Game Update 4.0 Class Changes: Jedi Knight + Sith Warrior

[TaitWatson]

Thanks for reading our first installment of Class Change blogs that we will be releasing leading up to the release of Knights of the Fallen Empire. This week, we are going to talk about the quintessential Star Wars™ champions: Jedi Knights and Sith Warriors.

 

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Edited September 4, 2015 by TaitWatson

[MorgenBlue]

So Annihilation is still really boring to play and Blade Dance.. why? Just why? Bring back Master Strike and 2.10 Annihilation playstyle.

[BaineOs]

So when are the Imperial Agents/Snipers going to get their blog or are we destined to be last like we usually are? A timetable of the other classes even if it's very much subject to change would be greatly appreciated.

[TaitWatson]

So when are the Imperial Agents/Snipers going to get their blog or are we destined to be last like we usually are? A timetable of the other classes even if it's very much subject to change would be greatly appreciated.

 

Next is Imperial Agent/Smuggler, then Bounty Hunter/Trooper, then Inquisitor/Consular!

[MorgenBlue]

You really need to have an open beta so we can try out these class changes for ourselves so that it doesn't go live in the same state as 3.0. Edited September 4, 2015 by MorgenBlue

[BaineOs]

Next is Imperial Agent/Smuggler, then Bounty Hunter/Trooper, then Inquisitor/Consular!

Cool cheers Tait

 

You really need to have an open beta so we can try out these class changes for ourselves so that it doesn't go live in the same state as 3.0.

 

Seconded!

[FireFoxed]

Are the new utilities in addition to the existing ones? So we have to pick the same number but have more to choose from?

 

You really need to have an open beta so we can try out these class changes for ourselves so that it doesn't go live in the same state as 3.0.

 

Yes please.

[DarthMaulUK]

You really need to have an open beta so we can try out these class changes for ourselves so that it doesn't go live in the same state as 3.0.

 

That's called 'Early Access'. Its going to be a car crash. No two ways about it. You wont need balance for 'story'

Edited September 4, 2015 by DarthMaulUK

[Emperor-Norton]

TL;DR: no meaningful changes to any Discipline and Master Strike is getting a terrible rename for the silliest of reasons.

[Master-Nala]

General Class + Combat Changes

Utility Grant Levels

Now you get utility choice points at the following levels to prevent excessive power inflation with each expansion, and to ensure a choice was present at level 65.

 

Tier 1: 17, 25, 33 (up from 11, 19, 27)

Tier 2: 41, 49 (up from 35, 43)

Tier 3: 57, 65 (up from 51, 60)

Discipline Active Ability Grant Levels

Starting at level 10, you get a new Discipline-specific Active Ability every 16 levels. The only changes from 3.x are that you get your 3rd ability at level 42 (up from 41) and your 4th ability at level 58 (up from 57).

Discipline Passive Ability Grant Levels

These now happen every 4 levels, beginning at level 12. The only change from 3.x is that instead of getting a level 59 Passive skill, you get one at level 60, and a new passive at level 64.

 

I can't tell you how disappointing this is. One of the main reasons for moving to Disciplines was to avoid having so many key powers come later and later in a character's career because of level cap increases. And what do you do? The very next time you do a level cap increase, you push everything back. Especially annoying is that everyone when they log in in 4.0 will have lost a utility choice that they had the day before.

 

If you don't want inflation, then just don't give a choice at 65. Or make it some weak passive that we get.

 

Sigh....

[Thufir_Hawat]

Question about 'Thirst for Rage'

 

Would it not work better to attach this ability to the activation of Fury instead of Bloodthirst. This is because during a raid only one Mara will be able to get any benefit from specing this way as bloodthirst cool down is raid wide, where as fury everyone could work into their rotation.

 

Just a small suggestion.

Edited September 4, 2015 by Thufir_Hawat

[PavSalco]

Are the new utilities in addition to the existing ones? So we have to pick the same number but have more to choose from?

 

Yeah, I think so. They didn't say anything about removing.

 

Edit: However, we are getting Unshackling Rage (Tier 1) which is the exact copy of Through Power (Tier 3), so I don't know what to think about this. Maybe they want to give us a choice when to take that ability or they already removed Through Power. But then what would be the purpose of the name change? Clearly Through Power fits better and it's from the SIth Code like the other two abilities (Through Victory, Through Passion).

Edited September 4, 2015 by PavSalco

[Ryuku-sama]

I can't tell you how disappointing this is. One of the main reasons for moving to Disciplines was to avoid having so many key powers come later and later in a character's career because of level cap increases. And what do you do? The very next time you do a level cap increase, you push everything back. Especially annoying is that everyone when they log in in 4.0 will have lost a utility choice that they had the day before.

 

If you don't want inflation, then just don't give a choice at 65. Or make it some weak passive that we get.

 

Sigh....

 

This. A better way would have been to keep everything as is. Just don't change current discipline trees. Currently you gain an ability every 16 levels. Keep it that way. Currently you gain a new utility every 8 levels except for 60. Change it so you gain an utility at 59, then the next one would be at 66 in the next expansion. Currently you gain a new passive every 4 level except 59. Change it so you gain the 59 one at 60 and the next one at 64. No need to give us a new ability at 65. It only mess up the trees at every single expansion.

Hell. If you want to give us something new at 65 give us our new 61 ability at 65 instead.

[Massoku]

Thanks for reading our first installment of Class Change blogs that we will be releasing leading up to the release of Knights of the Fallen Empire. This week, we are going to talk about the quintessential Star Wars™ champions: Jedi Knights and Sith Warriors.

 

Read More

 

Please no more overpowered healers and ranged dps try to please give the Knights and warriors ans meele the equivalent in game of the meaning they have for star wars story

[OMGITSJAD]

Really don't like that you are finally giving Jugg tanks a roll to boost their mobility, but then also forcing them to immobilize themselves every 18 seconds for a 6% defense chance buff that doesn't even last for very long and is very RNG dependent on if it even matters. Buff the duration and/or defense chance granted and/or put it on another skill like Force Scream or Crushing Blow and/or have it increase Shield chance instead and/or let us use Ravage on the move somehow. Otherwise we will continue to be eclipsed by Powertechs and Sins. Don't get me wrong, I like that we are getting more force/tech resist chance, 11% for 6s a third of the time(if you can even keep the abilitiy on cooldown) is kind of laughable though.

 

P.S. make it so that Saber Throw no longer has a minimum range if you haven't already.

P.P.S. Instead of changing the name of Master Strike all you had to do was change the Soresu Form tooltip to read: "...and all Strike abilities, except Master Strike, generate 1 less focus" for Knights. But, whatever, continue on with your contrived reasoning.

 

Question about 'Thirst for Rage'

 

Would it not work better to attach this ability to the activation of Fury instead of Bloodthirst. This is because during a raid only one Mara will be able to get any benefit from specing this way as bloodthirst cool down is raid wide, where as fury everyone could work into their rotation.

 

Just a small suggestion.

 

The differences on cooldowns is massive and if they put it on Fury everyone would need to take it because it would be such a massive DPS increase, especially for Carnage and Annihilation.

Edited September 4, 2015 by OMGITSJAD

[Copd_Onasi]

Don't ever change bioware! Blade Dance is such an excellent name.

[Costello]

Mad Dash who comes up with these names. I can't believe you pay someone a salary that has sat in a room and the best he could come with is mad dash.

 

Even more disappointing is that you have set yourselves the goal of increasing the mobility of a class that is underpar in end game pvp and pve and the best you can achieve is an uncontrollable 20 meter charge in a straight line with a combat engine that has no physics to it so you will run through people and probably out of range on the other side.

 

That you have gone down this route shows how little the combat team understand about the game, the engine, combat and the mechanics. You force people to be with 4 meters an uncontrollable charge in a straight line will not allow players to keep in combat and not be kited, nor unless I spent a heroic utility allow me to move while stunned or snared.

 

How about you take the combat team with this new ability against the newly minted level 65 hateful entity and see how mad dash works. You get knocked back and stunned in a red circle on the floor doing damage to you, then to get back in the fight mad dash which throws you 20 meters probably 10 of those past the entity and into more red circles of death that you stand in now that your damage immunity has worn off.

 

Or take PvP where you run past the target and and lose line of sight on them to boot as your now facing the wrong direction.

 

I get it you gave snipers a roll and it seemed to work and your combat team thought a similar approach to a melee class would work. Big difference and I appreciate the combat team should have noticed this snipers have a 35m range not 4m. It means you can roll forward and as long as you are between say 20 and 35m you in a good place. If they had to be within 4 meters of a moving opponent the skill would be so situational to make it not worth placing on the tool bar.

 

How can they possibly get a skill so wrong, and why are people paying them money to screw up so much?

[Quraswren]

I can't tell you how disappointing this is. One of the main reasons for moving to Disciplines was to avoid having so many key powers come later and later in a character's career because of level cap increases. And what do you do? The very next time you do a level cap increase, you push everything back. Especially annoying is that everyone when they log in in 4.0 will have lost a utility choice that they had the day before.

 

If you don't want inflation, then just don't give a choice at 65. Or make it some weak passive that we get.

 

Sigh....

 

I got to agree with this ^

 

Changing utilities seems rather poorly thought out. Gaining 5 levels to just to get back something you have had for over a year and all under the guise of power restraint? I don't but it.

 

Do something similar to what nala said,

Don't allow another utility point at 65.

Create a passive

 

Hell, they could allow an extra utility point because most of those things aren't all that great to start with. One extra point isn't going to cause some major power level jump or imbalance.

 

This readjustment seems way off. Today you have seven points. Tomorrow you will only have 6. This way you get to work yourself back to what you have had. UGH.....

[Excise]

Indifferent on Blade Dance vs Master Strike. Ok, it fits the naming convention of Knight attacks better. Don't have a problem with this.

 

Weirdly, these changes look like they're designed to make everything stay the same. Same number of utilities and discipline-specific active powers, but now spread out over 65 instead of 60.

 

Mildly disappointed that we're gaining yet another button on our tool bar (Mad Dash/Blade Blitz). This makes 3 movement powers for a Guardian/Juggy. Maybe making Combat Focus/Enrage reset Force Charge/Leap's cooldown, make the next Charge/Leap not activate the cooldown, and cleanse all movement debuffs would work?

 

Overall: These changes are all pretty minor and irrelevant, but Knight was already pretty fun so I have no real complaints.

[Sindariel]

Players are asking to allow Master Strike / Ravage to be channeled while moving to increase their mobility and Bioware... gives them another leap with 45s cooldown...

Yeah, this will be really helpful.

 

Head -> Desk

Edited September 4, 2015 by Sindariel

[KaellSolaris]

Master Strike has been renamed Blade Dance. The Jedi Knight's Master Strike ability has been renamed "Blade Dance" because Soresu Form reduces the Focus gained by "Strike" abilities (Strike, Sundering Strike, and Warding Strike), but Master Strike does not generate or cost Focus - so its name is out of place with the conventions of the rest of the class. No change needs to be made for Sith Warriors who gain Rage with "Assault" abilities (as Ravage does not contain the word “Assault” in it).

 

At first I thought that you rename master strike into blade dance because you change animation (even if i like MS animation, it will be unusable while moving, where ravage can be used) and because of the change for tank (tank use it for a 6 % def chance and then allowing it to be use while moving like it was done for shadow - assassin would have make sense ).

 

But a bit disappointed to see it was just for THAT ! (meaning a name misunderstood)

 

You said it will be easier to stay in melee, but Mad Dash - Blade Blitz has 45 sec cd, what will it change if other classes also get movement abilities with shorter cooldown ? (Blade dance - Ravage while moving make sense in this situation, because we can use it every 18 secs)

 

it will also provide defense, but the Guardian - Juggernaut already have a lot powerful CD and utilities which allow him to jump more frequently than Sentinel - Marauder, it seems guardian - juggernault will benefit more from this new action, lowering the cooldown for Sentinel - Marauder could be interesting from a defensive point a view

 

So please, make Blade dance - Ravage usable while moving, I believe every Jedi and Sith will be grateful for this ( especially tank ), and reduce the cooldown of Mad Dash/Blade Blitz around 30 secs for Sentinel - Marauders.

 

plz plz plz plz plz plz plz plz plz plz plz plz plz plz think about it ?

[NovusRex]

I can't tell you how disappointing this is. One of the main reasons for moving to Disciplines was to avoid having so many key powers come later and later in a character's career because of level cap increases. And what do you do? The very next time you do a level cap increase, you push everything back. Especially annoying is that everyone when they log in in 4.0 will have lost a utility choice that they had the day before.

 

If you don't want inflation, then just don't give a choice at 65. Or make it some weak passive that we get.

 

Sigh....

 

I have to say I agree with this. Seems inconsistent with what they wanted to achieve with Disciples. Especially considering 12xp will probably end, pushing abilities and utlities further away seems an odd choice. And yeah, losing a utlity is kinda lame aswell. What's wrong with just keeping that stuff as it was? Inflation sounds like a really poor excuse.

[Savej]

Sounds like knights are getting the operative roll but on a 45 sec cd and with a utility cost? That's just about all I see there other than a few damage buffs and the ghetto version of shadow's perpetual stun immunity.

[The-Kaitou-Kid]

So Annihilation is still really boring to play and Blade Dance.. why? Just why? Bring back Master Strike and 2.10 Annihilation playstyle.

 

It doesn't look like Annihilation is changing much so that's a fair statement, but they explained why they changed Master Strike to Blade Dance and honestly... I kinda prefer Blade Dance. It's not a horrible name by any means, nor was Master Strike the pinnacle of ability names itself. Comes down to personal taste I suppose, and I can admit that I'm bias since Blade Dance would have a nice synergy with Blade Rush for Combat Sentinels which is my main.

 

I do disagree with the utility change though. Moving the final utility point back to 65 will cause some people to be weakened as soon as 4.0 hits due to losing a heroic utility that they had before it dropped. Would have been better off just making the new passive attained at 65 instead of 64 and leaving the utility points where they were in my opinion.

[Massoku]

Mad Dash who comes up with these names. I can't believe you pay someone a salary that has sat in a room and the best he could come with is mad dash.

 

Even more disappointing is that you have set yourselves the goal of increasing the mobility of a class that is underpar in end game pvp and pve and the best you can achieve is an uncontrollable 20 meter charge in a straight line with a combat engine that has no physics to it so you will run through people and probably out of range on the other side.

 

That you have gone down this route shows how little the combat team understand about the game, the engine, combat and the mechanics. You force people to be with 4 meters an uncontrollable charge in a straight line will not allow players to keep in combat and not be kited, nor unless I spent a heroic utility allow me to move while stunned or snared.

 

How about you take the combat team with this new ability against the newly minted level 65 hateful entity and see how mad dash works. You get knocked back and stunned in a red circle on the floor doing damage to you, then to get back in the fight mad dash which throws you 20 meters probably 10 of those past the entity and into more red circles of death that you stand in now that your damage immunity has worn off.

 

Or take PvP where you run past the target and and lose line of sight on them to boot as your now facing the wrong direction.

 

I get it you gave snipers a roll and it seemed to work and your combat team thought a similar approach to a melee class would work. Big difference and I appreciate the combat team should have noticed this snipers have a 35m range not 4m. It means you can roll forward and as long as you are between say 20 and 35m you in a good place. If they had to be within 4 meters of a moving opponent the skill would be so situational to make it not worth placing on the tool bar.

 

How can they possibly get a skill so wrong, and why are people paying them money to screw up so much?

 

Totally agree:csw_guard: