Level synch = Revival of SWTOR

[Uruare]

The OP is trying to use formatting to evade the fact that he has no salient point.

 

It's like making a 45 segment PowerPoint that ultimately says nothing and just wasted an entire meeting to do it.

 

It's a very nice list of what the OP thinks, I suppose, though if he were a reviewer, I wouldn't read another from him.

 

Formatting =/= relevance.

 

Sorry OP, but the fact that you couldn't tell the difference disqualified you before you even began.

[Chazcon]

I TOTALLY agree with the OP. This is a great value add to the game, it makes all the planets relevant again, it makes the game challenging again.

 

Those who are so up in arms over it are the macroers, the casuals, the ego trippers, and the lazys.

 

I can't wait, i think it's awesome!

[Diefenbaker]

I TOTALLY agree with the OP. This is a great value add to the game, it makes all the planets relevant again, it makes the game challenging again.

 

Those who are so up in arms over it are the macroers, the casuals, the ego trippers, and the lazys.

 

I can't wait, i think it's awesome!

And the casuals are the ones who bring most money.

[Chazcon]

I know right? This is awesome, best idea, I can't wait!

[Rafaman]

Could not have said it better myself OP. Yes. It is an overall benefit to the game.

 

Old content will be relevant again even if it is just for a little while.

Vets can do content with lowbies at level. Great for grouping, guilds, and replay-ability.

Openworld will have a sense of danger as it should.

Certain achievements will require thought and skill.

WB mechanics and takedowns will mean something.

Openworld PvP will be less of a gank fest.

[Angror]

Never thought about it this way. Now i hate the change because it means i have to go back to Hoth. God i hate that cold planet and all of its quests.

[Kiesu]

Meanwhile, those of us who like to "multiplay this massively multiplayer" by, you know, roleplaying in this mmoRPG, get humped by making a feature they could easily have included for people like you as an option when grouping with lowbies mandatory, thus making huge swathes of those "huge beautiful maps" unusable for RP thanks to being continually attacked by at-level mobs that used to just ignore us.

 

But yeah, sure, the only people objecting to this are ebil seflish soloers

 

Yeah, its terrible when those RPing smugglers crotch kick a sith lords to death. So immersion breaking!!

 

People who agree with lvlsync= selfish. People who dont like lvsync others like and call them selfish= not selfish? logic of the internet

[Jaseja]

Meanwhile, those of us who like to "multiplay this massively multiplayer" by, you know, roleplaying in this mmoRPG, get humped by making a feature they could easily have included for people like you as an option when grouping with lowbies mandatory, thus making huge swathes of those "huge beautiful maps" unusable for RP thanks to being continually attacked by at-level mobs that used to just ignore us.

 

But yeah, sure, the only people objecting to this are ebil seflish soloers

 

I'm actually roleplayer, but I did not mention it since I did not see the need, as I can't see this impacting rp much. So far when I've been to open world rp events, there's always people who are low enough to pull the mobs regardless, also, since we are at the high end of the level spectrum of each lowbie area, we will still pretty much one shot the interfering mobs anyway. I see it ending up much the same as it were, you rp, some of the nearby mobs attack, you kill them with a swing or two, and that's how it is currently.

 

+1 for you roleplaying outside friendly cities or strongholds, most roleplayers seem to be holed up in their SH's and rarely go out in the world to begin with.

[Transairion]

You deserve a prize for most bias topic I've ever seen on SWTOR forums, which is quite the achievement as I've seen some real doozies.

 

 

Pros:

1. A new way to level up

 

And? Leveling post 50 isn't exactly hard, it's 1-50 that's the slog. There's always options, I wouldn't exactly call "go back and do old quests/heroics" so more a magical amazing solution. In fact, I'd find grinding out old Heroics even MORE time consuming than just following the actual recommended levelling path (ie the story) to do, you're showered in exp.

 

 

2. Content again relevant

 

That's a very odd way of putting it. You'll get more rewards, the content isn't improving any, nor is it suddenly new and exciting. The only people who'd find doing old content interesting again are those who've avoided it for so long they've forgotten the plotline (after which only one runthrough removes that), and those who never did it before period.

 

.... overlevelling content never made the content vanish, you just didn't get as rewarded as you might have if you did it at level. In fact, I'm pretty sure the ONLY difference is Exp related; a level 1 and a level 60 currently both get the same quest rewards and same credits save Experience.

 

When you hit max level, experience vanishes. When you hit Legacy 50, that type of exp vanishes too. So we're back to cash and comms (crystals now?) again. Except instead of taking 30 minutes to do a whole planet, it takes you 3 hours.

 

 

3. Incentive to do Heroics. The old content that is almost like new

 

If people wanted to do old content, they'd do it, "rewarding with big credits" or not, at least once for the storyline. "Almost like new", well no, it hasn't changed, it never went anywhere either. There's a big difference between changes and "I just couldn't be bothered to do it".

 

I'm sure there'll be a big explosion of people doing Heroics are part of all-but-forced Alliance related activities, but as soon as they complete that, then what? Back to same old same old nobody bothering anymore.

 

Black Hole still "pays well" but I usually only see a single instance of 5-6 people at any given time (and this is Harbringer too, which has like 3 servers including APAC squashed into it), and half of those are automated bots farming three golds that give blue+ drops too often. Just offering stuff like 10k credits isn't going force people into the grind when there's more efficient ways out there. Especially when those other methods don't require grouping up.

 

 

4. Helping out your friends or newcomers

 

You can always, you know, NOT blast everything in sight. When I've helped some people who needed it, even if I was 40 levels above them I'd just heal them and only mow everything down like cannonfodder if requested.

 

Drop group before they hand in, they still get full hand-in experience. The only difference is "killing mobs inside heroic" experience, which isn't gamebreakingly huge.

 

5. PVP servers and the problem of ganking

 

PvP players will be PvP players, regardless of level. A level 10 player is still gonna get his butt torn apart by a level 65 downbolstered to 10 PvPer in full PvP gear.

 

The only change might be massive base invasions overwhelming NPC guards being made obscenely harder.

 

Pretty sure PvP servers in general function of "There's always a bigger fish" to gank someone regardless

 

6. RP friendly.

 

I hope this isn't serious.

 

Using Yavin 4 again, it makes more sense a hostile jungle planet statured in the dark side has some crazy critters, and the further along in the story of SWTOR you go, the more zany planets and so on become.

 

It won't make a lot of sense for said Dark Lord of the Sith to go for a casual stroll on Korriban and die a brutal death to a pair of Korslugs he slew as a Acolyte. Same slugs. It's just weird. Especially after what, almost 4 years of the complete opposite?

 

7. Reasonable level-sync.

 

All the livestream proved that if a dev account downbolstered, they were still a god. We don't know what will happen to a normal player.

 

Mind you, in the stream Eric oneshotted a silver mob and then attacked then got cc'd by (for quite a while I might add) two golds before killing them without going below 95% health. Downbolstered to 18 on a 14-mob quest, he only fought a total of 3 mobs, on what amounts to a starter/intro planet and one of the easiest Heroics ingame.

 

As I've said elsewhere, a better example would have been him trying to bust into a Corellia Heroic 4 and try that same stunt. Cause they have more than 3 mobs in a single area usually. All I saw in the livestream that was different to how a 60 would do it is he did less damage to the golds.

__________________________________________________

 

Cons:

 

1. You won't be able to one-shoot mobs.

 

It's a bit different to that.

 

You won't be able to solo much of anything anymore, grouping will be all but forced if you can't overwhelm it. Probably not for stealthers, you know those classes at release that solo'd Heroic 4's when there were level 50 mobs and level cap was 50? It's easy if you don't fight anything!

 

Lower-level content dropping higher-level stuff is also a bad thing... what about that cosmetic Lightsaber from Kaas, the Forceslayer? I walk onto Kaas with a downbolstered 65, I'm suddenly getting 65 drops which'll be useless to me (obviously not gonna drop raid gear or anything better than basics), which basically equates to vendor trash. And if I want Forceslayer? Guess I'd better make a fresh toon and pray he gets the drop before he overlevels the loot table it drops from. Same for any other bit of level or planet based loot, lots of old original armors. Got a nice Sith Champion set primarily by spamming a Voss Heroic for blue drops, not gonna be able to do that anymore.

 

And what happens when the rush to group due to Alliance benefits dies down? Eventually everyone will get and max out every companion and so on, what then? Sitting on Fleet LFG Heroic XYZ, any takers? The cycle continues.

 

 

When KOTFE content is exhausted, which it eventually will be until the next monthly chapter, there isn't gonna be a lot to do anymore. Achievement hunting, Heroics, old questlines anything is easily soloable now is basically vanishing come KOTFE. Not sure what I'll do with myself honestly, I don't want to be another "LFG" guy on Fleet or sitting waiting as the minutes tick by and no queue pops.

 

It has the potential to be miserable. So yes, I'll consider that a pretty big con.

Edited October 1, 2015 by Transairion

[Arkaine]

This is actually fantastic for those master/padawan RPG guilds. Level scaling will benefit the master greatly when they help their padawan.

[Max_Killjoy]

This is actually fantastic for those master/padawan RPG guilds. Level scaling will benefit the master greatly when they help their padawan.

 

And they still could if it were optional.

[LordTynell]

This is actually fantastic for those master/padawan RPG guilds. Level scaling will benefit the master greatly when they help their padawan.

 

I mean, yeah, I am sure when Qui-Gon took on Obi-wan they were the same skill level. Same as Palps and Maul.

[Quraswren]

I mean, yeah, I am sure when Qui-Gon took on Obi-wan they were the same skill level. Same as Palps and Maul.

 

Didn't you hear, They were on corsaunt. They got down scaled.

 

I guess thats the only reason Obi-wan beat Darth Maul. Naboo must have been a starter world. Maul got down scaled.

[mastersdr]

I'm just thinking of compromises instead of being up in arms about it. I'm on the fence about it until I see it for myself.

 

I like what kiese said about there being two separate instances, that would be the best of both worlds.

 

Another compromise would be is to pay a fee of credits to not level sync when you go down on a planet.

 

Again I'm snowballing to figure out a fair solution

[Quraswren]

How about the compromise of making it entirely optional, so that everyone gets what they want, except for the people who get pissed off about how other people get enjoyment out of a game.

 

THIS ^

 

I can't figure out how BW could use even the smallest bit of logic in their design and not see how making this optional would have been the better way to design it at this point in the SWTOR game lifespan.

[TUXs]

What content is relevant again exactly?

What world wide quests can you replay?

Are they adding in a way to replay class quests?

Are they adding in a way to reply world story arcs?

 

WHAT CONTENT? Instanced heroics? Heroic areas where datacrons are? World bosses? Big flip...nobody is doing those as it is, not because they're over leveled but because they're simply unfun.

 

So again...what content is suddenly relevant?

Edited October 1, 2015 by TUXs

[Celise]

You didn't respond the first time I posted this, so here it is again: Having to waste my time killing trash I should have outleveled years ago isn't fun. It's not challenging. It's just time consuming. I already avoid doing Yavin 4 and Oricon because of the mob density. Sure, I can kill everything on either planet, but why would I want to? It's time consuming, tedious, and a chore. I don't do most of the other dailies very often either, but they're tolerable since fights with trash take no longer than three to five seconds.

 

I don't play this game to do chores. I play this game to have fun, and that isn't fun. If the goal is to keep things interesting, it's backfired spectacularly. They couldn't have made a worse design choice if they had been trying.

 

Why bother to upgrade my gear if I'm just going to get scaled down so that literally everything takes longer? No thank you. You can't convince me that will be enjoyable, because there's no way it ever will be.

 

thats like stating that your a race car driver, your first racing machine was a kart, it wasnt fun to be in and your indycar these days is so much better to drive but yet the same priniciples remain, that you have to be committed to enjoy it. so i fail to see where low level content is any different from high level content in order to enjoy it. your making excuses to try get out of doing them just for the hell of it.

 

I don't see how killing trash is fun. I don't see how making old content take several times longer is fun. It's not challenging or interesting; it's just tedious.

 

life is tedious, what difference does one group of trash mob npcs make from doing a trade run on another game? or building the same things, launching the same strategies in fights, eating the same food... its all tedious and yet you do it like everyone else. in that regard you got no valid reason not to play it.

 

No. Things are not relevant. Old content is still old content. Now I just have to waste my time trying to clear it. And, for some of it, I also have to deal with trying to wrangle 1 - 3 idiots that I was forced to pick up from General so I could clear it. Gee, that sounds fun.

 

excuses again. deliberatly pointing at the negatives as the only recourse to try prove a point. and the chances of something like that is random, its like blaming the wind because your cold when really your not wearing a jacket when you should be.

 

There are already tons of things to do. There is no shortage of content in this game, even at end game. The reason I don't do most of it is because it's not fun for me to spend loads of time on trash. That isn't going to change even when they try to force me to do it. I'm glad you're looking forward to it. I'm not, and no amount of color coded text is going to change that.

 

wait, so you call low level content tedious for no reason and label it as such and yet doing raids all the time, doing ziost, section x, ilum and makeb dailies all the time.. all of which are tedious.. and yet these are placed with a different label called exciting to play?

 

and at what point do crusts on a piece of bread become anything other then what they are, bits of bread?

 

if that is your reason? then its not a reason at all, its a bad excuse to jump on a bandwagon just for the hell of it.

[dlcman]

Why would BW have to compromise on anything. It is their game to run. You play it or you don't. i am sure this will get the hand wringing "but I'm a paying customer" rant but paying 15 dollars a month to access their servers to play their game doesn't buy you the right to demand changes. You either roll with it or you don't. You can complain all you want on deaf ears if it makes you feel better though.

[Sinapus]

Hmm. Might make my cybertech have a few issues getting low-level materials when crafting for alts, though she's a scoundrel so she can usually sneak around most enemies.

 

Though from what I've seen of the new gathering rules I won't have to go to as many nodes w/scavenging 500 on Coruscant or Taris since the yields will be higher.

[strongyp]

It's mandatory and has the potential to be an annoying time-waster.

 

I have enough mandatory, annoying and time-wasting activities at work. I don't want them in my happyfuntime.

 

this level-sync stuff is only ok if its optional, rift has it as an option its never forced on anyone stupid devs.

[PavSalco]

The only people who'd find doing old content interesting again are those who've avoided it for so long they've forgotten the plotline (after which only one runthrough removes that), and those who never did it before period.

I would say these people greatly outnumbers the people that actually did everything from the old content. Bioware wouldn't have made such a decision without backing that up with the numbers from their database.

 

.... overlevelling content never made the content vanish, you just didn't get as rewarded as you might have if you did it at level.

That's exactly why many people don't bother with them currently. For the same reason people didn't bother with HM flashpoints in 3.0. Why would they do content that drops inferior loot when they can spend a bit more time in Ravagers and get optimized gear and more commendations? INCENTIVE is one of the main reasons why people are interested in doing the content.

 

When you hit max level, experience vanishes. When you hit Legacy 50, that type of exp vanishes too. So we're back to cash and comms (crystals now?) again. Except instead of taking 30 minutes to do a whole planet, it takes you 3 hours.

To put it in your own words: Instead of taking 30 minutes to get 30k credits from all side missions on Balmorra, you can make it in 2 hours with much higher credit reward.

 

When you reach level 60, you potentially have other characters to level up. As I said earlier, post-50 level is very repetitive. I agree that going back to the old planets might take more time to level up but it's not grinding chorde with spacbarring the cutscene you have seen every time on other toons. Going back is optional and provides the variety in leveling up.

 

If people wanted to do old content, they'd do it, "rewarding with big credits" or not, at least once for the storyline. "Almost like new", well no, it hasn't changed, it never went anywhere either. There's a big difference between changes and "I just couldn't be bothered to do it".

 

Yet GW2 works great with its downscaling system.

 

PvP players will be PvP players, regardless of level. A level 10 player is still gonna get his butt torn apart by a level 65 downbolstered to 10 PvPer in full PvP gear.

Perhaps. That's why I said "slightly more fair".

 

Using Yavin 4 again, it makes more sense a hostile jungle planet statured in the dark side has some crazy critters, and the further along in the story of SWTOR you go, the more zany planets and so on become.

I gave Yavin IV as an example. I buy that RP explanation with creatures enhanced by the influence of the dark side. But let's take another planet that is just a regular planet with regular animals. How about Makeb for example? Why a cute frog would deal massive damage to Dark Lord while Korslugs from Korriban with their sharp teeth do zero harm? Anyway, isn't Korriban statured in the dark side with all these tombs, dark side users and ghosts?

 

 

The OP is trying to use formatting to evade the fact that he has no salient point.

 

It's like making a 45 segment PowerPoint that ultimately says nothing and just wasted an entire meeting to do it.

 

[...]

Sorry OP, but the fact that you couldn't tell the difference disqualified you before you even began.

 

http://i.imgur.com/BwgU6sY.jpg

Edited October 1, 2015 by PavSalco

[Reyze]

I don't mind level sync for this hell I enjoy it in Guild wars 2! Makes all quests and planet's relevant you can get lore,credits,gear,etc. Without feeling bored I think those whining that this is the death of swtor are being WAY too dramatic. Guild wars 2 is doing fairly well and yes I still play it from time to time. I'm normally more diplomatic about things but real tired of seeing people whine and complain about features they dislike and thinking that because one feature they dislike is added that it will KILL the game it won't. I love all the additions to kotfe and I DEARLY love the changes to companion gear. For the record I've been here since the start and love my founder title.

[Rafaman]

Most heroics are instanced so your compromise doesn't' really apply, but there are a few open world areas that are Heoric. But, your compromise wouldn't work in these open areas because there could be a mix of leveled and overleveled players there.

 

No. This is one of those times that it is either or. Making it optional invalidates the purpose of level sync to begin with.

 

BW, stick with your guns. Don't back down to the vocal minority. There is no need to do anything more. Launch and then see what is what. As I have mentioned before this is good for the game overall.

 

Old content will be relevant again even if it is just for a little while.

Vets can do content with lowbies at level. Great for grouping, guilds, and replay-ability.

Openworld will have a sense of danger as it should.

Certain achievements will require thought and skill.

WB mechanics and takedowns will mean something.

Openworld PvP will be less of a gank fest.

[Darevsool]

I haven't watched the stream yet so this is kind of news to me in the last 10 minutes.

 

You're all saying that if I take my lvl 60 back to Tatooine (as an example) my toon is going to have it's "power" adjusted downward just by landing on the planet?

 

What possible purpose does that serve?

 

If I take my max level toon there to gather resources or click on missed datacrons, I sure as heck don't want to waste time fighting through mobs to do so. That may be the exact reason WHY I wait to max level to go back and do stuff, so it doesn't take as much time.

 

If they're doing this so they can add quests to the planet for some new system, there are other ways they could do it. Section X and Black Hole are two example of higher level areas on a planet that don't line up, level wise, with the rest of the planet. New areas on old planets could be done the same way without touching the original parts of the lower level planets.

 

PLUS, you could use the power BOOST to take lower level toons up to the level of the new area the same way that already exists in game.

[Max_Killjoy]

What content is relevant again exactly?

What world wide quests can you reply?

Are they adding in a way to replay class quests?

Are they adding in a way to reply world story arcs?

 

WHAT CONTENT? Instanced heroics? Heroic areas where datacrons are? World bosses? Big flip...nobody is doing those as it is, not because they're over leveled but because they're simply unfun.

 

So again...what content is suddenly relevant?

 

Exactly.

 

People either did or didn't that lower-planet content already -- this isn't going to get anyone else to go back and do that same content now, if they weren't before.