramble to boost it again.

[thelordofhate]

Hey folks,

 

As you may know, our Cartel Market team has been making constant adjustments to how packs work, since our rework in Fallen Empire. We have heard in the past few months a lot of feedback from players that they really like the functionality of the “Grand Packs.”

 

So, in other words:

 

SWTOR community: "We really like the grand packs! Please bring these back exactly as they were before."

SWTOR devs: "We LISTENED to your feedback, so we're going to completely change what YOU liked to make it closer to what WE like, and then trumpet like we did with that entire expansion pack that everyone hates!"

 

You guys just really don't get it AT ALL, do you?

[omaan]

Hey folks,

 

As you may know, our Cartel Market team has been making constant adjustments to how packs work, since our rework in Fallen Empire. We have heard in the past few months a lot of feedback from players that they really like the functionality of the “Grand Packs.” Think of anything from the Bronze, Silver, Gold Packs to the old Grand packs we released last year. Because of this, we are making some changes to the new pack which will release with 4.1.

 

Currently when you open a Cartel Market pack, this is what you receive:

• 2 items from the pack (Mounts, Decorations, etc)
  
• 1 rank 5 or 6 Companion Gift
  
• 1 Scrap
  

When you open the new Firebrand Pack in 4.1 you will receive the following:

• 2 items- either a new item from the pack (Mounts, Decorations, etc) or a Grand Chance Cube (more on this in a second)
  
• 1 rank 5 or 6 Companion Gift
  
• 1 Scrap
  

Now you are asking, what is the Grand Chance Cube? Think of it as the ultimate Grand Pack. Inside a Grand Chance Cube you have a chance to receive any available Cartel Market Pack item, including from the current Pack. Also, the Grand Chance Cube acts as a Grand Pack in that if you open an Armor Lootbox, it will contain the entire armor set, not just a few pieces.

 

This change allows us to place more emphasis on the Silver and Gold items in each pack, as we are no longer building new Bronze items. Now, in place of Bronze items you will receive a Grand Chance Cube. This Cube can contain the rarest of Cartel Market selections, giving you a second chance at highly-desired items.

 

Due to the ongoing changes in the Cartel Market, all of this is subject to change. It is likely that more changes will follow in the future.

 

Let me know if you have any questions on how these new packs work and I will work to clear up any confusion.

 

-eric

 

Hey Eric what about accusation Of being a liar? YOU told us BSG packs (mounts,toys,gear) will be returned!! Now you are telling about "new good changes" and nothing about bsg packs! WE WANT THEM BACK if they wont be returned me and my friends will leave this game at once

 

Hey folks,

 

The Bronze, Silver, and Gold (BSG) packs were removed from the market to coincide with the launch of the new Strategy Alliance Pack. Don't worry though, the BSG packs will be coming back to the Market! I don't have exact timing at the moment but will pass on more information as I have it.

 

Thanks.

 

-eric

Edited January 27, 2016 by omaan

[DarthDymond]

Are Pack sales really in the toilet or something? What's with all these seemingly random attempts to rework them?

 

I'm not opposed to anything in this new setup in particular, but it all comes across as throwing idea after idea out there to see what sticks, rather than having a real plan / vision.

[AlrikFassbauer]

I have to agree. Simple armor sets. No backpacks, lunchboxes, flaps, flashlights, snickers bars on boots, 80's shoulder pads gone wild, shower caps, chest pieces with table legs. Seriously.

 

Fully agreed upon. But we have this "appendages plague" since 1.0 or so ?

This suggestion has been posted here a million of times, but there never happened anything.

[Qouivandes]

they really like the grand packs and buy them

ok, so lets put them out regularly

we cant, when they are available they dont buy the other packs...just those.

well, make them rare in how we offer them.

Ooooorrr...we could add the grand packs into our regular packs, but make it a chance thing.

yea...i think they will like that. they love the chance at something...gives them purpose.

i think so to...they get to buy a regular pack and a (chance at) a grand pack..like thing...sorta.

this is amazing...

another idea, there are too many Bronze items in these packs...lets get rid of them.

hmmm, i like where this is going...so that would mean more silver/gold items, but wont they get upset at losing bronze.

Silver.Gold. how could they not like that.

[Jinook_Phi]

Just read a blog post on this that I didnt necessarily agree with everything the person said but yeah, so no true microtransactions just a better seduction to encourage more legalized gambling for goodies. I stopped spending my money on packs for just that reason. If Bioware ever decides integrity is important to them again and thus offers a true microtransaction system that doesnt require me to gamble, cool- I'll check it out. But yeah, MEH

[runescapeisgood]

Seems to me that a far more consumer friendly model would be:

 

2 items from new pack

1 chance cube

1 rep item/cartel certificate

1 jawa scrap/companion gift

 

or if you absolutely insist on rationing out the new, better silver and gold items at a slow pace:

 

1 item from new pack

2 random items from old packs (don't bother with the box in a box that may have came in a box that has the potential of giving you something that comes in a box)

1 rep item/cartel certificate (you could even randomize the rep if your metrics suggest that would sell more packs)

1 jawa scrap/companion gift

 

Even if you got almost entirely garbage, the older cartel packs used to be fun to open because at the very least you got a lot of it. These last few have been terrible and I don't see your proposed situation improving things all that much.

[DWRoelands]

Everyone seemed to love the Bronze/Silver/Gold packs. I don't understand what was wrong with them. Edited January 27, 2016 by DWRoelands