Crafting Changes in Fallen Empire

[eartharioch]

They said in the crafting bog that you can't RE into raid quality relics.

 

A dev corrected that (in a post)...http://www.swtor.com/community/showpost.php?p=8491806&postcount=287

 

o There will be no trainer schematics for SM/HM Relics (craftable with Conquest mats)

o SM/HM Operations Drops can still be RE'd as usual (and will require Op mats)

 

We are still waiting to find out if there will be Basic Comm level Relics for Artifice at the trainer.

[Faelandaea]

Isn't that what tank comps are for? "Hold on, I gotta get the shiny. Don't complain, I'll be back with some healing, I promise!"

 

ROFL so true. That's one of the GOOD changes I am looking forward to. Setting my favorite companion to do those roles without bringing out a companion that utterly annoys me

[cdalman]

I know Jedi aren't supposed to care about money, but I'm honestly worried about my main here. She's an artificer, and you've stripped away the one thing she does more than anything. Artificers main markets are Enhancements, Dyes, Crystals, and Lightsabers, and you're taking the Enhancements, so let's take a look at what we're left with:

 

Lightsabers people buy once and then use forever. It's like selling Crocs, the only people willing to pay for them only pay for them once. Unlike blasters, it's actually a bit difficult to see what kind of lightsaber you or someone else is carrying in the heat of battle, so design isn't as big a factor here. Add to that a new style of lightsaber comes out with every Cartel Pack, flooding the GTN with sabers. Unless you're willing to remove Lightsabers (and consequently all weapons) from the Cartel Packs and replace them with their appropriate schematic, there's really no point in trying to make money with these.

 

Tradeskill-crafted Crystals can't keep up with the Cartel Market at all. Why should I keep spending credits upgrading my crystal to a slightly better one when I can buy a Cartel Crystal at level 10 secure in the knowledge that it is stronger than anything Artificers can produce below level 50? Artificers get a lock on the top three base colors, Red, Green, and Blue, but the Cartel Market has the entire rainbow in their pocket, not to mention multi-color crystals. I've got a Lime Green Crystal that does +41 Endurance and can be used by any character over level 10. 240 Cartel Coins means I can give as many copies of that crystal to my characters as I choose, so where's the incentive to upgrade? Unless Crystals are getting a major overhaul in 4.0, there is still little reason to make these.

 

Dyes have always been a limited ability for us. All Dye combinations we can craft are overshadowed by the Cartel Market. The Hutts have a near monopoly on the colors Red and Black, for example. If Artificers are to be made market viable after removing Enhancements, this is where that change needs to be. Open the entire spectrum to us. Let us make the same colors as are available on the Cartel Market, or even better, let us make both Primary and Secondary Dyes for the whole spectrum, and then combine them as we choose.

 

I'm going to withhold criticism until I see what you're implementing, but you see where my fears lie.

Edited October 12, 2015 by cdalman

[MikeRindos]

Now hold on if you get rid of light sabers then we as Jedi can't use them. Now all my characters can't use the cybertech skill to craft our items. And sell them for credits. Nor can we craft invasion force. what a shame. I was a gunner runner for my new guild.

[eartharioch]

Dyes have always been a limited ability for us. All Dye combinations we can craft are overshadowed by the Cartel Market. The Hutts have a near monopoly on the colors Red and Black, for example.

 

It sounds like you only bought the trainer dyes...I can (and do) craft Black/Red all day and it makes a *lot* of money. With a few exceptions, the trainer dyes are all pretty solid sellers, but to get some of the best profits, you have to get the Reputation Vendor schematics.

[MikeRindos]

also forgot to add that. I don't do operations all that much. I'm forced to do flashpoints. I really don't mind. But you guys should have ask us we wanted it like that. You know all those changes to the crafting materials is really wrong. It read like for people who like warzones, conquests and operations.

[Faelandaea]

Artificers main markets are Enhancements, Dyes, Crystals, and Lightsabers, and you're taking the Enhancements...

 

Which is correctly done. Enhancements should ALWAYS have been left to Cybertechs. Cybertechs were always at a disadvantage because they gave their craft to other stuff as well. You still have the rest of the items you listed, which were always meant to be the stronglines of Artificaers.

[Ardarell_Solo]

Only that reliable Artifice money came from enhancements and relics, bacause Dye and Crystal business is under heavy CM pressure and hilts are only 2/9 as compared to 7/9 enhancements and 9/9 modifications. (That's why hilts + enhancements = modifications. With Cybertech having Earpieces on top, Grenades + Space stuff, I really don't see how one should move enhancements from Artifice to Cybertech).

 

They're basically removing the reliable money makers from Artifice and only leave the stuff that needs quite a lot of watching the market and looking for niches on a daily basis. Whereas Cybertech has already been a no brainer WITHOUT enhancements!

 

I'd rather have moved enhancements to Synth or Armstech even.

 

Artifice would only be balanced if they gave them a craftable relic learnable from trainer like the 186 one for 3.0.: Say 212 if reverse engineered to purple.

Edited October 12, 2015 by Ardarell_Solo

[CheaterLL]

Only that reliable Artifice money came from enhancements and relics, bacause Dye and Crystal business is under heavy CM pressure and hilts are only 2/9 as compared to 7/9 enhancements and 9/9 modifications. (That's why hilts + enhancements = modifications. With Cybertech having Earpieces on top, Grenades + Space stuff, I really don't see how one should move enhancements from Artifice to Cybertech).

 

They're basically removing the reliable money makers from Artifice and only leave the stuff that needs quite a lot of watching the market and looking for niches on a daily basis. Whereas Cybertech has already been a no brainer WITHOUT enhancements!

 

I'd rather have moved enhancements to Synth or Armstech even.

 

Artifice would only be balanced if they gave them a craftable relic learnable from trainer like the 186 one for 3.0.: Say 212 if reverse engineered to purple.

 

The only relics that aren't available are the operations grade ones (current 192/198). They didn't say they wouldn't have the entry level relics (current 186).

[Bahama]

The only relics that aren't available are the operations grade ones (current 192/198). They didn't say they wouldn't have the entry level relics (current 186).

 

 

Elder Game Crafting:

 

All Modifications acquired from Operations can be Reverse Engineered for their Schematics.

Operation Gear can no longer be Reverse Engineered.

Crafters can now make gear equivalent to Story and Hard Mode Operations gear:

This gear can be acquired from their respective Trainer.

This crafted gear, when Reverse Engineered is equivalent to Story Mode Operations gear.

When this Story Mode equivalent gear is Reverse Engineered, a player can acquire the schematic to craft Hard Mode Operations equivalent gear.

This new gear has a guaranteed Reverse Engineer chance.

This new gear is sellable & tradable.

This new gear requires a new Crafting material that can only be acquired by completing your personal Conquest goals.

This gear does not have set bonuses.

Relics cannot be crafted in this method.

 

Probably me reading to much into it, I got the impression we weren't going to be able to crafted the purple entry level Relics??

Edited October 12, 2015 by Bahama

[Mithros]

Any chance they might reformat the conquest page so that I can figure out what exactly my "personal conquest goals" are? More easily see what I have done and what I have yet to do?

 

Can a character that isn't in a guild even complete personal conquest goals?

 

How long does a person have to complete these goals? When do these goals reset and when does the game check to see if you have completed them?

[CheaterLL]

Elder Game Crafting:

 

All Modifications acquired from Operations can be Reverse Engineered for their Schematics.

Operation Gear can no longer be Reverse Engineered.

Crafters can now make gear equivalent to Story and Hard Mode Operations gear:

This gear can be acquired from their respective Trainer.

This crafted gear, when Reverse Engineered is equivalent to Story Mode Operations gear.

When this Story Mode equivalent gear is Reverse Engineered, a player can acquire the schematic to craft Hard Mode Operations equivalent gear.

This new gear has a guaranteed Reverse Engineer chance.

This new gear is sellable & tradable.

This new gear requires a new Crafting material that can only be acquired by completing your personal Conquest goals.

This gear does not have set bonuses.

Relics cannot be crafted in this method.

 

Probably me reading to much into it, I got the impression we weren't going to be able to crafted the purple entry level Relics??

 

This part is only about Storymode and Hardmode gear, which is the current 192 and 198.

 

That means that in terms of relics it's basically the same as it is now only with the additional ability to RE HM grade relics from HM ops unassembled drops.

Which is actually a buff to Artifice.

 

 

Removal of Enhancements still sucks but yeah...

 

[CheaterLL]

Any chance they might reformat the conquest page so that I can figure out what exactly my "personal conquest goals" are? More easily see what I have done and what I have yet to do?

 

Can a character that isn't in a guild even complete personal conquest goals?

 

How long does a person have to complete these goals? When do these goals reset and when does the game check to see if you have completed them?

 

As said before, your personal conquest goal is to reach the number in the bottom of the conquest tab in the mission log.

At the beginning it will say 0/25000.

Then you complete the tasks listed on the left of said window to earn conquest points.

Conquest resets weekly at the same time as the weeklies are reset. For the last 24h before that you are unable to earn any points.

 

 

You don't need a subscription, a guild, a high-level char, a guild ship or a stronghold to participate in conquest and earn your personal conquest goal.

[Ardarell_Solo]

This part is only about Storymode and Hardmode gear, which is the current 192 and 198.

 

That means that in terms of relics it's basically the same as it is now only with the additional ability to RE HM grade relics from HM ops unassembled drops.

Which is actually a buff to Artifice.

 

 

Removal of Enhancements still sucks but yeah...

 

No, apparently (!) there won't be purple entry level relics anymore, that's exactly my point!

[MikeRindos]

Just re-read what I said. Edited October 12, 2015 by MikeRindos
Need to post more

[MikeRindos]

What I brought was Amorphous Carbonate now its going to removed. I need that for my crafting. Now that stinks. That Cybertech is being short changed. I get about over 2k - 5k for the new stuff I'm making. This is wrong.

 

•Advanced Power Implant Processor

•Alien Artifact Fragment

•Alien Data Cube

•Aluminium

•Amorphous Carbonite

•Augmentation Kit MK-10

•Augmentation Kit MK-9

•Augmentation Slot Component MK-10

•Augmentation Slot Component MK-9

•Bacterial Strain

•Biological Compounding Chemical

•Biometric Crystal Alloy

•Blue Goo

•Bondar Crystal

•Chanlon

•Cosmic Trace Particle

•Diatium

•Double-Pulse Implant Processor

•D-Package Implant Processor

•Enriched Durasteel

•Eralam Crystal

•Exonium

•Exotic Element Equalizer

•Exquisite Yellow Crystal

•Flawless Yellow Crystal

•Immaculate Yellow Crystal

•Impeccable Orange Crystal

•Impeccable Yellow Crystal

•Inert Virus

•Laminoid

•Luminescent Cell Culture

•Mass Manipulation Generator

•Matter Transubstantiator

•Medicinal Fluid

•Molecular Stabilizer

•Neurochemical Extract

•Neutronium

•Obsolete Crafting Material

•Perfect Orange Crystal

•Perfect Upari Crystal

•Perfect Yellow Crystal

•Phond Crystal

•Plasteel

•Precious Yellow Crystal

•Prehistoric Artifact Fragment

•Pristine Yellow Crystal

•Psychoactive Compound

•Quick-Growth Agent

•Rakata Energy Node

•Red Goo

•Resinite

•Rybcoarse Implant Processor

•Self-Perpetuating Power Cell

•Single-Pulse Implant Processor

•Synthetic Energy Matrix

•Synth-net Implant Processor

•Toxic Extract

•Universal Catalyst

•Unknown Microorganism

•Vial of Stabilized Isotope-5

•Viral Residue <-----Now look at some of these items. Some of them might be in your crafting crew skill. Just think about it. Some of the things their removing. Can be helpful in crafting weapons, invasion forces. Just think about it.

[Mithros]

What I brought was Amorphous Carbonate now its going to removed. I need that for my crafting. Now that stinks. That Cybertech is being short changed. I get about over 2k - 5k for the new stuff I'm making. This is wrong....

 

So sell it.

 

I have made some decent money selling off excess of some of those materials recently. People are going to need those materials up until KFE hits, so there is still a market out there.

 

Keep what you need for crafting, keep some if you expect it to be turned into something that you have a shortage of, and if you need some more before KFE hits then get more in whatever way you feel is most effective for you.

 

As far as cybertech being "short changed" I am not so sure.

Reusable grenades are going, but that's not a real hit on the value of the skill.

Droid parts are gone, and that's a bit of a hit, but let's not blow that out of proportion.

Armorings are the biggest loss, but they are getting enhancements in their place.

 

All in all, while they may have lost a little, cybertechs will still have a place on the market and still be a valuable skill for any player trying to develop self-sufficiency through crafting.

[MikeRindos]

Not only did they stripped Enhancements and etc. I'm going to sound like you alittle. My main character is a Cybertech person. And just recently transferred to another guild. What you said sounds like there going to push legacy armor. Which really we can't modify at all. I like orange armor. Having a new lightsaber added to a cartel pack. Which I can't use. I'll just sell the lightsaber. And have credits. Including, we can't make credits. In a nutshell this kind of systems is only geared toward people who make six figure incomes. People like us can't afford to get cartel coins all the time. That's a sad thing. :'( .

 

I know Jedi aren't supposed to care about money, but I'm honestly worried about my main here. She's an artificer, and you've stripped away the one thing she does more than anything. Artificers main markets are Enhancements, Dyes, Crystals, and Lightsabers, and you're taking the Enhancements, so let's take a look at what we're left with:

 

Lightsabers people buy once and then use forever. It's like selling Crocs, the only people willing to pay for them only pay for them once. Unlike blasters, it's actually a bit difficult to see what kind of lightsaber you or someone else is carrying in the heat of battle, so design isn't as big a factor here. Add to that a new style of lightsaber comes out with every Cartel Pack, flooding the GTN with sabers. Unless you're willing to remove Lightsabers (and consequently all weapons) from the Cartel Packs and replace them with their appropriate schematic, there's really no point in trying to make money with these.

 

Tradeskill-crafted Crystals can't keep up with the Cartel Market at all. Why should I keep spending credits upgrading my crystal to a slightly better one when I can buy a Cartel Crystal at level 10 secure in the knowledge that it is stronger than anything Artificers can produce below level 50? Artificers get a lock on the top three base colors, Red, Green, and Blue, but the Cartel Market has the entire rainbow in their pocket, not to mention multi-color crystals. I've got a Lime Green Crystal that does +41 Endurance and can be used by any character over level 10. 240 Cartel Coins means I can give as many copies of that crystal to my characters as I choose, so where's the incentive to upgrade? Unless Crystals are getting a major overhaul in 4.0, there is still little reason to make these.

 

Dyes have always been a limited ability for us. All Dye combinations we can craft are overshadowed by the Cartel Market. The Hutts have a near monopoly on the colors Red and Black, for example. If Artificers are to be made market viable after removing Enhancements, this is where that change needs to be. Open the entire spectrum to us. Let us make the same colors as are available on the Cartel Market, or even better, let us make both Primary and Secondary Dyes for the whole spectrum, and then combine them as we choose.

 

I'm going to withhold criticism until I see what you're implementing, but you see where my fears lie.

[IanArgent]

What I brought was Amorphous Carbonate now its going to removed. I need that for my crafting. Now that stinks. That Cybertech is being short changed. I get about over 2k - 5k for the new stuff I'm making. This is wrong.

 

The mats listed are being removed from the game, and stacks of the currently existing will be converted to other mats of the same grade and type. You won't need them for crafting any more, and you won't lose stacks that you have, they'll be converted to something you can use.

[CheaterLL]

No, apparently (!) there won't be purple entry level relics anymore, that's exactly my point!

 

Well, apparently (!) you're wrong.

 

They said you can't go to the vendor and buy the schematics for SM and HM relics.

 

They didn't say anything about relics that are lower than SM gear, so I assume that this will stay the same.

[CheaterLL]

What I brought was Amorphous Carbonate now its going to removed. I need that for my crafting. Now that stinks. That Cybertech is being short changed. I get about over 2k - 5k for the new stuff I'm making. This is wrong.

 

•Advanced Power Implant Processor

•Alien Artifact Fragment

•Alien Data Cube

•Aluminium

•Amorphous Carbonite

•Augmentation Kit MK-10

•Augmentation Kit MK-9

•Augmentation Slot Component MK-10

•Augmentation Slot Component MK-9

•Bacterial Strain

•Biological Compounding Chemical

•Biometric Crystal Alloy

•Blue Goo

•Bondar Crystal

•Chanlon

•Cosmic Trace Particle

•Diatium

•Double-Pulse Implant Processor

•D-Package Implant Processor

•Enriched Durasteel

•Eralam Crystal

•Exonium

•Exotic Element Equalizer

•Exquisite Yellow Crystal

•Flawless Yellow Crystal

•Immaculate Yellow Crystal

•Impeccable Orange Crystal

•Impeccable Yellow Crystal

•Inert Virus

•Laminoid

•Luminescent Cell Culture

•Mass Manipulation Generator

•Matter Transubstantiator

•Medicinal Fluid

•Molecular Stabilizer

•Neurochemical Extract

•Neutronium

•Obsolete Crafting Material

•Perfect Orange Crystal

•Perfect Upari Crystal

•Perfect Yellow Crystal

•Phond Crystal

•Plasteel

•Precious Yellow Crystal

•Prehistoric Artifact Fragment

•Pristine Yellow Crystal

•Psychoactive Compound

•Quick-Growth Agent

•Rakata Energy Node

•Red Goo

•Resinite

•Rybcoarse Implant Processor

•Self-Perpetuating Power Cell

•Single-Pulse Implant Processor

•Synthetic Energy Matrix

•Synth-net Implant Processor

•Toxic Extract

•Universal Catalyst

•Unknown Microorganism

•Vial of Stabilized Isotope-5

•Viral Residue <-----Now look at some of these items. Some of them might be in your crafting crew skill. Just think about it. Some of the things their removing. Can be helpful in crafting weapons, invasion forces. Just think about it.

Please read carefully.

hen Fallen Empire launches, any of these materials that you have will automatically convert to their equivalent counterpart. Example: Plasteel is being removed from the game. If you have 100 Plasteel when Fallen Empire launches it will turn into 100 Plastoid.

[Khevar]

They didn't say anything about relics that are lower than SM gear, so I assume that this will stay the same.

I hope you're right, but my expectations are that there won't be any new trainable relics adding in 4.0, and that the only way to get the next tier of relics is to run operations, or buy them from people that have learned the operations schematics.

 

Basically, reverting to pre-3.0 behavior.

 

We'll find out in a week.

Edited October 12, 2015 by Khevar

[dscount]

I hope you're right, but my expectations are that there won't be any new trainable relics adding in 4.0, and that the only way to get the next tier of relics is to run operations, or buy them from people that have learned the operations schematics.

 

Basically, reverting to pre-3.0 behavior.

 

We'll find out in a week.

 

I'm pretty sure we get NO new relic schematics. WHY? Because we are about to see THREE new tiers of gear available day one of launch. The SM and I'm pretty sure the HM versions will be RE-able. So the NIM stuff (If you are in a group narly enough to hit that ASAP) will likely NOT be RE-able. Now the bad news... you will need the PURPLE OPS mat to make those and I'm sure it's going to be a couple of those purple mats (Like 192's are today).

 

Back to the issue. The existing relics (Ruusaan) are so easy to get and they pack a good punch. You should (In theory) be able to quickly farm a couple SM relics without issue the first week. I mean how many of these operations drop relics the first couple of boss fights? (1st Boss "Red Kephess" ToS, 2nd Boss DP, 2nd Boss TFB, no idea KP/EV, etc.)

[dscount]

TAIT or NICK-

 

Guys can you provide the complete CONVERSION table for all these materials?

 

We know that Plasteel = Plastoid, but what about the tricky ones (Exotic Blue / Purple)?

 

• Exonium (Grade 11 Exotic Blue)

• Matter Transubstantiator (Grade 11 Exotic Purple)

• Exotic Element Equalizer (Grade 10 Exotic Blue)

• Mass Manipulation Generator (Grade 10 Exotic Purple)

• Molecular Stabilizer (Grade 8 Exotic Blue)

• Synthetic Energy Matrix (Grade 8 Exotic Purple)

[Thepyrethatburns]

Heavy Sigh

 

Well, as long as the stats remain the same, I suppose that the shifting of my MK-10s (both installed and the ones that I bought in advance for my Smuggler) to MK-8s isn't really much of a big deal.